England Vs Albania

[Darthlaw]

With Southgate people are expecting him to reach the semifinals as a minimum , that's how well he's done.

Like the England managers (woy aside) previous to him, he comes unstuck when we play a decent side.

No amount of smashing Panama’s, Swedens, Denmarks, Ukraines or Albania’s will change my mind until he can defeat the Belgiums and Italys in major tournaments.

(Awaits what about Germany argument)

[boatshed bill]

Bobby Robsons defence inc Walker, Butcher, and Pearce is better than ours today and Bryan Robson, Platt, Gascoigne and John Barnes were top class midfielders and thats before you mention Lineker up front.

In the 1990 World Cup Robson failed to win one match inside 90 mins including Egypt, Ireland and Cameroon

yes, we can all remember how good they were.
What we tend to ignore is that other nations had players at least as good...or better.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Like the England managers (woy aside) previous to him, he comes unstuck when we play a decent side.

No amount of smashing Panama’s, Swedens, Denmarks, Ukraines or Albania’s will change my mind until he can defeat the Belgiums and Italys in major tournaments.

(Awaits what about Germany argument)

He can only try to beat whats in front of him and we only just lost to Italy in all fairness.

If we won an international tournament without meeting and beating one of the top sides, would that diminish the accomplishment?

[Lancasterclaret]

World Cup semi finals

European final

Better than anyone has managed for decades

But no, people have to stick to their opinion that somehow we'd do better if it wasn't for Southgate

[Spijed]

Until England sort out the centre of defence they'll always have issues against the better teams.

The tanker that got stuck in the Suez canal could turn quicker than Stones and Maguire

[Devils_Advocate]

Like the England managers (woy aside) previous to him, he comes unstuck when we play a decent side.

No amount of smashing Panama’s, Swedens, Denmarks, Ukraines or Albania’s will change my mind until he can defeat the Belgiums and Italys in major tournaments.

(Awaits what about Germany argument)

In competitive international football you dont come up against the top 5 or 6 in the world that often. As an example this is Bobby Robsons competitive record as England manager

Failed to qualify to '84 Euros from a group consisting of Hungary, Greece, Luxemburg and Denmark

In the whole of the '86 campaign we managed to beat Finland, Turkey, N. Ireland, Romania, Poland and Paraguay

In the whole '88 campaign we managed to beat N. Ireland, Yugoslavia, Turkey and we lost all three games in the tournament

In the whole '90 campaign we managed to beat Albania, Poland, Egypt, Belgium and Cameroon

So in 8 years and 4 competitions the only decent team we managed to beat was Belgium with the last kick of extra time

To be clear I think as an overall manager Robson is absolutely light years ahead of Southgate but as an England manager he struggled a lot of the time and just did ok

[chekhov]

Like the England managers (woy aside) previous to him, he comes unstuck when we play a decent side.

Who is this woy you speak of?
Are you referring to Roy Hodgson, ex Crystal Palace and England manager, who, by the way deserves better that your cheap jibe.

[Darthlaw]

He can only try to beat whats in front of him and we only just lost to Italy in all fairness.

If we won an international tournament without meeting and beating one of the top sides, would that diminish the accomplishment?

England's name would be on the trophy, which is what matters. Nevertheless, that's if's buts and maybe's.

The facts are there. England eliminated (a woeful) Germany, Ukraine and Denmark then were beaten by Italy. Alas, Italy who knocked out Spain, Belgium and England to win the tournament is regarded pretty highly.

In the WC, England beat Colombia on pens and Sweden but were beaten by a very handy Croatia team. The winners, France, beat Argentina, Uruguay Belgium and that same Croatia team.

Southgate can only beat the teams in front of him. The favourable draws and defeats by good teams, however, don't illustrate he is capable of beating the ones that matter. Thats, of course, before you question his decisions like use of subs in the Euro's final.

[Darthlaw]

Who is this woy you speak of?
Are you referring to Roy Hodgson, ex Crystal Palace and England manager, who, by the way deserves better that your cheap jibe.

Sorry lad, I didn’t realise you two were so close.

If it makes you feel better, I’ve realised Schteeve was probably a much worse England manager in recent times.

[chekhov]

Sorry lad, I didn’t realise you two were so close.

If it makes you feel better, I’ve realised Schteeve was probably a much worse England manager in recent times.

It upsets me when I hear cheap “jokes” mocking how people speak. I’m happy to call you out, but obviously it’s not going to have any impact on you so I’ll leave it.

[Wile E Coyote]

semi finals, and losing finalists. And that's your lot after55 years. 55 years since the one and only trophy. won on home soil in a very small tournament.

Sadly that has to be seen as an embarrassment.

[BurnleyFC]

I’m not a huge fan of Southgate, but he probably is the best person out there for the job at this moment in time.

In fact I’d keep him just for the ‘luck factor’. He’s had incredibly favourable draws in the last two tournaments and some people are just naturally luckier than others.

[Roosterbooster]

In the 1990 World Cup Robson failed to win one match inside 90 mins including Egypt, Ireland and Cameroon

I thought we beat Egypt?

[Devils_Advocate]

I thought we beat Egypt?

Yep you're right it was that Mark Wright header. I think I included that as a win in my subsequent post on Robsons overall record. That 1990 campaign was quite poor at times and in other parts lucky but Gazza and that fantastic performance against Germany really changes peoples perception years down the line that we were really good and just very unlucky

[Roosterbooster]

You might be right. I was a bit too young to remember it other than the semi final and watching back highlights. I'd argue our current best 11 is better than that of the 90s, but I agree, to have that 11 and struggle to win in 90 minutes against that opposition is rather disappointing

[RVclaret]

Until England sort out the centre of defence they'll always have issues against the better teams.

The tanker that got stuck in the Suez canal could turn quicker than Stones and Maguire

Is this the same defence that conceded 2 goals in the entire Euros and 0 from open play?

Let me guess, Tarkowski and Mee would do a better job than those two wouldn’t they?

[Captain Obvious]

If we hadn’t conceded against Italy in the Euro 2020 final the we’d have won the competition.

[SouthLondonexile]

England have become a team now that proceeds in finals and semi-finals of major competitions. This is progress.
Well done England.
Btw I thought Reece James was outstanding and Man of the Match has to be Harry Kane. Do yourself a favour Harry and leave Tottenham.

[KRBFC]

Weren't Albania second in the group a short while ago?

Albania have some really bright young players, that striker Broja on loan at Soton (from Chelsea) was excellent against us. Kumbullah is highly regarded at Roma. Normally they're a competitive side, they got absolutely blown away last night though

[KRBFC]

England's name would be on the trophy, which is what matters. Nevertheless, that's if's buts and maybe's.

The facts are there. England eliminated (a woeful) Germany, Ukraine and Denmark then were beaten by Italy. Alas, Italy who knocked out Spain, Belgium and England to win the tournament is regarded pretty highly.

In the WC, England beat Colombia on pens and Sweden but were beaten by a very handy Croatia team. The winners, France, beat Argentina, Uruguay Belgium and that same Croatia team.

Southgate can only beat the teams in front of him. The favourable draws and defeats by good teams, however, don't illustrate he is capable of beating the ones that matter. Thats, of course, before you question his decisions like use of subs in the Euro's final.

A woeful Germany team? HAHAHAHHA why are they woeful? because England beat them? Imagine calling Germany a woeful team.
Ukraine are a very decent side and got absolutely spanked.
Denmark were ranked top 5 in the world rankings.

You praise Italy for beating sides on penalties while dismissing England for doing the same thing. Italy were fortunate to get past Spain on penalties, they were 2nd best throughout imo. We went 120+ minutes, tight tight game and lost out by a single penalty, about as close as you can get.

Like you said ''the facts are there'', best England results since the 60s, first ever European final.

[Rileybobs]

Not too often I agree with KRBFC but he’s absolutely right. And the constant undermining of Southgate’s achievements with England makes for cringeworthy reading.

[DCWat]

With the current squad and a some really promising emerging talent, we have a chance of a tournament win over the next two, three or four tournaments.

As ever it’ll be about a system that finds a good balance between being defensively solid and allowing our more creative attacking players to do their thing. I’m still not entirely convinced that two holding midfielders is the long term solution, but for now it’s working quite nicely.

[Darthlaw]

A woeful Germany team? HAHAHAHHA why are they woeful? because England beat them?

Like you said ''the facts are there'', best England results since the 60s, first ever European final.

The same Germany that went out at the last WC at the group stage, were beat by North Macedonia leading up to the Euro’s and managed one win in the tournament. That could be why.

The facts are there, better yet the facts don’t care about your opinions.

Riley, I’m not undermining his achievements I’m just not joining the jizz fest because he’s achieved what most other England managers have in major tournaments - beaten the knackers and minnows (Scotland aside) and been knocked out by the good teams. The fact he’s managed favourable tournament opposition, in his tenure, is not his fault.

As it stands, he’s the best man for the job anyway. I can’t see anyone else queueing up to take the job any better, particularly not with the expectations of a nation who have achieved the best part of **** all in nearly 60 years but somehow always expect to be in contention.

[Rileybobs]

Riley, I’m not undermining his achievements I’m just not joining the jizz fest because he’s achieved what most other England managers have in major tournaments - beaten the knackers and minnows (Scotland aside) and been knocked out by the good teams. The fact he’s managed favourable tournament opposition, in his tenure, is not his fault.

There doesn’t appear to be a jizz fest as far as I can tell, although Sid may be along shortly. He has achieved more than most other England managers, and to claim otherwise is just disingenuous.

[KRBFC]

The same Germany that went out at the last WC at the group stage, were beat by North Macedonia leading up to the Euro’s and managed one win in the tournament. That could be why.

The facts are there, better yet the facts don’t care about your opinions.

Riley, I’m not undermining his achievements I’m just not joining the jizz fest because he’s achieved what most other England managers have in major tournaments - beaten the knackers and minnows (Scotland aside) and been knocked out by the good teams. The fact he’s managed favourable tournament opposition, in his tenure, is not his fault.

As it stands, he’s the best man for the job anyway. I can’t see anyone else queueing up to take the job any better, particularly not with the expectations of a nation who have achieved the best part of **** all in nearly 60 years but somehow always expect to be in contention.

Semi final WC, first ever final of Euros. Like you said....


The facts are there, better yet the facts don’t care about your opinions.

[Darthlaw]

There doesn’t appear to be a jizz fest as far as I can tell, although Sid may be along shortly. He has achieved more than most other England managers, and to claim otherwise is just disingenuous.

What I’m saying is I don’t think he has achieved more. He beats minnows and also rans and gets knocked out by decent teams. Same as Sven, Fabio and Roy.

Had you put the same teams in front of them that Southgate faced in tournaments I think you’d have the same outcome.

In isolation, the headlines are he’s reached where he has in tournaments. Dig a little deeper though and it’s much of a muchness.

[Captain Obvious]

Albania would’ve been top of the group after zero games so we did really well to beat them 5-0.

[Woodleyclaret]

Southgate's problem is playing players who are bigged up to be better than they are by the media
The latest Arsenal wonderkid was anonymous last night and Bellingham and Abraham were poor with the latter showing his customary lack of ball control
Again we fell back on backwards play against a team we were in total control of
Henderson had his best game for a while though and Harry scored some well taken goals. The nucleus of a decent team is there but our cbs give me cause to worry
At least Mings didn't get on so that's a positive though

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Southgate's problem is playing players who are bigged up to be better than they are by the media
The latest Arsenal wonderkid was anonymous last night and Bellingham and Abraham were poor with the latter showing his customary lack of ball control
Again we fell back on backwards play against a team we were in total control of
Henderson had his best game for a while though and Harry scored some well taken goals. The nucleus of a decent team is there but our cbs give me cause to worry
At least Mings didn't get on so that's a positive though

He gave game time and a debut to squad players when the game was safe, nothing wrong with that.
It helps for him to see what he's got, what they can do etc in the event of injuries to his first choice players.

The arsenal lad wasn't that bad though to be fair, some good touches.

[yTib]

KRBFC still beating his 'italy are crap' drum.

get over it lad. you were massively wrong.

[elwaclaret]

When I see an England team play well against the Burnley type tactics employed by Scotland and Italy, and not when teams either open up against them and give them room to play, that is when Southgate becomes a good manager.

We know we have flair, what we have not been able to do is break down well organised top sides that are prepared to sit in and await their moment, even at the cost of settling for a draw rather than let England play through them.