have we got too much know how to go down?

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# 1
RalphCoatesComb
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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby RalphCoatesComb » Sun Jan 13, 2019 11:10 pm

HunterST_BFC wrote:Our final run in is terrible


End of season games are often a lottery with managers playing reserves, just to 'blood' them and, as has been said above, several other teams have little to play for.

Those who bet on football steer well clear of end of season games... too unpredictable!
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# 2
HunterST_BFC
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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby HunterST_BFC » Sun Jan 13, 2019 11:11 pm

FactualFrank wrote:People keep saying that. But you could easily turn that into a good thing, as one or more of those four could be preparing for a cup final or have their league position confirmed. Why am I the only poster who is seeing this?

You can argue that it's better to have those fixtures then as opposed to earlier on.


The Fact is...
We have more chance of getting points by the end of March than we do after that.

That is why we need the points by then.

Chelsea
Man City
Everton
Arsenal
are the last 4 - if we are not safe before these... we most likely won't have enough.

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FactualFrank
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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby FactualFrank » Sun Jan 13, 2019 11:15 pm

HunterST_BFC wrote:The Fact is...
We have more chance of getting points by the end of March than we do after that.

That is why we need the points by then.

Chelsea
Man City
Everton
Arsenal
are the last 4 - if we are not safe before these... we most likely won't have enough.


It doesn't matter how many points we have by the end of March. It's about how many points we have by the end of the season.

We need X points by end of the season. It's that simple. Sure - Man City, you can throw away, as their second side would challenge for the Premier League, but the rest, if they are preparing for a cup final, of course it's better to play them then.

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Rileybobs
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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby Rileybobs » Sun Jan 13, 2019 11:58 pm

FactualFrank wrote:It doesn't matter how many points we have by the end of March. It's about how many points we have by the end of the season.

We need X points by end of the season. It's that simple. Sure - Man City, you can throw away, as their second side would challenge for the Premier League, but the rest, if they are preparing for a cup final, of course it's better to play them then.


Huddersfield got a draw away at Man City at the end of last season. Our run in is difficult but there’s points to play for in every game so it’s ridiculous to assume that we’ll get 0 points from our final 4 games. Particularly as one is Everton who really don’t look anything special.

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FactualFrank
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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby FactualFrank » Mon Jan 14, 2019 12:00 am

Rileybobs wrote:Huddersfield got a draw away at Man City at the end of last season. Our run in is difficult but there’s points to play for in every game so it’s ridiculous to assume that we’ll get 0 points from our final 4 games. Particularly as one is Everton who really don’t look anything special.


Try reading it again. That's exactly my point. I'm saying we can get points from the remaining 4 games as those teams could have other things to play for. I never said we'll get 0 points from our final games. It's other posters that suggested that.

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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby Rileybobs » Mon Jan 14, 2019 12:04 am

FactualFrank wrote:Try reading it again. That's exactly my point. I'm saying we can get points from the remaining 4 games as those teams could have other things to play for. I never said we'll get 0 points from our final games. It's other posters that suggested that.


I know. I quoted you because you suggested we throw away the Man City game. I wasn’t challenging your other points so I don’t need to try to read your post again.

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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby FactualFrank » Mon Jan 14, 2019 12:06 am

Rileybobs wrote:so I don’t need to try to read your post again.


Ok.

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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby Vegas Claret » Mon Jan 14, 2019 4:18 am

if we get 2 players this window that walk into our first team we will definitely stay up, if we don't we are a few injuries away from a very difficult situation

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Rileybobs
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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby Rileybobs » Mon Jan 14, 2019 8:08 am

Vegas Claret wrote:if we get 2 players this window that walk into our first team we will definitely stay up, if we don't we are a few injuries away from a very difficult situation


I’ve read this on a couple of threads. I agree that we could do with a couple of players to bolster the squad but I’m not sure I agree that the difference between us staying up or not is signing players who will walk into our starting line up. Which two players in our current first eleven need replacing with new signings?

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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby Lancasterclaret » Mon Jan 14, 2019 8:12 am

We've given ourselves a chance by doing something that clubs that are struggling very rarely do.

We've won three on the trot and given ourselves back the confidence that we know we are more than good enough for this league.

We've got players coming back from injury and suspensions and the possibility of players joining in the window.

Its looking a lot better than it was and as long as we keep working as hard as we have been then we should be ok.

But we've got to keep these levels of performances up or we will be in trouble.

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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby Spijed » Mon Jan 14, 2019 8:21 am

Vegas Claret wrote:if we get 2 players this window that walk into our first team we will definitely stay up, if we don't we are a few injuries away from a very difficult situation


We completely outplayed West ham without any new additions and they are playing very well.

Why can't we beat other teams with the players we currently have?

Some were moaning about Jeff Hendrick before the Fulham game yet he played very well.

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Claretmatt4
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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby Claretmatt4 » Mon Jan 14, 2019 10:01 am

The negativity on here is astouonding considering we've won 3 premier league games in a row.

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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby Bosscat » Mon Jan 14, 2019 10:31 am

Claretmatt4 wrote:The negativity on here is astouonding considering we've won 3 premier league games in a row.

Agreed Matt :)

More 'glass half empties' on here than 'glass half fulls' I am afraid.

Mind you the "Dyche out" brigade seem to have shut up for now :lol: :lol:

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Lord Beamish
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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby Lord Beamish » Mon Jan 14, 2019 10:36 am

I’m neither Glass Half Empty, or Glass Half Full. For me the Glass is just twice as big as it needs to be.
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ElectroClaret
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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby ElectroClaret » Mon Jan 14, 2019 11:40 am

BurnleyFC wrote: I’d take 17th now.


I don't think there's many Clarets fans who wouldn't.

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claretspice
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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby claretspice » Mon Jan 14, 2019 12:33 pm

ElectroClaret wrote:
I don't think there's many Clarets fans who wouldn't.


And in that regard, it's probably worth noting that after the last 3 games, we've moved to a position that I'd argue is pretty much par for Burnley now and in the future in the Premier League, especially taking into account the fact we've had a fairly rough season so far with injuries. We're outside the bottom quarter of the league (albeit bottom of the third quarter), and 3 points clear of the relegation zone - and only 6 points behind Bournemouth. Whilst we may sometimes exceed what can be expected of (like last season), our basic expectations should be realistic.

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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby Longside4evr » Mon Jan 14, 2019 12:47 pm

The next seventeen days will determine our fate we need to get the best we can afford
Two players i would be happy with, three I would be ecstatic.

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NottsClaret
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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby NottsClaret » Mon Jan 14, 2019 12:53 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:But we've got to keep these levels of performances up or we will be in trouble.


Yup, I think that's what the first part of the season taught us. It's like so often when we play in the cup, if we're at 95% we're absolutely s**t. When we're at 100% we can give almost anyone a game.

It can't be easy running through brick walls every week but it's the only way we can go on bridging the gap.

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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby TVC15 » Mon Jan 14, 2019 1:03 pm

Rileybobs wrote:I’ve read this on a couple of threads. I agree that we could do with a couple of players to bolster the squad but I’m not sure I agree that the difference between us staying up or not is signing players who will walk into our starting line up. Which two players in our current first eleven need replacing with new signings?


Wood (or any of the forwards tbh). Wood has played a couple of good games this season...even on Saturday he was extremely frustrating to watch refusing to put in the kind of challenges that should be a bare minimum for any footballer (playing for us)
Any of the full backs could be improved on with a loan signing like Moses or Moreno.
Winger - McNeil has been brilliant but its a massive risk to think he can keep this up for the rest of the season at his age. Brady keeps on getting set backs and not sure when Lennon is back (or whether he is good enough).
Hendrick had a great game but his form and Cork`s has been inconsistent.

Of course 3 wins on the bounce is brilliant for us. But we have 2 very tough away games coming up and by the time we are playing a Southampton side who are playing far better under the new manager we could be right back in it.
We needed quality signings in the summer who would improve the first eleven and just because we have won 3 games there is very little we have shown this season which suggests we don't need to improve.

If we had blown our surplus monies / profit reserves on signings which had failed then personally I would not want us to risk anymore cash and try and stay up with the team we have got. However, we are not in that position - we are in a very healthy financial place and we should be looking to improve the first team to help us avoid relegation and also because we should be doing this anyway with most of the other teams getting stronger every season. Lets take advantage of Newcastle`s boardroom woes, Cardiff`s lack of money, Fulham`s lack of ability to spend their money wisely etc etc. What is the point of the stability of our management team / boardroom and fantastic financial position if we don't take advantage of it ? Stand still and eventually you get knocked over.

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Spijed
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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby Spijed » Mon Jan 14, 2019 1:28 pm

NottsClaret wrote:It can't be easy running through brick walls every week but it's the only way we can go on bridging the gap.


Wouldn't it be like being in the Army in that after a while it becomes the norm?

Once your body had adjusted to certain levels of fitness it should then become second nature.

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Rileybobs
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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby Rileybobs » Mon Jan 14, 2019 1:33 pm

TVC15 wrote:Wood (or any of the forwards tbh). Wood has played a couple of good games this season...even on Saturday he was extremely frustrating to watch refusing to put in the kind of challenges that should be a bare minimum for any footballer (playing for us)
Any of the full backs could be improved on with a loan signing like Moses or Moreno.
Winger - McNeil has been brilliant but its a massive risk to think he can keep this up for the rest of the season at his age. Brady keeps on getting set backs and not sure when Lennon is back (or whether he is good enough).
Hendrick had a great game but his form and Cork`s has been inconsistent.

Of course 3 wins on the bounce is brilliant for us. But we have 2 very tough away games coming up and by the time we are playing a Southampton side who are playing far better under the new manager we could be right back in it.
We needed quality signings in the summer who would improve the first eleven and just because we have won 3 games there is very little we have shown this season which suggests we don't need to improve.

If we had blown our surplus monies / profit reserves on signings which had failed then personally I would not want us to risk anymore cash and try and stay up with the team we have got. However, we are not in that position - we are in a very healthy financial place and we should be looking to improve the first team to help us avoid relegation and also because we should be doing this anyway with most of the other teams getting stronger every season. Lets take advantage of Newcastle`s boardroom woes, Cardiff`s lack of money, Fulham`s lack of ability to spend their money wisely etc etc. What is the point of the stability of our management team / boardroom and fantastic financial position if we don't take advantage of it ? Stand still and eventually you get knocked over.


I agree that we need a couple of signings, we don't have enough depth in the wide areas in particular. I wouldn't look at our first eleven and say that we need to replace two of them in the starting line up with new players in order to survive though.

We could certainly improve in both full-back positions but it's not a problem area for us and isn't the difference between staying up or going down. It would be nice to replace Vydra with someone who is more likely to get game time but we aren't going to sign a striker who will dislodge Barnes and Wood on current form. Both are proven Premier League forwards.

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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby JTClaret » Mon Jan 14, 2019 1:36 pm

To me there is a big difference between this team and the previous teams that have been relegated.
I can't put my finger on what it is, but we seem more composed in battle for the relegation fight games.
We also have more fight than the likes of Fulham, who spent over £100m on 'quality'.

We are just doing it the Burnley way... Last time we got to March without risk of relegation or possibility of promotion/europe was when??

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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby TVC15 » Mon Jan 14, 2019 2:04 pm

Rileybobs wrote:I agree that we need a couple of signings, we don't have enough depth in the wide areas in particular. I wouldn't look at our first eleven and say that we need to replace two of them in the starting line up with new players in order to survive though.

We could certainly improve in both full-back positions but it's not a problem area for us and isn't the difference between staying up or going down. It would be nice to replace Vydra with someone who is more likely to get game time but we aren't going to sign a striker who will dislodge Barnes and Wood on current form. Both are proven Premier League forwards.


Not sure I agree they are “proven”
We are 22 games in and Wood has had a couple of decent games this season.
I love Barnes but I think he would be even better with a different type of striker to Wood or Vokes. Not pretending it is easy to buy a striker when you are looking to spend between £20m and £30m because even that will only get you a 10 to 15 goals per season striker at best. I know not everyone agrees but I think JayRod would improve our team and I also felt Danny Ings would have. Both are in that price bracket.

Our lack of goals is not just down to the strikers - it’s also their service but the strikers we have are of a quality that they need a few chances to score a goal...they are not the natural goal scorer types as the likes of Charlie Austin. Wood and Vokes in particular have missed a number of pretty easy chances this year.
Since McNeil has been playing we are getting to the bi-line a lot more and also putting lots more good crosses in but it still takes a number of chances for us to convert into goals (or slices of luck)

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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby Vegas Claret » Mon Jan 14, 2019 3:24 pm

Rileybobs wrote:I’ve read this on a couple of threads. I agree that we could do with a couple of players to bolster the squad but I’m not sure I agree that the difference between us staying up or not is signing players who will walk into our starting line up. Which two players in our current first eleven need replacing with new signings?


Riley, if you read what I put I said if we get a few injuries we are screwed. IMHO we need a better CM and a better winger, so that for example would then put Cork and Lennon on the bench - if we don't get those two players and Cork and Lennon get injured we see what we saw on Saturday that the manager doesn't really have suitable back up at this level. Not saying the current team can't do a job, I just don't think that the quality is good enough especially when we get injuries

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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby Vegas Claret » Mon Jan 14, 2019 3:24 pm

Spijed wrote:We completely outplayed West ham without any new additions and they are playing very well.

Why can't we beat other teams with the players we currently have?

Some were moaning about Jeff Hendrick before the Fulham game yet he played very well.


read what I put - here's my reply to Riley "if you read what I put I said if we get a few injuries we are screwed. IMHO we need a better CM and a better winger, so that for example would then put Cork and Lennon on the bench - if we don't get those two players and Cork and Lennon get injured we see what we saw on Saturday that the manager doesn't really have suitable back up at this level. Not saying the current team can't do a job, I just don't think that the quality is good enough especially when we get injuries"

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Rileybobs
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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby Rileybobs » Mon Jan 14, 2019 6:52 pm

Vegas Claret wrote:Riley, if you read what I put I said if we get a few injuries we are screwed. IMHO we need a better CM and a better winger, so that for example would then put Cork and Lennon on the bench - if we don't get those two players and Cork and Lennon get injured we see what we saw on Saturday that the manager doesn't really have suitable back up at this level. Not saying the current team can't do a job, I just don't think that the quality is good enough especially when we get injuries


The post you made which I quoted stated that if we get two players who walk into our first team. My points is that I don’t necessarily think we need, and we almost certainly won’t get 2 players who walk into our first team. 2 players in the right areas would strengthen our depth and mitigate the impact of injuries.

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Re: have we got too much know how to go down?

Postby Vegas Claret » Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:59 pm

Rileybobs wrote:The post you made which I quoted stated that if we get two players who walk into our first team. My points is that I don’t necessarily think we need, and we almost certainly won’t get 2 players who walk into our first team. 2 players in the right areas would strengthen our depth and mitigate the impact of injuries.


I stick by what I said, we need 2 better players than we have otherwise we end up with the development squad on the bench when we have injuries which we cannot afford to do imho - but I'm not expecting us to sign anyone so it's all conjecture !


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