Spanish Football Chief : Should He Resign?

[Big Vinny K]

You actually replied to the post, but here we go, I'll copy it for you

Both parties were carried away in the moment of winning the world Cup.. both probably did things they wouldn't normally do in every day life, it all needs taking in context

Yes I know I did - that does not mean I understand the point you are trying to make.
It very much sounds like that what you are saying is that because she did one thing then it’s fine that he kissed her on the lips - it’s all about context.

[DCWat]

I'm surprised there should be a debate on whether it is ok to kiss someone on the lips without their consent.

Would on the head have been OK?

I’m not saying that in hindsight he shouldn’t have done it, but I do feel it’s being blown out of proportion.

In light of the article linked further up this thread, I do wonder if this is more due to a culmination of issues with this bloke than the incident itself.

[Jakubclaret]

Nothing creepy or sexual about a woman being kissed on the lips without her consent?

Interesting viewpoint to put out there.

Things aren't always so clear cut if the signals are right, it's not really the done thing to ask for permission that said if the signals aren't right to start with you don't kiss the woman, each individual case will be different but as a general rule you should know or at least be capable of judging the situation.

[Firthy]

Yep, that's exactly what I said when I saw his post. Smelly and creepy wasn't it.

I meant your response to it.

[bpgburn]

Once again highlights that there’s a real age gap (=outdated views) with posters on this board.

It’s awful to read some of the things written on here as a father who has a daughter.

Age has nothing to do with it and I resent, as an over 60's male, being tarred with the same brush as those defending his actions (of whom could well be in your age bracket for all you know).

My opinion, the creep should have been sacked on the spot!

[daveisaclaret]

Would on the head have been OK?

I’m not saying that in hindsight he shouldn’t have done it, but I do feel it’s being blown out of proportion.

In light of the article linked further up this thread, I do wonder if this is more due to a culmination of issues with this bloke than the incident itself.

So when you said we shouldn't be calling people creeps, it was just because you agreed with the creeps?

[DCWat]

This is such an awful take. It doesn't devalue a point to call creepy sexist arseholes creepy. There is no need to be nice to dickheads.

It’s a leap and a half between someone not seeing this particular incident in as bad a light as you and them being a creep, sexist, arsehole, dick head, misogynist.

There’s only black and white on here, with some, no room for an in between. Take a more middle ground and you’re subjected to a raft of insults from one side or the other and pigeonholed thereafter.

[Nori1958]

Yes I know I did - that does not mean I understand the point you are trying to make.
It very much sounds like that what you are saying is that because she did one thing then it’s fine that he kissed her on the lips - it’s all about context.

I don't read it that way, and have never said that
My point was,and still is that the player in question didn't seem offended at the time, far from it.
Without reading back all my posts, I don't think I've ever said it was OK, but I can understand that in that specific moment everybody got carried away, and like I said did things they wouldn't normally do. Iam sure the player doesn't go round hugging and lifting her boss in the air on a daily basis, but having won the world Cup probably did it without even thinking about it.

[ksrclaret]

I meant your response to it.

As I said, smelly and creepy

[DCWat]

So when you said we shouldn't be calling people creeps, it was just because you agreed with the creeps?

Not what I said at all, but crack on pigeonholing.

[bpgburn]

Would on the head have been OK?

I’m not saying that in hindsight he shouldn’t have done it, but I do feel it’s being blown out of proportion.

In light of the article linked further up this thread, I do wonder if this is more due to a culmination of issues with this bloke than the incident itself.

No, it's more due to the fact that a man felt he didn't need consent to kiss a woman on the mouth. Hard to believe that people can't see that.

[Hipper]

Think he has to go due to his bizarre behaviour but I’ve just seen a female racehorse owner kiss a male jockey on the lips after winning a race wonder if this will attract the same media uproar?

.... and what if she'd kissed the horse on it's lips!

[ksrclaret]

Would on the head have been OK?

I’m not saying that in hindsight he shouldn’t have done it, but I do feel it’s being blown out of proportion.

In light of the article linked further up this thread, I do wonder if this is more due to a culmination of issues with this bloke than the incident itself.

He didn't kiss her on the head. He kissed her on the lips without her consent.

That's why he's a creep and people who are defending his action are also creeps.

I'm not unsympathetic to the fact that kissing people on the head is more socially acceptable, but why do so many people think other people want to be touched and kissed by them without their consent?

[daveisaclaret]

Not what I said at all, but crack on pigeonholing.

It's open and shut sexual assault by a boss on an employee. No amount of mealy-mouthed, equivocal bullshit about things being blown out of proportion changes that and to think it's anything other than a resignation issue is inherently creepy and misogynistic.

[NottsClaret]

There’s some really weird men on this board, either pathetically terrified of women or tragically backward in their thinking.

He should be fired, never mind expected to resign. Just another creepy guy trying to make a talented woman’s achievements all about him while being a slimeball at the same time.

[Firthy]

You can’t go around kissing women in the work place, sexual or non sexual it’s totally inappropriate. Those arguing that she was smiling before and after the kiss are delusional, she’s on television being broadcast around the world, do you expect her to start windmilling on live television?

We hit record sales in work last month I didn’t go around planting one on the lips of girls I worked with, I’d get the sack and rightly so.

He could have kissed her on the cheek? On the forehead? On the lips is creepy as fuk, he shouldn’t be working with women.

Creepy if done in private but hardly when it's in front of literally millions of viewers. Ill advised and over exhuburant maybe but that's about it. What sad world we live in these days with social media, influencers etc. Everything has to be a drama these days and peoples overreaction is unbelievable.

What should have been a wonderful day for womens football and the Spanish team in particular has been tarnished and overshadowed unnecessarily. Most women I know are stronger than men in many ways and capable of looking after themselves but the media treat them like they are put down by the make sex at every opportunity which in itself is disrespectful to women IMO.

[ksrclaret]

There’s some really weird men on this board, either pathetically terrified of women or tragically backward in their thinking.

He should be fired, never mind expected to resign. Just another creepy guy trying to make a talented woman’s achievements all about him while being a slimeball at the same time.

Bang on.

I am slightly heartened though that for every poster who should really be on some sort of register, there are loads more who call out their creepy views.

[Firthy]

As I said, smelly and creepy

As I said in another post. Everything has to be a drama these days because they can't accept that someone else has a point of view that doesn't agree with their own. In fact calling another poster smelly and creepy is actually more offensive than what the post is actually about but it's far to easy to call someone names on a forum than in person.

[daveisaclaret]

As I said in another post. Everything has to be a drama these days because they can't accept that someone else has a point of view that doesn't agree with their own. In fact calling another poster smelly and creepy is actually more offensive than what the post is actually about but it's far to easy to call someone names on a forum than in person.

It's not possible to think that calling someone smelly and creepy is worse than kissing someone against their will, lying about it, pressuring them to lie about it and then using a position of power to threaten legal action against them. Simply not possible.

[Greenmile]

“CallIing someone names online is more offensive than sexually assaulting your employee”

I’ve heard it all now.

[TheFamilyCat]

You actually replied to the post, but here we go, I'll copy it for you

Both parties were carried away in the moment of winning the world Cup.. both probably did things they wouldn't normally do in every day life, it all needs taking in context

Yes, she probably restrained herself from chinning him.

[ksrclaret]

As I said in another post. Everything has to be a drama these days because they can't accept that someone else has a point of view that doesn't agree with their own. In fact calling another poster smelly and creepy is actually more offensive than what the post is actually about but it's far to easy to call someone names on a forum than in person.

Calling someone smelly and creepy is more offensive than sexually assaulting someone?

[Robbie_painter]

“CallIing someone names online is more offensive than sexually assaulting your employee”

I’ve heard it all now.

You’ve heard nothing because it’s a quote you’ve just made up.That’s not what he said at all.

[DCWat]

It's open and shut sexual assault by a boss on an employee. No amount of mealy-mouthed, equivocal bullshit about things being blown out of proportion changes that and to think it's anything other than a resignation issue is inherently creepy and misogynistic.

There you go again.

Assume what you like about me for having a different perspective, but rest assured, your pigeon holing is wrong.

I’ll look forward to you calling out similar things in the men’s game, a player being kissed in celebration, a manager patting a sub on the arse as he walks goes on to the pitch.

[ksrclaret]

You’ve heard nothing because it’s a quote you’ve just made up.That’s not what he said at all.

That's exactly what was said.

[Greenmile]

You’ve heard nothing because it’s a quote you’ve just made up.That’s not what he said at all.

What’s this supposed to mean, then?

“In fact calling another poster smelly and creepy is actually more offensive than what the post is actually about”

[daveisaclaret]

There you go again.

Assume what you like about me for having a different perspective, but rest assured, your pigeon holing is wrong.

I’ll look forward to you calling out similar things in the men’s game, a player being kissed in celebration, a manager patting a sub on the arse as he walks goes on to the pitch.

I'm not assuming anything, I don't think. You said it is being blown out of proportion and that it's wrong to call people defending it creeps. I just understand the implications of that.

[Greenmile]

There you go again.

Assume what you like about me for having a different perspective, but rest assured, your pigeon holing is wrong.

I’ll look forward to you calling out similar things in the men’s game, a player being kissed in celebration, a manager patting a sub on the arse as he walks goes on to the pitch.

There’s this thing called “consent”. If you haven’t heard of it, I’d suggest you look it up before you interact with anyone again in real life.

[Firthy]

That's exactly what was said.

Only if you class what happened as sexual assault which says it all about the media and society these days. A peck on the lips in front of millions of people is hardly that.

[Big Vinny K]

I don't read it that way, and have never said that
My point was,and still is that the player in question didn't seem offended at the time, far from it.
Without reading back all my posts, I don't think I've ever said it was OK, but I can understand that in that specific moment everybody got carried away, and like I said did things they wouldn't normally do. Iam sure the player doesn't go round hugging and lifting her boss in the air on a daily basis, but having won the world Cup probably did it without even thinking about it.

She has said she was offended by it though so not sure why you would not take that at face value.
Maybe at the time she thought it was not appropriate to make a big issue of it there and then in front of the watching world or maybe she was a bit shocked - it doesn’t really matter though does it ?
The fact she hugged anybody is also irrelevant.

Context, getting caught up in the moment etc etc - none of it justifies the action. And whatever point it is you are trying to make you do seem to be trying to justify it.

[ksrclaret]

Only if you class what happened as sexual assault which says it all about the media and society these days. A peck on the lips in front of millions of people is hardly that.

I hate this question generally, but are you actually happy with your wife/ daughter etc getting a peck on the lips from her male boss whenever he feels like it?

[Greenmile]

Only if you class what happened as sexual assault which says it all about the media and society these days. A peck on the lips in front of millions of people is hardly that.

Kissing someone on the lips without their consent is absolutely sexual assault, whether it’s done down a dark alley, or in full view of the world’s cameras, particularly when the victim of the assault is an employee of the perpetrator.

[RicardoMontalban]

Things aren't always so clear cut if the signals are right, it's not really the done thing to ask for permission that said if the signals aren't right to start with you don't kiss the woman, each individual case will be different but as a general rule you should know or at least be capable of judging the situation.

Are you a real person? Good grief.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

https://x.com/sevillafc_eng/status/1695 ... 22567?s=46

[ksrclaret]

Kissing someone on the lips without their consent is absolutely sexual assault, whether it’s done down a dark alley, or in full view of the world’s cameras, particularly when the victim of the assault is an employee of the perpetrator.

It's just terrifying isn't it.

The thought of my daughter one day having to go out into a world knowing there are people like Firthy and others out there who don't think a boss kissing someone on the lips without consent is sexual assault genuinely makes me fear for her safety and well-being even more than I already do.

[DCWat]

There’s this thing called “consent”. If you haven’t heard of it, I’d suggest you look it up before you interact with anyone again in real life.

Thank you for being so patronising, another string to the bow.

Perhaps I’m wrong in seeing a difference between, for example, business workplaces and those that are played out on a field in front of thousands at the event and millions at home.

There are a hundred and one things that go on, on the field of play or in celebration during and after, that of course would not be acceptable in a different working environment.

My perspective is not that I condone kissing someone on the lips, nor that I don’t understand consent, despite your assertion, it’s that the environment that they were in is entirely different, emotionally charged and celebratory. I just think that needs to be taken in to consideration when attempting to compare and contrast.

You’re more than entitled to disagree and suggest that there are no mitigating factors that should be applied. That’s fine, the labelling less so.

[jrgbfc]

Hard to believe how much of a mess the Spanish FA have made of this.

[RVclaret]

It's just terrifying isn't it.

The thought of my daughter one day having to go out into a world knowing there are people like Firthy and others out there who don't think a boss kissing someone on the lips without consent is sexual assault genuinely makes me fear for her safety and well-being even more than I already do.

Completely agree, I have a 3 year old daughter and it’s worrying.

[Volvoclaret]

TBF he didn't do tongues.

[Juan Tanamera]

Anyone fancy starting an 'Holier Than Thou' thread?

[daveisaclaret]

Thank you for being so patronising, another string to the bow.

Perhaps I’m wrong in seeing a difference between, for example, business workplaces and those that are played out on a field in front of thousands at the event and millions at home.

There are a hundred and one things that go on, on the field of play or in celebration during and after, that of course would not be acceptable in a different working environment.

My perspective is not that I condone kissing someone on the lips, nor that I don’t understand consent, despite your assertion, it’s that the environment that they were in is entirely different, emotionally charged and celebratory. I just think that needs to be taken in to consideration when attempting to compare and contrast.

You’re more than entitled to disagree and suggest that there are no mitigating factors that should be applied. That’s fine, the labelling less so.

Your perspective now seems to be that it's ok he did it because she's a footballer. I hope you can understand why I might label you unkindly based on that.

[Firthy]

It's just terrifying isn't it.

The thought of my daughter one day having to go out into a world knowing there are people like Firthy and others out there who don't think a boss kissing someone on the lips without consent is sexual assault genuinely makes me fear for her safety and well-being even more than I already do.

And yours and others complete overreaction to it makes me fear for the future of society. Firstly I never said I agreed with it and said it was ill advised.

But the suggestions of it being creepy and calling it sexualt assault are way over the top and exactly my point that everything has to be made drama these days.

It was an over exuberant and ill advised peck on the lips done in full view of everyone watching. Anyone who thinks otherwise needs to get over themselves and come into the real world where there are far worse atrocities happening every minute of every day.

[Jakubclaret]

Are you a real person? Good grief.

I'm saying things happen naturally & you shouldn't necessarily permission to kiss a girl if the signals are right, you stated that you needed consent to kiss a woman which isn't entirely true if she's keen on you.

[Swizzlestick]

[Firthy]

Completely agree, I have a 3 year old daughter and it’s worrying.

I really can't believe you've said that. You'll be comparing him to a paedophile next.

[Greenmile]

Thank you for being so patronising, another string to the bow.

Perhaps I’m wrong in seeing a difference between, for example, business workplaces and those that are played out on a field in front of thousands at the event and millions at home.

There are a hundred and one things that go on, on the field of play or in celebration during and after, that of course would not be acceptable in a different working environment.

My perspective is not that I condone kissing someone on the lips, nor that I don’t understand consent, despite your assertion, it’s that the environment that they were in is entirely different, emotionally charged and celebratory. I just think that needs to be taken in to consideration when attempting to compare and contrast.

You’re more than entitled to disagree and suggest that there are no mitigating factors that should be applied. That’s fine, the labelling less so.

There are no mitigating factors which can justify sexually assaulting an employee. That you think there may be is deeply worrying.

[Greenmile]

I really can't believe you've said that. You'll be comparing him to a paedophile next.

You think his daughter will be three years old forever??

[AlargeClaret]

Seems a bit of an overreaction and possible politically charged ,though ill advised to say the least .I appreciate the Spanish and Med types are big social kissers etc ,though couldn’t he just have profusely apologised “ heat of the moment etc “ ?

Gotta say generally speaking though planting a smacker on the lips of a tattooed lesbian is always a high risk move IMO .

[elwaclaret]

It was a particularly stupid thing to do. Such a shame because he’s really stood up to the Spanish clubs when it comes to overspending, and seemed to be doing a really good job.

However there are things you just cannot do, I think he has to go unfortunately.

[DCWat]

There are no mitigating factors which can justify sexually assaulting an employee. That you think there may be is deeply worrying.

Expand on the deeply worrying, I’m intrigued to understand what you’re implying here.