ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by Somethingfishy » Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:34 pm

Rileybobs wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:30 pm
There’s nothing like having the grace to give credit where it’s due.
I think i make it quite clear i don't want to give him any. I don't think I am the only one. He got lucky with Dyche...we all did.
We are where we are despite Garlick...not because of him.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by PaintYorkClaretnBlue » Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:36 pm

Somethingfishy wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:34 pm
I think i make it quite clear i don't want to give him any. I don't think I am the only one. He got lucky with Dyche...we all did.
We are where we are despite Garlick...not because of him.
In my opinion that is utter nonsense.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by Somethingfishy » Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:37 pm

dandeclaret wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:33 pm
One man's tied hands and frugality is another mans sunstainability and strong financial management.
That is fine and i understand that. He has got the balance wrong though..in my opinion.
There is a saying in business. If you stand still..you go backwards. That is where we are at..ever so slowly and painfully.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:37 pm

BurnleyFC wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 12:32 pm
I’ll forever thank Mr Garlick for his early tenure and for appointing Mr Dyche in the first instance, but I still think his leadership has been a shambles for the last 18 months or so. For that, it leaves a bitter taste in the mouth.

I’m really looking forward to seeing how the new chairman operates.
He wasn't actually chairman when Dyche was appointed. He was co-chairman with John B and I know that Lee Hoos played a big part in the selection process. It then went to the full board with, I know, one board member not in favour.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by aggi » Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:38 pm

When Chester named his thread Football's Magic Money Tree I'm not sure if he was aware of how many Burnley fans there are who think there is one.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by bf2k » Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:43 pm

dandeclaret wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:22 pm
I disagree with the current board "Not having the skill". I still think if you drew up a league table of the 92 clubs in the league, and gave points for right decisions taken, I still suspect Burnley would be in the top 6 in the whole country.

...

I suspect that their perceived lack of skill may be that they've not monetised the club's success enough. I think there's an expectation that monetising it means with bigger sponsors (Many of the Sponsors they have sought out have been criticised by a proportion of fans), but the reality for Burnley is I suspect monetising it from fans and from corporate hospitality. I'd ask you a question.... how would you feel if the new owners said, we're going to sign a £20m player, but we need £2m a year in wages, so we're adding £100 a year to season tickets / ticket prices? Realistically, that probably wouldn't be too far off a 5% per year increment for each season in the Premier League, rather than freezing prices. Would YOU be ok with that price increase next season?
I mean the skills to take us further forward which yes this is capitalising on our current wave in the most publicised league in the world. The commercial gains we've made in the last 5 years can't be called a success really can it. We've still got small, relatively unknown, local businesses sponsoring stands and advertising boards around the ground. Unfortunately if you want the club to move forward in a global league you need to look globally. I think this is what a lot of our fans can't understand. A lot say we're "selling our soul" which I get but you can't have it both ways.

I won't take away the work they have done up to this point. We've been a model club that many have followed since and that needs celebrating but not dwelling on.

On the season ticket prices, again much like the "selling our soul" debate. If we want to maintain eating at the top table, unfortunately, you have to pay a fair going rate for eating there. This includes the fans as well.

To answer your question, yes I'd pay extra if we were seeing football worthy the extra money and gave us a better chance of progressing forward. We're the cheapest team to watch but probably the worst to watch as well footballing wise. Those facts are no coincidence.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by dandeclaret » Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:44 pm

Somethingfishy wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:37 pm
That is fine and i understand that. He has got the balance wrong though..in my opinion.
There is a saying in business. If you stand still..you go backwards. That is where we are at..ever so slowly and painfully.
There are sayings, there's also real life things like bankruptcy and liquidation, which is what happens when you spend beyond the income of the business. The club have invested. They are carrying the highest ever wage bill. That wage bill is unsustainable without external funding if the club were to be relegated. The likelihood of relegation at the start of the season was put at between 30% and 40% (based on 100% markets with the bookmakers). That's a significant enough business risk I would say to not stretch beyond the capabilities of the business. As I said above, their biggest mistake is probably that they've not charged fans enough to maximise income, in order to provide funds to stretch (and save for the somewhat inevitible relegation).
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by elwaclaret » Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:46 pm

PaintYorkClaretnBlue wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:36 pm
In my opinion that is utter nonsense.
Completely agree, very few Clarets were impressed when SD was appointed. Even the most even handed Clarets (including myself) had reservations and awaited events with a degree of trepidation. The fact that the board filtered such a gem from a reasonable pack of options was some of the best upper management I’ve ever witnessed. They deserve to be remembered at our club every bit as much as Bob Lord for their influence on the club.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by bf2k » Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:48 pm

aggi wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:27 pm
I think they've demonstrated over the past few years that they certainly have the skills. What they don't have is the financial backing.

The current owners/directors don't have the pockets to bail the club out if things go wrong and football isn't an industry where it's particularly easy to get significant lines of credit.

Arguably the infrastructure improvements could have been debt funded to leave more funds for the squad but that carries its own risks.

There aren't that many options for a club like us.
You've misunderstood my term "the skills". As I've said in reply to dande, I meant the skills commercially to capitalise on our current participation in a globally watched league were we're still heavily reliant on local businesses for sponsorship. I know we're not the only Premier League club like this but arguably they have benefactrices in other areas, i.e. wealthy owners.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:48 pm

Somethingfishy wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:37 pm
That is fine and i understand that. He has got the balance wrong though..in my opinion.
There is a saying in business. If you stand still..you go backwards. That is where we are at..ever so slowly and painfully.
Ask Sheff Wed if they think our board have got it wrong thus far.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by fidelcastro » Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:54 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:48 pm
Ask Sheff Wed if they think our board have got it wrong thus far.
Or Bolton, Blackburn, Portsmouth, Sunderland, Bury... I could go on.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:54 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:48 pm
Ask Sheff Wed if they think our board have got it wrong thus far.
Not sure what Sheffield Wednesday have got to do with our board.

The simple fact is that two of our board members own around 77% of the company between them and they want to sell their shares which is their right. It's not whether they've been good or bad directors, not whether they have or haven't fallen out with anyone, not whether they got lucky with Sean (which to an extent they obviously did because you never know with any managerial appointment), not anything other than they wish to sell their shareholding, or part of it, in the company.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by warksclaret » Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:57 pm

elwaclaret wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:46 pm
Completely agree, very few Clarets were impressed when SD was appointed. Even the most even handed Clarets (including myself) had reservations and awaited events with a degree of trepidation. The fact that the board filtered such a gem from a reasonable pack of options was some of the best upper management I’ve ever witnessed. They deserve to be remembered at our club every bit as much as Bob Lord for their influence on the club.
Agreed-I would say other than Brian Laws we have made (at the time) good managerial signings going as far back as Stan and including Coyle

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by dandeclaret » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:01 pm

bf2k wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:43 pm
I mean the skills to take us further forward which yes this is capitalising on our current wave in the most publicised league in the world. The commercial gains we've made in the last 5 years can't be called a success really can it. We've still got small, relatively unknown, local businesses sponsoring stands and advertising boards around the ground. Unfortunately if you want the club to move forward in a global league you need to look globally. I think this is what a lot of our fans can't understand. A lot say we're "selling our soul" which I get but you can't have it both ways.

I won't take away the work they have done up to this point. We've been a model club that many have followed since and that needs celebrating but not dwelling on.

On the season ticket prices, again much like the "selling our soul" debate. If we want to maintain eating at the top table, unfortunately, you have to pay a fair going rate for eating there. This includes the fans as well.

To answer your question, yes I'd pay extra if we were seeing football worthy the extra money and gave us a better chance of progressing forward. We're the cheapest team to watch but probably the worst to watch as well footballing wise. Those facts are no coincidence.

I take the point on commercial opportunities, but a lot of those come from having the right contacts. Also, when they signed a stand deal with Ladbrokes, or a sponsorship with a global betting company, they were both derided. When I look at Sheff Utd, Crystal Palace and West Brom, clubs with similar sizes and historical ownership profiles, I don't see them having these significant global sponsors either. Are these opportunities freely available?

On your last point, unfortunately spending in football is no guarantee of success - so the best on offer here is that you trust the club with increased spending to spend it correctly.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by claptrappers_union » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:02 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:54 pm
Not sure what Sheffield Wednesday have got to do with our board.

The simple fact is that two of our board members own around 77% of the company between them and they want to sell their shares which is their right. It's not whether they've been good or bad directors, not whether they have or haven't fallen out with anyone, not whether they got lucky with Sean (which to an extent they obviously did because you never know with any managerial appointment), not anything other than they wish to sell their shareholding, or part of it, in the company.
I don't get this - 'getting lucky with Sean Dyche' nonsense - The Chairmen didn't sack him after relegation - that shows loyalty, trust and good leadership. Besides, aren't all clubs lucky when they make a good managerial appointment?

Kilby and the board were simply unlucky then, when they appointed Brian Laws
Last edited by claptrappers_union on Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by Chester Perry » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:03 pm

bf2k wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:48 pm
You've misunderstood my term "the skills". As I've said in reply to dande, I meant the skills commercially to capitalise on our current participation in a globally watched league were we're still heavily reliant on local businesses for sponsorship. I know we're not the only Premier League club like this but arguably they have benefactrices in other areas, i.e. wealthy owners.
Well I suspect what you are talking about in reality is patience for things to develop and grow, we have built (and continue to do so, at a steady pace) - prior to lockdown we had more than doubled our commercial income in the previous 3 seasons (which is impressive, even given our lowly starting point) - moving ourselves out of the relegation zone (table wise) in this respect - is there more to be done? absolutely - but the club have continued to make progress in this direction with the appointment in August of someone with that specific remit.

The club have been very keen to find a balance between the local and international sponsorship, it has not forgotten, and should not forget, how many of those local sponsors have helped see us through some dark times - even this century (which could easily be returned too). Barry Kilby did not forget at the time of the itv digital collapse, refusing administration (when many clubs took it) so local creditors could be paid in full (though at a probable slower rate).

From what I have seen ALK will also want to maintain such a balance (though maybe with a different flavour) and so they should
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by Sproggy » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:04 pm

Somethingfishy wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:28 pm
ONE decision has enabled Mike Garlick to walk away from the club with a big fat cheque. The appointment of Sean Dyche as manager. He has generally done his best to hinder and tie Dyches hands but Dyche still gives him the reward of TV money every season.

The training ground improvements are largely down to Dyches prompting and the dire necessity with the condition it was in. If we hadn't been in the Prem (down to Dyche) would we have improved it? Would Garlick have invested or taken the step? I very much doubt it.
It is quite a sad indictement that he treats Dyche like he does..even though it is likely it isn't all one way.

If Garlick did any good work at the start of his reign he has rapidly dismantled it in the latter part with the frugality and his ability to alienate not only the manager but several other key people within the club.
This pretty much sums up my feelings too. At the start of our Premier league journey we seemed to have a model of gradual improvements off the field, and importantly a succession plan on it. So - absolutely, credit where it is due for that model of operating. However, in the last couple of years, any on-field planning seems to have been discarded and we've switched to a make do and mend approach. Recruitment, succession, contracts and by all accounts communicating with the manager have all gone by the wayside. We're hanging on despite the chairman at the moment so the sooner he collects his windfall and moves on, the better for the club.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by Somethingfishy » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:05 pm

So predictable...Sheff Wed, Bolton etc all get trotted out. Just waiting for the Orient game to get thrown in for the full house (i was there by the way!)

Do you really think I am advocating p*ssing money away willy nilly? There is a middle ground. There has been little to no investment in the first team of any note (Brownhill aside) in the last 3 years. Our squad is ageing and thin. Is that what we have to accept? Dyche doesn't seem too happy to accept it if rumours about his unhappiness are true even if he gets on with it professionally in the meantime. You do all realise that he quite likely would be away if a decent job came up? Why is that do you think?
The slide is inevitable and once relegated (as alluded to) we would be forced to sell and do a complete rebuild even though we most likely have relegation clauses in the players contracts. Do you think these players will readily accept it or look for a transfer?
The status quo as it is has no long term future. Totally self defeating. Something had to give.

Fortunately (and i will give Garlick credit for this) i think he realises the same. Hence the requirement to sell. I certainly don't think he has done it to line his pockets. However all this sycophantic fawning over him is just blind nonsense.......in my opinion.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by arise_sir_charge » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:07 pm

Excellent, it seems we can add Sheffield Wednesday to the “we don’t want to end up like” list.

It needed freshening up, the Portsmouth references we’re going g a bit stale.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by Colburn_Claret » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:07 pm

bf2k wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:48 pm
You've misunderstood my term "the skills". As I've said in reply to dande, I meant the skills commercially to capitalise on our current participation in a globally watched league were we're still heavily reliant on local businesses for sponsorship. I know we're not the only Premier League club like this but arguably they have benefactrices in other areas, i.e. wealthy owners.
Commercially selling Burnley football club is harder than any other team in the league. Through our population size, geographically hidden in the shadows of the pennines, with much bigger towns all around us. The problem with the spend, spend, spend brigade, is their lack of ability to grasp reality. Mike Garlick, John B, Barry Kilby are all very successful businessmen. They know how to run a business, and how not, and the dangers, especially to football clubs that live beyond their means.
I wish one of you geniuses could explain where all the extra money you would have spent,would have come from.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by Rileybobs » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:13 pm

Somethingfishy wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:05 pm
So predictable...Sheff Wed, Bolton etc all get trotted out. Just waiting for the Orient game to get thrown in for the full house (i was there by the way!)

Do you really think I am advocating p*ssing money away willy nilly? There is a middle ground. There has been little to no investment in the first team of any note (Brownhill aside) in the last 3 years. Our squad is ageing and thin. Is that what we have to accept? Dyche doesn't seem too happy to accept it if rumours about his unhappiness are true even if he gets on with it professionally in the meantime. You do all realise that he quite likely would be away if a decent job came up? Why is that do you think?
The slide is inevitable and once relegated (as alluded to) we would be forced to sell and do a complete rebuild even though we most likely have relegation clauses in the players contracts. Do you think these players will readily accept it or look for a transfer?
The status quo as it is has no long term future. Totally self defeating. Something had to give.

Fortunately (and i will give Garlick credit for this) i think he realises the same. Hence the requirement to sell. I certainly don't think he has done it to line his pockets. However all this sycophantic fawning over him is just blind nonsense.......in my opinion.
I think you’re mistaking sycophantic fawning for giving due credit for a job well done.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by dandeclaret » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:16 pm

Somethingfishy wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:05 pm
So predictable...Sheff Wed, Bolton etc all get trotted out. Just waiting for the Orient game to get thrown in for the full house (i was there by the way!)

Do you really think I am advocating p*ssing money away willy nilly? There is a middle ground. There has been little to no investment in the first team of any note (Brownhill aside) in the last 3 years. Our squad is ageing and thin. Is that what we have to accept? Dyche doesn't seem too happy to accept it if rumours about his unhappiness are true even if he gets on with it professionally in the meantime. You do all realise that he quite likely would be away if a decent job came up? Why is that do you think?
The slide is inevitable and once relegated (as alluded to) we would be forced to sell and do a complete rebuild even though we most likely have relegation clauses in the players contracts. Do you think these players will readily accept it or look for a transfer?
The status quo as it is has no long term future. Totally self defeating. Something had to give.

Fortunately (and i will give Garlick credit for this) i think he realises the same. Hence the requirement to sell. I certainly don't think he has done it to line his pockets. However all this sycophantic fawning over him is just blind nonsense.......in my opinion.
Was the £15m investment in Gibson not in the last 3 years?

I suspect that the club was on a similar trajectory prior to Covid. At that point, with uncertainty on revenue losses, and the likely low margin the club run at, and remaining uncertainty around when fans can return to the ground, the board had to make a decision - could the club afford a £15-£20m+ transfer fee, and a 3- 4 year contract at £2-£3m per year basic plus bonuses? Was the club in a position to invest a further £21 - £32 million pounds? Clearly those in charge have decided no. There is an argument that the transfer fee is an investment, and it is, but it's a risky investment - with a significant chance of the value dropping significantly. As it did with Gibson and likely Vydra.

Why would Dyche be away? Probably because there are clubs that may have different investment and risk profiles, and therefore give him a chance of greater success in his career. And that's admirable. It appears that you would like the club to be riskier, the board, don't share that view. They have driven the club forward in most areas - the results on the pitch have been good for the last 6 seasons - exceptional in 3 of those seasons. The ground has improved with the disabled facilities being built. The academy and training ground progression, and as Chester has just posted a 200% improvement (On a low base) in commercial activity. Personally I find life better when you're grateful for what you have and strive for more, rather than resentful for what you don't have.

EDIT - also, that list of improvements and progression, which outstrip the vast majority of clubs in the country, is not "Sycophantic Fawning" - they are cold hard FACTs
Last edited by dandeclaret on Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by BurnleyFC » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:16 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:37 pm
He wasn't actually chairman when Dyche was appointed. He was co-chairman with John B and I know that Lee Hoos played a big part in the selection process. It then went to the full board with, I know, one board member not in favour.
Brendan Flood?

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:17 pm

claptrappers_union wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:02 pm
I don't get this - 'getting lucky with Sean Dyche' nonsense - The Chairmen didn't sack him after relegation - that shows loyalty, trust and good leadership. Besides, aren't all clubs lucky when they make a good managerial appointment?

Kilby and the board were simply unlucky then, when they appointed Brian Laws
Not sure why this reply was to me, I was only saying there is luck with any managerial appointment. As for not sacking him after relegation, that didn't show loyalty or trust, it was down to the fact that he knew because the club were taking a lot of the money to spend on the training ground which severely limited us in the transfer market.

Yes, all clubs are lucky with good appointments because you don't know how they will work out. Sometimes a damn good manager can change club and it just doesn't work.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by elwaclaret » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:19 pm

warksclaret wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:57 pm
Agreed-I would say other than Brian Laws we have made (at the time) good managerial signings going as far back as Stan and including Coyle
I think Laws was on a hiding to nothing, and was very brave taking the job he so wanted at the worst possible time. OC had ripped the soul from the club and the infighting within the squad meant that he never stood a chance. I remember half the squad was not talking to the other half... It needed more time than Laws would ever be given to turn around. He had been out of the game too long and never really found his feet.

What fans forget both SD and Brian Laws learnt from one of the best managers of all time Clough, and even cough needed Peter Taylor to back him.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by joey13 » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:27 pm

elwaclaret wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:19 pm
I think Laws was on a hiding to nothing, and was very brave taking the job he so wanted at the worst possible time. OC had ripped the soul from the club and the infighting within the squad meant that he never stood a chance. I remember half the squad was not talking to the other half... It needed more time than Laws would ever be given to turn around. He had been out of the game too long and never really found his feet.

What fans forget both SD and Brian Laws learnt from one of the best managers of all time Clough, and even cough needed Peter Taylor to back him.
Dear me , people still defending Laws

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by majormajor » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:32 pm

elwaclaret wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:19 pm
It needed more time than Laws would ever be given to turn around. He had been out of the game too long and never really found his feet.
Laws was bombed out by Sheff Wed a month before he joined us.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by aggi » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:37 pm

elwaclaret wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:19 pm
I think Laws was on a hiding to nothing, and was very brave taking the job he so wanted at the worst possible time. OC had ripped the soul from the club and the infighting within the squad meant that he never stood a chance. I remember half the squad was not talking to the other half... It needed more time than Laws would ever be given to turn around. He had been out of the game too long and never really found his feet.

What fans forget both SD and Brian Laws learnt from one of the best managers of all time Clough, and even cough needed Peter Taylor to back him.
Hadn't he been sacked a couple of weeks before he joined us. That was part of the bewilderment, that he'd just been sacked from a team in the championship relegation zone and then got a job in the premier league.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:37 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:54 pm
Not sure what Sheffield Wednesday have got to do with our board.

The simple fact is that two of our board members own around 77% of the company between them and they want to sell their shares which is their right. It's not whether they've been good or bad directors, not whether they have or haven't fallen out with anyone, not whether they got lucky with Sean (which to an extent they obviously did because you never know with any managerial appointment), not anything other than they wish to sell their shareholding, or part of it, in the company.
I read the article on the Magic money tree thread about Sheff Wed and their history of over spending, not getting value for money etc, hence the reference to them when someone is complaining about our board managing the money sensibly

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by clarethomer » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:37 pm

I much preferred reading about the new owners and trying to understand the future of the club rather than trying to lobotomise the tenure of our current directors and previous managers and how we compare to other clubs that have nothing to do with this takeover.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by Fez » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:38 pm

:o :o
Attachments
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by aggi » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:41 pm

bf2k wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:48 pm
You've misunderstood my term "the skills". As I've said in reply to dande, I meant the skills commercially to capitalise on our current participation in a globally watched league were we're still heavily reliant on local businesses for sponsorship. I know we're not the only Premier League club like this but arguably they have benefactrices in other areas, i.e. wealthy owners.
I think if there was a chasm between our commercial revenue and equivalent clubs then that would be a fair point. As it is our commercial revenue has grown steadily and isn't hugely out of line with others.

The real area where we suffer is matchday revenue and that's obviously a fine balancing act.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by ClaretAL » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:44 pm


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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by Steddyman » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:45 pm

New article in The Atheltic titled 'New owners are imminent at Burnley and they can't come soon enough':

It has been more than 14 months in the making but it appears there is about to be white smoke before Burnley’s takeover.

New owners in the form of ALK Capital, headed by American Alan Pace, are imminent and there is plenty of optimism as thoughts now turn to 2021. The final details are understood to be close to being agreed and cannot come soon enough — Sean Dyche’s paper-thin squad needs adding to in January.

Burnley’s bench in the 1-0 win over Sheffield United was another reminder of how quickly Dyche’s squad can look threadbare. It was made up of two goalkeepers, four defenders, two central midfielders and one striker, the inexperienced under-23s forward, Joel Mumbongo.

Missing from the squad were five important first-team players Jay Rodriguez (knee injury), Matej Vydra (back), Dwight McNeil, (groin), Johann Berg Gudmundsson (hamstring) and Jack Cork (ankle).

Those five would dramatically change the outlook of the bench if fit but it is becoming a common theme that, when it looks like Burnley are just about to have a fully fit squad, they are hit by another spurt of injuries. The latest casualty being Charlie Taylor, who appeared to pull his hamstring after nine minutes.

Since football restarted in June, Dyche has been working wonders with the smallest squad in the top flight and one that has been further compromised by a consistent run of injuries. At the end of the summer window, the Burnley boss made it clear that he still felt he was two or three players short. At least.

There was some irony that as Burnley prepared for their final game of 2020, it was against Sheffield United, the side that ALK had unsuccessfully tried to purchase in 2019 after the court ruling that Kevin McCabe had to sell his 50 per cent stake to Prince Abdullah.

Fast forward to yesterday, Pace and his team were working hard, having arrived in Lancashire at the start of the week, to seal the deal to take the reins at Turf Moor. The group are not allowed access to the club until the takeover has been officially completed, however, and therefore could not attend the 1-0 victory on Tuesday night.


Talks have progressed positively over the past few weeks and ALK’s position was made even stronger after the second group in talks with the club, led by Mohamed El Kashashy and Chris Farnell, pulled out of the race last week after growing frustrated having not spoken to owner Mike Garlick for six weeks.

Heading into Christmas, ALK talks were at an advanced stage, with only legal sign-off and final Premier League approval required. The determination to secure the deal before the January window, or as early as possible next month, meant work has continued throughout the Christmas period. There was a small hope there would be an announcement before Burnley’s game against Leeds United. That proved too soon and ahead of the game against Sheffield United, The Athletic understands that there were still a few documents to be completed.

That is expected to be sorted within the next 48 hours and ALK hope to be in situ before Burnley’s next game against Fulham on January 3.

ALK have yet to talk to Dyche, who once again confirmed on Tuesday night that he has yet to be spoken to by the current board about the potential new owners about just how close the takeover is. ALK are known to be big fans of Dyche and their first job will be to understand his vision and what areas of the squad and players he believes the club should target.

They will still be starting the transfer window somewhat on the back foot, however. Clubs will have had strategies in place for a number of months and targets finalised heading into the window. Ideally, ALK would have liked to have been in place well in advance of January.

During Pace’s discussions with the board, the club’s original January transfer plans, pre-takeover, had been discussed as part of his due diligence and also to align strategies. He will assume the position of chairman and is moving to Lancashire to oversee the day-to-day operations, becoming the ultimate decision-maker at the club.

Burnley’s upturn in form, taking 14 points from their last eight games, moving them out of the relegation zone and providing them with a small cushion on the teams below, has lifted morale from the gloom of two points from their opening seven games. The faith that Dyche placed in his squad at the start of the season has paid off.

ALK are not going to make bundles of money available in a panic to try and help Burnley survive this season. But they are keen to invest in the upcoming window and back Dyche, who they see as a big part of their plans moving forward.

One of the elements that made Burnley an attractive proposition is the job that the present board have done in making the club sustainable. ALK are not planning on ripping up that model, only to push it forward.

As discussed in the sensible transfers piece this month, the two obvious areas lacking in depth are central defence and, more prominently, wide midfield. That has been highlighted over the Christmas period with Burnley missing all of their wide players (McNeil, Gudmundsson and Robbie Brady) for the trip to Leeds and having to play Erik Pieters (left-back) and Josh Benson (central midfielder) instead.

Burnley’s scouting department headed by technical director Mike Rigg, one of the areas the board invested heavily in over the last 18 months, have been hard at work trying to identify the players which suit their model and Dyche’s playing style. ALK have plenty of expertise in player recruitment products having invested in the companies AiScout and Player Lens.

The exciting question is how Burnley can now approach this market. The winter window is generally a difficult one for all clubs with player availability limited and prices inflated but Dyche signed Josh Brownhill from Bristol City a year ago and he has proved one of the signings of his eight-year reign. It will be interesting to see how Dyche will operate in the market knowing there will be sufficient financial backing. It opens doors for players who may not have been available under the current board, although prices may be impacted by other clubs seeking to take advantage of Burnley’s new investment.

This is a key moment in Burnley’s history and the hope is that the January transfer window should provide the first positive glimpse of what is to come.

(Photo: Barrington Coombs/PA Images via Getty Images)
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by elwaclaret » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:48 pm

joey13 wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:27 pm
Dear me , people still defending Laws
Absolutely I’m happy to defend Laws. He was offered and took the job he had always wanted, for reasons mostly beyond his control he NEVER had more than one in a million chance here.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:52 pm

clarethomer wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:37 pm
I much preferred reading about the new owners and trying to understand the future of the club rather than trying to lobotomise the tenure of our current directors and previous managers and how we compare to other clubs that have nothing to do with this takeover.
Once the deal has been confirmed then that surely should be our only concern. It looks as though we have played our final game under the current board so now it is a case of just waiting for the news. Will it be today as I had thought last week? Maybe not, but I'll be surprised if it's not done by the time we move into 2021. Then it's a case of waiting to see what Alan Pace has to say and going from there.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:53 pm

Interesting the our sensible financial model has been one of the main attractions for ALK.

We've come in for a lot of stick for that, Inc from Burnley fans, but it's paid off during the pandemic and to attract new owners.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by ClaretAL » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:53 pm


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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by elwaclaret » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:54 pm

aggi wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:37 pm
Hadn't he been sacked a couple of weeks before he joined us. That was part of the bewilderment, that he'd just been sacked from a team in the championship relegation zone and then got a job in the premier league.
Possibly and I’m not saying I was thrilled with his arrival, but I know if I’d have been offered the job I’d have taken it. Laws had made it plain many times he always wanted the job... Flood it is a matter of record wanted him... so he came.

Much as I loved Robbie Blake and others in the team, they rebelled at the cost of the club against Laws, yet he has taken 100% of the blame for things largely beyond his control. It was sad (if predictable) that it did not work, but this habit society has of scapegoating is nonsensical. Things are NEVER simple.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by Paul Waine » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:56 pm

Steddyman wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:45 pm
New article in The Atheltic titled 'New owners are imminent at Burnley and they can't come soon enough':
Great read, Steddyman. Thanks for posting.

Exciting times.

UTC
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by Paul Waine » Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:06 pm

ClaretAL wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:53 pm
This lot reckon £120M

http://www.insideworldfootball.com/2020 ... e-burnley/
ALK closes in on £120m deal for Premier League Burnley
30th December 2020

December 30 – A sixth Premier League club could come under US ownership this week with reports that ALK Capital are on the verge of completing their £120 million deal for Burnley.

ALK looks to have beaten off a rival deal for the club involving Cheshire-based lawyer Chris Farnell and Egyptian businessman Mohamed El Kashashy.

ALK’s managing director Alan Pace has passed the Premier League’s owners and directors’ test and is currently in the North West to conclude the deal with Burnley chairman Mike Garlick who holds a near 50% stake in the club.

Pace is a former president of Major League Soccer side Real Salt Lake and has reportedly said he intends to take a hands-on role at the club. His banking background includes both stints at Citigroup and Lehman Brothers. He recently entered the UK football market with two football-based technology solutions, AiScout and Player Lens.

The news of the deal will welcomed by Burnley manager Sean Dyche who has called for funds to boost his squad. Pace has indicated that money would be available in the January transfer window.

An improvement in recent results have lifted Burnley out of the relegation zone. Their next match is against Fulham this weekend who are one place below them and in a relegation position.

Burnley will follow Manchester United, Liverpool, Arsenal, Fulham and Crystal Palace into US ownership, and they could be followed Southampton who have been – for several months – working their way through a £200 million deal with Miami-based US sports investor Joe DaGrosa.

DaGrosa currently looks like he doesn’t have the money to join the Premier League party, nor the co-operation to form a consortium. That would leave Saints in the hands of Chinese owner Gao Jisheng who put Southampton on sale earlier this year with a £250 million price tag.

***********************

Copy/paste from Inside World Football - link above.

I've substituted "Burnley" - the article says "Fulham" where underlined. I'm pretty sure "Fulham" wasn't intended.

Interesting that the figure is quoted at £120 million. Until it's confirmed we won't know. If it is just purchase of MG's and JB's shares, maybe it will never be disclosed.

Interesting reports on Soton and the valuations of their proposed deal.

Exciting times.

UTC

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:11 pm

elwaclaret wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:48 pm
Absolutely I’m happy to defend Laws. He was offered and took the job he had always wanted, for reasons mostly beyond his control he NEVER had more than one in a million chance here.
How on earth has this thread got to Laws? As said, Flood wanted him when Cotterill left even though he'd already spoken to Coyle and he was always his number one target then. I'm not sure who we could have got to be honest, Sean O'Driscoll would definitely not have been a better appointment, but the Laws appointment was not good. Having said that, the way the players treated him was a disgrace and, for balance, they tried to treat Howe in the same way but he was strong enough to ship them out.

Anyway, back to the takeover and The Athletic, as the post above, are reporting that Alan Pace will become our next chairman, only the seventh in all my years watching the Clarets.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by Bigvince » Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:14 pm

Fez wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:38 pm
:o :o
Don’t think we’ll get all of them them, but would be happy if we got 3 or 4 off that list :D

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by elwaclaret » Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:15 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:11 pm
How on earth has this thread got to Laws? As said, Flood wanted him when Cotterill left even though he'd already spoken to Coyle and he was always his number one target then. I'm not sure who we could have got to be honest, Sean O'Driscoll would definitely not have been a better appointment, but the Laws appointment was not good. Having said that, the way the players treated him was a disgrace and, for balance, they tried to treat Howe in the same way but he was strong enough to ship them out.

Anyway, back to the takeover and The Athletic, as the post above, are reporting that Alan Pace will become our next chairman, only the seventh in all my years watching the Clarets.
Not sure CT to be honest... just read something, and I hate scapegoating. Really looking forward to seeing what Pace has to say. Getting excited for what is next on our claret journey through life.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by joey13 » Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:18 pm

elwaclaret wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:48 pm
Absolutely I’m happy to defend Laws. He was offered and took the job he had always wanted, for reasons mostly beyond his control he NEVER had more than one in a million chance here.
Agreed , because he wasn’t up to it , still he was handsomely rewarded for all his trouble.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by elwaclaret » Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:22 pm

joey13 wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:18 pm
Agreed , because he wasn’t up to it , still he was handsomely rewarded for all his trouble.
Last comment on this Joey as has been pointed out what is the point.... I’m not sure how many other managers would have come, it maybe needed a transitional manager to try and steady the ship after OC and Laws was available and willing to give his dream job a go, knowing the odds were stacked.

Anyway, to the next chapter.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by Chester Perry » Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:33 pm

Paul Waine wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:06 pm

Interesting that the figure is quoted at £120 million. Until it's confirmed we won't know. If it is just purchase of MG's and JB's shares, maybe it will never be disclosed.

Interesting reports on Soton and the valuations of their proposed deal.

Exciting times.

UTC
As you know Paul - a staged payment profile/share transfer for a takeover is not unusual even in football - it could easily be 60% of shares initially which would allow finance for squad development/new contracts - I am sure many would say tying Tarks to a new deal would be excellent business (though I worry about our salary ceiling being raised to high, given our underlying revenues)
Last edited by Chester Perry on Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by bf2k » Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:44 pm

aggi wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:41 pm
I think if there was a chasm between our commercial revenue and equivalent clubs then that would be a fair point. As it is our commercial revenue has grown steadily and isn't hugely out of line with others.

The real area where we suffer is matchday revenue and that's obviously a fine balancing act.
Out of interest, what other clubs are you comparing us with?

I'm not to sure we are comparable. Take short sales as an example, we only sell through the club shop. Basically means the local area or existing exiled fans. I work all around the world and I see most other Premier League shirts in sport shops (I've even seen Championship & League One shirts - although that was Sheff Utd & Leeds when they were in League One). It was mentioned on the rebranding thread, marketing and commercial activities is one way the new board can really push the club forward financially, capitalising on our current global exposure. We simply haven't done this nearly enough as we should.

I also find it admirable that the club has chosen a balance between local & global sponsorship. However, this is not going to provide the funding to keep a club like us in the Premier League long term without a structured debt approach, which is very risky.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by nyclaret » Wed Dec 30, 2020 4:18 pm

I’m very excited.

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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

Post by Swizzlestick » Wed Dec 30, 2020 4:31 pm

“ALK Capital’s Burnley takeover vehicle Calder Vale Holdings Ltd is borrowing money from Michael Dell’s MSD UK Holdings. That should get the deal over the line & it adds another to Dell’s growing list of debtors in English football: Burnley, Derby, Southampton & Sunderland.”

Matt Slater on Twitter

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