January transfer window rumours.

[NewClaret]

Obafemi was another bizarre signing. We had a pretty good idea last January we were going to get promoted, yet we tied ourselves into a permanent deal when he'd never shown anything to suggest he'd be good enough for the Prem.

True but nothing was by any means guaranteed last January. I think we basically signed players we thought had potential to make the step up to the Prem within our levels of affordability at the time. So far only Foster of that group, has. AAD, Ekdal and Obafemi haven’t stepped up yet.

Doesn’t mean it was wrong to strengthen the squad last January with that level of quality for a Championship run in though.

[Newcastleclaret93]

The ones that go without loan options will unlikely leave in my opinion. So of that list maybe Churlinov and Roberts I’d agree. The others it’ll depend on how well they do on loan, if they go on loan, but it’ll be on our terms.

You don’t know any better than I do if any player we receive an offer for will be sold. Obviously you’d expect some movement if big offers come in (I think they will) but we won’t be seeing 15 players come in like we did last summer or the one prior. It’ll be nothing like that turnover.

This is currently what I’m expecting.

Players leaving in the summer:
Muric
Roberts (if not Jan)
Delcroix/Beyer I suspect one of them to leave and McNally take there place.
Taylor
Brownhill
Berge
Tresor (loan)
Odobert
Amdouni
Foster
Weghorst
Obafemi
Twine
Redmond
Benson (signed by whatever club he’s goes to on loan)
Jay

I suspect we will sign:

1 back up keeper
3 full backs
2 centre mids (possibly one if Massengo steps up)
2 wingers
2 forwards

[CoolClaret]

Funny those semantics always seem to show you exaggerating numbers though isn’t it ?

Nevertheless not really sure what point you are trying to make by quoting a fee from many years ago. You are asking another poster whether he is “numb” but your point is far from clear or accurate.

Blackburn paying £15m for Shearer just illustrates a point that has been there for 50 years or longer - some clubs are just richer than others and buy up the best players. It was just the same when the first £50,000 signing was made or Trevor Francis at a million etc

But it’s about strength in depth in the league that has changed. There is no league in the world where so many clubs spend so much money and what the statistics definitely do show you is that year on year this is increasing - so yes that will mean the overall league is getting stronger and stronger because more of the better players across the world are joining the league (and no that does not mean all the best players are in the PL).

Relative spend has got nothing to do with what people are saying - it’s strength in depth. When Blackburn were spending how many other teams in the league were matching their spend ? We now have most of the bottom half of the league spending £100m plus in one transfer window and a team in 9th place (and who did crap last year too) spending a billion pounds in a couple of years. There’s nothing “relative” about that at all.

Whether this is the hardest division or not this season I have no particular view or opinion…but it’s certainly one of them…just like last year was too.

When and what numbers have I 'exaggerated' and what is with an ad-hominem immediately to reply to my comment?

How is my point far from being 'clear or accurate'? I'm merely stating that spends have always been nuts in this league and I most certainly don't think that the league is improving at a rate some people like to make out.

How's United's spends ended for them? Bounced out of UCL by FC Copenhagen was it?

It's relative because the spend of bottom 10 PL teams in any year is always been significantly higher than teams in the Championship/Second tier.

Again, look at some of the teams in the lower half of the PL in years gone by, had genuine superstars playing for them - it's a tough league, always has been... What it doesn't mean is that the one year we happen to rejoin the league doesn't somehow make it 'the best PL ever' or some sort of insurmountable gap.

[bumba]

The ones that go without loan options will unlikely leave in my opinion. So of that list maybe Churlinov and Roberts I’d agree. The others it’ll depend on how well they do on loan, if they go on loan, but it’ll be on our terms.

You don’t know any better than I do if any player we receive an offer for will be sold. Obviously you’d expect some movement if big offers come in (I think they will) but we won’t be seeing 15 players come in like we did last summer or the one prior. It’ll be nothing like that turnover.

Benson looks like he wants out, Twine I think we want him out.
Benson, Twine, Obafemi, Roberts, Rodriguez, Cork, Muric, JBG I'd expect all to leave.
Fofana and JBL are only on loan, Fofana definitely won't be here, JBL not sure on details if we are relegated.
That's 10 players that need replacing before we even talk about the players who could potentially be sold.
I'd imagine Brownhill will go if a premier League club comes in for him, Amdouni I don't think will stay, Koleosho and Odabert are the two clubs will try to get.

[Westleigh]

Would imagine Jay Rod ,Roberts,Cork,and JBG we’re going to leave this summer whether we got relegated or not and apart from JBG they’ve hardly kicked a ball between them ,they will be on relatively big wages compared to some of the newer guys so it gives VK wiggle room to decide if he wants to bring in a couple on higher wages ,4 of a similar standard or a few more youngsters that won’t affect the squad size.

[burnmark]

Would imagine Jay Rod ,Roberts,Cork,and JBG we’re going to leave this summer whether we got relegated or not and apart from JBG they’ve hardly kicked a ball between them ,they will be on relatively big wages compared to some of the newer guys so it gives VK wiggle room to decide if he wants to bring in a couple on higher wages ,4 of a similar standard or a few more youngsters that won’t affect the squad size.

Gudmondsson has signed an extension hasn’t he?

[Big Vinny K]

When and what numbers have I 'exaggerated' and what is with an ad-hominem immediately to reply to my comment?

How is my point far from being 'clear or accurate'? I'm merely stating that spends have always been nuts in this league and I most certainly don't think that the league is improving at a rate some people like to make out.

How's United's spends ended for them? Bounced out of UCL by FC Copenhagen was it?

It's relative because the spend of bottom 10 PL teams in any year is always been significantly higher than teams in the Championship/Second tier.

Again, look at some of the teams in the lower half of the PL in years gone by, had genuine superstars playing for them - it's a tough league, always has been... What it doesn't mean is that the one year we happen to rejoin the league doesn't somehow make it 'the best PL ever' or some sort of insurmountable gap.

Of course spend has always been more in the premier league than the championship. That does not mean it is relative at all.
The “relative” relates to the amount of spend made by PL clubs on players compared to previous seasons and relatively speaking it is now a lot more and it’s increasing every year.
It’s also not about previously teams in the bottom half of the PL having really good players - everybody already knows that. It’s the amount of players in the league now and the strength of the squads. You only have to look at the benches and those not even on the bench of the teams in the bottom half to see players getting paid £100k a week and hardly getting a kick. Origi an example - going from a top 4 Italian team hardly getting on the pitch at a bottom 6 team (a bottom 6 team that has spent best part of 300 million in 2 seasons to be fighting regulation both years).

Not sure why it’s even a debate to be honest. The statistic about spend, team values, international players, wage bills etc etc are irrefutable

[boyyanno]

It depends on your perspective, we are that bad if you’re comparing us to the other established Prem sides, yes.

We’re 19th best team in the country with a squad stronger than all the teams in the league below, so as you say we’re in a pretty good position on the whole. We’re in an envious position to fans of any club outside the Prem which is why I find posts on here lacking balance sometimes.

I’d add that I think we’ve been pretty unlucky this season. The fixtures fell unkindly, I thought, VAR decisions (or lack of) have been particularly poor, we’ve also suffered injuries to key players like Foster, Koleosho and Beyer, and just generally not had anything go for us. Thats no excuse, you make your own luck, but I agree with Goliath’s post that we’re not a terrible team - just an inexperienced one.

I also agree that we need to learn from our mistakes and make sure we add more experience, but it’s also fair to say those players are in high demand and are often very expensive/after big final contracts so finding and affording them is not as easy as it is to type.

There's being overly negative but then there's being overly positive.

I mean it's debatable that we are the 19th best team in the country- given that means we will be going down and someone replacing us.

But it's an absolute fact that Leicester are not looking enviously at us. Why would you even think that

[RVclaret]

There's being overly negative but then there's being overly positive.

I mean it's debatable that we are the 19th best team in the country- given that means we will be going down and someone replacing us.

But it's an absolute fact that Leicester are not looking enviously at us. Why would you even think that

Sorry but there is nothing debatable about being the 19th best team in the country right now, it’s one of those black and white things, given there is a league table.

Not specifically replying to you with this bit but I noted Southampton just went a club record 21 games unbeaten yesterday, fans all loving it obviously. Interestingly I looked at their starting 11 / bench and aside from Kyle Walker-Peters at right back I’m not sure they have any other player in their starting 11 who gets into/improves ours right now.

[CrosspoolClarets]

It depends on your perspective, we are that bad if you’re comparing us to the other established Prem sides, yes.

We’re 19th best team in the country with a squad stronger than all the teams in the league below, so as you say we’re in a pretty good position on the whole. We’re in an envious position to fans of any club outside the Prem which is why I find posts on here lacking balance sometimes.

I’d add that I think we’ve been pretty unlucky this season. The fixtures fell unkindly, I thought, VAR decisions (or lack of) have been particularly poor, we’ve also suffered injuries to key players like Foster, Koleosho and Beyer, and just generally not had anything go for us. Thats no excuse, you make your own luck, but I agree with Goliath’s post that we’re not a terrible team - just an inexperienced one.

I also agree that we need to learn from our mistakes and make sure we add more experience, but it’s also fair to say those players are in high demand and are often very expensive/after big final contracts so finding and affording them is not as easy as it is to type.

Agree with this, but it does mean we are not the 19th best team. It’s different to being 19th over those 21 games alone because we have all played different teams. Add the 8 or so VAR robberies and we are on 20 points, factor in key injuries and I reckon we would be on 23. Useless now for rerunning half one of the season, but useful for judging how good we are and what the second half of the season may bring.

Next season, if we stay up, which we may if Forest or Everton lose more points, I don’t see us being much different to sides like Bournemouth, Fulham or Palace. Yes they have big squads but their benches aren’t that good. So I don’t think we need to conduct transfers like some clubs do, chasing the dream. Rather, organic steady growth.

[boyyanno]

Sorry but there is nothing debatable about being the 19th best team in the country right now, it’s one of those black and white things, given there is a league table.

Not specifically replying to you with this bit but I noted Southampton just went a club record 21 games unbeaten yesterday, fans all loving it obviously. Interestingly I looked at their starting 11 / bench and aside from Kyle Walker-Peters at right back I’m not sure they have any other player in their starting 11 who gets into/improves ours right now.

Of course it's debatable. When the season finishes the teams who are 18th, 19th and 20th will be replaced with the teams that are 1st, 2nd and win the play offs in the league below.

So anyone who finishes in the bottom 3 is not within the best 20 clubs are they? Season hasn't finished admittedly but I think we're all pretty aware we're going down this season.

R:E Saints, maybe, maybe not, but given the money we've spent rebuilding the squad and the fact we're a year ahead of them then that's probably to be expected. They probably have some though like THB.

[Ampth7]

This is currently what I’m expecting.

Players leaving in the summer:
Muric
Roberts (if not Jan)
Delcroix/Beyer I suspect one of them to leave and McNally take there place.
Taylor
Brownhill
Berge
Tresor (loan)
Odobert
Amdouni
Foster
Weghorst
Obafemi
Twine
Redmond
Benson (signed by whatever club he’s goes to on loan)
Jay

I suspect we will sign:

1 back up keeper
3 full backs
2 centre mids (possibly one if Massengo steps up)
2 wingers
2 forwards

WOW! That is some prediction!!

[PremierLeagueClass]

This is currently what I’m expecting.

Players leaving in the summer:
Muric
Roberts (if not Jan)
Delcroix/Beyer I suspect one of them to leave and McNally take there place.
Taylor
Brownhill
Berge
Tresor (loan)
Odobert
Amdouni
Foster
Weghorst
Obafemi
Twine
Redmond
Benson (signed by whatever club he’s goes to on loan)
Jay

I suspect we will sign:

1 back up keeper
3 full backs
2 centre mids (possibly one if Massengo steps up)
2 wingers
2 forwards

I suspect this post will be dug back up come September.

[Swizzlestick]

You could make a reasonable argument that entire Saints back four improves ours. At least they don’t seem to be injured all the time. Manning probably more suited to VK style than Taylor, THB we know what he can do and would have provided leadership, Bednarek would’ve brought a lot of experience, Polish international and KWP one of the best players in the Champ.

[Swizzlestick]

This is currently what I’m expecting.

Players leaving in the summer:
Muric
Roberts (if not Jan)
Delcroix/Beyer I suspect one of them to leave and McNally take there place.
Taylor
Brownhill
Berge
Tresor (loan)
Odobert
Amdouni
Foster
Weghorst
Obafemi
Twine
Redmond
Benson (signed by whatever club he’s goes to on loan)
Jay

I suspect we will sign:

1 back up keeper
3 full backs
2 centre mids (possibly one if Massengo steps up)
2 wingers
2 forwards

What planet are you on?

[RVclaret]

Of course it's debatable. When the season finishes the teams who are 18th, 19th and 20th will be replaced with the teams that are 1st, 2nd and win the play offs in the league below.

So anyone who finishes in the bottom 3 is not within the best 20 clubs are they? Season hasn't finished admittedly but I think we're all pretty aware we're going down this season.

R:E Saints, maybe, maybe not, but given the money we've spent rebuilding the squad and the fact we're a year ahead of them then that's probably to be expected. They probably have some though like THB.

That’s kinda the point though as to why it’s fine using league position to denote being the 19th best. We are a year ahead and have a better squad, so whether they are currently in position to swap with us doesn’t really matter. On THB, appreciate he has a lot of big fans on here, and my opinion is not the popular one, which is that O’Shea is better than him and Ekdal is a better actual defender. Also I think the vote on which loanees to sign last season showed Beyer as a fans priority. I put THB in the same bracket as AAD, young, high potential but needs to bulk out to be successful at this level.

[Newcastleclaret93]

What planet are you on?

A lot of them will leave on loan and then there’s a few out of contract. Theres also the likes of Muric who I can’t see wanting to be second fiddle in the championship.

Out of them how do you see it playing out differently?

[RVclaret]

You could make a reasonable argument that entire Saints back four improves ours. At least they don’t seem to be injured all the time. Manning probably more suited to VK style than Taylor, THB we know what he can do and would have provided leadership, Bednarek would’ve brought a lot of experience, Polish international and KWP one of the best players in the Champ.

Manning is a bit weak defensively from what I’ve seen. But take your point on style. Bednarek was a reserve last season when they conceded the most goals in this league so can’t agree there. And my post above has commented on THB.

[boyyanno]

That’s kinda the point though as to why it’s fine using league position to denote being the 19th best. We are a year ahead and have a better squad, so whether they are currently in position to swap with us doesn’t really matter. On THB, appreciate he has a lot of big fans on here, and my opinion is not the popular one, which is that O’Shea is better than him and Ekdal is a better actual defender. Also I think the vote on which loanees to sign last season showed Beyer as a fans priority. I put THB in the same bracket as AAD, young, high potential but needs to bulk out to be successful at this level.

The argument against that is that promotion/relegation is not confirmed until the certificates are exchanged. So in your view you would say that the team in the 19th spot in the PL are the "19th best in the country" the day before the certs are exchanged, and then the day after you would say they are now not. Despite no transfer activity, games or anything else taking place.

For example Leicester could have a P next to their name for weeks and Sheff United an R for months yet you'd still be saying Sheff were the 20th best team in the country, despite the fact that they were changing places. How can that be right?

[claretandy]

This is currently what I’m expecting.

Players leaving in the summer:
Muric
Roberts (if not Jan)
Delcroix/Beyer I suspect one of them to leave and McNally take there place.
Taylor
Brownhill
Berge
Tresor (loan)
Odobert
Amdouni
Foster
Weghorst
Obafemi
Twine
Redmond
Benson (signed by whatever club he’s goes to on loan)
Jay

I suspect we will sign:

1 back up keeper
3 full backs
2 centre mids (possibly one if Massengo steps up)
2 wingers
2 forwards

Good grief.

[boyyanno]

That’s kinda the point though as to why it’s fine using league position to denote being the 19th best. We are a year ahead and have a better squad, so whether they are currently in position to swap with us doesn’t really matter. On THB, appreciate he has a lot of big fans on here, and my opinion is not the popular one, which is that O’Shea is better than him and Ekdal is a better actual defender. Also I think the vote on which loanees to sign last season showed Beyer as a fans priority. I put THB in the same bracket as AAD, young, high potential but needs to bulk out to be successful at this level.

I like O'Shea, not convinced on Ekdal over THb but I was just making the point that there are arguably some. I'm sure there are others without too much scrutiny. That being said I haven't been too critical about the quality available in our squad, more about what we've got out of them (amd other things such as the balance not being right in recruitment) I actually think this is probably the most talented burnley team I've ever seen in terms of technical and individual ability.

[CoolClaret]

That’s kinda the point though as to why it’s fine using league position to denote being the 19th best. We are a year ahead and have a better squad, so whether they are currently in position to swap with us doesn’t really matter. On THB, appreciate he has a lot of big fans on here, and my opinion is not the popular one, which is that O’Shea is better than him and Ekdal is a better actual defender. Also I think the vote on which loanees to sign last season showed Beyer as a fans priority. I put THB in the same bracket as AAD, young, high potential but needs to bulk out to be successful at this level.

O'Shea has really grown on me and I'll hold my hands up I thought it was the wrong signing till about gameweek 10 or so...

Think a lot of the poor individual showings from him were more a reflection on the setup and sadly on some of his CB partnerships - most notable AAD who I do think has a high ceiling but put on some extremely poor showings early season and yes, the PL probably came too early for him.

It's no conicidence for me that IMO our best showings defensively have been with O'Shea and Ekdal together, who I both believe are our best natural CBs... Also a mention for Delcroix, who I believe at LCB is a very good option and much better than people like to give credit for.

On THB - brilliant leadership skills for a young 'un; I think his physicality side of it is fine, loves a tackle and was fine in the air, the only major gripe was his acceleration which was exploited a few times last season, most noticeably Hull at home.

He'd have been great in this current system, imo.

[Newcastleclaret93]

Good grief.

Who do you see staying out of them?

[boatshed bill]

Still no transfer news then?

[123EasyasBFC]

Who do you see staying out of them?

You could easily see Taylor, brownhill Berge foster and Odobert staying but it will be a summer of who knows

[Westleigh]

Taylor could be back at DL’s if we change places.

[claretandy]

Who do you see staying out of them?

You have 16 leaving, I'd be surprised if half as many as that leave.

[Hedontplayforyou]

Lille interested in Zaroury

[jojomk1]

Still no transfer news then?

Plenty according to Newcastleclarert93
Trouble is, it's all in his head

[Vegas Claret]

The league table doesn’t lie, we are that bad. For those who say, stop being so negative and stop whinging; I take no pride in saying it, it’s just the truth as far as I can see it. I’m not one to pretend things are okay when clearly right now they are not, that’s just kidding yourself.

The main thing now is that lessons need to be learned moving forwards, especially for next season when we will be trying to win back promotion. It can’t all be about buying young players in the hope of flipping them for a huge profit, so I hope we do buy sensibly in the summer. With that in mind, we have plenty of reasons to be optimistic moving forwards, but let’s not pretend we’re good enough in this league right now.

perfectly summed up

[Westleigh]

The league table doesn’t lie, we are that bad. For those who say, stop being so negative and stop whinging; I take no pride in saying it, it’s just the truth as far as I can see it. I’m not one to pretend things are okay when clearly right now they are not, that’s just kidding yourself.

The main thing now is that lessons need to be learned moving forwards, especially for next season when we will be trying to win back promotion. It can’t all be about buying young players in the hope of flipping them for a huge profit, so I hope we do buy sensibly in the summer. With that in mind, we have plenty of reasons to be optimistic moving forwards, but let’s not pretend we’re good enough in this league right now.

Surely you can’t be a true Clarets fan,no fan would dare claim that we’re rubbish,it’s all a fig biscuit of your imagination,without VAR we’d be challenging for Europe or so it’s said,.

[gandhisflipflop]

They haven’t said we would be challenging for Europe though, have they?

[CoolClaret]

We definitely bought talent last season, but have failed to find a team.
Bennys lack of game time, plus some bizarre team selections and subs, make me believe VK picks a team based on their form on the training pitch.
There's no pressure on a training pitch, and the team are often found wanting when it comes to the battle.
We'll never know if Benny was up to the challenge which is a shame for him, and very disappointing for the fans.

Just picked up on this - and I must say I do agree.

Happens in all sports as well, some players just turn up on gameday.

Seen countless guys that are absolute gym killers in boxing/muay thai/mma etc that **** the bed come fight night as well.

Everyone's personality is different, and some can't train as hard as they play and some can.

It's a hard balance to have - of course you need to train to improve and I understand of wanting high levels on the training field but it's a well known occurrence of some athletes being much better in training than gameday, can't quantify it but it certainly needs to be taken into account with team selections.

[Bigvince]

This is currently what I’m expecting.

Players leaving in the summer:
Muric
Roberts (if not Jan)
Delcroix/Beyer I suspect one of them to leave and McNally take there place.
Taylor
Brownhill
Berge
Tresor (loan)
Odobert
Amdouni
Foster
Weghorst
Obafemi
Twine
Redmond
Benson (signed by whatever club he’s goes to on loan)
Jay

I suspect we will sign:

1 back up keeper
3 full backs
2 centre mids (possibly one if Massengo steps up)
2 wingers
2 forwards

[roperclaret]

The argument against that is that promotion/relegation is not confirmed until the certificates are exchanged. So in your view you would say that the team in the 19th spot in the PL are the "19th best in the country" the day before the certs are exchanged, and then the day after you would say they are now not. Despite no transfer activity, games or anything else taking place.

For example Leicester could have a P next to their name for weeks and Sheff United an R for months yet you'd still be saying Sheff were the 20th best team in the country, despite the fact that they were changing places. How can that be right?

I’ve just watch Leeds beat PNE. Not one player on the pitch even gets on out bench. The gulf between the Prem and the Championship is huge.

[StayingDown4Ever]

They haven’t said we would be challenging for Europe though, have they?

Some on here were talking about a potential European challenge in the summer

[CoolClaret]

I’ve just watch Leeds beat PNE. Not one player on the pitch even gets on out bench. The gulf between the Prem and the Championship is huge.

Summerville was a top target for VK wasn't he?

[Newcastleclaret93]

You could easily see Taylor, brownhill Berge foster and Odobert staying but it will be a summer of who knows

Potentially but Taylor is out of contract. Brownhill has a year left so likely we will want to cash in.

Then who knows with the other three. I personally suspect all three will want to play at a higher level

[123EasyasBFC]

Potentially but Taylor is out of contract. Brownhill has a year left so likely we will want to cash in.

Then who knows with the other three. I personally suspect all three will want to play at a higher level

Every player at all 3 relegated clubs will always want to play at a higher level

[Newcastleclaret93]

Every player at all 3 relegated clubs will always want to play at a higher level

True but our three best players are the most likely to leave

[Taffy on the wing]

.....................ALL IS DROSS!!!!!!...............................

[Cap]

An actual link

https://twitter.com/FabrizioRomano/stat ... Jwwlw&s=19

[burnley007]

I’ve just watch Leeds beat PNE. Not one player on the pitch even gets on out bench. The gulf between the Prem and the Championship is huge.

This is so true, the gulf is huge and getting bigger.

We are slowly closing that gap, but we are/have run out of games. Annoyingly, we'll probably be good enough by the time we are relegated!

[burnley007]

An actual link

https://twitter.com/FabrizioRomano/stat ... Jwwlw&s=19

Looks promising, but is promising what we need right now?

[NewClaret]

Maxime Estève:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bNDb0sdrQzs

Looks to have good potential!

[NewClaret]

Looks promising, but is promising what we need right now?

No, not really but fwiw I’m still fully behind any deal that brings us what we see as the best young talent available.

Couple of theories if we make this kind of signing in this window are:

1. that we’re doubling down on a strategy we think will pay off longer term and therefore must be very comfortable with the strategy vs staying up at all costs, or;

2. we’re struggling to attract any more experienced players.

[Newcastleclaret93]

I would probably say CB along with winger are the two positions we least need to sign someone.

[NewClaret]

Better video here:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ukcb0c2FlZI

Looks much better in this one. Man mountain.

[wilks_bfc]

He’s been a regular starter for Montpellier since November so I can’t see him wanting to come here just to sit on the bench

[NewClaret]

I would probably say CB along with winger are the two positions we least need to sign someone.

I’d agree.

Although a top drawer right winger would not disappoint me if Benson leaves. I’d prefer he stay.