Where has the 100m gone

123EasyasBFC · Post by **123EasyasBFC** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:20 pm

We have spent close to 100m and there’s not a single player who looks genuine starting 11 quality as of yet, would over spending on tella, Maatsen and getting THB back on loan been such a bad idea to go with Beyer.

8m - O’Shea looks shocking business
14m - on Trafford looks shocking business
14m - Ramsey not even making match day squad - how can we afford to keep 14m out the squad
2m - 4th choice at Anderlect in delcroix
12m - berge who kompany seems to think is a CDM
9m - Odobert who yes has talent but is he really going to be affective
15m - in summer on tresor who looks so weak
15m - Amdouni who we don’t know where to play him

Aclaret · Post by **Aclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:26 pm

Frightening figures for the return we have received......up to now.

123EasyasBFC · Post by **123EasyasBFC** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:33 pm

Tella - 18m
THB - loan with option
Maatsen - 20m early in summer before he did well in pre season
Koleosho - 2m
Redmond - free
Larsen - loan
Then an actual CDM would of been much better window

DCWat · Post by **DCWat** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:34 pm

What I also wonder, is who we have at the club that has the footballing background, nouse and authority to rein Kompany in.

Were no questions asked when wingers kept rolling through the door with no sign of bolstering midfield or full back positions. Who queried sending McNally out on loan to then spend seven million quid on O’Shea?

I could go on, but it seems that free rein has been given for the signing of players that we might turn a profit on. Scant regard has been given to building a team, strong across the park and with obvious leaders.

I’m not advocating that Kompany should go but there are some big questions that need answering and plenty of solutions that need to be found - which are likely going to cost many millions more.

The other issue (aside from relegation) is what value we might actually achieve from the huge sums we have spent. Playing this way, there won’t be many, if any, increasing in value.

123EasyasBFC · Post by **123EasyasBFC** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:35 pm

DCWat wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:34 pm
What I also wonder, is who we have at the club that has the footballing background, nouse and authority to rein Kompany in.

Were no questions asked when wingers kept rolling through the door with no sign of bolstering midfield or full back positions. Who queried sending McNally out on loan to then spend seven million quid on O’Shea?

I could go on, but it seems that free rein has been given for the signing of players that we might turn a profit on. Scant regard has been given to building a team, strong across the park and with obvious leaders.

I’m not advocating that Kompany should go but there are some big questions that need answering and plenty of solutions that need to be found - which are likely going to cost many millions more.

The other issue (aside from relegation) is what value we might actually achieve from the huge sums we have spent. Playing this way, there won’t be many, if any, increasing in value.

Paul Jenkins took up more of a director role with first term from the academy this summer I think

CoolClaret · Post by **CoolClaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:54 pm

DCWat wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:34 pm
What I also wonder, is who we have at the club that has the footballing background, nouse and authority to rein Kompany in.

Part of me thinks he has managed to gain some extra influence after signing the contract extension.

I'd kill to see the breakdown of the deal with his MUD analytics company as well. Something seems a bit off to me.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:01 pm

CoolClaret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:54 pm
Part of me thinks he has managed to gain some extra influence after signing the contract extension.

I'd kill to see the breakdown of the deal with his MUD analytics company as well. Something seems a bit off to me.

What do we mean by extra influence in comparison to the influence he would have had on signings last season?

RVclaret · Post by **RVclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:02 pm

CoolClaret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:54 pm
Part of me thinks he has managed to gain some extra influence after signing the contract extension.

I'd kill to see the breakdown of the deal with his MUD analytics company as well. Something seems a bit off to me.

There were no complaints at last summers business though? He had just as much influence in that one.

ElectroClaret · Post by **ElectroClaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:04 pm

O'Shea for me is a really poor signing, no more than a fairly average Championship player, nowhere near
PL requirements.

123EasyasBFC · Post by **123EasyasBFC** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:08 pm

ElectroClaret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:04 pm
O'Shea for me is a really poor signing, no more than a fairly average Championship player, nowhere near
PL requirements.

O’Shea 100x better in last 2 games than al-dakhil

JohnMcGreal · Post by **JohnMcGreal** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:09 pm

DCWat wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:34 pm
What I also wonder, is who we have at the club that has the footballing background, nouse and authority to rein Kompany in.

Were no questions asked when wingers kept rolling through the door with no sign of bolstering midfield or full back positions. Who queried sending McNally out on loan to then spend seven million quid on O’Shea?

I could go on, but it seems that free rein has been given for the signing of players that we might turn a profit on. Scant regard has been given to building a team, strong across the park and with obvious leaders.

What makes you think it was the manager driving that?

Newcastleclaret93 · Post by **Newcastleclaret93** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:10 pm

JohnMcGreal wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:09 pm
What makes you think it was the manager driving that?

Didn’t nearly every player say they came in because of VK?

To me that means he was heavily involved if not driving it

CoolClaret · Post by **CoolClaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:11 pm

RVclaret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:02 pm
There were no complaints at last summers business though? He had just as much influence in that one.

Not so certainm happy to be wrong though.

McNally, Twine, Tella deals maybe had influence from elsewhere?

Also operated on a tighter budget which imo led to getting needs rather than wants, if that makes sense?

JohnMcGreal · Post by **JohnMcGreal** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:13 pm

Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:10 pm
Didn’t nearly every player say they came in because of VK?

To me that means he was heavily involved if not driving it

He's a pull factor, for sure. But do we know who at the club was largely responsible for this particular recruitment strategy?

ElectroClaret · Post by **ElectroClaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:15 pm

123EasyasBFC wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:08 pm
O’Shea 100x better in last 2 games than al-dakhil

Maybe.
That's not exactly a high bar though, is it?

The point being that we already had al dakhil at the club, but then went out of our way to get O'Shea in.
Im just wondering what exactly VK saw in him.
Eight million does seem a tad fierce.

123EasyasBFC · Post by **123EasyasBFC** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:17 pm

ElectroClaret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:15 pm
Maybe.
That's not exactly a high bar though, is it?

The point being that we already had al dakhil at the club, but then went out of our way to get O'Shea in.
Im just wondering what exactly VK saw in him.
Eight million does seem a tad fierce.

No the bar isn’t high and kompany clearly didn’t rate Ekdal to start him in cup and not first 2 league games

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:18 pm

123EasyasBFC wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:08 pm
O’Shea 100x better in last 2 games than al-dakhil

The problem here is that any defensive partnership relies on both being on the ball (so to speak).
This is clearly not our No1 CD partnership, there is little gained by singling either out as being the worse of the two.

DCWat · Post by **DCWat** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:19 pm

JohnMcGreal wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:09 pm
What makes you think it was the manager driving that?

It appears that he has significant control of recruitment and the analytics that determine the players being recruited.

I have a concern that Pace and his team have placed all of their eggs in Kompany’s basket and that there is no one there to question the footballing decisions.

I could be completely wrong. Jenkins is mentioned further up the thread, do we know what his role and authority in the process is?

kentonclaret · Post by **kentonclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:20 pm

Burnley won promotion from the Championship predominately with players newly signed by Kompany who had no previous experience of the Premier League. Some of these players who had PL experience were not retained (Tella, Maatsen etc) leaving us with a squad totally unprepared for the challenges ahead. VK failed to add any players of true PL quality.
Compare that to Leicester who, despite having sold some star names, still have a squad full of plenty of PL experience so will be far better prepared when they inevitably come straight back up.

ElectroClaret · Post by **ElectroClaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:25 pm

123EasyasBFC wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:17 pm
...kompany clearly didn’t rate Ekdal to start him in cup and not first 2 league games

Well he was wrong. (Or Ekdal wasn't fully fit.)
And Ekdal now would 100% start ahead of O'Shea when fit which i hope would be pretty obvious to everyone.

123EasyasBFC · Post by **123EasyasBFC** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:30 pm

ElectroClaret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:25 pm
Well he was wrong. (Or Ekdal wasn't fully fit.)
And Ekdal now would 100% start ahead of O'Shea when fit which i hope would be pretty obvious to everyone.

Ekdal the best defender easily, he’s better than Beyer just not as quick

Anonymous Claret · Post by **Anonymous Claret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:33 pm

DCWat wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:34 pm
What I also wonder, is who we have at the club that has the footballing background, nouse and authority to rein Kompany in.

Were no questions asked when wingers kept rolling through the door with no sign of bolstering midfield or full back positions. Who queried sending McNally out on loan to then spend seven million quid on O’Shea?

I could go on, but it seems that free rein has been given for the signing of players that we might turn a profit on. Scant regard has been given to building a team, strong across the park and with obvious leaders.

I’m not advocating that Kompany should go but there are some big questions that need answering and plenty of solutions that need to be found - which are likely going to cost many millions more.

The other issue (aside from relegation) is what value we might actually achieve from the huge sums we have spent. Playing this way, there won’t be many, if any, increasing in value.

I think Pace is fully on board with the buying policy. The only thing that he is thinking when buying these young players is how much his assets (players) can increase in value. Pace and co are only interested in 1 thing and that is making tonnes of cash. It is a very high risk strategy but he probably thought after last season that Kompany deserved to be trusted in his recruitment. Obviously in hindsight at the moment it looks like mistake from all involved and everyone was too ambitious in that plan.
On a much larger scale Chelsea have employed a similar policy buying lots of young players and tying them down to long contracts. Both Pace and Boehly come from investment banking backgrounds and they have both been fully aware when investing millions into their projects.

kentonclaret · Post by **kentonclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:40 pm

When we were relegated we failed to retain enough young players who had PL experience, just some of the old guard not capable of making any real impact.
VK ended up signing a whole raft of new players with no previous PL experience and sadly it isn’t working. Although Leicester sold some of their star names they still retained a core of younger players with PL experience.

DCWat · Post by **DCWat** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:49 pm

Anonymous Claret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:33 pm
I think Pace is fully on board with the buying policy. The only thing that he is thinking when buying these young players is how much his assets (players) can increase in value. Pace and co are only interested in 1 thing and that is making tonnes of cash. It is a very high risk strategy but he probably thought after last season that Kompany deserved to be trusted in his recruitment. Obviously in hindsight at the moment it looks like mistake from all involved and everyone was too ambitious in that plan.
On a much larger scale Chelsea have employed a similar policy buying lots of young players and tying them down to long contracts. Both Pace and Boehly come from investment banking backgrounds and they have both been fully aware when investing millions into their projects.

I’m on board with a policy to buy well and sell for a profit. What I don’t see though is how we can have spent as significantly as we have (bigger sums than we ever have before) and still be questioning why key areas were not addressed.

We are hindering the potential to sell players at a profit because of the summer’s dealings. Koleosho aside (and his decent performances seem an age ago) which of the summer recruits can we say we have been given a platform from which to showcase their talents?

The set up and recruitment shortcomings are biting us right on the arse.

Tufty · Post by **Tufty** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:52 pm

Hindsight, as they say, is a wonderful thing. But I've got to say, I was surprised at the time that we didn't match the asking price for Tella and Maatsen. Also surprised we'd fork out 15m on a keeper when Muric had earned his right to be first choice. O'Shea I'd never heard of whilst McNally at Coventry was getting nothing but praise. Obafemi always flattered to deceive at Swansea so that was a strange one too.

BurnleyFC · Post by **BurnleyFC** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:54 pm

Can’t see any of the summer’s recruits making any sort of profit, to be honest. We certainly wouldn’t be recouping our outlay on them all just yet.

The only saving grace with relegation is we might not be forced into signing the likes of Tresor, or anyone else we have an obligation on.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:55 pm

Tufty wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:52 pm
Hindsight, as they say, is a wonderful thing. But I've got to say, I was surprised at the time that we didn't match the asking price for Tella and Maatsen. Also surprised we'd fork out 15m on a keeper when Muric had earned his right to be first choice. O'Shea I'd never heard of whilst McNally at Coventry was getting nothing but praise. Obafemi always flattered to deceive at Swansea so that was a strange one too.

I think they still have an eye on the possibility of relegation and who we could keep who would be nailed on Championship promotion candidates.

Boss Hogg · Post by **Boss Hogg** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:58 pm

DCWat wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:19 pm
It appears that he has significant control of recruitment and the analytics that determine the players being recruited.

I have a concern that Pace and his team have placed all of their eggs in Kompany’s basket and that there is no one there to question the footballing decisions.

I could be completely wrong. Jenkins is mentioned further up the thread, do we know what his role and authority in the process is?

The above reflects my thoughts too. The board don’t really know that much about the playing side. They are putting all their faith in Kompany which is a fine when it’s been going well but it is a high risk game. These signings needed more questioning. Future value is a nice idea but if we carry on like this not many will have add on value and we get relegated anyway.

The board are great at brand promotion and the marketing side of things along with releasing the purse strings. Think it’s fair to say they might be naive about some aspects of football. Think we would have benefitted from a proper Director of Football in the close season.

Walkerpool · Post by **Walkerpool** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:00 pm

123EasyasBFC wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:33 pm
Tella - 18m
THB - loan with option
Maatsen - 20m early in summer before he did well in pre season
Koleosho - 2m
Redmond - free
Larsen - loan
Then an actual CDM would of been much better window

I've been saying the same since the start of the season

claret2018 · Post by **claret2018** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:04 pm

Is Tella injured? He’s only played twice since his move to Germany

Newcastleclaret93 · Post by **Newcastleclaret93** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:06 pm

claret2018 wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:04 pm
Is Tella injured? He’s only played twice since his move to Germany

No just not playing

Pickles · Post by **Pickles** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:07 pm

claret2018 wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:04 pm
Is Tella injured? He’s only played twice since his move to Germany

Seven times. Four in the Bundesliga (but off the bench) and three in the Europe League.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:11 pm

123EasyasBFC wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:30 pm
Ekdal the best defender easily, he’s better than Beyer just not as quick

And he improves with every game he misses.
He may very well struggle just as much as all our other defenders have.

Anonymous Claret · Post by **Anonymous Claret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:36 pm

DCWat wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:49 pm
I’m on board with a policy to buy well and sell for a profit. What I don’t see though is how we can have spent as significantly as we have (bigger sums than we ever have before) and still be questioning why key areas were not addressed.

We are hindering the potential to sell players at a profit because of the summer’s dealings. Koleosho aside (and his decent performances seem an age ago) which of the summer recruits can we say we have been given a platform from which to showcase their talents?

The set up and recruitment shortcomings are biting us right on the arse.

Fully agree. At the time I was very happy with all the signings. On reflection I can see the problems that over buying in 1 area and failing to invest in other areas has created. I am pretty sure that Pace and Kompany are also aware of this and privately admit this fact. It wouldn't surprise me if some of our Summer recruits leave in January either permanently or on loan. I am still on board with the policy of buying young players and developing those players as I see it as the only way our club can be sustainable. We just need to learn from this Summer's mistakes which I am sure that we will do.

CoolClaret · Post by **CoolClaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:42 pm

Anonymous Claret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:36 pm
Fully agree. At the time I was very happy with all the signings. On reflection I can see the problems that over buying in 1 area and failing to invest in other areas has created. I am pretty sure that Pace and Kompany are also aware of this and privately admit this fact. It wouldn't surprise me if some of our Summer recruits leave in January either permanently or on loan. I am still on board with the policy of buying young players and developing those players as I see it as the only way our club can be sustainable. We just need to learn from this Summer's mistakes which I am sure that we will do.

Our club was the definition of sustainable around sort of 2018/19

What's sustainable is buying players on contracts within our means and selling if a good offer comes in.

Speculating on talent on money we do not own is not sustainable.

RVclaret · Post by **RVclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:48 pm

CoolClaret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:42 pm
Our club was the definition of sustainable around sort of 2018/19

What's sustainable is buying players on contracts within our means and selling if a good offer comes in.

Speculating on talent on money we do not own is not sustainable.

You keep saying this without having any clue on what money we do or don’t have. Quite frustrating.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:59 pm

CoolClaret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:42 pm
Our club was the definition of sustainable around sort of 2018/19

What's sustainable is buying players on contracts within our means and selling if a good offer comes in.

But we didn't really do that, did we?

CoolClaret · Post by **CoolClaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 8:09 pm

boatshed bill wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:59 pm
But we didn't really do that, did we?

Yeah we did actually - Andre Gray, Michael Keane to name but two. Changed with the pandemic/sale of the club coming in.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 8:13 pm

CoolClaret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 8:09 pm
Yeah we did actually - Andre Gray, Michael Keane to name but two. Changed with the pandemic/sale of the club coming in.

They were sold around 2017.
The truth is that we held on to players and let them run down contracts after 2017.

CoolClaret · Post by **CoolClaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 8:17 pm

RVclaret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:48 pm
You keep saying this without having any clue on what money we do or don’t have. Quite frustrating.

I can't really be arsed to get into it but:

- Deffo some 'creative accounting' going re embargo etc
- We had a substantial amount of debt from the buyout that wasn't fully paid off last season
- This season we have had extra TV money yes but will still be paying for transfers from last year as well as this year
- We have also taken out extra loans and are clearly doing the 'loan with obligation to buy' to circumvent FFP / other measures.

That's more than fair. You may point to potential extra investment but again - that isn't money the club has naturally generated.

CoolClaret · Post by **CoolClaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 8:19 pm

boatshed bill wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 8:13 pm
They were sold around 2017.
The truth is that we held on to players and let them run down contracts after 2017.

That's because Garlick wanted to sell the club then the Pandemic it - Dyche tasked with staying in the league at all cost.

Lets not just pretend that we wasn't once possibly the most sustainable club in English football.

Cirrus_Minor · Post by **Cirrus_Minor** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 10:32 pm

Many of the new signings do not have the experience at Premier league level or the physicality. A few years back they would have only been signed for a fraction of what we paid and either sent out on loan or under 21s to get experience and hardened up. Its incredible that we have brought these in to improve or at least maintain the standards from last season. Questions need to be asked about how on Earth they were assessed by our club.

It would have surely been wiser to invest in at least some experienced players at this level, especially in defence and mid field.

ArmchairDetective · Post by **ArmchairDetective** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:25 am

I'll chip on this thread now the dust has settled.

I agree with previous sentiments that signing last season's loanees such as THB and Tella might have given us a better chance at the start of this season. What I would say is that it's very easy to assume that things would have been different had we signed them. There are no guarantees.

What that doesn't mean is that we should automatically be critical of the signings we did make. It's clear that it will take a couple of seasons at least before we can accurately judge 'where the £100m has gone', and we may well have unearthed a couple of gems that will make us an absolute fortune over the next couple of years. But that's the risk with the transfer model we have adopted, a model which I think the majority of fans would agree is the right model for a club in our position. The opposite would be buying for the now and trying to all but secure our position in the Premier League, but there's risk in that strategy too.

What I think is a better question than wondering where the money has gone is to question the decision making to throw so many newer recruits and inexperienced players into the starting line-up at the start of this season, at the expense of some of the more experienced players and players that were instrumental in last season's success. I think it would have been possible to pick up more points with the exact same squad we have now.

Cleveleys_claret · Post by **Cleveleys_claret** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:49 am

It's a project we have on our hands. It was said very early on that it would take a few years to come to fruition. I dont think anybody, Kompany included though last season would go so well. The problem was was that we had half a team made up of loanees. The summer before this we hardly had a player left, every asset had left. Kompany was left picking up the pieces of a team which had had its core ripped out of it. I think quite a lot are forgetting the state we were in.

Yes there have been mistakes in the summer regards recruitment but this 100m hasn't all been spent at once, it's spread over several years, 1 or 2 sales and that will cover that years payments on what is owed. Who thought Foster would be so good this year? Who thought Muric after those first 10 games would reach almost god like status with a group of fans? We have lots of assets that may take 1 or 2 years to even come close to their potential.

A problem I do think VK has is one similar to Eddie Howe when at Burnley and many said he struggled to work with older players. Maybe in time this is something which he will become better at like EH has. I personally think he has gone a lil overboard on the assets mantra. Every team needs a core of strong characters, I dont think Taylor is very vocal, Connor Roberts more a joker, Jay Rod just looks totally ruined as a player, Cork can't do it alone and especially now his partner in crime Barnes has gone.

When we go down this year which I am pretty sure we will, we will be in a position where we don't have to buy a whole new squad, bring in half teams worth of loanees.

When did we as fans suddenly become so expectant. The Dyche era is over, as great as it was. Last summer was a total reset of the club and it could have gone 2 ways...very very bad, or as it was The Greatest season I have witnessed in over 30 years as a Burnley fan. That has earned VK the right to make a few mistakes. We did that well last season I think it kind of set VK back a little, we were that good he hardly made any mistakes to learn from.

We need to see out this ride, we have had the fun part to begin with, now it's time to buckle in, take a little pain, hope we ride it out, if not...we have to still be as one and come back stronger...This squad with a couple of losses, 2 or 3 would be sold if relegated would absolutely rip up the Championship

ArmchairDetective · Post by **ArmchairDetective** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 12:01 pm

Cleveleys_claret wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:49 am
It's a project we have on our hands. It was said very early on that it would take a few years to come to fruition. I dont think anybody, Kompany included though last season would go so well. The problem was was that we had half a team made up of loanees. The summer before this we hardly had a player left, every asset had left. Kompany was left picking up the pieces of a team which had had its core ripped out of it. I think quite a lot are forgetting the state we were in.

Yes there have been mistakes in the summer regards recruitment but this 100m hasn't all been spent at once, it's spread over several years, 1 or 2 sales and that will cover that years payments on what is owed. Who thought Foster would be so good this year? Who thought Muric after those first 10 games would reach almost god like status with a group of fans? We have lots of assets that may take 1 or 2 years to even come close to their potential.

A problem I do think VK has is one similar to Eddie Howe when at Burnley and many said he struggled to work with older players. Maybe in time this is something which he will become better at like EH has. I personally think he has gone a lil overboard on the assets mantra. Every team needs a core of strong characters, I dont think Taylor is very vocal, Connor Roberts more a joker, Jay Rod just looks totally ruined as a player, Cork can't do it alone and especially now his partner in crime Barnes has gone.

When we go down this year which I am pretty sure we will, we will be in a position where we don't have to buy a whole new squad, bring in half teams worth of loanees.

When did we as fans suddenly become so expectant. The Dyche era is over, as great as it was. Last summer was a total reset of the club and it could have gone 2 ways...very very bad, or as it was The Greatest season I have witnessed in over 30 years as a Burnley fan. That has earned VK the right to make a few mistakes. We did that well last season I think it kind of set VK back a little, we were that good he hardly made any mistakes to learn from.

We need to see out this ride, we have had the fun part to begin with, now it's time to buckle in, take a little pain, hope we ride it out, if not...we have to still be as one and come back stronger...This squad with a couple of losses, 2 or 3 would be sold if relegated would absolutely rip up the Championship

Agree with most of this, Cleveleys. Though I'm still a little more optimistic (or naive) than you are about us staying up this season!

Carlos the Great · Post by **Carlos the Great** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 1:10 pm

Tufty wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:52 pm
Hindsight, as they say, is a wonderful thing. But I've got to say, I was surprised at the time that we didn't match the asking price for Tella and Maatsen. Also surprised we'd fork out 15m on a keeper when Muric had earned his right to be first choice. O'Shea I'd never heard of whilst McNally at Coventry was getting nothing but praise. Obafemi always flattered to deceive at Swansea so that was a strange one too.

It was a huge gamble getting virtually a new team .: Tella for me was the biggest mystery claiming don’t want give too much of our budget on 1 player .: then sign Amoudini .. Ramsey .. and Trafford each costing around the same money .. seemed madness .. I wanted to see how last years team did in the premier league ..with 3 or 4 quality additions

jlup1980 · Post by **jlup1980** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 2:12 pm

ElectroClaret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:04 pm
O'Shea for me is a really poor signing, no more than a fairly average Championship player, nowhere near
PL requirements.

O'Shea is a basic defender. A Kevin Long type. I suspect he was brought in originally as 4th choice behind Beyer, Ekdal and AAD. We then had the injury to Beyer which forced us to sign Delcroix as well - meaning we now have at least two CB's who aren't currently up to PL standard.

AAD is struggling as a result of this too. He's a young man with very little first team experience. He should have been blooded this season, playing mainly in the Cup competitions. Unfortunately he's played every game and has been RB, LB and CB at different times. All this whilst playing alongside different personnel every week. It's no surprise he looks a little lost at times, he's still learning. What he really needs is an experienced head next to him - similar to when Gary Cahill had John McGreal next to him - as there's no doubting AAD has talent.

CoolClaret · Post by **CoolClaret** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 2:17 pm

The 100 mill lost in the leveraged buyout or the transfer fees this season?

CoolClaret · Post by **CoolClaret** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 2:19 pm

jlup1980 wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 29, 2023 2:12 pm
O'Shea is a basic defender. A Kevin Long type. I suspect he was brought in originally as 4th choice behind Beyer, Ekdal and AAD.

He started at the beginning of the season ahead of Ekdal

bfcjg · Post by **bfcjg** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 2:29 pm

Considering the long glorious career VK had in the Premier league you'd have thought out of everyone at Turf Moor he would know how physical the Premier league is and bought accordingly.