Gray to Watford story

Braindead · Post by **Braindead** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:33 am

ClaretTony wrote:The reference included the selling of our striker and to my knowledge, right now, we haven't done that.

Agree with regards to Gray, but this looks like it's happening, and to be honest it is no secret that he wants out, a friend of mine with good contacts at the club told me a month ago 'Don't get your kids a BFC shirt with Gray on the back, as he will be gone'. But our best player was undoubtably Keane and it has been six weeks since he was sold and we appear to be putting all our eggs in a Craig Dawson sized basket whilst Pulis and WBA take the **** again.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:35 am

UpTheBeehole wrote:How many centre backs did we have before selling Keane?

How many do we have now?

He hasn't been replaced.

Gray is going. We've no one like him at the whole club, down to the youth team. We need to sign a replacement to avoid being the most one-dimensional team in world football.

As others have said, we've waited for Norwich to sign a replacement left back for them to sell their left winger for a record fee to us.

We've waited for other clubs to fill their holes before they open on numerous occasions, and this summer we're on course for selling our 2 big name players without having a replacement in. Keane went weeks ago, where's his replacement#?

If we wait the sign amount of time for Gray's replacement the window will have closed!

The season starts in 70ish hours. We've sold Keane, and not replaced him. We're selling Gray to a relegation rival, without a replacement. What on earth is going on at Burnley Football Club?

Gray may well be going which of course has given you yet another big stick to beat the club up with. At least you might stop hammering the club for putting together a poor pre-season for a while. But as far as I know, we haven't sold Gray as yet and I don't know where we are with the potential recruitment of a replacement should Gray leave. But what I do know is no matter what we do, you won't be happy with it.

ŽižkovClaret · Post by **ŽižkovClaret** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:35 am

18.5 in the last year of his deal. Yes please IF we sign some damn good replacements.

If we knew this was coming why the hell were we not in for Jay Rod?

SGr · Post by **SGr** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:37 am

Good money? Yes

Good team to sell to? Definitely not

Am I confident in us finding a suitable replacement? Not entirely

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:38 am

I'll be delirious if we stick to Garlick's words and improve on the team from last year.

That means improving defence, where we've lost a player. I can't wait for the improvement on Keane, that'll be gamechanging for us.

Improving midfield - ok, yes, we could say that's happened as Cork came in. We haven't got a new pacy winger though.

Strikers: Sell Gray and get an improvement in. I'll be over the moon if we can sign a player who scores more goals for us than Gray has in his time here,

Jambounchained · Post by **Jambounchained** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:38 am

Lump on Peter Crouch being Gray's replacement.

Walt · Post by **Walt** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:38 am

My only concern about this would be selling to one of our rivals. Seems clear to me he isn't interested in staying or he'd have signed the deal we offered him several weeks ago.

northeastclaret · Post by **northeastclaret** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:39 am

On the Assombalonga thread somebody said a club Director said he was our number one target this transfer window, even if he wasn't we still wanted to sign him, indicating that the club were expecting Gray to leave this window.

Would have loved Jay or Assombolonga to have replaced Gray, but doubt we will let him go without another good option secured.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:39 am

It ONLY makes sense if we use the money on a replacement who is signing before Gray leaves.

Any other scenario is leaving us well short for what is going to be another very tough season

SGr · Post by **SGr** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:40 am

Jambounchained wrote:Lump on Peter Crouch being Gray's replacement.

And then lump on people thinking that'd be an acceptable replacement

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:40 am

Braindead wrote:Agree with regards to Gray, but this looks like it's happening, and to be honest it is no secret that he wants out, a friend of mine with good contacts at the club told me a month ago 'Don't get your kids a BFC shirt with Gray on the back, as he will be gone'. But our best player was undoubtably Keane and it has been six weeks since he was sold and we appear to be putting all our eggs in a Craig Dawson sized basket whilst Pulis and WBA take the **** again.

I'll agree with the Keane situation. I'm not happy with our central defensive options right now but I got hammered for that not long ago for even suggesting I had concerns re: Tarkowski being a regular starter. If the target is Dawson, then it is a different manager and different owners at West Brom since we last tried to sign him.

We all knew Keane was going all the time so that's different to this one should Gray be leaving because it has just been a level of uncertainty over the summer. I do know that not much over a week ago we hadn't received any offers for him but things do change quickly. I'm certainly not offering any defence here and we will need to replace him, but here we have the usual suspects on this thread who just want to criticise everything the club do.

wickdkewlclaret · Post by **wickdkewlclaret** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:42 am

Screw this business sense malarky, we want to see the best players playing for Burnley, for Burnley to pocket 18 mil and us not have tht speedy aggressive striker to watch week in week out would be crap.

As a side note didn't Dyche say recently he has a couple of players lined up and was waiting for other moves to happen? This could be that move.

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:42 am

Signings:
Legzdins. Unlikely to play. But if he does hes nowhere near the standard Robinson on the field and probably not off either. Not an improvement.
Bardsley. Second choice. So not an improvement on the first 11. He is an improvement on our backup.
Taylor. Second choice. So not an improvement on the first 11. Not seen enough of him to know whether hes an improvement on a loanee who played in a champions league qualifying liverpool side. Same age with less experience.
Cork. Not sure who he is replacing per se but happy enough with his signing.
Walters. See Cork.

Out

Keane. Our best player. Replaced with nobody however its spun.
Boyd. One of our most important players in Dyches team. Hoping we are looking to be more attacking and fluid by replacing him but not much evidence in our business to date to suggest that so losing him again is a bad move. At least we still have Arfield whos of the same mould.
Barton. Happy that Cork offers more than he can at this stage of his career when available.
Robinson. Was vital to have a keeper of his experience to call on when needed. Obviously very hard to get someone like that to sit on the bench. But hope we never see Legzdins.

All in all the business has been abysmal thus far. Thank god defour seems to have settled!

Losing Gray loses our only fast striker if not only fast player!

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:43 am

If the club didn't sell our main players without replacements, we wouldn't have things to moan about, would we.

kentonclaret · Post by **kentonclaret** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:45 am

You cannot sell quality players that are the spine of the team without bringing in adequate replacements and say that "it is all good business" and expect the majority of fans to be happy.

True, Andre Gray has not yet been sold but even the diehards are admitting that the story must have legs to have been reported by so many media outlets.

If the club sells it's two main players without sourcing adequate replacements they are setting themselves up for criticism. The season kicks off in earnest on Saturday and we do so with the very strong likelihood of being without our leading goalscorer from the last campaign and our only player with any real pace.

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:46 am

Jambounchained wrote:Lump on Peter Crouch being Gray's replacement.

ecc · Post by **ecc** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:46 am

If this is true, and the story on the BBC site makes me think it is highly probable, I think we've had no other option. Again, if it is true that Gray asked for his wages to be increased four-fold in order to sign a new contract, then we have to sell him. The fee: the problem today with fees is you rarely know the true figures. The media, especially the comics, automatically include the add-ons to "big up" the story. But, yet again, if we'd be getting £18.5m without add-ons then I think it's a decent price.

ElectroClaret · Post by **ElectroClaret** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:48 am

If the BBCs carrying the story, he's as good as gone,
I would have thought.

Steve1956 · Post by **Steve1956** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:49 am

Don't worry guys if he goes so be it, in Dyche we trust.

BurnleyPaul · Post by **BurnleyPaul** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:52 am

If, as seems likely, he goes then so be it. It's obvious that he wants to move on (well move to London!) for his career/personal life. By helping us get promoted and keeping us up he's earned the right to try his luck elsewhere and to do it with our gratitude.

We now need to trust to our club to (1) get the best possible price for him and (2) to get a replacement into the club as soon as possible.

nighty · Post by **nighty** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:52 am

I cant believe the negativity , gray is never going to be good enough if you want the club to progress , he cant control the ball and hes not as pacy as people believe..he ok running on to the ball but back to goal or ball into his feet hes hopeless.....this on top of him refusing to extend his deal , i say let him go ,watford have as much chance of going down as we do ......albeit we do need a couple of markee signings that i agree.......
IN DYCHE WE TRUST

PWBFC · Post by **PWBFC** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:53 am

Have to cross our fingers and hope that we're far down the line with a replacement. If not and we're scrambling around on deadline day then it's possibly a fatal blow to our season.

Likewise, we desperately need a replacement for Keane.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:53 am

kentonclaret wrote:None of us like it when the pundits tip Burnley for relegation but selling your key central central defender and main striker without bringing in adequate replacements hardly inspires confidence does it?

That's pushing it. If you want to criticise the club for selling Gray without signing a replacement, wouldn't it be as well to wait until they sell Gray? I mean, how silly would you look if they sign a replacement first, or if they don't sell Gray? It would look like you were just trying to find reasons to complain.

I still don't want to write off Tarkowski. I realise he's not as good as Keane, but if you were expecting us to sign an England quality centre half as good as Keane is, then you were always expecting too much.

kentonclaret · Post by **kentonclaret** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:54 am

Wind back a few weeks and the same comments were being made about the departure of Michael Keane.

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:57 am

dsr wrote:
I still don't want to write off Tarkowski. I realise he's not as good as Keane, but if you were expecting us to sign an England quality centre half as good as Keane is, then you were always expecting too much.

Mike Garlick said we'd improve as a team, when Keane was still at the club. Now Keane has gone, how does he stick to his words and improve the defence?

We need to sign a defender as good if not better than Keane in order to improve the defence. That's what Garlick said. Improve.

kentonclaret · Post by **kentonclaret** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:58 am

dsr

I wish I had your complete faith that Gray is not on his way out of the club.

Even CT admitted in post 44 that the story is quoted by too many media outlets not to have some real substance to it.

I hope that they are able to sign a replacement for Gray proven at PL level ready to go straight in to the team to face Chelsea.

whalleyclaret · Post by **whalleyclaret** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:03 am

dont often comment on player transfers but selling Gray is one thing, selling him to a bottom half prem rival is madness.

Down_Rover · Post by **Down_Rover** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:03 am

I think we should sell.
We all see Gray week in week out and know, barring improvement, that he is not a PL striker. He does not anticipate the next phase of play or read a game, he is not as fast as he is touted to be and his ball control is poor. We all deep down know this.

Watford want a striker and have been shown a promotional video of all his good bits.

If the deal is £18.5m we have to take the money. If he does not improve and the scouts watch him regularly we will get nothing.

The fact is we have offered a contract, he has not accepted and it appears he wants to go. Faced with this we have to get as much as we can and lick our wounds. Other than paying him a ridiculous amount of money what can the club do?

Sometimes the business decisions have to come first

JohnMac · Post by **JohnMac** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:05 am

IF he goes it could well be due to pressure from his girlfriend to be nearer to London. He wouldn't be the first person in life to follow his heart and common sense says if it was financial he would probably earn more by waiting until next year.

IAmAClaret · Post by **IAmAClaret** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:07 am

He'll be looking at doubling his wages and keeping his Mrs happy, he's done a good job for us but does still have his shortcomings.

Let's hope we have someone lined up, or it will be a long season.

JohnMac · Post by **JohnMac** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:09 am

ElectroClaret wrote:If the BBCs carrying the story, he's as good as gone,
I would have thought.

The BBC had Dyche to become the next Manager of Crystal Palace. Not saying he isn't going but...

Braindead · Post by **Braindead** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:09 am

JohnMac wrote:IF he goes it could well be due to pressure from his girlfriend to be nearer to London. He wouldn't be the first person in life to follow his heart and common sense says if it was financial he would probably earn more by waiting until next year.

When you say heart you actually mean an external bodily part...?

starting_11 · Post by **starting_11** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:10 am

£18.5 million?

The engines already running... Hop in 'Dre!

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:10 am

I cant believe anyone thinks losing gray is good business. If we dont replace him with like for like we will be the easiest team in british football to defend against.

Sidney1st · Post by **Sidney1st** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:10 am

Last season - Gray is crap, cant trap a bag of cement and only scored 9 league goals get rid of him.

Now he's possibly going he's being elevated to top striker status and people are whining he's off.

Two faced sods on this forum.

kentonclaret · Post by **kentonclaret** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:12 am

I have no argument with Gray being sold for the right price nor with his reason for wanting to leave.

The timing (a few days before the season kicks off) could have been better and an adequate replacement would have been nice.

We need a striker proven at this level since we have plenty of young guns in and about the club not yet proven.

He didn't have to be elevated to top striker he WAS our top striker in terms of PL goals scored.

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:13 am

Down_Rover wrote: Watford want a striker and have been shown a promotional video of all his good bits.

Do you honestly, honestly think that an established Premier League club, with owners who are professional football club owners who have led clubs to the latter stages of UEFA competitions, who have an ownership model of purchasing players, improving them, shifting them between their clubs and then selling at a profit, would sign a player in the same division as them based on a bloody video?

Sidney1st · Post by **Sidney1st** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:14 am

Fergie did it at UTD so why wouldn't Watford?

jedi_master · Post by **jedi_master** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:15 am

kentonclaret wrote:I have no argument with Gray being sold for the right price nor with his reason for wanting to leave.

The timing (a few days before the season kicks off) could have been better and an adequate replacement would have been nice.

We need a striker proven at this level since we have plenty of young guns in and about the club not yet proven.

He didn't have to be elevated to top striker he WAS our top striker in terms of PL goals scored.

No he wasn't, Sam Vokes got 10 in the league, Gray got 9.

Socrates · Post by **Socrates** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:15 am

Generally speaking I'm quite a positive chap. I am certainly full of admiration for the job Dyche has done in his tenure here.

Yesterday I was slightly concerned about our position this season, but thought that we'd probably have enough to just about stay up. I had Brighton, Huddersfield, Watford and Swansea down as being poorer than us.

This morning's speculation - and at this moment it remains just that - moves me from slightly concerned to concerned. If Gray actually goes to Watford I'll expect us to be relegated.

To elaborate, even if James Tarkowski proves to be Premier League standard - note the IF - we were still a tweaked hamstring or bad ref decision away from Kevin Long starting a Premier League game. That is inadequate, and that's before you even address the question marks over Tarks. Having a question mark over such an important position where Kevin Long is your Plan B is inadequate - nothing personal against those players, those are just the facts.

I felt we were light up top already. I like all of our strikers as it happens, I see what they all bring to the table, but the reality is that probably more quality was needed. I'm a big fan of Gray generally because of his pace, and should he go we are completely bereft of anybody with that speed. On top of that, selling to a team I had likely finishing below us makes them stronger and likely gives them 10 more league goals.

Somebody on here said we have the lowest budget in the division. Whilst i'd debate that (Huddersfield say Hi) we need to look at the new reality of Premier League money. Whilst we may have the 19th or 20th lowest revenue in the league we likely are top 50 highest revenue in the world, if not top 40. This pleading poverty will not stand when we're making tens of millions of pounds of profit like we look like doing again.

I understand the need for saving for a rainy day, but right now we're a man looking at beautiful blue skies through a gaping hole in our roof. We're congratulating ourselves on having plenty of money to fix the roof should it rain but doing nothing to fix the roof whilst it is dry.

My final thought is those people complaining of others digging the club out. As I say, I'm a positive guy generally and am full of admiration for the work Dyche has done. We're in a position beyond my wildest dreams. That does not mean that I think everything the club does is perfect or that they are absolutely beyond criticism. There are valid concerns over the team which will be increased should Gray go - and even though he hasn't yet I think we all accept it's looking likely. Time is running out and historically we do not move quickly in the market - yes Hendrick, Defour and Brady all signed late but they were linked for ages before actually signing. Right now we're being linked with nobody which is a real concern for me.

Cork is a first team player, Walters maybe is and Taylor perhaps. Other than that I don't expect our other signings to start 5 games between them this season so it is difficult to be anything other than underwhelmed with our business so far.

Hedontplayforyou · Post by **Hedontplayforyou** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:15 am

£11.5m now on Sky

Herts Clarets · Post by **Herts Clarets** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:17 am

His first touch is poor. His scoring record at the top level was 1 every 3.5 games, so not what you would call prolific. His heart seems set on a move away. He won't sign a new contract. All signs are saying sell.

He is the only forward we have that offers something other than being good on the air and holding the ball up. He is the only forward we have with anything like a bit of pace. All signs are saying we must replace him.

Am I confident we can? Given that the season starts in 3 days and we are an injury away from the central defensive partnership against last seasons Champions being Tarks and Long. And we saw how calamitous they were at the back and of last season. I am quite worried now.

jedi_master · Post by **jedi_master** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:22 am

Hedontplayforyou wrote:£11.5m now on Sky

That puts a different angle on it because that fee would be useless to us after Brentford's obligatory cut.

I would have let him go for free next summer without doubt.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:22 am

Terrible business if we sell for anything less than £20 million, minimum. And even then, if we don't replace him even that would be bad business. Unless, like I've mentioned before, we're going to accept relegation and have a plan to bounce back up. I really don't see any way we can stay up if he goes and he's not replaced like for like.

claretburns · Post by **claretburns** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:22 am

From Sky:

Watford are closing in on an £11.5m deal for Burnley striker Andre Gray, according to Sky sources.

Sky Sports News understands the two Premier League clubs have agreed a fee for the 26-year-old.

Personal terms are due to be discussed later today followed by a medical.

MyRightFoot · Post by **MyRightFoot** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:23 am

If he doesn't want to play for the clarets the best thing we can do is get some dosh for him. I think the board will surprise us with a few signings yet! I know it's a bit last minute as per usual but let's just relax and enjoy the first match or two and worry more if we don't manage to bring anyone in!

ksrclaret · Post by **ksrclaret** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:24 am

I've been positive so far this window, but if we don't have a replacemt in the door by the end of the week then this is downright shocking.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:25 am

And as somebody has mentioned. We're selling to a relegation rival (even though I think their manager will keep them up), making it even harder for us to survive. We must have a replacement already in mind, otherwise it's a headshaker to say the least.

Lord Beamish · Post by **Lord Beamish** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:25 am

If Gray does go then I think many who post on here should do their best to get their carers to hide all the sharp objects.

Top Claret · Post by **Top Claret** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:26 am

He is obviously on his way and as been on the cards through out pre season, were he has only played cameo rolls.
I for one will miss him and I rate him as our best striker at the club in over 40 years. Gray will be a massive loss and I hope we can find a striker with his pace and fire power to replace him, if not the season is going to be a long torturous one