Nigel Lawson RIP

[evensteadiereddie]

Says the guy/gal who is usually one of the main contributors to almost every political thread on this board.

Yup and laughs at morons like you who don't get it.
That's my whole point, there shouldn't be any political stuff on here but if folks are going to post rubbish and the mods let it go then that rubbish should be pointed out.
Sorry you're not getting your own way but, hey ho, time for you togrow up a bit.

[Middle-agedClaret]

RIP Nigel Lawson.

[IanMcL]

My thoughts are for Nigella.

[SocialistClaret]

My thoughts go out to all the climate change deniers who have lost a lot of their income today.

[Benson]

Yup and laughs at morons like you who don't get it.
That's my whole point, there shouldn't be any political stuff on here but if folks are going to post rubbish and the mods let it go then that rubbish should be pointed out.
Sorry you're not getting your own way but, hey ho, time for you togrow up a bit.

You don’t think political stuff should be on here but you post on every political thread, you suggest it’s time for me “togrow up a bit” but start your post with an insult straight from the playground.
You, Edward, are a pompous, overbearing bore.

[elwaclaret]

The Christian in me says RIP

The social historian - ..If he reaches Purgatory he’s got a good PR man.

[Lancasterclaret]

And you aren’t?
From what I can see you all are on this board, the difference between Rowls and the rest of you though is the fact that he never plays the man. I disagree with all of his politics but I will read his posts because ad hominem is not his thing, unlike many others to whom it is the first port of call. The hypocrisy of many of the self styled “progressives” on here is staggering. They profess to be tolerant of others but are always prepared to stereotype members of a social group whenever it suits, because to them they are fair game. They throw terms such as gammon and boomer in a totally pejorative way because all, middle aged to old aged, white people are all little Englanders. Unthinking red faced racist brexiteers incapable of rational thought. A point of view that ticks all of the ism boxes
Racist
Sexist
Ageist


But not there to be challenged because, just like David Baddiel’s argument re-Jewish people, the people in their target group don’t matter.

I don't think everyone who voted Brexit is an unthinking red faced racist brexiteer

Problem I have on here is the ones who attack me personally (and who are ALL on the blocked list because they do) are unfortunately that

I also have a huge issue with people who are incapable of changing their minds when facts are presented to them (or in the case of Brexit, reality) and stick to their guns

I know they are bright enough to know they have messed up, but they can't admit it

Is that pride?

Fear of failure?

Complete absence of dealing with the consequences of their actions?

I have no idea, but if I'm wrong about something, I say I am, and amazingly the world doesn't explode because its okay to be wrong

[elwaclaret]

I don't think everyone who voted Brexit is an unthinking red faced racist brexiteer

Problem I have on here is the ones who attack me personally (and who are ALL on the blocked list because they do) are unfortunately that

I also have a huge issue with people who are incapable of changing their minds when facts are presented to them (or in the case of Brexit, reality) and stick to their guns

I know they are bright enough to know they have messed up, but they can't admit it

Is that pride?

Fear of failure?

Complete absence of dealing with the consequences of their actions?

I have no idea, but if I'm wrong about something, I say I am, and amazingly the world doesn't explode because its okay to be wrong

I voted for Brexit, not for what it became. The swing to the right between the vote and ‘Brexit’ was enough to make me feel slightly sick as other ‘Brexit’ voters celebrated. The notion that Trade Law could remain in place in a common market, what the public agreed to was hijacked by the little Englanders. I didn’t want to be part of a Federal Europe… still don’t, but I’d prefer it to the morally corrupt government we have now. Would I be a remainer if there was another vote tomorrow? Bet your boots I would. The democratic route was steamrollered on. The right winged takeover of Brexit precedent set for the Tories they’ve been using ever since to undermine democracy.

[CardyTheClaret]

.along with others far more balanced.

From YOUR echo chamber, presumably.

[Lancasterclaret]

I voted for Brexit, not for what it became. The swing to the right between the vote and ‘Brexit’ was enough to make me feel slightly sick as other ‘Brexit’ voters celebrated. The notion that Trade Law could remain in place in a common market, what the public agreed to was hijacked by the little Englanders. I didn’t want to be part of a Federal Europe… still don’t, but I’d prefer it to the morally corrupt government we have now. Would I be a remainer if there was another vote tomorrow? Bet your boots I would. The democratic route was steamrollered on. The right winged takeover of Brexit precedent set for the Tories they’ve been using ever since to undermine democracy.

I get the not wanting to be part of a federal Europe thing 100%

The way the argument was framed so that we left, so that what is happening now could happen is absolutely shameful and borderline criminal

Everything would stay the same as it was, except for the bad bits we didn't like?

Pointing it out at the time put me on a lot of peoples **** lists unfortunately but hey ho, we are were we are the best we can do now is make sure those who are responsible pay at the ballot box

[elwaclaret]

I get the not wanting to be part of a federal Europe thing 100%

The way the argument was framed so that we left, so that what is happening now could happen is absolutely shameful and borderline criminal

Everything would stay the same as it was, except for the bad bits we didn't like?

Pointing it out at the time put me on a lot of peoples **** lists unfortunately but hey ho, we are were we are the best we can do now is make sure those who are responsible pay at the ballot box

Oh, I’m hoping there is far more to worry about than losing their seats for a good number of them after the next election.

[HunterST_BFC]

Politics thread...

It's still a Political thread...
Should be removed just like others have.

Or is it the wrong colour?

[Rowls]

The notion that Trade Law could remain in place in a common market, what the public agreed to was hijacked by the little Englanders. I didn’t want to be part of a Federal Europe…

We've just joined a free trade organisation that spans the globe. From Canada to Malaysia to Australia.

That's as far removed from trade protectionism of socialism or "little Englanders" as you can get. It is the United Kingdom on the global stage. Nigel Lawson would have approved.

I have no idea, but if I'm wrong about something, I say I am, and amazingly the world doesn't explode because its okay to be wrong

I don't suppose you're willing to retract the insinuation you made against me yesterday that I'm somehow in favour of genocide? As you say, the world won't explode.

[HunterST_BFC]

If you want to make it that way you have succeeded.

Its about the passing of a man who was a well known figure and who happened to be a poitician and might I say unlike todays shower a rather good one.

Revisionism.

Do some research. Cause and effect.

[elwaclaret]

We've just joined a free trade organisation that spans the globe. From Canada to Malaysia to Australia.

That's as far removed from trade protectionism of socialism or "little Englanders" as you can get. It is the United Kingdom on the global stage. Nigel Lawson would have approved.



I don't suppose you're willing to retract the insinuation you made against me yesterday that I'm somehow in favour of genocide? As you say, the world won't explode.

Obviously you are taking the official position… others are reading the fine print. Being massively oversold by the right, as most analysts expected.

[Rowls]

Obviously you are taking the official position… others are reading the fine print. Being massively oversold by the right, as most analysts expected.

I don't think so. It exactly what Brexit was about. The CPTPP trade zone is forecast to outstrip the EU and be about twice the size in 20-30 years. This is the future and unless the EU changes, it will swiftly become the past.

It's already stagnating.

[Billy Balfour]

We've just joined a free trade organisation that spans the globe. From Canada to Malaysia to Australia.

Yeah, a trade deal that's predicted to boost our economy by 0.08% in ten years time.

[Rowls]

Yeah, a trade deal that's predicted to boost our economy by 0.08% in ten years time.

No, that's the amount it's estimated to boost the economy right now.

[elwaclaret]

I don't think so. It exactly what Brexit was about. The CPTPP trade zone is forecast to outstrip the EU and be about twice the size in 20-30 years. This is the future and unless the EU changes, it will swiftly become the past.

It's already stagnating.

Hope you are right regarding this trade deal, but as I say I’m far from convinced…and it is certainly not going to help reduce world pollution.

[Lancasterclaret]

Hope you are right regarding this trade deal, but as I say I’m far from convinced…and it is certainly not going to help reduce world pollution.

Its better than not having one, but if Rowls et al argument that its better than CU/SM membership then it blatantly isn't, and never will be

[SocialistClaret]

I don't think so. It exactly what Brexit was about. The CPTPP trade zone is forecast to outstrip the EU and be about twice the size in 20-30 years. This is the future and unless the EU changes, it will swiftly become the past.

It's already stagnating.

We all were dreamers once. I wanted to be an astronaut.

[Rowls]

Its better than not having one, but if Rowls et al argument that its better than CU/SM membership then it blatantly isn't, and never will be

OK, you clearly don't want to apologise or retract what you said so I'll drop it. It's because it's already boring and I'm confident you're much better person than that. We both know it's easy to tap something, post it and regret it. Things we'd never dream of saying to each other face to face.

But let's not pretend that what you said wasn't completely unwarranted and grossly tasteless. You might want to think twice next time something as appalling as that pops into your head and maybe also question where it comes from.

[Rowls]

We all were dreamers once. I wanted to be an astronaut.

I dare say you still can be, SocialistClaret. NASA are back to sending people to the moon and by the time you finish school/college maybe Elon Musk will be running private expeditions into space. Who knows, eh?

All the best!

Rowls

[elwaclaret]

Its better than not having one, but if Rowls et al argument that its better than CU/SM membership then it blatantly isn't, and never will be

I just about remember the shortages as we turned our back on the Commonwealth for the Common Market… pretty similar to this. I cannot help thinking this has just been done to prop up the financial sector and the Tories eyeing up Britain as a potential a tax haven. It’s a bad time in history not to be high middling sort or above. Tories used to act like Victorians, now they appear to idolise the Georges.

[Lancasterclaret]

I just about remember the shortages as we turned our back on the Commonwealth for the Common Market… pretty similar to this. I cannot help thinking this has just been done to prop up the financial sector and the Tories eyeing up Britain as a potential a tax haven. It’s a bad time in history not to be high middling sort or above. Tories used to act like Victorians, now they appear to idolise the Georges.

Nothing in this deal for services so its not that

Its good news for car manufacturers I think, but bad news for farmers (again)

[AmbleClaret]

Rich (very) old man dies.Some people want to be respectful,some don't. It's the nature of a message board,albeit I think it should have been pulled. FWIW ,RIP ? It's a no from me.

[elwaclaret]

Rich (very) old man dies.Some people want to be respectful,some don't. It's the nature of a message board,albeit I think it should have been pulled. FWIW ,RIP ? It's a no from me.

The main reason for pulling is that it encourages abusive posters… this has been mostly a sensible discussion, without trolls.

[Rowls]

Nothing in this deal for services so its not that

Its good news for car manufacturers I think, but bad news for farmers (again)

It's good news for everybody.

Farmers will have increased competition but they get to distinguish their products by their quality.

Cheap frozen NZ lamb is never going to be the same quality as saltmarsh lamb or Welsh lamb.

Consumers will win because they will have a choice.

For those who are trumping up the 0.08% figure as some kind of proof that this deal isn't worth much - take a look at how much of our trade we used to do with Au-Nz before we joined the EEC and were forced to turn our backs on them. If we get back to those kind of trade figures then it will be worth significantly more.

It also isn't a customs union. It's a free trade association. The difference seems marginal but it's huge.

Next time there's a President of the US who isn't hostile to the UK we'll be able to negotiate a trade deal with the USA too. It's just a matter of time before that pendulum aligns and once it's signed it will stay. If Trump had won a second term it would have been done already.

There are opportunities with Brexit and in an increasingly global world, they are set to grow.

The EU is set to stagnate. It will continue to stagnate until or unless it reforms.

[Beagle]

Good job this thread isn’t political.

[Bordeauxclaret]

Turned into comedy.

[AmbleClaret]

Well at least we know Rowls could have a second career, as a (poor) comedian.

[Billy Balfour]

Good job our economy isn't stagnating. Oh, silly me, I got it wrong. We have the worst-performing economy among the advanced economies. Obviously, this has nothing to do with the B-word.

[Rowls]

Good job our economy isn't stagnating. Oh, silly me, I got it wrong. We have the worst-performing economy among the advanced economies.

It's going to continue to stagnate until we get public expenditure and taxation under control. They both need to come down.

Nigel Lawson's obituraries would be a good place to learn about this.

[Billy Balfour]

It's going to continue to stagnate until we get public expenditure and taxation under control. They both need to come down.

Nigel Lawson's obituraries would be a good place to learn about this.

[SocialistClaret]

It's going to continue to stagnate until we get public expenditure and taxation under control. They both need to come down.

Nigel Lawson's obituraries would be a good place to learn about this.

[Stayingup]

Revisionism.

Do some research. Cause and effect.

A nonsense no content comment. Rubbish. .

[Rick_Muller]

…anyway…

RIP Mr Lawson

[Spiral]

My condolences to his daughter, beardless Russell Brand.

[IanMcL]

We've just joined a free trade organisation that spans the globe. From Canada to Malaysia to Australia.

I think you will find it improves our GDP by just £200k per annum.

Probably cost more to maintain and set up!

[Here's-Johnny]

And you aren’t?
From what I can see you all are on this board, the difference between Rowls and the rest of you though is the fact that he never plays the man. I disagree with all of his politics but I will read his posts because ad hominem is not his thing, unlike many others to whom it is the first port of call. The hypocrisy of many of the self styled “progressives” on here is staggering. They profess to be tolerant of others but are always prepared to stereotype members of a social group whenever it suits, because to them they are fair game. They throw terms such as gammon and boomer in a totally pejorative way because all, middle aged to old aged, white people are all little Englanders. Unthinking red faced racist brexiteers incapable of rational thought. A point of view that ticks all of the ism boxes
Racist
Sexist
Ageist


But not there to be challenged because, just like David Baddiel’s argument re-Jewish people, the people in their target group don’t matter.

You can take the young boy out of Stoneyholme.....but you can't take Stoneyholme out of the young boy.

[evensteadiereddie]

You don’t think political stuff should be on here but you post on every political thread, you suggest it’s time for me “togrow up a bit” but start your post with an insult straight from the playground.
You, Edward, are a pompous, overbearing bore.

Yet you find time to answer me and attempt to insult me.
Weird, uh?
xxx

[Spiral]

Just looking back over this ridiculous thread I've noticed there are folk who logged in and posted for the sole purpose of performing outrage at a comment on the internet while forgetting to tell the guy who is dead to rest in peace (I wonder if he'll hear). I'll post trigger warnings next time, but if you're going to put on the theatre of venerating a dead stately figure so as to rhetorically drape yourself with a veil of civil virtue, it's essential to type "RIP" in the post, and for maximum effect say, "I didn't agree with his politics, but..." This will make you appear to an idiot as though you are truly enlightened.

[SocialistClaret]

Just looking back over this ridiculous thread I've noticed there are folk who logged in and posted for the sole purpose of performing outrage at a comment on the internet while forgetting to tell the guy who is dead to rest in peace (I wonder if he'll hear). I'll post trigger warnings next time, but if you're going to put on the theatre of venerating a dead stately figure so as to rhetorically drape yourself with a veil of civil virtue, it's essential to type "RIP" in the post, and for maximum effect say, "I didn't agree with his politics, but..." This will make you appear to an idiot as though you are truly enlightened.

It's political correctness gone mad.

[Spiral]

It's political correctness gone mad.

i'm like literally being cancelled god so much for the tolerant right

[SocialistClaret]

i'm like literally being cancelled god so much for the tolerant right

This is cancel culture. You can't say anything these days without the right-wing SJWs jumping up and down on you.

[Lancasterclaret]

Just looking back over this ridiculous thread I've noticed there are folk who logged in and posted for the sole purpose of performing outrage at a comment on the internet while forgetting to tell the guy who is dead to rest in peace (I wonder if he'll hear). I'll post trigger warnings next time, but if you're going to put on the theatre of venerating a dead stately figure so as to rhetorically drape yourself with a veil of civil virtue, it's essential to type "RIP" in the post, and for maximum effect say, "I didn't agree with his politics, but..." This will make you appear to an idiot as though you are truly enlightened.

I put "I didn't agree with his politics" but I didn't put "RIP"

Very intentionally

[Jakubclaret]

It really takes some doing & credit where credits due from somebody posting a thread about a dead politician & a poster who wants to make the thread all about himself, amazed doesn't scratch the surface.

[Bigbopper]

If you are referring to LC then do not be amazed he has had years of practice.

[Taffy on the wing]

It's good news for everybody.

Farmers will have increased competition but they get to distinguish their products by their quality.

Cheap frozen NZ lamb is never going to be the same quality as saltmarsh lamb or Welsh lamb.

Consumers will win because they will have a choice.

For those who are trumping up the 0.08% figure as some kind of proof that this deal isn't worth much - take a look at how much of our trade we used to do with Au-Nz before we joined the EEC and were forced to turn our backs on them. If we get back to those kind of trade figures then it will be worth significantly more.

It also isn't a customs union. It's a free trade association. The difference seems marginal but it's huge.

Next time there's a President of the US who isn't hostile to the UK we'll be able to negotiate a trade deal with the USA too. It's just a matter of time before that pendulum aligns and once it's signed it will stay. If Trump had won a second term it would have been done already.

There are opportunities with Brexit and in an increasingly global world, they are set to grow.

The EU is set to stagnate. It will continue to stagnate until or unless it reforms.

....................Just WOW!

[fatboy47]

....................Just WOW!

It's like having our very own Lord Haw-Haw.