Bitcoin

Carter2711 · Post by **Carter2711** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:06 pm

has anybody had any experiences investing in bitcoin? I recently signed up to usi tech which 'mine' bitcoin after a recommendation from a work colleague, I seem to be making some good money off it!

I have not invested any great amounts of money but I am wanting to see how it multiplies (if it ever does!)

SammyBoy · Post by **SammyBoy** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:26 pm

I don't follow this closely so I could be wrong but I think if you're getting into Bitcoin now you've sort of missed the boat. 2012 was the time to invest before the bubble, last time I checked 1 Bitcoin is now worth $2200. My mate had loads back in the day but spent them all on trivial purchases, they'd have been worth an absolute fortune had he kept hold of them. Possibly look at other cryptocurrencies, logic dictates that if the Bitcoin bubble bursts another one might take off.

RingoMcCartney · Post by **RingoMcCartney** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:33 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/ ... dfill-site" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Carter2711 · Post by **Carter2711** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:33 pm

Yeah I thought that myself. The beauty of this is I can buy packs so I get a % of a Bitcoin at a time as well as daily interest rates. It seems really good so far!

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 1:17 pm

There's a lengthy discussion on crypto currency here http://www.uptheclarets.com/messageboar ... =2&t=18600&" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

In terms of USI Tech, I'd be a bit suspicious of it. The main money seems to come from referrals, i.e. like a pyramid scheme. It's probably doing OK at the moment with the increase in value of bitcoin recently but I imagine that if a few of the larger investors pulled out it would collapse like a house of cards.

They claim that the money comes from arbitrage deals on the exchanges but the variances aren't really large enough with a high enough volume to make significant profits.

My gut feel is that a few people will make money from this, many more will lose.

whiffa · Post by **whiffa** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 1:51 pm

You'd be better off investing in Ethereum now, the new Bitcoin. Read into it if you wanted to know more.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 1:58 pm

SammyBoy wrote:I don't follow this closely so I could be wrong but I think if you're getting into Bitcoin now you've sort of missed the boat. 2012 was the time to invest before the bubble, last time I checked 1 Bitcoin is now worth $2200. My mate had loads back in the day but spent them all on trivial purchases, they'd have been worth an absolute fortune had he kept hold of them. Possibly look at other cryptocurrencies, logic dictates that if the Bitcoin bubble bursts another one might take off.

Alternatively, logic also says that when one bitcoin bubble bursts it may well be because people have realised they are paying $2,200 for something which does not exist and which only has value because of the chance that someone else might pay even more further down the line.

Essentially, bubbles are created when something which is worthless becomes popular. The price goes up and up until there comes a point when there aren't any more buyers at that price, the price starts to fall, people realise they're not getting anything for their money, and the price goes through the floor. The ones holding the baby when that happens lose everything.

CombatClaret · Post by **CombatClaret** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 1:59 pm

I'm a bit of a geek and I massively regret not getting in on it earlier despite knowing about it. I purchased a small amount not to long ago in that time it went down 25% with news from China but is now up 30% on my starting price :s

I would not recommend 'Cloud Mining' such as USI or Genesis Mining at all, the money you get back diminishes over time and is eaten into by fees so you are highly unlikely to get back what you paid in.
Here's a thread on Genesis which looks similar to USI on how the figures do not add up to a profit.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/commen ... our_money/

Far better to just use that same money to buy bitcoin up front and hold.

SammyBoy wrote:if you're getting into Bitcoin now you've sort of missed the boat. 2012 was the time to invest before the bubble, last time I checked 1 Bitcoin is now worth $2200..

The initial huge increase in price is behind us, but it is still early days for it to go mainstream as a currency or a legitimate store of value/common investment tool. There could be a lot more still to come.
Don't let the price of one bitcoin put you off, 1BTC is now worth around $5k but don't see that as the barrier to entry. Best way to start it to buy 0.01btc ($50) just to see how it all works.

CombatClaret · Post by **CombatClaret** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 2:03 pm

dsr wrote:Alternatively, logic also says that when one bitcoin bubble bursts it may well be because people have realised they are paying $2,200 for something which does not exist and which only has value because of the chance that someone else might pay even more further down the line.

Essentially, bubbles are created when something which is worthless becomes popular. The price goes up and up until there comes a point when there aren't any more buyers at that price, the price starts to fall, people realise they're not getting anything for their money, and the price goes through the floor. The ones holding the baby when that happens lose everything.

Same goes for fiat currency, only difference is you can pay your taxes with pounds and dollars. Though I should mention countries are starting to allow that with bitcoin and you can already buy coffee and pizza with it.

Bitcoin with seen as a speculative investment, it has value as an original technology and as a network of integrated computers acting as a decentralized payment system. All of that combined does create a tangible physical resource you can point to and not just a bunch of tulips.

Carter2711 · Post by **Carter2711** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 2:11 pm

CombatClaret wrote:I'm a bit of a geek and I massively regret not getting in on it earlier despite knowing about it. I purchased a small amount not to long ago in that time it went down 25% with news from China but is now up 30% on my starting price :s

I would not recommend 'Cloud Mining' such as USI or Genesis Mining at all, the money you get back diminishes over time and is eaten into by fees so you are highly unlikely to get back what you paid in.
Here's a thread on Genesis which looks similar to USI on how the figures do not add up to a profit.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/commen ... our_money/

Far better to just use that same money to buy bitcoin up front and hold.

The initial huge increase in price is behind us, but it is still early days for it to go mainstream as a currency or a legitimate store of value/common investment tool. There could be a lot more still to come.
Don't let the price of one bitcoin put you off, 1BTC is now worth around $5k but don't see that as the barrier to entry. Best way to start it to buy 0.01btc ($50) just to see how it all works.

That us it, I started with €50 and I get a daily interest back which can be withdrawn into Bitcoin and as long as prices remain the same or increase I will make money. If anyone wants to join me on my journey and see it for themselves I have a link I can pass to You!

SammyBoy · Post by **SammyBoy** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 2:11 pm

CombatClaret wrote:
The initial huge increase in price is behind us, but it is still early days for it to go mainstream as a currency or a legitimate store of value/common investment tool. There could be a lot more still to come.
Don't let the price of one bitcoin put you off, 1BTC is now worth around $5k but don't see that as the barrier to entry. Best way to start it to buy 0.01btc ($50) just to see how it all works.

$5k? Jeez! As I said a good friend of mine had 20 bitcoins that he bought back in 2012 for about £30 each, which we subsequently used to buy ecstasy from The Silk Road. Good to know those nights out in Preston have in effect cost us about £75k

Hindsight is a wonderful thing!

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 2:11 pm

Pounds and dollars are backed by the UK and US governments who promise to honour them. Bitcoins are backed by an anonymous computer owner in Japan who promises nothing. It makes a difference.

CombatClaret · Post by **CombatClaret** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 2:35 pm

Carter2711 wrote:That us it, I started with €50 and I get a daily interest back which can be withdrawn into Bitcoin and as long as prices remain the same or increase I will make money. If anyone wants to join me on my journey and see it for themselves I have a link I can pass to You!

With your $50 you've actually brought a small amount of computing power which will drip feed you small amounts of BTC, however over time the difficulty of mining more bitcoin increases so you will see your payments get smaller and smaller.
So if prices remain the same you may only end up with $35 of bitcoin for your initial $50 payment.

UTI & Genesis Mining are in it to make money off you, not for you!

Rather than paying someone else to mine for you, who charge you fees etc. Just buy $50 of bitcoin up front.

FCBurnley · Post by **FCBurnley** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 2:42 pm

Have a look at Ripple.com and their `bitcoin` which is called XRP. 22.5 cents this morning to USD. Forecast to go 1/1USD by next year ! but who knows

Paul Waine · Post by **Paul Waine** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 2:45 pm

Carter2711 wrote:has anybody had any experiences investing in bitcoin? I recently signed up to usi tech which 'mine' bitcoin after a recommendation from a work colleague, I seem to be making some good money off it!

I have not invested any great amounts of money but I am wanting to see how it multiplies (if it ever does!)

Hi Carter2711, bitcoin is now just one of many cryptocurrencies - a few months back bitcoin "split" into two, as one group weren't happy about the time it was taking to record a purchase/sale transacted with bitcoin. The technology isn't "great" to use to pay for a coffee or a pizza - much too slow, your coffee/pizza will be cold before the bitcoins have been transferred.

There are also "initial coin offerings" (ICOs) - but it's had to say what these really are, an upfront payment for something someone might produce some time in the future seems to be one pattern.

You should know that the regulators, FCA in UK, are warning against cryptocurrency transactions - there are no regulatory protections. It can be a bit like buying shares in a worthless, scam company in a boiler room transaction. Definitely "buyer beware."

Blockchain - the technology underlying bitcoin - may be different: the FT carried an article recently about things that banks are doing to benefit from blockchain. However, the work the banks are doing is still in a very early stage, nothing is proved to work, i.e. improve the current processes, reduce costs, be more secure, etc etc.

And, yes, if you plan to invest in bitcoin you need to understand the tulip bulb "speculation." Plus, the most optimistic words of all investors "it will be different this time."

IndigoLake · Post by **IndigoLake** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 2:52 pm

I did have some Bitcoin but have since invested in a few other cryptocurrencies - expanding the old portfolio and all that. The market is volatile and my suggestion is to have a good read up on as much information as you can before investing.

Cryptocurrency is still in its infancy and you certainly haven't missed the boat. I believe Bitcoin will continue to rise in value over the coming years though there will be some dips. Personally, I'm also interested in the following currencies: Litecoin (transactions are cheaper and quicker) and Monero which is a very secure and untraceable coin.

I believe in investing in coins that serve a purpose. There are a lot of scams out there (Bitcoin Cash and BitConnect being two of them) and a lot of ICO's with very bold promises and little substance to back them up. Be sure to read whitepapers as well as research the people behind different coins.

Also, I'd try and avoid daytrading in crypto. Most people who try to do so end up failing and losing money. Analysing the markets takes a lot of experience and they're too volatile without experience. If you do invest, hold onto your coins and be patient and it may well pay long term.

Carter2711 · Post by **Carter2711** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 3:00 pm

thank you all for your valuable input and I will take it on board, like I say im not hugely clued up on it all hence why I wanted the small investment to see where my money is, also like a pyramid scheme I do have people signed up under me which is commission based so my theory is if I invest small and others invest small around me then I should see some kind of return, even if bitcoin doesn't change much!

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 3:15 pm

Indigo, when I tried to purchase Bitcoin, they were asking for a passport photo, is that the norm?

IndigoLake · Post by **IndigoLake** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 3:20 pm

FactualFrank wrote:Indigo, when I tried to purchase Bitcoin, they were asking for a passport photo, is that the norm?

Hi! Not necessarily. Most exchanges have different tiers for security reasons. Unless you're trading huge sums, you shouldn't need to upload a photo. After all, a lot of people who trade in crypto like it because of its privacy potential.

I'm guessing you were using coinbase? Try Kraken. I really struggled getting verified on several coin exchanges because of silly rules such as needing to upload an ID document and that it needed to be from the same country in which I reside. Daft considering how many people move around Europe nowadays.

My advice is to try Kraken. You can get verified up to tier 2 or 3 which is still plenty of money. You don't need to upload any personal documents for that. It's a respected site and my SEPA transfers to the site have typically taken 24-48 hours but sometimes less. Be sure to avoid keeping substantial amounts of crypto on exchanges though. There have been issues with this. I always download mine to wallets.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 3:24 pm

Indigo, no it was Blockchain. I'll try Kraken, thanks for the advice.

Which online wallet do you recommend?

IndigoLake · Post by **IndigoLake** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 3:30 pm

FactualFrank wrote:Indigo, no it was Blockchain. I'll try Kraken, thanks for the advice.

Which online wallet do you recommend?

You're very welcome. Typically, different cryptocurrencies have different wallets. Personally, I avoid any online wallets. Try downloading Electrum's Bitcoin wallet. They also have one for Litecoin as well. If you have any questions when it comes to using these, just give me a shout.

Now is a good time to buy though I'm staggering my purchases over the coming week or two until the Bitcoin fork is over as I feel the prices will continue to be a bit unpredictable (pretty obvious statement though considering this is crypto). The feeling among crypto is that Bitcoin money will come pouring into the altcoins (basically everything that isn't Bitcoin) once the fork is over. Interesting to read up on the whole thing.

CombatClaret · Post by **CombatClaret** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 3:34 pm

FactualFrank wrote:Indigo, no it was Blockchain. I'll try Kraken, thanks for the advice.

Which online wallet do you recommend?

https://99bitcoins.com/best-bitcoin-wal ... on-review/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I use Blockchain, it's fine for smaller amounts though I'm moving mine offline. Any online service you have to put your trust in to not get hacked or steal your stuff.

You can set up a wallet on your own computer or buy a hardware wallet for about £80. I'm keeping mine on my desktop due to the upcoming potential hardfork which could potentially give you some free money!

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 3:41 pm

FactualFrank wrote:Indigo, when I tried to purchase Bitcoin, they were asking for a passport photo, is that the norm?

The passport photo and bill or similar are Anti-Money laundering regulations. If it is a reputable site I wouldn't be concerned by it, it shows that they're actually following the rules. I'd be more concerned about one that allowed you to trade large amounts without having to jump through the hoops first.

If you really do want to mine coins in some form then an interesting one coming up is Crown. You set up a node (which currently will take an investment of ~$500) which forms part of the infrastructure and the reward for that is a small share in the coins that are mined in that currency.

The ROI by itself (in terms of Crowns) looks good but if the currency itself loses all value (which is possible) then you'll have a lot of coins but they'll have no value. Obviously if the value increases that's great but the currencies are very volatile at the moment so who knows.

JohnMac · Post by **JohnMac** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 5:12 pm

I think learning Mandarin would easier for me than trying to understand what you lot are talking about

Carter2711 · Post by **Carter2711** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 9:19 pm

I have only just got into it in the last few days and I find it fascinating. I like the way usi-tech works by buying just slices of Bitcoin at a time. I heard the Bitcoin is still gaining a lot of momentum and is expected to do for a while but then again I guess it's what you listen to, everything is a risk!

JohnMac · Post by **JohnMac** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 5:52 pm

Looks like this is the New 'Nigerian Lottery' Scam.

I have just opened my emails and am happy to read I still have 4.3 Bitcoins in my Wallet

I have also been selected as a tester for Bitcoin and am allowed to keep any profit

This is despite never in my life getting involved in Bitcoin in any way shape or form (more's the pity though)

IndigoLake · Post by **IndigoLake** » Sat Oct 21, 2017 7:37 am

Last night BTC achieved a new all-time high (over $6000 per coin) and reached a market cap of over $100 billion. Meanwhile, my beloved Vertcoin went from $2 to $2.50 overnight and reached a market cap of $100 million - also a new personal all-time high. Loving those gains.

piston broke · Post by **piston broke** » Sat Oct 21, 2017 9:33 am

This might be of interest to you bitcoin owners
http://news.sky.com/story/from-two-pizz ... e-11090760" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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