ARTICLE: Police seeking help with request for video footage

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:44 pm

HuncoatClaret wrote:I think that some Burnley fans will also face bans and criminal charges after the evidence has been look at.

Based on what? If evidence points the finger at Burnley fans then that would be the correct thing to happen, but the police have made it very clear with both their statements that the visiting fans were the perpetrators.

mybloodisclaret · Post by **mybloodisclaret** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:48 pm

Some absolute whoppers on this thread, clearly with a dislike for the police from other experiences, and what a great media to broadcast those views.....

Tell me...how many Burnley fans were hit with batons and arrested? I don't know the figures, but guessing none?? Yet keep going with your the police don't like Burnley agenda... bearing in mind of course that some believe the police are now after Burnley fans.... absolute nonsense!!!

The police have clearly blamed the Hanover supporters for the disgraceful scenes and have not once, anywhere suggested that BFC fans would be sought or blamed!!! Some of the comments beggar belief.

I can absolutely guarantee, that had we all turned up to the Turf on Saturday, and been faced with 700-900 cops dressed in full riot gear (bala's and helmets) and all the rest of it, that the same people criticising a lack of response on this thread would be saying, "it was over the top" "we pay their wages" ""they're on trillion times overtime"

The thread where they have asked for support has turned into a few clarets venting their anger at police. Sad.

Let's see what happens in the coming days. Hopefully the Muppets responsible will get locked up. Personally I'm happy to see they are getting locked up at the airport. There will still be some on here whinging about that though.

Unreal

JarrowClaret · Post by **JarrowClaret** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:01 am

I'm lost with this thread, I have been on hundreds of Burnley games home and away I have also been on quite a few games in Germany and have seen bits of trouble. I have seen the Police be heavy handed on a few occasions but at no point did I see them being unfairly heavy handed going from memory every time was deserved because some ****** up idiot was being stupid or kicking off. None of us know what the Police plan was but I guess it was reasonably successful as there weren't many injuries. In situations like this it is very rare that arrests are made straight away as the ring leaders never make themselves known at the front and they don't want the pawns at the front. They need to study video to work out who they were and if enough evidence get the relevant force German or British to arrest them.

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:05 am

Do you think they were unfairly heavy handed or fairly heavy handed at Stockport ?

mybloodisclaret · Post by **mybloodisclaret** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:06 am

Makes a bit of sense that Jarrow. I too have been lucky to watch football in Germany and saw any "problems" dealt with rapidly. I think a few on here would go into melt dos if they saw how polizei deal with hooliganism.

Somethingfishy · Post by **Somethingfishy** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:06 am

Well as can be seen with my experiences i am extremely wary and don't have much faith in the Lancs police. It remains to be seen if they catch the culprits and i hope they do but i think many of them will get away with it. I just can't get away from the fact they should have made it so much easier for themselves. How was the plan successful if people got injured? Nobody should have been injured. It should never have been allowed to get to that...as i keep saying.

Time will tell the final outcome and no certainty we will find out anyway.

Somethingfishy · Post by **Somethingfishy** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:07 am

mybloodisclaret wrote:Makes a bit of sense that Jarrow. I too have been lucky to watch football in Germany and saw any "problems" dealt with rapidly. I think a few on here would go into melt dos if they saw how polizei deal with hooliganism.

They deal with it as it should be dealt with. No messing about..unlike yesterday.

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:08 am

I to have watched football in Germany.

Paul Waine · Post by **Paul Waine** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:09 am

I've just watched Michael/The YouTube Joker's vlog (see "encouragement" thread). Gives a different impression of what was going on in CFS from what I get from reading this thread.

mybloodisclaret · Post by **mybloodisclaret** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:11 am

tim_noone wrote:Do you think they were unfairly heavy handed or fairly heavy handed at Stockport ?

What are you talking about???
Was this when the police officer got slapped and it all went off????

How many years ago? I am not defending them, but we are talking about YESTERDAY, not 20 odd years ago or Hillsborough. Have a word man.

For once (for your info) the police are clearly on your side!!!

It was them who allowed US in the CFS

bfccrazy · Post by **bfccrazy** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:12 am

tim_noone wrote:Do you think they were unfairly heavy handed or fairly heavy handed at Stockport ?

Forget Stockport - was walking with a limp for about 2 weeks after Preston away other season after being truncheoned in the concourse.

The police officer doing it didnt seem to find the logical reasoning that we couldnt get out of the concourse because he was stood in the way of the steps to the seats ...... So just decided to try and beat us back into the concourse ....... Which he then got annoyed at because we still were'nt out of that area.

It's happened all over and as someone mentioned earlier - for years we've been treated as **** by a lot of police officers for being football fans ....... Then they come back and ask to forget everything that they've done over the years and help them out as much as we can.

JarrowClaret · Post by **JarrowClaret** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:18 am

The Polizei carry Guns which also helps I have never seen any trouble in Germany if Honest, but I know there is lots of it they certainly don't mess about but I wouldn't the British Police doing what they do there would be some justifiably whinging if Lancs Constabulary did. I will leave you with the first thing I learnt in the Army when doing Riot training, there are no innocents in a riot the innocent have already left before it started. Not always accurate but 99% of the time it is.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:21 am

mybloodisclaret wrote:What are you talking about???
Was this when the police officer got slapped and it all went off????

How many years ago? I am not defending them, but we are talking about YESTERDAY, not 20 odd years ago or Hillsborough. Have a word man.

For once (for your info) the police are clearly on your side!!!

It was them who allowed US in the CFS

The fans in the cricket field stand seem to have actually won over the police. I believe they had real reservations when the club pushed for it initially and then came the Blackburn game when fans had been told they might be kicked out but, because things had gone smoothly, were allowed to stay. Without their support it would not have happened and now it is almost two years of home support in there with very few problems. Whatever they got right or wrong yesterday, they are, as mybloodisclaret has posted, on our side with this one. It really doesn't matter what's happened previously, and I know we've had problematic games when the police have been far from helpful, but the one thing we all surely want to see now is for those responsible (and they were clearly in the away fans section from what most of us have seen) to be found and dealt with.

bfccrazy · Post by **bfccrazy** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:26 am

mybloodisclaret
Re: ARTICLE: Police seeking help with request for video footage

Unread postMon Aug 07, 2017 12:22 am

Haha I was there, I know what you're talking about, I went to my seat when beer started getting thrown around, lads screaming and shouting and having a good old time....but when I saw more old bill arriving, I knew it was time to leave. Enjoyed the game.
Walked back to train with no leg injuries.

Ended up arriving to the ground late and actually had a laugh with the police outside - stepped in and just got hit after about 30 seconds. Charming - I didnt think Preston could get more grim.

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:32 am

bfccrazy wrote:mybloodisclaret
Re: ARTICLE: Police seeking help with request for video footage

Unread postMon Aug 07, 2017 12:22 am

Haha I was there, I know what you're talking about, I went to my seat when beer started getting thrown around, lads screaming and shouting and having a good old time....but when I saw more old bill arriving, I knew it was time to leave. Enjoyed the game.
Walked back to train with no leg injuries.

Ended up arriving to the ground late and actually had a laugh with the police outside - stepped in and just got hit after about 30 seconds. Charming - I didnt think Preston could get more grim.

Another rambling irrelevant post stay on track. Someone got it wrong at Saturdays game.

mybloodisclaret · Post by **mybloodisclaret** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:34 am

Oich... doesnt sound good mate. Did you report it? The concourse would have been full of cameras to catch such incidents?

bfccrazy · Post by **bfccrazy** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:35 am

tim_noone wrote:Another rambling irrelevant post stay on track. Someone got it wrong at Saturdays game.

Dyche got it wrong - he should have played Tark in CM.

DYCHE OUT - GERMANS OUT - POLICE OUT.

SU!

bfccrazy · Post by **bfccrazy** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:37 am

mybloodisclaret wrote:Oich... doesnt sound good mate. Did you report it? The concourse would have been full of cameras to catch such incidents?

Had a couple of their stewards give me their names ad said they would back up any complainta made to the club and gave me their clubs security office number.

By time I woke up the next morning that feelig of "whats the point, nothing will be done anyway" kicked in so I just left it.

Vegas Claret · Post by **Vegas Claret** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:38 am

I'm not a massive fan of the police nor do I hate them. I certainly don't envy them. With 2 stewards and 1 police officer injured yesterday I honestly don't see how anyone can say there execution of security was successful.

fidelcastro · Post by **fidelcastro** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:40 am

bfccrazy wrote:Had a couple of their stewards give me their names ad said they would back up any complainta made to the club and gave me their clubs security office number.

By time I woke up the next morning that feelig of "whats the point, nothing will be done anyway" kicked in so I just left it.

So the stewards offered to assist you, but you couldn't be bothered?

Seems strange when you'd just been assaulted.

Evil prospers when good men do nothing... unless, of course, you're just telling porkies?

bfccrazy · Post by **bfccrazy** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:42 am

fidelcastro wrote:So the stewards offered to assist you, but you couldn't be bothered?

Seems strange when you'd just been assaulted.

Evil prospers when good men do nothing... unless, of course, you're just telling porkies!

It's like I mentioned earlier - after a few incidents the distrust grows. Had it been a one off I'd of probably done something but it's not an isolated incident of police taking liberties at football matches I've been to.

mybloodisclaret · Post by **mybloodisclaret** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:42 am

Tim, I think everyone is on track the thread is riddled with previous experiences, everyone should have their say.
Mine is this;
It was a lose lose for the police, they are clear who is to blame but people aren't happy.
If they had over policed it, people would have had problem
They tried with Twitter and Facebook to make it a friendly affair, for the Germans hooligans that didn't work.
I don't think the police dislike Burnley my ST is in the CFS and I regularly see them happy when we score.
I imagine when you get a load of clowns looking for trouble you get a crazy circus.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:45 am

Jimscho wrote:Must have been a long time ago as every time I have been I have been,Burnley and Blackburn fans have been battling in the streets.Maybe I was just unlucky and was in the wrong part of town.

Some dates and evidence of this post could be interesting?
Or are we taking 20, 30 years ago?

fidelcastro · Post by **fidelcastro** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:46 am

bfccrazy wrote:It's like I mentioned earlier - after a few incidents the distrust grows. Had it been a one off I'd of probably done something but it's not an isolated incident of police taking liberties at football matches I've been to.

Which do you think would result in a more positive outcome?

1/ You make a statement to the Police with support from the stewards, as promised.

2/ You do nowt.

Answers on a postcard.

bfccrazy · Post by **bfccrazy** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:47 am

fidelcastro wrote:Which do you think would result in a more positive outcome?

1/ You make a statement to the Police with support from the stewards, as promised.

2/ You do nowt.

Answers on a postcard.

Probably have the same outcome ........

fidelcastro · Post by **fidelcastro** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:52 am

bfccrazy wrote:Probably have the same outcome ........

Hells Bells!

bfccrazy · Post by **bfccrazy** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:54 am

fidelcastro wrote:Hells Bells!

I remember a lot of people complaining about the way police acted in the video posted earlier (which I got caught up in)......... And nothing came of it - even though you can see the police swearing and indiscriminantly lashing out at any fans.

With that in mind - and many people having videos of it ........ You might see my reluctance to do anything and take it on the chin...... Or leg.

fidelcastro · Post by **fidelcastro** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:57 am

bfccrazy wrote:I remember a lot of people complaining about the way police acted in the video posted earlier (which I got caught up in)......... And nothing came of it - even though you can see the police swearing and indiscriminantly lashing out at any fans.

With that in mind - and many people having videos of it ........ You might see my reluctance to do anything and take it on the chin...... Or leg.

Yeah. I can see it now.

You enter the Police Station to make a statement, and out come the plods complete with full riot gear and batons waving, under orders to give you a right good flogging!

I stand corrected.

bfccrazy · Post by **bfccrazy** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:59 am

fidelcastro wrote:Yeah. I can see it now.

You enter the Police Station to make a statement, and out come the plods complete with full riot gear and batons waving, under orders to give you a right good flogging!

I stand corrected.

Or I go through all the necessary means like a lot of people did with another incident to just get told "it was justified and nothing can be done" ....

fidelcastro · Post by **fidelcastro** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 1:01 am

bfccrazy wrote:Or I go through all the necessary means like a lot of people did with another incident to just get told "it was justified and nothing can be done" ....

What strange logic you have.

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 1:07 am

fidelcastro wrote:Which do you think would result in a more positive outcome?

1/ You make a statement to the Police with support from the stewards, as promised.

2/ You do nowt.

Answers on a postcard.

Doing nowt would be the most positive outcome.save on paperwork travelling to and from court all the drama of a court case the acquittal .doing nowt is the positive approach .

fidelcastro · Post by **fidelcastro** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 1:10 am

tim_noone wrote:Doing nowt would be the most positive outcome.save on paperwork travelling to and from court all the drama of a court case the acquittal .doing nowt is the positive approach .

Ah, Tim Loon and his pearls of wisdom!

Definitely my cue to go to bed.

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 1:17 am

Yes and put the. cat out please.

ten bellies · Post by **ten bellies** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 1:41 am

ClaretTony wrote:One personal view of once incident - that's all it is and if you believe the rest then sadly we have no chance have we?

I've witnessed similar behaviour from Burnley police. Head in the sand Claret Tony. The midget policeman and his superior I talked to in CFS immediately after the seat throwing, were pathetic. I asked why they had not used the weapons they carry, to drive back the Hannover fans. Answer, there were more of them than the coppers. Instead they drove back the Burnley fans, who know full well we are easily identified, arrested and banned if we responded.

dermotdermot · Post by **dermotdermot** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 2:20 am

Bedtime for Bonzo.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 4:44 am

Top Claret wrote:The UK police have no chance of bringing the Germans to book and they know it. Old bill, are after Burnley supporters full stop. Anyone who thinks other wise is very nieve.

And many on here would happily snitch on fellow Burnley fans despite many claims of it not being our fans at fault. The police want convictions to make themselves not look stupid, they cant get the Hannover lot so will happily punish our fans regardless of circumstances.

ExistentialWanderer · Post by **ExistentialWanderer** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 5:04 am

I've been moving house, crossing t's, dotting i's, gas, electric etc over the past week so have been busy but feel compelled to post on this. I can see the deep mistrust some have with police. Personally I am no fan of the police whatsoever. That said, they do a difficult job and usually in situations such as Saturday, can be a very fluid set of circumstances where innocents may become embroiled in a situation, which; given a didfferent time/place the officer may have acted with more restraint.
I digress. I think this is a very clear message from the police that they don't blame our fans and to go down the road of prosecuting Burnley fans for defending themselves would set a dangerous precedent. It is, however; a chance for Burnley police to step up to the plate and show themselves in a positive light and possibly gain a bit of trust back.
When all is said and done it is patently clear that is was Hannover fans who were to blame. For what it's worth. There is a very keen movement across Europe's police forces to identify hooligans and while these Germans may not face prosecution here. The German authorities will be very keen on the video footage.
As stated. I am no police fan but I'd not be adverse to sending footage to them in this instance as it was clearly their fans causing trouble. It's a good chance for Burnley Police to build a few bridges and I'd be interested to see how it develops.

Danieljwaterhouse · Post by **Danieljwaterhouse** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 5:09 am

It's staggering to see the horrendous attitude many are having to go this polite request.

I think many in here need to consider the implications of their actions in writing potentially delflamatory statements about a police force that may well be reading these forums.

The police acted to keep Burnley fans safe in asking for further evidence are continuing to do so. It's an ongoing investigation into the WHOLE incident. That will likely be reviewed internally as a force as well as with both clubs and the FA.

The one sided reporting of incidents that have happened years past is nothing more than a excuse for fans to bring up every injustice they perceive to have suffered at the hands of the police. Sadly it's still 'cool' to hate the police and authority in many parts of our society.

The real question for me is, who made the decision to allow the team to play Hannover knowing that their following was such, and that this had been evidenced in previous visits to the UK?

This should've been stopped at source.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 5:13 am

I'm sure we are near the top of the banning order list. The police treat Burnley fans like sh** now they want help

The pigs are so incompetent they moved the Burnley fans and still had to abandon the game.

TsarBomba · Post by **TsarBomba** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 5:49 am

There's some quite staggering comments on this thread. Quite clearly a number of posters have an axe to grind with the Police, for personal reasons, which have nothing to do with this incident.

There are a lot of armchair critics on here, when it comes to Policing, but judging by their comments know **** all about policing a public order incident.

The priority is to contain, reduce the risk, and then identify offenders at a later stage. The Police don't have the resources to arrest en masse a large number of people who are drunk, volatile, and clearly looking for a fight.

Has anyone on here tried to detain and arrest a man, or woman, drunk and wanting to fight? No? Thought not. It can take anything up to half a dozen officers to deal with one person safely. Every arrest reduces the strength of numbers out on the street.

Lancs Police don't have the numbers, the vehicles, or cell space to deal with a violent disorder on any scale. This isn't their fault. If you have a problem with this, take it up with Teresa May.

Look at the London Riots. The Met arrested 4,500+ after the event, all through CCTV and secondary enquiries. This is the way of dealing with any sort of public order incident. Like it or lump it. The Police will do what they can at the time, but the priority is ensuring public safety, not effecting arrests. Lancs Police did that yesterday by calling the game off, and escorting the Hannover fans away.

And instead of constantly criticising, nit picking, and finding fault in their actions, in policy and procedure that you all quite clearly know **** all about, try supporting the Police in what they do. They're putting themselves in harms way, with little or no protection, on a daily basis.

JohnMac · Post by **JohnMac** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 5:54 am

Anyone with an ounce of normality would help the Police without being asked, there will be vital footage somewhere.

In this self obsessed age I bet a few will have been taking 'selfies' to show the trouble behind them for an 'I was there' later on.

Perhaps you won't help because you don't want the world to know how stupid you look?

Your average copper would love nothing more than to crack of few heads BUT they don't have a licence to act above the law with impunity and have to show restraint. Dumbing down the situation is the best method , okay it didn't deter the Hannover Ultra's but life isn't always predictable.

Edit
I remember being at Ewood in 09/10 and trying to have a pee after some idiots had smashed nearly every bowl, toilet and sink.

But Burnley fans are innocent so it must have been the Police trying to start something, or at least some on here will choose to believe that.

Herts Clarets · Post by **Herts Clarets** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 6:19 am

"Your average copper would love nothing more than to crack of few heads BUT they don't have a licence to act above the law with impunity and have to show restraint. "

Watch the clip in post 101. The Police did crack a few heads,didn't show restraint and acted above the law. In the very same stand we saw the trouble on Saturday. Many complaints were made to the Police including video footage. The outcome was that the Police action was justified.

Then you may understand the mistrust many people have with policing at the Turf.

TheFamilyCat · Post by **TheFamilyCat** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 6:50 am

I think some people just need to admit that they are ****** off that the police didn't crack a few German skulls.

JohnMac · Post by **JohnMac** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:06 am

Herts Clarets wrote:"Your average copper would love nothing more than to crack of few heads BUT they don't have a licence to act above the law with impunity and have to show restraint. "

Watch the clip in post 101. The Police did crack a few heads,didn't show restraint and acted above the law. In the very same stand we saw the trouble on Saturday. Many complaints were made to the Police including video footage. The outcome was that the Police action was justified.

Then you may understand the mistrust many people have with policing at the Turf.

I remember that sad affair and FWIW maybe there should have been some action taken against the Police but
those who want trouble are often out of their head on drugs and drink and the application of minimum force is on a sliding scale.

Not being in confrontation in the first place seems to work for hundreds of thousands of other people who perhaps enjoy watching football every week.

I don't think anything would have prevented the flare up this weekend other than an over proportional Police presence. Of course if that had worked there would have been scathing criticism on here from the usual suspects of over the top action of the Lancashire Constabulary for a 'friendly fixture'.

TheFamilyCat · Post by **TheFamilyCat** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:12 am

Herts Clarets wrote:"Your average copper would love nothing more than to crack of few heads BUT they don't have a licence to act above the law with impunity and have to show restraint. "

Watch the clip in post 101. The Police did crack a few heads,didn't show restraint and acted above the law. In the very same stand we saw the trouble on Saturday. Many complaints were made to the Police including video footage. The outcome was that the Police action was justified.

Then you may understand the mistrust many people have with policing at the Turf.

That video seems to show the police effectively clearing dickheads out of the stand.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:55 am

Are any of these incidents recent?

Preston away seems to be the only one that I can remember recently, and my recollection of our fans behaviour differs quite a lot from what one poster has posted on here.

Stockport was what? thirty years ago?

Things have changed thankfully, both in fan behaviour and the way the police do things.

claretdom · Post by **claretdom** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:20 am

Anyone else had the clip of the "legendary" Burnley informer on 606 on Saturday, "worst he has ever seen", "miles worse than Celtic" then described himself as a bit of a lad sent to them ?

Cooperclaret · Post by **Cooperclaret** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:31 am

I know of at least one post on this thread that has been reported to the Police and they are currently investigating it.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:38 am

Which one?

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:50 am

Hopefully one by ablue