2.7 Million Brexiteers Have Changed to Remain

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 6:08 pm

Yep, it will all go away now.

Well, it would do but you've got someone who Labour think is ok in the NEC, and everybody else thinks is an anti-semite.

Mind you, according to the gossip he might not be there very long.

SmudgetheClaret · Post by **SmudgetheClaret** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 6:25 pm

Leave would still win as remain fiddled the vote by at least 3M but still lost ..lol

lesxdp · Post by **lesxdp** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 6:47 pm

A second referendum may be the only valid solution, and it should only be feared by those who don’t want true democracy.

I find it hard to understand that statement. You mean we had a vote for something and because some don't like the result we have to have another or it is not democratic.

Damo · Post by **Damo** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 6:55 pm

Yes because voting for something and actually implementing what was voted in favour of isn't true democracy.

Remainers eh

Vino blanco · Post by **Vino blanco** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 7:09 pm

Ian, I think you will find that a section of Welsh, Jock and Irish society also voted for Brexit.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 7:20 pm

Teresa’s been in Africa dancing for trade deals in the last week so we’ll be fine.

Vino blanco · Post by **Vino blanco** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 7:23 pm

Our second female PM, both Tory, will, I believe , step down after Brexit has been completed. So you lefties won't have to worry about her, you should be more concerned about your beloved leader, Jeremy.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 7:35 pm

Do you not rate his dancing skills?

Vino blanco · Post by **Vino blanco** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 7:39 pm

About as much as I rate his political skills.b

1fatclaret · Post by **1fatclaret** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 8:26 pm

houseboy wrote:And 57k people are employed in telesales but it doesn't stop many people wanting cold calling stopped.

Ha ha ha ha ha. Yes, cold calling and building cars are exactly the same thing.

Greenmile · Post by **Greenmile** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 8:36 pm

Stayingup wrote:Absolute cobblers. Are you drunk?

Do us a favour go and live in Germany who are the de facto leaders of Europe. EU is a vehicle for their dominance of Europe. Perhaps you haven't studied history but they have form
They've tried it before - more than once.

What’s the remoaner equivalent of a post like the above? I mean, there are stupid people on both sides of the argument (as to be expected for an issue which split the country 52/48) but I’m wondering if there’s a similarly stupid argument on the remain side of the equation. It’s a genuine question if anyone has any suggestions.

This isn’t the first time I’ve seen someone trying to make out some kind of equivalency between the EU and Nazi Germany - or the (E)USSR, of course, but the latter can at least be put down to simple wordplay - and my heart sinks every time with the thought that I have to share a country with people like this.

Vino blanco · Post by **Vino blanco** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 8:39 pm

Green mile, I really wish I were as superior as you.

Greenmile · Post by **Greenmile** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 8:44 pm

Vino blanco wrote:Green mile, I really wish I were as superior as you.

Keep practising. You’ll get there in the end.

Edit - in the meantime, do you have any suggestions for answers to my question?

Vino blanco · Post by **Vino blanco** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 8:45 pm

Get where? Up my own ar.se?

Greenmile · Post by **Greenmile** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 8:53 pm

Vino blanco wrote:Get where? Up my own ar.se?

Aw, that’s a shame - you need me to explain for you. Maybe you need more practice than I thought.

You want to be as superior as I am, so I’m suggesting practice would get you there. “There” in this instance is a state of being superior like me.

Do you see now? I know it’s a bit tricky to understand as “getting there” in this sense doesn’t actually involve reaching a physical place. The English language can be confusing sometimes.

Anyway as I say, keep trying champ. I believe in you.

Vino blanco · Post by **Vino blanco** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 8:59 pm

Oh I see it's an English language thing, and there was I, thinking you were spouting another load of self-opinionated, pseudo-intellectual, biased, political drivel like most on here. I apologise profusely for fully understanding your superiority.

RMutt · Post by **RMutt** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 9:04 pm

Try this tomorrow. Ask a handful of people what they thought would happen if we voted leave. If you get different answers from each it proves that the people you asked didn’t really know what they were voting for. Now multiply that handful up to the millions who voted. If you were to ask me, I thought I would probably be voting for hard brexit, a border again in Ireland, an almost immediate withdrawal from Europe, no negotiating trade deals until we had left...... oohhand a return to pounds and ounces. What did you all think would happen?

Greenmile · Post by **Greenmile** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 9:05 pm

Vino blanco wrote:Oh I see it's an English language thing, and there was I, thinking you were spouting another load of self-opinionated, pseudo-intellectual, biased, political drivel like most on here. I apologise profusely for fully understanding your superiority.

Apology accepted. Part of being superior means that I am also very gracious and understanding of other’s mistakes.

tiger76 · Post by **tiger76** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 9:56 pm

Stories like these do the EU no favours https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-45407247 sums up how this organisation works.

Stayingup · Post by **Stayingup** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 10:15 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Two posts confirming Stayingup "top brexiteer" status.

bet he doesn't even like Jaws either.

He thinks your a bit of a pillock.actually. But let's have fun and give away our hard earned freedom.to Germany. What do you think Heil Lancaster.

But you have not responded to my points. Just added another load of tosh.

You tell me what is good about the dictatorial, un democratic. Unaccountable EU. For your information I have lived and worked in Europe including Germany
But so detest the EU almost as much as our dear terrorist Communist idiot thick Corbyn.

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 10:36 pm

Stayingup wrote:He thinks your a bit of a pillock.actually. But let's have fun and give away our hard earned freedom.to Germany. What do you think Heil Lancaster.

But you have not responded to my points. Just added another load of tosh.

You tell me what is good about the dictatorial, un democratic. Unaccountable EU. For your information I have lived and worked in Europe including Germany
But so detest the EU almost as much as our dear terrorist Communist idiot thick Corbyn.

You do realise that the EU has elections I assume.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 10:37 pm

Because I disagree with you?

No offence taken here, but I'm intrigued about how all that experience of working abroad caused you to hate the EU.

Rest of your stuff isn't true, but one thing the last two years have taught me is that people like you will just reply "Its true I'm afraid, you'll just have to take my word for it"

And the biggest crime of all?

No answer on whether you like Jaws or not.

BabylonClaret · Post by **BabylonClaret** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 10:57 pm

Stop it Lancaster. You cant makr a reasonable case against put the Great back in Britain.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 10:58 pm

He could at least answer the Jaws question

Pstotto · Post by **Pstotto** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 11:02 pm

Stop it Lancaster, Stop it, you can't.

bluelabrador16 · Post by **bluelabrador16** » Tue Sep 04, 2018 11:46 pm

Back to the Future

A fictional story by Gilad Atzmon

"...The more the Jewish self-appointed ‘leadership’ pushed: the more they equated Corbyn with Enoch Powel and even Hitler, the more the Brits responded by siding with the old anti racist. In the months leading up to the election the picture became clear, a wide spectrum of Brits were expressing fatigue with the manner in which a foreign lobby was crudely intervening in their national politics.

But in spite of the many signs that Britain had had enough, the British Jewish so-called ‘leadership’ didn’t stop pushing. Not a day passed without a rabbi using the BBC to spread the message of Jews’ right to live in ‘peace’ on someone else’s land. Every day we read a Guardian interview with an influential Jew who threatened to make Aliya and take his or her shekels with him. The Brits weren’t impressed, on social media some offered departing Zionists piggy back rides to Heathrow.....

https://www.gilad.co.uk/writings/2018/9 ... the-future" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Labour Party cave to Israel and the Zionist lobby - and 'Corbyn clarification not endorsed' by spineless NEC

https://www.davidicke.com/article/49278 ... neless-nec" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

A sad day for Democracy and the Labour Party

Spiral · Post by **Spiral** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 1:19 am

I quite enjoy reading bluelabrador's posts insofar as I have a sort of morbid curiosity towards the musings of anyone confident enough in such a nutty worldview they'll post what can be best described as...what?...dadaist discharges...and cite David Icke as a source while still expecting their positions to be taken seriously.

Labour can't do a damn thing if they aren't in power, and Labour won't gain power while they/the leadership have an image problem. It's been said before, but what a stupid hill to die on. Take a step back to look at the bigger picture: opposition party blows chance of power, ergo, chance to help millions of people, on grounds of...wait for it...specific wording of internal disciplinary code.

Bfcboyo · Post by **Bfcboyo** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 5:11 am

houseboy wrote:And 57k people are employed in telesales but it doesn't stop many people wanting cold calling stopped.

Is that all. Surely 5.7m it seems they are relentless.

Although many are now based abroad.

"hello this is kevin, would you like broadband and telephone from £12.00 per month" cold caller asks clearly from a distant time zone and planet with his figures and rich accent.

"Hi kevin can I give you all my bank details?"
I reply

Kevin hangs up. Through the thick fog of translation and culture Kevin understood a common place. Kevin knows I am taking the p#ss

houseboy · Post by **houseboy** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 9:40 am

1fatclaret wrote:Ha ha ha ha ha. Yes, cold calling and building cars are exactly the same thing.

What a ridiculous reply. It is people IN EMPLOYMENT regardless of whether it is building cars, telesales or shovelling shite, people are employed because they are needed, would you rather those 57k people were on the dole claiming taxpayers money. EVERY job is important, both to the employer and the employee, not to mention the economy, why do you differentiate between one form of employment or another.
My point was that the original belittling of farmers in comparison to the 'car industry' was somewhat stupid in the first place given that both are needed and neither is less important than the other (unless you think cars are more important than food).

houseboy · Post by **houseboy** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 9:46 am

Bfcboyo wrote:Is that all. Surely 5.7m it seems they are relentless.

Although many are now based abroad.

"hello this is kevin, would you like broadband and telephone from £12.00 per month" cold caller asks clearly from a distant time zone and planet with his figures and rich accent.

"Hi kevin can I give you all my bank details?"
I reply

Kevin hangs up. Through the thick fog of translation and culture Kevin understood a common place. Kevin knows I am taking the p#ss

57k in the UK alone regardless of anything abroad, 57k people paying tax and earning a living as opposed to 'Sharon' from Shadsworth claiming 3k a week for her 14 illegitimate kids whilst smoking 50 fags a day and drinking cider at 10 in the morning. If 2 calls a week or less gets up your nose that much remember 'just say no'.
By the way if 'Kevin' called me and offered broadband and phone at £12 per month I'd snap his hand off.

nil_desperandum · Post by **nil_desperandum** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 9:50 am

houseboy wrote:What a ridiculous reply. It is people IN EMPLOYMENT regardless of whether it is building cars, telesales or shovelling shite, people are employed because they are needed, would you rather those 57k people were on the dole claiming taxpayers money. EVERY job is important, both to the employer and the employee, not to mention the economy, why do you differentiate between one form of employment or another.
My point was that the original belittling of farmers in comparison to the 'car industry' was somewhat stupid in the first place given that both are needed and neither is less important than the other (unless you think cars are more important than food).

I think that this (below from ACEA) would be why most people would consider the impact of Brexit on the car industry to be far more significant than that on 57k telesales operators, who will most likely, (one hopes) still be employed after brexit in any event.

The UK is home to over 30 production facilities, producing both engines and whole vehicles, as well as many more suppliers to the auto industry. In total, the sector employs some 814,000 people in the United Kingdom.

80% of the UK’s car production is exported, of which 54% goes to EU member states. In 2017, the United Kingdom produced 1.75 million motor vehicles, exporting 800,000 of these within the European Union.

I am not - incidentally - in any way denigrating telesales operators or their contribution to the economy.

BennyD · Post by **BennyD** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 9:57 am

JohnMcGreal wrote:You mean all the things that made our EU membership the best deal we'd ever get, anywhere? I'd hope that they'd be prepared to let us continue with our existing arrangement, but I imagine our politicians and civil servants would have to do quite a bit of 'sounding out' before officially withdrawing Article 50.

Personally, I think they'd be happy for us to carry on as before and consign this entire fiasco to the dustbin of history, where it belongs.

Best deal we'd ever get? It looks like you too are 'blinded by fallacies' becsuse you aren't making any sense at the moment either. Btw, it isn't a fiasco, it's democracy in action.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 10:03 am

The thing is, nil-d, that even more European workers are dependent on exports to the UK that there are UK workers dependent on exports to the EU. So if their exports, which have already taken the hit of a weaker pound, were to take another hit of a trade war, then it is likely that (a) more of the cars we make for export would be sold in the UK, and (b) more of the cars which EU companies want to sell in the UK, would be made in the UK.

Turn it however you want, we manufacture fewer cars in the UK than we sell. We are net importers. There is no reason IMO to believe that the imposition of tariffs will cause a huge decline in demand for new cars, and there is also no reason to suppose that the introduction of tariffs will disproportionately affect UK manufacturers as against EU manufacturers.

houseboy · Post by **houseboy** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 10:16 am

nil_desperandum wrote:I think that this (below from ACEA) would be why most people would consider the impact of Brexit on the car industry to be far more significant than that on 57k telesales operators, who will most likely, (one hopes) still be employed after brexit in any event.

I am not - incidentally - in any way denigrating telesales operators or their contribution to the economy.

Excellent point and understand it fully. My only complaint, such as it was, was that there are those who dislike particular kinds of employees (I'm not keen on traffic wardens or HR 'experts') but people in employment is people in employment, paying tax (or not if they are unfortunate enough to be low paid) and not claiming benefits (again some in employment do but that is the fault of their employer not them). I believe the car industry will be completely safe under Brexit because the industry itself and the whole supply chain involved won't and probably can't just change overnight because a political decision. As you rightly point out nearly a million people are involved in some way and those people perform, one assumes, a vital role in the industry as a whole and to change it would be a statistical nightmare. The fact is the only people we know for certain will lose their jobs in this country because of Brexit are the Euro MPs, a small band of trough feeders who, I am sure, will soon find another trough to feed from.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 10:19 am

I believe the car industry will be completely safe under Brexit because the industry itself and the whole supply chain involved won't and probably can't just change overnight because a political decision.

Based on? An extensive knowledge of the car industry and the logistics chain, with specific reference to JIT deliveries?

Or something else?

CrosspoolClarets · Post by **CrosspoolClarets** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 10:36 am

I expect the car industry to be one that struggles after Brexit, and there will be loss of jobs (but there are ups and downs resulting from any big strategic move, that's the nature of top leadership, to weigh it up).

If it were me (and I am no expert on the car industry) I would think about funding innovation (driverless, electric etc so we become more like Germany or Japan) and providing incentives (e.g. low corporation tax for a 5 year period which would terrify the EU). I would negotiate zero tariffs as part of a free trade deal, and no customs holdups for big companies who instead would get their factories periodically visited.

Big firms ship in goods and labour from outside the EU because it is cheaper (India, China etc). We have to make them want to do the same with us, but for different reasons than labour costs. The other difference is that we would still want to export the finished product from here in some cases, into the EU, so that would be totally dependant on the details of a free trade deal to ensure suppliers don't relocate.

All in all, it is do-able and the loss of jobs should be able to be minimised.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 10:40 am

That shark in Jaws is looking more and more realistic by the day

If it be your will · Post by **If it be your will** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 10:40 am

Pstotto · Post by **Pstotto** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 10:50 am

Think big, think BREXIT.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 10:52 am

The Labour Party voted an anti-semite on to the NEC.

Thats all I need to know.

They will introduce mandatory re-selection of MPs after this.

By the end of the next election, Jeremy Corbyn will have a party who will do exactly what he tells them too.

No danger to that at all, none at all.

What happened to Labour being a broad church for all?

nil_desperandum · Post by **nil_desperandum** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 10:58 am

dsr wrote:The thing is, nil-d, that even more European workers are dependent on exports to the UK that there are UK workers dependent on exports to the EU. So if their exports, which have already taken the hit of a weaker pound, were to take another hit of a trade war, then it is likely that (a) more of the cars we make for export would be sold in the UK, and (b) more of the cars which EU companies want to sell in the UK, would be made in the UK.

Turn it however you want, we manufacture fewer cars in the UK than we sell. We are net importers. There is no reason IMO to believe that the imposition of tariffs will cause a huge decline in demand for new cars, and there is also no reason to suppose that the introduction of tariffs will disproportionately affect UK manufacturers as against EU manufacturers.

No problem with that argument, but it we have a no deal brexit, it's up to the other 27 countries how they deal with it, but the reality for the UK is that it will significantly impact on those who work in the car industry - nearly 1 million of them.
It's fine the govt. recommending stockpiling food and drugs for 6 weeks, but what happens after those 6 weeks are up?

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 11:56 am

nil_desperandum wrote:It's fine the govt. recommending stockpiling food and drugs for 6 weeks, but what happens after those 6 weeks are up?

Nothing happens when the 6 weeks are up, because by the time the 6 weeks are up the supply chain will have adapted. The doomsayers seem to think that just-in-time ordering is the only possible way to run a car industry and the industry will die without it; they are wrong, The car industry will adapt. The doomsayers also say that if food is delayed by a week at the docks, then we will starve; they are wrong.

So let's suppose food is delayed by, say, a week.

For one thing, fresh food from the EU will have gone off and we will have to buy more fresh food from outside the EU - which we already do, and they seem to be able to get food here in a timely manner without it going off.

For another thing, after the first week's delay, food will be arriving at the normal rate. If your daily pineapple takes a week longer to get here, at the end of the year you have still received 358 pineapples and only 7 are still stuck in transit.

And for another thing, if the docks don't have the staff to check imports and paperwork in the same detail as they do now, then they will check it in less detail to ensure the food supplies don't stop. They don't check 100% now, so there is no reason to suppose they will check 100% then.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 11:58 am

I very, very glad indeed that you choose accountancy, rather than logistics.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:06 pm

Is there anything in the world you use in your life that we can't make here in the UK?

See it can work, just needs adapting.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:22 pm

Timescale for that?

Cost for that?

This is the problem - you say something that sounds ace but you don't want to acknowledge any possible difficulties. In short, its Brexit and the thinking behind it in a nutshell.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:48 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Timescale for that?

Cost for that?

This is the problem - you say something that sounds ace but you don't want to acknowledge any possible difficulties. In short, its Brexit and the thinking behind it in a nutshell.

There's been difficulties for the last 40 years of my life, difficulties now and I expect difficulties for the rest of my life.

The last 10 places I have been that trade under the Euro have been way more expensive than Britain, it is time to avoid them like the plague. (unless the clarets produce another miracle then I will swallow my pride)

Britain can and Britain will make a success of it. Well we would if politicians hadn't got their fingers in too many pies.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:49 pm

Yep, blaming someone else for the problems with Brexit.

Standard, absolutely classic Brexiteer post.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:50 pm

F**k it, I bet you don't even like Jaws

burnleymik · Post by **burnleymik** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:56 pm

Wonder how many remainers, have seen all the original lies and threats, that have clearly been proven wrong, would now just want to get on with Brexit and would be happy to support leave? I have seen a good few on social media who are tired of it all and just want to get on with what was voted for.

I don't want a second referendum, as I think we should actually give Brexit a fair shot before just writing it and the UK off, but I think if we did, there could be another surprise in store for the establishment and the hardcore remoaners.

nil_desperandum · Post by **nil_desperandum** » Wed Sep 05, 2018 3:25 pm

Quickenthetempo wrote: The last 10 places I have been that trade under the Euro have been way more expensive than Britain, it is time to avoid them like the plague. (unless the clarets produce another miracle then I will swallow my pride)
.

Would that be since the pound dropped dramatically following the referendum, and also, (perhaps) that you were buying and eating at a tourist resort or city, where prices are far more expensive?
e.g. If I shop at Lidl in France, (in an ordinary town or village), I find that approx half the prices are slightly more expensive than here, but the other half are a bit cheaper, so overall, not much in it, even at the current poor exchange rate.
If you shop where the locals shop, and look for bargains, (as you would at home), then in most countries you won't find that much difference.