Name the next manager

This Forum is the main messageboard to discuss all things Claret and Blue and beyond
Murger
Posts: 4206
Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2016 12:55 pm
Been Liked: 1235 times
Has Liked: 844 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Murger » Sun Apr 17, 2022 10:52 am

gandhisflipflop wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 10:48 am
I’d absolutely love nuno. The cynic in me says why would he come here?
If Palace didn't want to pay for his massive back room staff, there is no chance we would.

NewClaret
Posts: 13225
Joined: Tue Dec 31, 2019 9:51 am
Been Liked: 3037 times
Has Liked: 3759 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by NewClaret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 10:58 am

tiger76 wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 10:51 am
If we could attract Nuno that would be a heck of a coup, but like you I can't see him being interested in Burnley.
No chance we’d pay his/his teams massive wages. And I can’t see him wanting to come here & play Championship football next year.

For me, Rooney is the best bet currently: young but massive name with something to prove, would have a presence/get the players going, has proven himself able to work on a shoestring/no budget, seems to get teams motivated in adversity, but most importantly… knows the Championship!

Trouble is, not sure we’re an attractive enough prospect atm, although Derby look destined for L1 I’m sure he would be a candidate for bigger jobs.

RVclaret
Posts: 13836
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:30 am
Been Liked: 3707 times
Has Liked: 2499 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by RVclaret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:03 am

Willy wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 9:36 am
Not read all this post but I wouldn't mind the Bodo Glimt manager who would tick a lot of boxes.
They were knocked out of Europe on Thursdday with Dyche sacked on Friday?
Really hope Pace is aware of him. He’d be a really exciting appointment.

KlyBfc
Posts: 945
Joined: Wed Mar 16, 2016 7:38 pm
Been Liked: 211 times
Has Liked: 126 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by KlyBfc » Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:05 am

Don’t worry Grayson is not coming to Burnley. Just for the record he lives in Normanton (Pontefract / Wakefield)

tiger76
Posts: 25697
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:43 pm
Been Liked: 4644 times
Has Liked: 9849 times
Location: Glasgow

Re: Name the next manager

Post by tiger76 » Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:05 am

NewClaret wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 10:58 am
No chance we’d pay his/his teams massive wages. And I can’t see him wanting to come here & play Championship football next year.

For me, Rooney is the best bet currently: young but massive name with something to prove, would have a presence/get the players going, has proven himself able to work on a shoestring/no budget, seems to get teams motivated in adversity, but most importantly… knows the Championship!

Trouble is, not sure we’re an attractive enough prospect atm, although Derby look destined for L1 I’m sure he would be a candidate for bigger jobs.
Rooney would be a gamble, but at least I can see why we'd be interested, and yes he does know the Championship, plus he's shown he can improve young players, which if we need to use some of our youngsters next season could prove invaluable.

Which bigger jobs is Rooney going to be offered this summer? I can't see any PL clubs taking a punt on him, so a club with promotion ambitions is likely to be an attractive prospect for him surely.

jrgbfc
Posts: 8422
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2016 10:30 pm
Been Liked: 2098 times
Has Liked: 336 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by jrgbfc » Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:23 am

The football Nuno played at Wolves was pretty negative. And he had the luxury of having decent players to work with.

spt_claret
Posts: 1891
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2016 6:52 pm
Been Liked: 728 times
Has Liked: 456 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by spt_claret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:39 am

Nuno won't come. Wage demands will be too high especially with his staff, he's not been in this sort of relegation fight especially with a 7 game hiding to nothing so can easily hold off for a better offer.

Rooney won't come. If he wouldn't join Everton, his boyhood club, in a better position with more time.

Russell Martin won't come if Swansea go up or we go down and certainly won't come right now abandoning a promotion fight for a stacked deck relegation fight.

Chris Wilder won't come for the exact same reasons, replace Swansea with Boro. I doubt either would come even if we are both in the Championship, we are clearly crisis riddled and debt riddled already. Only hope of either is if we stop up and they don't come up.

Allardyce is an inferior, corrupt version of Dyche who will demand a fortune for an interim job and probably want a survival clause or extension. Not any offer of longer term hope going forward.

Michael Duff is far too inexperienced in general and is on his first season at league one. Barton similarly inexperienced, plus has reverted to type since leaving Dyche's custody.

Rafa Benitez would cost a fortune and also be likely to hold off for alternative offers given the high probability of dropping into the Championship. Nobody wants a relegation on their CV regardless of the many extenuating circumstances.

We are not going to be able to appoint someone who isn't a collosal gamble, doesn't come with a ton of downsides, or isn't extremely extremely expensive. Or possibly 2/3.

Call me fun at parties,glass half empty Dyche worshipper all you want. This is nothing to do with Dyche. He's now gone. This is to do with the realistic prospect of these candidates.

I think the vast majority are unrealistic and those that are realistic have significant downsides. Which leaves us likely resorting to a left field gamble.
These 2 users liked this post: BabylonClaret beddie

DCWat
Posts: 9296
Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2016 11:04 am
Been Liked: 4131 times
Has Liked: 3599 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by DCWat » Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:42 am

spt_claret wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:39 am
Nuno won't come. Wage demands will be too high especially with his staff, he's not been in this sort of relegation fight especially with a 7 game hiding to nothing so can easily hold off for a better offer.

Rooney won't come. If he wouldn't join Everton, his boyhood club, in a better position with more time.

Russell Martin won't come if Swansea go up or we go down and certainly won't come right now abandoning a promotion fight for a stacked deck relegation fight.

Chris Wilder won't come for the exact same reasons, replace Swansea with Boro. I doubt either would come even if we are both in the Championship, we are clearly crisis riddled and debt riddled already. Only hope of either is if we stop up and they don't come up.

Allardyce is an inferior, corrupt version of Dyche who will demand a fortune for an interim job and probably want a survival clause or extension. Not any offer of longer term hope going forward.

Michael Duff is far too inexperienced in general and is on his first season at league one. Barton similarly inexperienced, plus has reverted to type since leaving Dyche's custody.

Rafa Benitez would cost a fortune and also be likely to hold off for alternative offers given the high probability of dropping into the Championship. Nobody wants a relegation on their CV regardless of the many extenuating circumstances.

We are not going to be able to appoint someone who isn't a collosal gamble, doesn't come with a ton of downsides, or isn't extremely extremely expensive. Or possibly 2/3.

Call me fun at parties,glass half empty Dyche worshipper all you want. This is nothing to do with Dyche. He's now gone. This is to do with the realistic prospect of these candidates.

I think the vast majority are unrealistic and those that are realistic have significant downsides. Which leaves us likely resorting to a left field gamble.
To summarise, potting Dyche when we did was madness!
This user liked this post: spt_claret

daveisaclaret
Posts: 2058
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 9:23 pm
Been Liked: 1129 times
Has Liked: 94 times
Location: your mum

Re: Name the next manager

Post by daveisaclaret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:44 am

spt_claret wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:39 am
Russell Martin won't come if Swansea go up or we go down and certainly won't come right now abandoning a promotion fight for a stacked deck relegation fight.
I'm not against the tone/message overall of your post at all but Swansea are 14th.

Blakesboots
Posts: 324
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2022 9:47 am
Been Liked: 87 times
Has Liked: 178 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Blakesboots » Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:45 am

DCWat wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:42 am
To summarise, potting Dyche when we did was madness!
Unless you’re given no choice.

Steve-Harpers-perm
Posts: 5744
Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2016 10:52 am
Been Liked: 1868 times
Has Liked: 835 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Steve-Harpers-perm » Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:47 am

DCWat wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:42 am
To summarise, potting Dyche when we did was madness!
Unless they weren’t given a choice.

bodge
Posts: 1576
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2016 6:04 pm
Been Liked: 725 times
Has Liked: 474 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by bodge » Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:50 am

It wouldn't surprise me if they had a chat with managers who have done well in the US, so a real leftfield call would be Klinsmann.
This user liked this post: KateR

claretandbluesky
Posts: 300
Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2022 9:14 pm
Been Liked: 78 times
Has Liked: 13 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by claretandbluesky » Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:57 am

Dyche was a gamble.

Nothing wrong with identifying a possible ambitious young manager with potential.

Whether the fans would give him a chance is another thing.

For some anything ALK does is going to be evil.

It’s the age of extreme views.
This user liked this post: Vegas Claret

spt_claret
Posts: 1891
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2016 6:52 pm
Been Liked: 728 times
Has Liked: 456 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by spt_claret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:57 am

daveisaclaret wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:44 am
I'm not against the tone/message overall of your post at all but Swansea are 14th.
I know. 7 points off the playoffs with 5 to play and a game in hand is slim odds but they are not out of the race yet so I can't see him ditching them. Without even arguing about how if they finish mid table that counts further against him as a choice (Not going to move those goalposts) - my point is that he's extremely unlikely to jump NOW, certainly won't if he pulls off the slim odds of playoff qualification, and if we drop I would say is unlikely to jump. He's probably more likely than Wilder due to performance and Wilder tending to stay at clubs for a few years while Martin is younger and has already hopped once. But I still think he's unlikely to be appointed.

ClaretMov
Posts: 2499
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2019 3:13 pm
Been Liked: 843 times
Has Liked: 822 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by ClaretMov » Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:59 am

willsclarets wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 10:48 am
We should avoid anyone with zero experience like Michael Carrick. He's done absolutely nothing to suggest he'd do a good job.
Just like Dyche 10 year's ago

JimmyRobbo
Posts: 2518
Joined: Sat Jan 23, 2016 7:55 am
Been Liked: 490 times
Has Liked: 871 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by JimmyRobbo » Sun Apr 17, 2022 12:01 pm

What did Nuno do in English football? Was great with Jota and Raul. Awful without them at Wolves.
Didn't do too well with Spuds.

As pointed out earlier, we need someone with some good experience. Need someone who can lead. Problem with young exciting prospects is they move on if they're any good.

Let's hope there is a good plan in place for recruitment. Dyche wasn't an exciting appointment but turned out to be a miracle worker.

CardyTheClaret
Posts: 392
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 7:22 am
Been Liked: 190 times
Has Liked: 114 times
Location: Barrowford

Re: Name the next manager

Post by CardyTheClaret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 12:06 pm

ClaretMov wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:59 am
Just like Dyche 10 year's ago
Not strictly true. He was doing a cracking job at Watford.
This user liked this post: JimmyRobbo

Penwortham_Claret
Posts: 308
Joined: Tue Sep 21, 2021 11:23 am
Been Liked: 123 times
Has Liked: 19 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Penwortham_Claret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:46 pm

It looks like Sky have closed the book on our next manager betting

Bigvince
Posts: 2638
Joined: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:39 pm
Been Liked: 930 times
Has Liked: 699 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Bigvince » Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:56 pm

Penwortham_Claret wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:46 pm
It looks like Sky have closed the book on our next manager betting
In favour of who?

RVclaret
Posts: 13836
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:30 am
Been Liked: 3707 times
Has Liked: 2499 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by RVclaret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:59 pm

Bigvince wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:56 pm
In favour of who?
Not sure it says, just that the market is no longer available.

Middle-agedClaret
Posts: 1039
Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2016 7:55 pm
Been Liked: 314 times
Has Liked: 1069 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Middle-agedClaret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:02 pm

Chris Hughton?

Bigvince
Posts: 2638
Joined: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:39 pm
Been Liked: 930 times
Has Liked: 699 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Bigvince » Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:02 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:59 pm
Not sure it says, just that the market is no longer available.
Cheers, if book is being closed a candidate may well of been selected

NL Claret
Posts: 2006
Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2016 12:37 pm
Been Liked: 515 times
Has Liked: 209 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by NL Claret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:05 pm

Penwortham_Claret wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:46 pm
It looks like Sky have closed the book on our next manager betting
Means absolutely nothing. Odds available elsewhere plus these markets are not necessarily a good indicator.

I think it suggests there is no one lined up to immediately take over.

RVclaret
Posts: 13836
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:30 am
Been Liked: 3707 times
Has Liked: 2499 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by RVclaret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:06 pm

Bigvince wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:02 pm
Cheers, if book is being closed a candidate may well of been selected
Interesting one. No rumours anywhere at all. Could be a glitch on Sky’s end.

daveisaclaret
Posts: 2058
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 9:23 pm
Been Liked: 1129 times
Has Liked: 94 times
Location: your mum

Re: Name the next manager

Post by daveisaclaret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:11 pm

It's probably closed because it's 6PM on Easter Sunday and it's not a big enough market to bother having someone monitor it in case news breaks.
This user liked this post: NL Claret

jedi_master
Posts: 7104
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:33 pm
Been Liked: 3580 times
Has Liked: 1023 times
Location: Chesterfield

Re: Name the next manager

Post by jedi_master » Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:12 pm

Oddschecker has Wilder as favourite at 2/1

Claretitus
Posts: 1257
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 10:39 pm
Been Liked: 327 times
Has Liked: 199 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Claretitus » Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:15 pm

jedi_master wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:12 pm
Oddschecker has Wilder as favourite at 2/1
I’d like it, but can’t see it happening

Pearcey
Posts: 3376
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 12:59 pm
Been Liked: 1140 times
Has Liked: 1439 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Pearcey » Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:20 pm

Don’t get the Wilder thing to be honest. Good manager and seems a good bloke but he’s not an upgrade on Dyche. Got Sheff Utd promoted and had 1 good premier league season. Spent good money and was relegated.

NL Claret
Posts: 2006
Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2016 12:37 pm
Been Liked: 515 times
Has Liked: 209 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by NL Claret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:22 pm

Steve Coppell

Pearcey
Posts: 3376
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 12:59 pm
Been Liked: 1140 times
Has Liked: 1439 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Pearcey » Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:24 pm

NL Claret wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:22 pm
Steve Coppell
Could do a job on the wing!

Milltown1882
Posts: 3063
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2016 5:47 pm
Been Liked: 1102 times
Has Liked: 854 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Milltown1882 » Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:46 pm

NL Claret wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:05 pm
Means absolutely nothing. Odds available elsewhere plus these markets are not necessarily a good indicator.

I think it suggests there is no one lined up to immediately take over.
It means nothing. I made a lot of money off Nuno to Spurs last year on this exact situation. Odds will fluctuate over the next few days.

NL Claret
Posts: 2006
Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2016 12:37 pm
Been Liked: 515 times
Has Liked: 209 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by NL Claret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 7:01 pm

Milltown1882 wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:46 pm
It means nothing. I made a lot of money off Nuno to Spurs last year on this exact situation. Odds will fluctuate over the next few days.
The only market like this I've made decent money off was Avram Grant going to Chelsea, that was just a hunch. Knew that Keith Hill had an interview at Burnley but Dyche blew him out of the water with his presentation. Keegan going to City was one I had inside info on, only had a Hills account at the time and they weren't running a book.

A small punt in a market like these can dramatically change the price.
This user liked this post: Milltown1882

Steddyman
Posts: 2402
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 3:45 pm
Been Liked: 624 times
Has Liked: 491 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Steddyman » Sun Apr 17, 2022 7:27 pm

spt_claret wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:39 am
We are not going to be able to appoint someone who isn't a collosal gamble, doesn't come with a ton of downsides, or isn't extremely extremely expensive. Or possibly 2/3.

Call me fun at parties,glass half empty Dyche worshipper all you want. This is nothing to do with Dyche. He's now gone. This is to do with the realistic prospect of these candidates.
You are not a glass half empty, you are a glass completely empty. And also wrong.
These 3 users liked this post: RVclaret Claretitus Jörmungandr

Long Time Lurker
Posts: 1313
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2017 8:12 pm
Been Liked: 603 times
Has Liked: 420 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Long Time Lurker » Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:23 pm

I tuned in for todays match, noticed Dyche was absent from the side lines, did some quick google fu and learned he was sacked on Friday.

Shock, stunned and gutted. I'm guessing that our relegation plight brought forward conversations that were being scheduled for the end of the season.

Taking into account our inability to attract any new investments of any note and our substantial financial outgoings I fully expected a fire sale and a lot of players being released at the end of the season, up or down.

If that was the case then I can't imagine it would have gone down well with Dyche, especially if the main voice in our recruitment discussions and what could be a complete team overhaul is Michael Smith and his special sauce.

I'm still processing the departure of Dyche and pretty much all of our backroom staff. It hasn't quite sunk in yet.

Looking at how we set up and played today, pretty much giving up the wings and playing tight through the centre, along with the wacky idea of playing Dwight back on the right and then pulling him off and replacing him with Vydra ?, I wouldn't be surprised to see Jason Kreis in our future. Our tactics for today had his favoured 4 - 4 - 2 Diamond written all over them.

Above and beyond that we look to be setting ourselves up for the St Louis Blues Mk2 plan I mentioned when ALK first took over. Sell everything that isn't nailed down, release the older players who won't play for peanuts to reduce the wage bill and sign some youngsters.

The problem is that American sports reward teams for being crap. If a team is crap they don't get relegated, so their revenue stream remains intact, and they get rewarded with the higher draft picks that they can use to secure the best young talent or use as valuable bargaining chips for established players. A dedicated long term period of rebuilding is possible in American Sports, in England rebuilding can see a team fall and fall.

Ripping everything up and starting from scratch is what Checketts did at St Louis. However, they reaped the benefits of being crap and kept their fans interested ( and maintained game income, which counts for more in American sports ) with a stream of media releases centred on the new young players.

The team gradually improved over a period of six years, but not by any great leaps. Checketts ran out of money, the loan repayments bit deep, and the 20% ownership held by Checketts in the form of SCP Worldwide wasn't enough to sway Tower Brook Partners from forcing through a sale with their 70% stake. Checketts couldn't find any new investors and the sale dragged on for a ridiculous amount of time. Finally, the club was sold off to Tom Stillman who previously held a 10% stake. Stillman secured new investment for the club, improved the team enormously and they have gone from strength to strength under his tenure.

It isn't that far removed from the Real Salt Lake experience. Checketts buys the club as part of an investment group. Money is spent like water and no significant investment is secured, Salt lake city are manoeuvred into funding a new stadium that doesn't generate the envisioned income streams, the investors get cold feet ( or in the case of Lehman brothers collapse ) making it difficult to negotiate cheap finance, everything that can be easily sold off is sold off and then the club itself is sold to a minority investor to avoid it going bust.

Can anybody see a pattern ?

Even with our PL revenue stream we aren't earning enough to pay our ongoing costs, cover our debts and pay for a complete team rebuild with PL quality players. The money simply isn't there, it can't be, and ALK's failure to develop new revenue streams or attract new investors has put us in a dire financial pickle. We are paying the price for a leveraged buyout that was orchestrated by an investment group with no serious money. It is the same story, different club and probably the same eventual outcome.

If we go down the fire sale will begin and the bulk of the money will be used to pay off our debts to Dell and Garlick. Not doing that would be very risky and more than likely financial suicide. Our under performing recruitment team will then be tasked with a complete squad rebuild. That won't be easy given the left over money they will have to work with, our reduced pulling power as a Championship club, the absence of anything solid to build on, a new manager and diminished appeal for foreign players. What foreign player is going to leave the top league of another country to come and play in the Championship ? Not many I suspect, which will leave us paying a premium for domestic players.

If we stay up we will have to give new contracts to a lot of players who will expect PL wages and probably more than one year. If we can't sign them up then we would have to replace them, which we can't afford to do. The problem is that we can't really afford to stay up and we can't really afford to be relegated.

The problem is a consequence of our awful recruitment over the past 3 or 4 seasons. We had money to spend, the impetus to spend it was there at the start, but our disaster of a technical director stretched the budget by signing journeymen and then targeted players who weren't going to come here as a big additions. The money built up in our dry powder store, we didn't freshen up the squad with younger players, we directed transfer fees and wages to securing the services of more veterans, our situation got worse and the money in our dry powder store facilitated a leveraged buyout that would have appealed to any business minded individual.

It is a clear and simple truth, a club can't afford to have a bad transfer window and we had several on the trot. The last window was a run around emergency affair when we responded to an unexpected event. In the Summer we didn't do what we needed to do. We needed a central midfielder and a new right winger of quality. Lennon has done really well, but fresh legs in those areas would have benefitted our performance levels hugely this season. Instead we got a hot and cold Cornet who didn't suit how we played under Dyche when we had McNeill for the left wing. We signed up Collins who looks good, albeit a little raw and a cheap Roberts and a backup goalkeeper because BPF isn't good enough. Apart from that we chased after another left winger in the form of the veteran Orsic when we were struggling to accommodate Cornet - which was bonkers.

We are paying the price for a long period of poor recruitment that was muppet minded by an awful technical director. The only saving grace was that until the buyout went through we had cash in the dry powder store to pay for a rebuild and the option to increase our cash reserves with a small manageable loan on top of that.

Being bought out by a cash strapped ALK condemned us to an uncertain future in the Championship - sooner or later. With everything to do and no real money to do everything that needs to be done the question is how far could we fall and will a new manager really make a positive difference in terms of preventing that decline ?

We should have stuck with Dyche

Vegas Claret
Posts: 30275
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:00 am
Been Liked: 10917 times
Has Liked: 5594 times
Location: clue is in the title

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Vegas Claret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:27 pm

Pearcey wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:20 pm
Don’t get the Wilder thing to be honest. Good manager and seems a good bloke but he’s not an upgrade on Dyche. Got Sheff Utd promoted and had 1 good premier league season. Spent good money and was relegated.
me neither, spent loads and then complained it wasn't enough

TheFamilyCat
Posts: 10843
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:56 pm
Been Liked: 5521 times
Has Liked: 208 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by TheFamilyCat » Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:36 pm

Long Time Lurker wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:23 pm
I tuned in for todays match, noticed Dyche was absent from the side lines, did some quick google fu and learned he was sacked on Friday.
You're a Burnley fan who didn't know Dyche had been sacked? Do you live in a cave?
These 2 users liked this post: Taffy on the wing RVclaret

RVclaret
Posts: 13836
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:30 am
Been Liked: 3707 times
Has Liked: 2499 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by RVclaret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:41 pm

TheFamilyCat wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:36 pm
You're a Burnley fan who didn't know Dyche had been sacked? Do you live in a cave?
Didn’t know Dyche was sacked yet seems to know exactly what will happen with ALK and our club from here. :lol:
This user liked this post: Jörmungandr

Middle-agedClaret
Posts: 1039
Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2016 7:55 pm
Been Liked: 314 times
Has Liked: 1069 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Middle-agedClaret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:41 pm

TheFamilyCat wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:36 pm
You're a Burnley fan who didn't know Dyche had been sacked? Do you live in a cave?
He/she probably has a full and challenging life.
This user liked this post: Long Time Lurker

Zom Zom
Posts: 1767
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 8:20 pm
Been Liked: 688 times
Has Liked: 917 times
Location: The Park

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Zom Zom » Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:46 pm

Penwortham_Claret wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:46 pm
It looks like Sky have closed the book on our next manager betting
Seems to be open now. BFS the favourite at 7/4

Long Time Lurker
Posts: 1313
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2017 8:12 pm
Been Liked: 603 times
Has Liked: 420 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Long Time Lurker » Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:51 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:41 pm
Didn’t know Dyche was sacked yet seems to know exactly what will happen with ALK and our club from here. :lol:
I know what happens when somebody asks for a pound and you only have 10p in your pocket.

Winstonswhite
Posts: 2530
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:04 am
Been Liked: 605 times
Has Liked: 309 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Winstonswhite » Sun Apr 17, 2022 9:15 pm

Pearcey wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:20 pm
Don’t get the Wilder thing to be honest. Good manager and seems a good bloke but he’s not an upgrade on Dyche. Got Sheff Utd promoted and had 1 good premier league season. Spent good money and was relegated.
If you’re looking someone with a better record than Dyche you’ll be looking for a long long time.

boatshed bill
Posts: 15108
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:47 am
Been Liked: 3138 times
Has Liked: 6682 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by boatshed bill » Sun Apr 17, 2022 9:21 pm

Vegas Claret wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:27 pm
me neither, spent loads and then complained it wasn't enough
TBF, it clearly wasn't. :D

JohnDearyMe
Posts: 2723
Joined: Fri Jan 29, 2016 2:31 pm
Been Liked: 666 times
Has Liked: 2041 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by JohnDearyMe » Sun Apr 17, 2022 9:25 pm

Long Time Lurker wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:23 pm
I tuned in for todays match, noticed Dyche was absent from the side lines, did some quick google fu and learned he was sacked on Friday.

Shock, stunned and gutted. I'm guessing that our relegation plight brought forward conversations that were being scheduled for the end of the season.

Taking into account our inability to attract any new investments of any note and our substantial financial outgoings I fully expected a fire sale and a lot of players being released at the end of the season, up or down.

If that was the case then I can't imagine it would have gone down well with Dyche, especially if the main voice in our recruitment discussions and what could be a complete team overhaul is Michael Smith and his special sauce.

I'm still processing the departure of Dyche and pretty much all of our backroom staff. It hasn't quite sunk in yet.

Looking at how we set up and played today, pretty much giving up the wings and playing tight through the centre, along with the wacky idea of playing Dwight back on the right and then pulling him off and replacing him with Vydra ?, I wouldn't be surprised to see Jason Kreis in our future. Our tactics for today had his favoured 4 - 4 - 2 Diamond written all over them.

Above and beyond that we look to be setting ourselves up for the St Louis Blues Mk2 plan I mentioned when ALK first took over. Sell everything that isn't nailed down, release the older players who won't play for peanuts to reduce the wage bill and sign some youngsters.

The problem is that American sports reward teams for being crap. If a team is crap they don't get relegated, so their revenue stream remains intact, and they get rewarded with the higher draft picks that they can use to secure the best young talent or use as valuable bargaining chips for established players. A dedicated long term period of rebuilding is possible in American Sports, in England rebuilding can see a team fall and fall.

Ripping everything up and starting from scratch is what Checketts did at St Louis. However, they reaped the benefits of being crap and kept their fans interested ( and maintained game income, which counts for more in American sports ) with a stream of media releases centred on the new young players.

The team gradually improved over a period of six years, but not by any great leaps. Checketts ran out of money, the loan repayments bit deep, and the 20% ownership held by Checketts in the form of SCP Worldwide wasn't enough to sway Tower Brook Partners from forcing through a sale with their 70% stake. Checketts couldn't find any new investors and the sale dragged on for a ridiculous amount of time. Finally, the club was sold off to Tom Stillman who previously held a 10% stake. Stillman secured new investment for the club, improved the team enormously and they have gone from strength to strength under his tenure.

It isn't that far removed from the Real Salt Lake experience. Checketts buys the club as part of an investment group. Money is spent like water and no significant investment is secured, Salt lake city are manoeuvred into funding a new stadium that doesn't generate the envisioned income streams, the investors get cold feet ( or in the case of Lehman brothers collapse ) making it difficult to negotiate cheap finance, everything that can be easily sold off is sold off and then the club itself is sold to a minority investor to avoid it going bust.

Can anybody see a pattern ?

Even with our PL revenue stream we aren't earning enough to pay our ongoing costs, cover our debts and pay for a complete team rebuild with PL quality players. The money simply isn't there, it can't be, and ALK's failure to develop new revenue streams or attract new investors has put us in a dire financial pickle. We are paying the price for a leveraged buyout that was orchestrated by an investment group with no serious money. It is the same story, different club and probably the same eventual outcome.

If we go down the fire sale will begin and the bulk of the money will be used to pay off our debts to Dell and Garlick. Not doing that would be very risky and more than likely financial suicide. Our under performing recruitment team will then be tasked with a complete squad rebuild. That won't be easy given the left over money they will have to work with, our reduced pulling power as a Championship club, the absence of anything solid to build on, a new manager and diminished appeal for foreign players. What foreign player is going to leave the top league of another country to come and play in the Championship ? Not many I suspect, which will leave us paying a premium for domestic players.

If we stay up we will have to give new contracts to a lot of players who will expect PL wages and probably more than one year. If we can't sign them up then we would have to replace them, which we can't afford to do. The problem is that we can't really afford to stay up and we can't really afford to be relegated.

The problem is a consequence of our awful recruitment over the past 3 or 4 seasons. We had money to spend, the impetus to spend it was there at the start, but our disaster of a technical director stretched the budget by signing journeymen and then targeted players who weren't going to come here as a big additions. The money built up in our dry powder store, we didn't freshen up the squad with younger players, we directed transfer fees and wages to securing the services of more veterans, our situation got worse and the money in our dry powder store facilitated a leveraged buyout that would have appealed to any business minded individual.

It is a clear and simple truth, a club can't afford to have a bad transfer window and we had several on the trot. The last window was a run around emergency affair when we responded to an unexpected event. In the Summer we didn't do what we needed to do. We needed a central midfielder and a new right winger of quality. Lennon has done really well, but fresh legs in those areas would have benefitted our performance levels hugely this season. Instead we got a hot and cold Cornet who didn't suit how we played under Dyche when we had McNeill for the left wing. We signed up Collins who looks good, albeit a little raw and a cheap Roberts and a backup goalkeeper because BPF isn't good enough. Apart from that we chased after another left winger in the form of the veteran Orsic when we were struggling to accommodate Cornet - which was bonkers.

We are paying the price for a long period of poor recruitment that was muppet minded by an awful technical director. The only saving grace was that until the buyout went through we had cash in the dry powder store to pay for a rebuild and the option to increase our cash reserves with a small manageable loan on top of that.

Being bought out by a cash strapped ALK condemned us to an uncertain future in the Championship - sooner or later. With everything to do and no real money to do everything that needs to be done the question is how far could we fall and will a new manager really make a positive difference in terms of preventing that decline ?

We should have stuck with Dyche
Nurse!!
This user liked this post: Jörmungandr

clarethomer
Posts: 3104
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:24 am
Been Liked: 942 times
Has Liked: 410 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by clarethomer » Sun Apr 17, 2022 9:54 pm

Winstonswhite wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 9:15 pm
If you’re looking someone with a better record than Dyche you’ll be looking for a long long time.
Depends over what timeframe you are looking at?

Last 9.5 years probably looks much better than this season (and possibly last 2).

Not many managers perform for the length of time he has either.

Vegas Claret
Posts: 30275
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:00 am
Been Liked: 10917 times
Has Liked: 5594 times
Location: clue is in the title

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Vegas Claret » Sun Apr 17, 2022 10:15 pm

boatshed bill wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 9:21 pm
TBF, it clearly wasn't. :D
:lol: :D truth

ClaretMov
Posts: 2499
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2019 3:13 pm
Been Liked: 843 times
Has Liked: 822 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by ClaretMov » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:07 am

CardyTheClaret wrote:
Sun Apr 17, 2022 12:06 pm
Not strictly true. He was doing a cracking job at Watford.
Totally true, before he came to Burnley he was unknown, he was at Watford in his first ever manager's Job, he was in charge for 1 single season, they finished 11th, winning just 16 games and conceding 64 goals hardly cracking was it ??

CardyTheClaret
Posts: 392
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 7:22 am
Been Liked: 190 times
Has Liked: 114 times
Location: Barrowford

Re: Name the next manager

Post by CardyTheClaret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 7:15 am

ClaretMov wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:07 am
Totally true, before he came to Burnley he was unknown, he was at Watford in his first ever manager's Job, he was in charge for 1 single season, they finished 11th, winning just 16 games and conceding 64 goals hardly cracking was it ??
It’s simply not true that he had zero experience. That’s what you said. Also, the end of that season he had a great run once his system was in place.

Kevwando
Posts: 278
Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2016 7:37 am
Been Liked: 37 times
Has Liked: 37 times
Contact:

Re: Name the next manager

Post by Kevwando » Mon Apr 18, 2022 7:37 am

Jackson until the end of the season and then appoint a foreign manager.

gavster
Posts: 53
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 9:36 am
Been Liked: 2 times
Has Liked: 6 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by gavster » Mon Apr 18, 2022 7:46 am

I know this is a bit off a strange in and won’t happen but I’d love to see Joachim Löw here.

ClaretMov
Posts: 2499
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2019 3:13 pm
Been Liked: 843 times
Has Liked: 822 times

Re: Name the next manager

Post by ClaretMov » Mon Apr 18, 2022 9:35 am

CardyTheClaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 7:15 am
It’s simply not true that he had zero experience. That’s what you said. Also, the end of that season he had a great run once his system was in place.
You are missing my point, some fan's want a well known manager with plenty of experience because some have moaned about the possibility of appointing Duff, I was pointing out that Dyche had neither when we he was given the job at Burnley, and sometimes taking a risk can pay off

On that great run you say he had at the end of the season, he won 1 from his last 6 games and won just 3 more games in total in the second half of the the season compared to the first

Post Reply