ARTICLE: Police seeking help with request for video footage

MACCA · Post by **MACCA** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 8:50 pm

Aahh here it is, send them this....

Ask them why these type of officers wasn't on duty Saturday.

https://youtu.be/zqPz-xd94z0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 8:52 pm

I agree with you 100% as is my right.

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 8:54 pm

MACCA wrote:Aahh here it is, send them this....

Ask them why these type of officers wasn't on duty Saturday.

https://youtu.be/zqPz-xd94z0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And that's my view on burnley police.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 8:57 pm

Its an era of mobile phones and people filming everything. What the hell is wrong with asking for more videos, so they can actually arrest people and CONVICT them.

You know, that pesky stuff like "evidence". Might stop this happening again.

But no, lets rant about the bias that the police have towards us.

beddie · Post by **beddie** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 8:57 pm

If the Police receive some good footage that identifies the culprits they will liaise with their counterparts in bringing them to justice.

MACCA · Post by **MACCA** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 8:58 pm

tim_noone wrote:And that's my view on burnley police.

And mine. 1 rule for 1, a different one for another.

All I ask for is fairness. If We all play by the same rules and punishments, no one can complain.
Sadly the Lancs police ( probably the top dogs ) can't do there jobs correctly.

Half of them wouldn't last a week in the big city.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 8:58 pm

Jimmymaccer wrote:Relatively minor incident.....

That's ok then, just a few harmless kids.

No it was organised thuggery, and there's no place for that. 5 or 500, needs dealing with.

Well, they dealt with it in the way they saw fit, which is fine with me.
Does anyone really think the German police are going to follow this up?
Was anyone actually hurt?

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:02 pm

1 policewoman and 2 stewards, but no one seriously.

Which is a relief.

Just send the police what you've got and see what happens.

MACCA · Post by **MACCA** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:02 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Its an era of mobile phones and people filming everything. What the hell is wrong with asking for more videos, so they can actually arrest people and CONVICT them.

You know, that pesky stuff like "evidence". Might stop this happening again.

But no, lets rant about the bias that the police have towards us.

They usually have 2 or 3 of their own avoidance gatherers, the batteries mustn't have been charged up though in time for this game.. .

It Is a rant, because they are quick enough to tar us all with the same brush, yet come cap in hand when they're found wanting.
They failed at their jobs, yet they are trying to portray as if they like us and we'rein this together.

Burnley fans did nothing wrong Saturday. The police force put lives at risk, they need to be held accountable and must answers the critics!

Jimscho · Post by **Jimscho** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:03 pm

Somethingfishy wrote:So they kick off with the police then within the stand..but surely that than getting to the point they start trying to attack the Burnley fans and throwing seats that injure 4 year old children? The police get paid to deal with trouble like that and they ended up having to do it anyway. Just keep burying your head in the sand and defending the indefensible. They should have been confronted before they had chance to charge the home end. They had just trashed a family restaurant for gods sake and the police leave them alone in a stadium full of families?? Really??

It wouldn't have stopped with them just attacking the police it would have escalated.Guaranteed.Not to confront them they were hoping,what happened,wouldn't happen.Unfortunately it did.Not the police fault.It was totally the fault of the YOBS.They knew what they were doing and what they came for.To cause trouble.I am not burying my head in the sand but if you can't see what you wanted the police to do would have made things worse then we will have to beg to differ.

Somethingfishy · Post by **Somethingfishy** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:04 pm

tim_noone wrote:And that's my view on burnley police.

Mine too. I have seen it first hand way too many times.

Burnley v Preston several years ago...2 fans having a private spat on Belvedere Road after the game. Along comes a copper on a horse screaming his head off at the innocent familes who are already trying to avoid the scuffle..forcing them to either jump in peoples gardens or get trampled by his horse. The look on his face of sheer anger. He had lost control of himself and his horse. I was amazed nobody got hurt..yet the 2 combatants were allowed to carry on. Beyond bizarre policing.

Another game....Walking along Harry Potts Way..a guy in front of me asks a policeman next to the away coaches why the heavy operation and states in his opinion it is OTT..he is instantly grabbed and thrown against the coach and cuffed. No reason given. This caused aggravation amongst the fans around me and could have easily caused a more dangerous incident.I can only presume he was later released with no caution. I certainly hope so. This latter type of incident is quite a common occurrence. Just don't talk to them is the best policy.

Just a couple of examples.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:05 pm

They usually have 2 or 3 of their own avoidance gatherers, the batteries mustn't have been charged up though in time for this game.. .

I saw one filming the Hannover fans before the game.

There is nothing wrong in the era of mobile phones asking for more evidence.

MACCA · Post by **MACCA** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:07 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:I saw one filming the Hannover fans before the game.

There is nothing wrong in the era of mobile phones asking for more evidence.

I agree, it's bed time for me.

I hope the culprits are brought to justice.
And I do hope our local police force, changed their minds about Burnley fans, as it could have been 10 times worse should they have reacted, not just in the ground.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:08 pm

Weird. Its only happened to me once that I can remember.

I've only ever felt that the police have penalised me for being a football fan after the first derby v Rovers after all those years without playing each other, and we all know what happened there.

And I've been going home and away for far too long!

Now if you want me to list times I've seen Burnley fans act like complete tools its certainly more than once!

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:08 pm

They have made arrests boarding planes.

Stevebfc40 · Post by **Stevebfc40** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:10 pm

I'm in Germany myself, just come for a couple of days. In Manchester airport today was talking to a few of their returning lads. They told me no one has been detained or charged and that it had been a great and successful weekend in Burnley and Manchester.

I find it incredible that no one was detained in the ground. If that had happened in the home section the cells would have been full across Lancashire. The stand is fully covered by CCTV and culprits could have been pinpointed within minutes. Not let go to return home and it get swept under the carpet given time.

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:11 pm

That police rider was a complete nasty piece of work..saw him in more than one occasion mounting the pavement...one outside the110 club.dont get me on kids and old folk he ploughed into them all.a nasty piece of work.

Somethingfishy · Post by **Somethingfishy** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:13 pm

The real difference is the treatment. Go to an away game and you feel like they are there to protect you, to help you..some have a laugh with you and as long as you are a sensible and normal person you are fine.

Go to Turf Moor on a game with a big police presence and you are just waiting for something to happen. Very easily offended. Very irritable and a general bad attitude. You just get the arms folded..move on or else look. It is just not acceptable and too many people clearly can't see it. It wouldn't stop me giving evidence if i had it but i certainly see where Macca is coming from. It isn't all in his head.

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:13 pm

Stevebfc40 wrote:I'm in Germany myself, just come for a couple of days. In Manchester airport today was talking to a few of their returning lads. They told me no one has been detained or charged and that it had been a great and successful weekend in Burnley and Manchester.

I find it incredible that no one was detained in the ground. If that had happened in the home section the cells would have been full across Lancashire. The stand is fully covered by CCTV and culprits could have been pinpointed within minutes. Not let go to return home and it get swept under the carpet given time.

Incredibly one burnley fan was!!!

Diesel · Post by **Diesel** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:15 pm

Agree

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:16 pm

Somethingfishy wrote:The real difference is the treatment. Go to an away game and you feel like they are there to protect you, to help you..some have a laugh with you and as long as you are a sensible and normal person you are fine.

Go to Turf Moor on a game with a big police presence and you are just waiting for something to happen. Very easily offended. Very irritable and a general bad attitude. You just get the arms folded..move on or else look. It is just not acceptable and too many people clearly can't see it. It wouldn't stop me giving evidence if i had it but i certainly see where Macca is coming from. It isn't all in his head.

They are Manchester and Lancashire .spoiling for trouble..always did. Remember Stockport??? Give me the met anyday.

dermotdermot · Post by **dermotdermot** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:21 pm

tim_noone wrote:Incredibly one burnley fan was!!!

I should think so too. Was it that bloke giving them the 'come and get me' gesture on the other thread?

MACCA · Post by **MACCA** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:22 pm

Somethingfishy wrote:The real difference is the treatment. Go to an away game and you feel like they are there to protect you, to help you..some have a laugh with you and as long as you are a sensible and normal person you are fine.

Go to Turf Moor on a game with a big police presence and you are just waiting for something to happen. Very easily offended. Very irritable and a general bad attitude. You just get the arms folded..move on or else look. It is just not acceptable and too many people clearly can't see it. It wouldn't stop me giving evidence if i had it but i certainly see where Macca is coming from. It isn't all in his head.

It all depends what officer you get, some will have a joke and it helps pass the time and keeps things amicable, however some clearly thrive on making arrests and letting you know who is boss.

I've been on the train going away, having a laugh, drinking and taking selfies/videos in a jovial atmosphere , and the police join in on either the jokes, the pic, or even take it for you.

But you get one, last season. Grab you with the scruff of the neck, asking what the hell you're playing at. Causing a scene trying to ruffle some feathers.
When I quiet, I don't want to pictured nor take a picture thanks pal.

I wouldn't ask a police officer for directions on a match day, in fear of being nicked for drinking or something, they are not worth the hassle.

But some people think all officers are there simply doing their job, and the last thing they want is trouble, well rubbish, sometimes it's the first thing they want.

Vegas Claret · Post by **Vegas Claret** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:24 pm

going back about 10 years I used to play footy with a load of cops that policed the Burnley games, I kid you not, 5 out of the 6 who played were Rovers season ticket holders. I can pretty much guarantee they still Police the Burnley games (doubt they watch that shower down the road anymore the glory whores)

Diesel · Post by **Diesel** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:25 pm

Vegas Claret wrote:going back about 10 years I used to play footy with a load of cops that policed the Burnley games, I kid you not, 5 out of the 6 who played were Rovers season ticket holders. I can pretty much guarantee they still Police the Burnley games (doubt they watch that shower down the road anymore the glory whores)

Pigs.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:53 pm

MACCA wrote:And the police also had "intelligence " on the matter.

Why not take control of the situation at 12:30 when 100+ took over the Inn on Wharf?

Tell the club to widen the segrigation. Get more stewards in there, make them sit top left, get a large police presence in there from the off to clamp down.

We knew what they were coming for, the police admitted there was a risk, but didn't prepare properly. 2 organisations at fault for Saturday's level of violence
1. Hannover 96 ultras
2. Lancashire constabuly

I can't answer on behalf of the police but it seems some of you can't wait to condemn them. I still don't believe anyone could have envisaged that happening.

As for the Inn on the Wharf, the situation looked very much under control when I went past around 12:45.

If you have the opinion that the police didn't prepare properly then that's your right to have that view. I still don't think anyone could see that happening but for what it's worth I thought the stewards and police dealt with it very quickly and efficiently.

I'm no lover of the police, certainly not where football is concerned, but I think some of you are being very unnecessarily quick to condemn them here.

Herts Clarets · Post by **Herts Clarets** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 10:19 pm

I posted this elsewhere hours before i read any of this.

.Police are not interested in away fans. They gather evidence on home fans to make arrests and get banning orders. If they nail an away fan the banning order affects another force and only benefits a Lancs Constabulary once season. Ban a Burnley fan and you get a season's benefit. Been going on for years. I was in the town centre after a game v Derby and a few away fans attacked Burnley fans. Clarets defended themselves, Police steered the Derby fans away and nicked 2 Burnley fans. I told them what had happened, their response was get away or we'll nick you as well.

That is just one personal experience of dealings with Lancs Constabulary so i can sympathise with some of the views on here.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 10:39 pm

Herts Clarets wrote:I posted this elsewhere hours before i read any of this.

.Police are not interested in away fans. They gather evidence on home fans to make arrests and get banning orders. If they nail an away fan the banning order affects another force and only benefits a Lancs Constabulary once season. Ban a Burnley fan and you get a season's benefit. Been going on for years. I was in the town centre after a game v Derby and a few away fans attacked Burnley fans. Clarets defended themselves, Police steered the Derby fans away and nicked 2 Burnley fans. I told them what had happened, their response was get away or we'll nick you as well.

That is just one personal experience of dealings with Lancs Constabulary so i can sympathise with some of the views on here.

One personal view of once incident - that's all it is and if you believe the rest then sadly we have no chance have we?

Braindead · Post by **Braindead** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 10:42 pm

Jimscho wrote:If the police had waded in after the hooligans had started moving the tarpaulin and it had then escalated to the violence that occurred and perhaps worse someone had been seriously injured,who would have been blamed?The police of course.They can't win for some of you.

Yes but they are THE POLICE, isn't it their job to ensure that stadium laws aren't being broken?
The point that you seem to be missing is that had it been Burnley fans in any way misbehaving, there would have been a completely different reaction from Lancashire police.

Garnerssoap · Post by **Garnerssoap** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 10:43 pm

Frankly I'm amazed the cricketfield line held in the absence of Burnley's top boys. What with Dushanbe campervanning somewhere on the Worth Valley line. Bodge and Karen love islanding it up in Skegness and Tybfc and the rishon casuals at some east lancs minor cricketing event. Plus whalleyclaret has been **** all use since he discovered Lidl 10 quid champers.

Somethingfishy · Post by **Somethingfishy** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 10:44 pm

I have posted 2 events among several i have seen first hand so HertsClarets incident isn't an isolated incident. You can pretend it doesn't happen because you havn't been involved but i can assure you it does. Whatever their motive they are very heavy handed when it comes to Burnley fans and you just don't see it at other grounds.

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 10:52 pm

When all is said and done the one thing I dont understand is why every stand was open. Doesnt even make sense financially never mind anything else.

3,000 or so spread across 6 stands.

They could have made things far easier for themselves but didnt. They heard trouble was likely - even this forum did! Its almost like they wanted it to happen.

Lancs police are the worse I have encountered anywhere.

HuncoatClaret · Post by **HuncoatClaret** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 10:52 pm

After the way the Burnley fans were treated after the Southampton game 2 seasons ago, I wouldn't send anything to the police. Lots of Burnley fans were arrested at later dates, when clearly, Southampton fans were the guilty ones.
Yesterday, I was at Victoria station, Manchester at 10.30 on my way to the cricket and there was 150-200 Hanover fans there with a police presence, how we're they allowed to do what they did? Heads should roll for this Police incompetence.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 10:52 pm

Somethingfishy wrote:I have posted 2 events among several i have seen first hand so HertsClarets incident isn't an isolated incident. You can pretend it doesn't happen because you havn't been involved but i can assure you it does. Whatever their motive they are very heavy handed when it comes to Burnley fans and you just don't see it at other grounds.

We are discussing the incidents of yesterday, not something Herts so at a Derby game some time ago. What might or might not have happened previously is not relevant in any way at all but it is obvious some on this board are just concerned in criticising the police over things when we should be doing our level best, where possible, to help identify the people responsible and see the appropriate action taken.

clarethomer · Post by **clarethomer** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 10:55 pm

Beggars belief some of the posts on here...

The police statement accepts that this was the fault of the away fans. They have asked for help with more video to help identify people within the crowd who have been responsible for causing damage to the ground and for injuring the stewards/officer involved. If Burnley fans are found the be ripping up seats or injuring officers or stewards they should face the same consequences as the away fans. I don't think any burnley fan will be done for that btw.

I saw a chair fly back across in return and I also saw another fan go and place one in the segregation area so it couldn't be used.

if the club had moved the home fans into the longside before the game, there would have been uproar for doing that with no evidence or poor intelligence and accusations of allowing the away fans to intimidate the club into them giving in to threats etc.

They (club and police) are damned if they do and damned if they don't. I bet experience of policing domestic games in this country would say that if there is a little bit of rowdiness from an away fans before the game, it would settle down once in the ground.

Im no expert on policing operations on dealing with these types of scenarios and I doubt many people contributing to this thread are either. Therefore to make any more out of this thread is pointless.

If you have footage and don't want to share - fine don't lose any sleep over it. If you do and will share then at least this post has helped the club and police.

But to come out with a boat load of conspiracies and trying to push personal agendas of perception and discrimination of the police/club is senseless.

If you have an issue with the way it was policed or the club acted, I would recommend you take it up directly with them

What should have been a simple post.... Its times like this I wish the padlock came back and moderation we saw on clarets mad.

Herts Clarets · Post by **Herts Clarets** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 10:57 pm

ClaretTony wrote:One personal view of once incident - that's all it is and if you believe the rest then sadly we have no chance have we?

I have seen plenty more Tony, just giving one example. There is a video further up of police ordering Burnley fans out of the CF stand and then battering them with truncheons as they attempt to follow the police orders. Too many people are sharing similar experiences for it to just be an isolated case. I would be very wary of approaching Lancs Police about any football related matter as a result of my own experience of their approach.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:02 pm

Herts Clarets wrote:I have seen plenty more Tony, just giving one example. There is a video further up of police ordering Burnley fans out of the CF stand and then battering them with truncheons as they attempt to follow the police orders. Too many people are sharing similar experiences for it to just be an isolated case. I would be very wary of approaching Lancs Police about any football related matter as a result of my own experience of their approach.

And I think your comments, whatever you think, are nothing to do with this investigation and I wasn't aware you were so close to the police that you knew who had and who hadn't been arrested in incidents. They are clearly pointing the finger of blame here entirely at the visiting supporters yet that's just not good enough for some of you.

"I would be very wary of approaching Lancs Police about any football related matter as a result of my own experience of their approach." Then don't but I find the comments pretty damn poor after the incidents we saw yesterday.

Somethingfishy · Post by **Somethingfishy** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:08 pm

The Lancs police have lost a lot of the goodwill of a lot of Burnley fans..law abiding Burnley fans. Sadly that is a fact. Doesn't mean they will go out of their way to be obstructive. Just wary. Goodwill is a two way thing and when they want help you can sympathise with people sticking their noses up at it. I wouldn't personally as i would prefer to see justice served but i can see their point.

Herts Clarets · Post by **Herts Clarets** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:11 pm

ClaretTony wrote:And I think your comments, whatever you think, are nothing to do with this investigation and I wasn't aware you were so close to the police that you knew who had and who hadn't been arrested in incidents. They are clearly pointing the finger of blame here entirely at the visiting supporters yet that's just not good enough for some of you.

"I would be very wary of approaching Lancs Police about any football related matter as a result of my own experience of their approach." Then don't but I find the comments pretty damn poor after the incidents we saw yesterday.

The give away sign was one group were allowed to walk away into town despite being the instigators, 2 of the other group who defended themselves were handcuffed and put in the back of a van.

It smacks of hypocrisy that after years of that kind of behaviour towards Burnley fans, the Police get it so wrong yesterday and are now asking those who they have demonised to forget that and help cover their arses.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:12 pm

Herts Clarets wrote:The give away sign was one group were allowed to walk away into town despite being the instigators, 2 of the other group who defended themselves were handcuffed and put in the back of a van.

Were they? And where did you witness that?

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:12 pm

ClaretTony wrote:We are discussing the incidents of yesterday, not something Herts so at a Derby game some time ago. What might or might not have happened previously is not relevant in any way at all but it is obvious some on this board are just concerned in criticising the police over things when we should be doing our level best, where possible, to help identify the people responsible and see the appropriate action taken.

How is something thats happened previously irrelevant?

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:13 pm

cricketfieldclarets wrote:How is something thats happened previously irrelevant?

Because the incident was yesterday and is the only thing under discussion

Somethingfishy · Post by **Somethingfishy** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:13 pm

" but I find the comments pretty damn poor after the incidents we saw yesterday. "

I find them entirely pertinent considering the poor decisions made by the hierarchy...with credible intelligence and evidence. None of this i can't see how they could imagine what would happen would. It is their job to contain the risk. They failed. They are quick to do that with a Burnley v Blackburn game though aren't they?

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:14 pm

ClaretTony wrote:Because the incident was yesterday and is the only thing under discussion

But its not though.

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:15 pm

ClaretTony wrote:Were they? And where did you witness that?

Your being arsey for the sake of it. The police commander got it wrong 100% .

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:15 pm

Somethingfishy wrote:" but I find the comments pretty damn poor after the incidents we saw yesterday. "

I find them entirely pertinent considering the poor decisions made by the hierarchy...with credible intelligence and evidence. None of this i can't see how they could imagine what would happen would. It is their job to contain the risk. They failed. They are quick to do that with a Burnley v Blackburn game though aren't they?

That's yesterday and if that's your view that's pertinent.

Somethingfishy · Post by **Somethingfishy** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:21 pm

Indeed it is and it is indicative of the difference in the policing of home and away fans at Burnley. If Burnley fans had run at the Hannover fans do you think the response would have been as slow? We don't know but i can have a damn good guess! Cells would have been at bursting point. It stinks.

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:23 pm

Like fish !

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:23 pm

Somethingfishy wrote:Indeed it is and it is indicative of the difference in the policing of home and away fans at Burnley. If Burnley fans had run at the Hannover fans do you think the response would have been as slow? We don't know but i can have a damn good guess! Cells would have been at bursting point. It stinks.

As I said, I'm no lover of the police but I can't agree with one word of that.

HuncoatClaret · Post by **HuncoatClaret** » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:41 pm

I seriously can't believe a word the Police say and I think that some Burnley fans will also face bans and criminal charges after the evidence has been look at.