how long before investors....?

Sidney1st · Post by **Sidney1st** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 4:03 pm

As for Gibson dumping his money into Boro, can I point you towards Bolton as an example?

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 4:11 pm

Sidney1st wrote:As for Gibson dumping his money into Boro, can I point you towards Bolton as an example?

Can I point you towards Chelsea and Man City?

Chester Perry · Post by **Chester Perry** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 4:33 pm

UpTheBeehole wrote:Can I point you towards Chelsea and Man City?

very different scenarios we are not in a big world renowned city - the nearest analogy in world sport to what we could potentially be in a big league is the Greenbay Packers and a lot of the residual affection for them outside Wisconsin is down to their domination of the NFL in its formative years. Greenbay is a similar sized town but Wisconsin has a much bigger population than our catchment and you have to travel a quite bit further to meet your nearest competitors. There are also very different rules in place to even out the competitive balance

Hipper · Post by **Hipper** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:17 pm

I don't want external investment for two reasons:

1. I would question the motives of any external investor at our club. He cannot possibly get any financial return in the usual way of dividends on his shares. How would he get rewarded?

2. I like the challenge we have with our current set up. For example, it feels so good getting the away results we've got this season with our existing set up. Does a Man City fan get the same feeling winning 6-0 at Watford? I don't want things handed to us on a plate.

Walt · Post by **Walt** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:37 pm

Hipper wrote:I don't want external investment for two reasons:

2. I like the challenge we have with our current set up. For example, it feels so good getting the away results we've got this season with our existing set up. Does a Man City fan get the same feeling winning 6-0 at Watford? I don't want things handed to us on a plate.

Totally agree our successes feel so much better following graft and keeping control of spending. However, whether we want it or not, a takeover will happen at some point. We have to trust the board to use their own fit and proper test rather than the farcical one that seems to exist at the FA.

Dyched · Post by **Dyched** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:37 pm

Hipper wrote: 2. I like the challenge we have with our current set up. For example, it feels so good getting the away results we've got this season with our existing set up. Does a Man City fan get the same feeling winning 6-0 at Watford? I don't want things handed to us on a plate.

Winning 6 - 0 on the road to go top? Yes please.

I get where people are coming from regarding this issue. Does it mean as much or feel the same. I recall Noel Gallagher talking about a conversation he had with Ricky Hatton. Apparently Ricky hates how City are and wants the old days back and Noel is the complete opposite. I understand both sides.

But imagine waking up on a tuesday morning before going to the airport to watch Burnley vs Barcelona/Real in a CL game.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:52 pm

Dyched wrote:Winning 6 - 0 on the road to go top? Yes please.

I get where people are coming from regarding this issue. Does it mean as much or feel the same. I recall Noel Gallagher talking about a conversation he had with Ricky Hatton. Apparently Ricky hates how City are and wants the old days back and Noel is the complete opposite. I understand both sides.

But imagine waking up on a tuesday morning before going to the airport to watch Burnley vs Barcelona/Real in a CL game.

Imagine signing some of the best players in the world, winning the PL title and competing in the Champions League every year. An absolute dream that could never be made a reality without investment. Imagine how great Aguero and De Bruyne would look in Claret and Blue.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:54 pm

Sidney1st wrote:As for Gibson dumping his money into Boro, can I point you towards Bolton as an example?

But so long as Gibson is willing to dump HIS money into HIS club it doesn't really matter and it makes him the complete opposite of a bad owner. I wish there was a billionaire Burnley fan willing to do the same.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:57 pm

If we do get an investor, I hope they're aware that relegation can happen.

diamondpocket · Post by **diamondpocket** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:09 pm

KRBFC wrote:Imagine signing some of the best players in the world, winning the PL title and competing in the Champions League every year. An absolute dream that could never be made a reality without investment. Imagine how great Aguero and De Bruyne would look in Claret and Blue.

Investment at that level will never ever happen to us. If it does then we will have sold our club and the fears of many about traditions and losing identity will have come true.

Sidney1st · Post by **Sidney1st** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:13 pm

UpTheBeehole wrote:Can I point you towards Chelsea and Man City?

You're more than welcome too, let me know when you're ready to be taken apart though.

Sidney1st · Post by **Sidney1st** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:16 pm

KRBFC wrote:But so long as Gibson is willing to dump HIS money into HIS club it doesn't really matter and it makes him the complete opposite of a bad owner. I wish there was a billionaire Burnley fan willing to do the same.

Gibson's net worth is rumoured to be £150 million.
I'm not sure why you think he's dumping his own money into the club.

What he actually does is offset the clubs losses against the profits from his haulage firm and they're both 'owned' by a parent company.
Occasionally he will need to write off x amount and that's what he did a few years ago to meet FFP I think it was.

He doesn't risk his own personal money, he isn't that silly.
Davies did something similar at Bolton, they owed Davies close to £200 million but he offset that against something else so his own personal fortune wasn't at risk, ever.

AndrewJB · Post by **AndrewJB** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:16 pm

Chester Perry wrote:very different scenarios we are not in a big world renowned city - the nearest analogy in world sport to what we could potentially be in a big league is the Greenbay Packers and a lot of the residual affection for them outside Wisconsin is down to their domination of the NFL in its formative years. Greenbay is a similar sized town but Wisconsin has a much bigger population than our catchment and you have to travel a quite bit further to meet your nearest competitors. There are also very different rules in place to even out the competitive balance

The Packers offer an insight into the way Burnley could be owned in the future - by the fans.

diamondpocket · Post by **diamondpocket** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:17 pm

KRBFC wrote:But how long can we realistically expect to stay in the PL without paying the big bucks? Then when we're relegated, what happens then.... We would end up in deep sh** without the TV income.

Its almost like the longer we stay in the PL the more we set ourselves up for a bigger fall when relegation strikes. A good foreign investor would be a safety blanket or give us the platform to really even the playing field in the PL and give us a much better chance long term.

And what would happen if we got investment and spent it on average players flashing the cash because we can spend and then end up in relegation? TV income would drop and we'd be in the **** again; what if the investment then stopped or the owner didnt care because we werent in The Prem anymore? How many teams have invested more than they could afford/relied on TV money/have rich owners and still be relegated and not return from the Championship?
Investment at a mediocre level doesnt increase our chances of survival for me compared with our current model; slowly but surely we're growing.If we're talking about Chelsea/City type investment it's a different story but that isnt going to happen.

Chester Perry · Post by **Chester Perry** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:39 pm

KRBFC wrote:Imagine signing some of the best players in the world, winning the PL title and competing in the Champions League every year. An absolute dream that could never be made a reality without investment. Imagine how great Aguero and De Bruyne would look in Claret and Blue.

I appreciate that you weren't around at the time - but for many of those that were - what we are doing now and where we are and the state of the club is beyond anything we could have imagined

To be fair to you though I am sure that those who were there at the beginning of the 60's could tell you about that kind of excitement (no imagination required then for this at least) - though they may struggle to get their heads around the mind-boggling amounts of money required to do that now

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 7:10 pm

Chester Perry wrote:I appreciate that you weren't around at the time - but for many of those that were - what we are doing now and where we are and the state of the club is beyond anything we could have imagined

To be fair to you though I am sure that those who were there at the beginning of the 60's could tell you about that kind of excitement (no imagination required then for this at least) - though they may struggle to get their heads around the mind-boggling amounts of money required to do that now

One can dream cant he?

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 7:11 pm

Sidney1st wrote:Gibson's net worth is rumoured to be £150 million.
I'm not sure why you think he's dumping his own money into the club.

What he actually does is offset the clubs losses against the profits from his haulage firm and they're both 'owned' by a parent company.
Occasionally he will need to write off x amount and that's what he did a few years ago to meet FFP I think it was.

He doesn't risk his own personal money, he isn't that silly.
Davies did something similar at Bolton, they owed Davies close to £200 million but he offset that against something else so his own personal fortune wasn't at risk, ever.

Because I'm stupid when it comes to football finance

Sidney1st · Post by **Sidney1st** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 7:22 pm

KRBFC wrote:Because I'm stupid when it comes to football finance

I'm not even going to argue with that one

levraiclaret · Post by **levraiclaret** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 7:46 pm

KRBFC wrote:Imagine signing some of the best players in the world, winning the PL title and competing in the Champions League every year. An absolute dream that could never be made a reality without investment. Imagine how great Aguero and De Bruyne would look in Claret and Blue.

How much do you imagine the "investor" would have to invest to get BFC to that level bearing in mind that Everton have invested £140 million and Koeman does not believe that Everton will be in the top 6 at the end of the season?

Sidney1st · Post by **Sidney1st** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:33 pm

Is that £140million AFTER the sale of Lukaku?

Steddyman · Post by **Steddyman** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:38 pm

Three pages of pointless posts about an investment that will never come.

You can tell the transfer window isn't open.

tiger76 · Post by **tiger76** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:48 pm

levraiclaret wrote:How much do you imagine the "investor" would have to invest to get BFC to that level bearing in mind that Everton have invested £140 million and Koeman does not believe that Everton will be in the top 6 at the end of the season?

I don't imagine it's just Koeman that thinks Everton won't be in a European spot come the end of the season

Walt · Post by **Walt** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:34 pm

Steddyman wrote:Three pages of pointless posts about an investment that will never come.

You can tell the transfer window isn't open.

Yes most of the comments have been geared towards an Abramovich type of investment (highly unlikely to happen) but it's a very worthy debate I think. Change of ownership has to happen at some point and to me it's a concern as to where we'll go after that.

Cash is king now. The years of fighting our way back from division 4 has been achieved whilst not really having a pot to **** in. Where we are now we still don't really when you consider the finances of most premier league clubs compared to ours.

Ambrose · Post by **Ambrose** » Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:13 pm

Blackburn sold out and still finished up playing in the lower leagues.

We can find our level without being mismanaged by a bunch of greedy foreigners because it goes wrong more often than not.

Whilst it's exciting being in the top division, it's not essential. I would rather watch Burnley in League two, than sell out. Burnley is a proper club and I'm proud to be a supporter.

Burnleyareback2 · Post by **Burnleyareback2** » Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:52 pm

I have said it before but I really wish we would take £50m out of the budget and invest it somewhere, property etc. Something that will give us an income if we ever need it again.

Paul Waine · Post by **Paul Waine** » Mon Sep 25, 2017 9:01 pm

Burnleyareback2 wrote:I have said it before but I really wish we would take £50m out of the budget and invest it somewhere, property etc. Something that will give us an income if we ever need it again.

Hi Burnleyareback2, I doubt it works like that. Let's say we put £50 million into residential property, build a few warehouses for Amazon/whoever, or some residential units. How much return are we going to get every year? Let's assume we can make 10%, so we get £5 million a year. How much do we spend on wages every year? Let's say £40 m in the Prem, and reducing to £25 in Championship (and below). It's hard to see £5 million making much of difference.

Maybe doing the best we can to stay in the Premier League is the best investment we can make - while keeping a little back as a cushion to avoid the "financial catastrophe" of going back down to the Championship and giving us a good basis for another promotion. I'm sure that's how the Board see things.

UTC

Burnleyareback2 · Post by **Burnleyareback2** » Mon Sep 25, 2017 9:11 pm

Paul Waine wrote:Hi Burnleyareback2, I doubt it works like that. Let's say we put £50 million into residential property, build a few warehouses for Amazon/whoever, or some residential units. How much return are we going to get every year? Let's assume we can make 10%, so we get £5 million a year. How much do we spend on wages every year? Let's say £40 m in the Prem, and reducing to £25 in Championship (and below). It's hard to see £5 million making much of difference.

Maybe doing the best we can to stay in the Premier League is the best investment we can make - while keeping a little back as a cushion to avoid the "financial catastrophe" of going back down to the Championship and giving us a good basis for another promotion. I'm sure that's how the Board see things.

UTC

Fair point and I hope we never need it, however the longer we stay in this league the longer we can reinvest the interest or add to the capital.

Even the most positive of fans will expect us back in the championship at some stage, worst case longer than the parachute payments last. A £5m a season income a few years ago would of made one hell of a difference, we appeared to only survive based on selling players.
If nothing else it would keep the academy running.

Get your point though.

Longsidebovril · Post by **Longsidebovril** » Mon Sep 25, 2017 9:34 pm

That Reading song is AWESOME!

how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?

Re: how long before investors....?