Game postponed

[martin_p]

Ok, Can we ask “how” stopping kids playing in their football teams in an arranged league on Saturday 9th September 2022 is “a mark of respect”?
Is that allowed?

You’d have to ask those making the mark of respect for a definitive answer but I suspect it’ll be along the lines of actively stopping what they’re doing to take time to reflect on the Queen’s life. Now you’ll quite rightly argue that the vast majority will just do something else but this is the more nebulous concept of an organisation or ‘family’ showing respect. It’s a similar principle to a minutes silence I guess, stopping doing what you’re doing to reflect.

[bumba]

Cricket is off today. That’s their ‘pause’. And I’ve no doubt they are ‘back on’ tomorrow to swoop up some of the football fans who are now free.

Football should be on too with Burnley v Norwich tomorrow, no need to cancel sport. Cancel it next weekend but not this one

[martin_p]

Not by some

I get it btw if you are ex military, and the oath of allegiance to the Queen makes this a huge thing, but its still not on to not understand why some of us what to remember her while watching football and our kids play football

Yes, but that works both ways. There’s got to be some understanding as to why an organisation or sport would choose to do it in a different way. Now let’s be clear, if the match was on tonight I’d be there and I’d be respectful of any decision the football authorities had taken over how the wanted to mark the Queen’s death just in the same way I’m respectful of the decision they have taken.

[Mattster]

No, they’re not two sides of the same coin. Making a gesture as a sign of respect doesn’t mean making a different gesture (or no gesture at all) is disrespectful.

Nonsense. Doing something and saying it's a mark of respect does not make it respectful, unless the act itself is respectful. In which case the opposite action would have to be disrespectful.

If I didn't eat my lunch today "as a mark of respect" that's just a nonsense because eating my lunch wouldn't be disrespectful.

If "as a mark of respect" I don't play a certain song by the Sex Pistols today then that is actually respectful because doing the opposite would be disrespectful.

[Bordeauxclaret]

You’d have to ask those making the mark of respect for a definitive answer but I suspect it’ll be along the lines of actively stopping what they’re doing to take time to reflect on the Queen’s life. Now you’ll quite rightly argue that the vast majority will just do something else but this is the more nebulous concept of an organisation or ‘family’ showing respect. It’s a similar principle to a minutes silence I guess, stopping doing what you’re doing to reflect.

And that has to be done tomorrow then yes?

[martin_p]

Nonsense. Doing something and saying it's a mark of respect does not make it respectful, unless the act itself is respectful. In which case the opposite action would have to be disrespectful.

If I didn't eat my lunch today "as a mark of respect" that's just a nonsense because eating my lunch wouldn't be disrespectful.

If "as a mark of respect" I don't play a certain song by the Sex Pistols today then that is actually respectful because doing the opposite would be disrespectful.

No that’s not the case. Not playing it is just not being disrespectful.

[martin_p]

And that has to be done tomorrow then yes?

That’s what the football authorities have decided. I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make.

[Mattster]

Not really, it's just football making the decision, which they feel is right, to show a moment of respect for what is a momentous occasion for the country. Our late Queen was a patron of the FA and William is the President of the FA - perhaps this also was part of their decision.

Racing paused, cricket paused, golf paused, why shouldn't football?

Why should they have paused?

Just because some sports have paused why should another?

It's just a nonsense.

It's a "mark of respect" or the "right thing to do" apparently, but the only justification I can seem to get from anyone as to why it is those things is simply "because it is".

And in the absence of an actual explanation as to why it is respectful or "right" then the only reasoning for saying those things would be if doing the opposite would be disrespectful or "wrong". And you and martin_p are saying that's not the case.

[Bordeauxclaret]

That’s what the football authorities have decided. I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make.

In fact forget it.

[Big Vinny K]

You’d have to ask those making the mark of respect for a definitive answer but I suspect it’ll be along the lines of actively stopping what they’re doing to take time to reflect on the Queen’s life. Now you’ll quite rightly argue that the vast majority will just do something else but this is the more nebulous concept of an organisation or ‘family’ showing respect. It’s a similar principle to a minutes silence I guess, stopping doing what you’re doing to reflect.

Stopping doing what you are doing though is an individual’s decision though.
Being prevented doing what you are doing by an individual or committee of individuals is different.

I understand that the reasoning behind their decision is that they believe it’s a gesture of respect. But playing football or watching it is not disrespectful. And not playing football or watching it, is not in my view an especially respectful gesture either.

All feels pretty pointless to be doing this and I think there will be lots of far better and poignant opportunities to pay respect for those who want to over the coming week or so.

[martin_p]

Why should they have paused?

Just because some sports have paused why should another?

It's just a nonsense.

It's a "mark of respect" or the "right thing to do" apparently, but the only justification I can seem to get from anyone as to why it is those things is simply "because it is".

And in the absence of an actual explanation as to why it is respectful or "right" then the only reasoning for saying those things would be if doing the opposite would be disrespectful or "wrong". And you and martin_p are saying that's not the case.

No it’s not the case, it would only be disrespectful if having decided to postpone all matches some clubs decided to play them anyway. It’s like a minutes silence. It’s not necessarily disrespectful not to hold a minutes silence to mark someone’s death but if you do decide to hold one then people making a noise during the silence would be being disrespectful.

[martin_p]

Stopping doing what you are doing though is an individual’s decision though.
Being prevented doing what you are doing by an individual or committee of individuals is different.

I understand that the reasoning behind their decision is that they believe it’s a gesture of respect. But playing football or watching it is not disrespectful. And not playing football or watching it, is not in my view an especially respectful gesture either.

All feels pretty pointless to be doing this and I think there will be lots of far better and poignant opportunities to pay respect for those who want to over the coming week or so.

But it’s not an individual making the mark of respect, it’s a sport, and the sport has chosen to postpone all it’s competitive fixtures.

[Mattster]

No it’s not the case, it would only be disrespectful if having decided to postpone all matches some clubs decided to play them anyway. It’s like a minutes silence. It’s not necessarily disrespectful not to hold a minutes silence to mark someone’s death but if you do decide to hold one then people making a noise during the silence would be being disrespectful.

Again, nonsense. Those examples are actions dependant on the original decision.

Using my lunch example that'd be like me justifying not eating my lunch as a mark of respect because if I ate my lunch I could chose to scrawl something offensive to the Queen on it in tomato ketchup.

And that's before we get to the fact that if football had gone ahead this weekend and chose not to have a minutes silence then that would very widely be considered disrespectful.

[Lancasterclaret]

Yes, but that works both ways. There’s got to be some understanding as to why an organisation or sport would choose to do it in a different way. Now let’s be clear, if the match was on tonight I’d be there and I’d be respectful of any decision the football authorities had taken over how the wanted to mark the Queen’s death just in the same way I’m respectful of the decision they have taken.

I think (on reflection) our match should be called off

I don't think the weekend calender should be, and the fact that loads of other sports are continuing suggests that the FA have got this wrong

To then double down on that by cancelling the kids games as well is just ludicrous

I appreciate others have a different point of view and I respect that btw

[martin_p]

Again, nonsense. Those examples are actions dependant on the original decision.

Using my lunch example that'd be like me justifying not eating my lunch as a mark of respect because if I ate my lunch I could chose to scrawl something offensive to the Queen on it in tomato ketchup.

And that's before we get to the fact that if football had gone ahead this weekend and chose not to have a minutes silence then that would very widely be considered disrespectful.

I think you’re missing my point, that being that the absence of a particular ‘mark of respect’ doesn’t equate to disrespect

[claretonthecoast1882]

I think (on reflection) our match should be called off

I don't think the weekend calender should be, and the fact that loads of other sports are continuing suggests that the FA have got this wrong

To then double down on that by cancelling the kids games as well is just ludicrous

I appreciate others have a different point of view and I respect that btw

I think they would rather call off a full weekend than release a statement saying 2 games are postponed as a mark of respect but all the others will go ahead.

You can imagine the pithy comments aired if the Premier league fixtures had gone ahead aimed at Sky sports and the Premier League. If we all miss 1 game that is played at a alter date it isn't that much of a sacrifice and everyone can move on and look forward to a decent away day on Tuesday.

[quoonbeatz]

I played 5 a side last night, after the announcement, pitches were packed as usual. The lads on pitch 4 had an impromptu minute's silence before their game which was a nice touch. Everyone else just got on with it. Very much as it should be.

[RVclaret]

Why should they have paused?

Just because some sports have paused why should another?

It's just a nonsense.

It's a "mark of respect" or the "right thing to do" apparently, but the only justification I can seem to get from anyone as to why it is those things is simply "because it is".

And in the absence of an actual explanation as to why it is respectful or "right" then the only reasoning for saying those things would be if doing the opposite would be disrespectful or "wrong". And you and martin_p are saying that's not the case.

An actual explanation could be that there is huge elation caused at a football match / sporting event, which to many, is not appropriate during a period of national mourning. Therefore, a 'mark of respect' is to avoid that situation.

[Big Vinny K]

No it’s not the case, it would only be disrespectful if having decided to postpone all matches some clubs decided to play them anyway. It’s like a minutes silence. It’s not necessarily disrespectful not to hold a minutes silence to mark someone’s death but if you do decide to hold one then people making a noise during the silence would be being disrespectful.

I said it was a committee of board of individuals making the decision on behalf of that sport. You are not telling me there has been any consultation with supporters, federations, clubs etc ? It does not sound like they been consulted other sporting bodies given they are all doing different things.

Do you believe it’s disrespectful to be playing or watching sport today ? Or tomorrow…..or Sunday ?

Or put the question another way why do you believe that children not playing football tomorrow morning is a gesture of respect ?

[Steve-Harpers-perm]

Rugby carrying on over the weekend as well.

[Mattster]

I think you’re missing my point, that being that the absence of a particular ‘mark of respect’ doesn’t equate to disrespect

The example you gave of absence of a particular ‘mark of respect’ (not holding a minutes silence) was one that would very much equate to disrespect in the eyes of the majority, though.

[Stalbansclaret]

An actual explanation could be that there is huge elation caused at a football match / sporting event, which to many, is not appropriate during a period of national mourning. Therefore, a 'mark of respect' is to avoid that situation.

Interesting thought. I hope when I die that anyone who cared about me will go to every length possible to cheer themselves up and avoid sinking into morose thoughts about my demise. I'm sure that whilst doing so they will still retain their feelings for me and think fondly and respectfully of me.

[Mattster]

An actual explanation could be that there is huge elation caused at a football match / sporting event, which to many, is not appropriate during a period of national mourning. Therefore, a 'mark of respect' is to avoid that situation.

If that was the explanation then it would need to be postponed throughout the whole period of national mourning, not just a few days (or in the case of other sports you're highlighting, one day), to justify it.

[quoonbeatz]

An actual explanation could be that there is huge elation caused at a football match / sporting event, which to many, is not appropriate during a period of national mourning. Therefore, a 'mark of respect' is to avoid that situation.

Could be something in this as nobody gets elated at cricket, rugby, golf etc.

[RVclaret]

If that was the explanation then it would need to be postponed throughout the whole period of national mourning, not just a few days (or in the case of other sports you're highlighting, one day), to justify it.

Not necessarily. Just not within 24-48 hours of the announced death, which 'may' be seen as distasteful/too soon. I mean, the new King has yet to even address the public and won't do so until 6pm this evening. Not saying I 100% agree with it but it's a plausible explanation which you seem to have been looking for. United and West Ham games only went ahead last night as 1. They kicked off an hour after the announcement 2. UEFA insisted they go ahead.

[Big Vinny K]

All laughing, applause and moments of elation to be suspended at The Lowry and all theatres tonight.
Audiences are being respectfully asked to hold it in till they get back home and can then laugh or clap in groups of 2 or less.

[claretonthecoast1882]

Could be something in this as nobody gets elated at cricket, rugby, golf etc.

Steady on, have you ever seen how giddy Tarquin and his chums get when saracens score a touch down

[quoonbeatz]

Steady on, have you ever seen how giddy Tarquin and his chums get when saracens score a touch down

I thought they saved all that for drinking games in the bar aftwards?

[quoonbeatz]

Not necessarily. Just not within 24-48 hours of the announced death, which 'may' be seen as distasteful/too soon. I mean, the new King has yet to even address the public and won't do so until 6pm this evening. Not saying I 100% agree with it but it's a plausible explanation which you seem to have been looking for. United and West Ham games only went ahead last night as 1. They kicked off an hour after the announcement 2. UEFA insisted they go ahead.

I bagged 6 goals last night, chief, and I have to tell you the elation was pure. Dedicated all 6 to Her Majesty, nearly one for every year of throneage. 100% respectful.

[TheFamilyCat]

An actual explanation could be that there is huge elation caused at a football match / sporting event, which to many, is not appropriate during a period of national mourning. Therefore, a 'mark of respect' is to avoid that situation.

If anyone is getting married this weekend or becomes a parent or grandparent, please don't dare be happy about it.

[RVclaret]

If anyone is getting married this weekend or becomes a parent or grandparent, please don't dare be happy about it.

I bagged 6 goals last night, chief, and I have to tell you the elation was pure. Dedicated all 6 to Her Majesty, nearly one for every year of throneage. 100% respectful.

Neither examples are in the public eye. Sport, on the other hand, could be seen as a leader in society.

[NottsClaret]

Cancelling kid's football over the weekend is genuinely bizarre. The FA have lost it there. Although in their email it did say you would be allowed to go training, which is very nice of them. Cheers.

[Bordeauxclaret]

Cancelling kid's football over the weekend is genuinely bizarre. The FA have lost it there. Although in their email it did say you would be allowed to go training, which is very nice of them. Cheers.

Almost like it’s a nonsensical and indefensible decision.

[TheFamilyCat]

Cancelling kid's football over the weekend is genuinely bizarre. The FA have lost it there. Although in their email it did say you would be allowed to go training, which is very nice of them. Cheers.

Our club have closed the ground for three days. We can organise a game in the park (jumpers for goalposts etc) but not in the name of the club.

[TheFamilyCat]

Neither examples are in the public eye. Sport, on the other hand, could be seen as a leader in society.

Many sports are going ahead.

Is under-7's football a leader in society and in the public eye?

[CoolClaret]

Be interesting to see how many of the purported Royalists here/nationwide demanding that more ‘respect’ should be shown for simply stating that cancelling/postponing leisure activities in order to forcefully mourn an unelected official is a false equivalence/a bit daft are also Brexiteers that voted leave due to ‘unelected officials having control over our lives’…..

Strange old world

[Bordeauxclaret]

Many sports are going ahead.

Is under-7's football a leader in society and in the public eye?

Under 7’s out of all people need to actively stop what they’re doing to take time to reflect on the Queen’s life.

[RVclaret]

Many sports are going ahead.

Is under-7's football a leader in society and in the public eye?

Like I said before, maybe football feels a greater duty with William as President of the FA. Maybe football could have waited to see what cricket and rugby were doing, but then complaints would have been ‘why aren’t they telling us we’ve got trips to plan/cancel’. And I don’t really see the same reason for under 7s football, no, not sure on that one aside from just accept the decision, it’s a once in a lifetime event and quick decisions have had to be made.

[claretonthecoast1882]

Be interesting to see how many of the purported Royalists here/nationwide demanding that more ‘respect’ should be shown for simply stating that cancelling/postponing leisure activities in order to forcefully mourn an unelected official is a false equivalence/a bit daft are also Brexiteers that voted leave due to ‘unelected officials having control over our lives’…..

Strange old world

Almost as strange as your whole post

[Mattster]

Not necessarily. Just not within 24-48 hours of the announced death, which 'may' be seen as distasteful/too soon. I mean, the new King has yet to even address the public and won't do so until 6pm this evening. Not saying I 100% agree with it but it's a plausible explanation which you seem to have been looking for. United and West Ham games only went ahead last night as 1. They kicked off an hour after the announcement 2. UEFA insisted they go ahead.

So the first 24-48 hours (minus the first 6 hours or so, for convenience) is more mourny but it's OK after that, knock yourselves out, wouldn't want to be all mourned out by the funeral...

Either it's a decision to respectfully observe the national mourning period or it isn't, and since this doesn't cover the national mourning period then it isn't.

None of this is convincing as to the decision being anything other than completely arbitrary.

[CoolClaret]

Almost as strange as your whole post

Ahh - seems like you’re one of them

[tiger76]

Grassroots now cancelled.

Now that decision I vehemently disagree with, cancelling pro fixtures is one thing, but what can possibly be gained by not allowing kids to enjoy their weekly footy activity.

This is in danger of going to far, and then running the risk of alienating the public if the authorities aren't careful.

[quoonbeatz]

Neither examples are in the public eye. Sport, on the other hand, could be seen as a leader in society.

You've clearly never watched me play.

[claretonthecoast1882]

Ahh - seems like you’re one of them

I am just not dumb enough to think I am being forced into doing anything.

You have banged on about this a few times and each time it comes across dumber and dumber. You aren't being forced to do anything, you don't like the royals and you need to let everyone know.

It just depends what happens first I guess, will you move on or grow up ?

[tiger76]

Under 7’s out of all people need to actively stop what they’re doing to take time to reflect on the Queen’s life.

That is bonkers, and why isn't it possible for them to do both.

[quoonbeatz]

Like I said before, maybe football feels a greater duty with William as President of the FA.

Football isn't a living thing. I've not done a poll but I would bet a lot of money that the vast majority of the people who count in football (fans and players at all levels) would rather have played and paid tribute this weekend than cancelling everything 'out of respect'.

[TheFamilyCat]

Now that decision I vehemently disagree with, cancelling pro fixtures is one thing, but what can possibly be gained by not allowing kids to enjoy their weekly footy activity.

This is in danger of going to far, and then running the risk of alienating the public if the authorities aren't careful.

I notice that the government have been making it very clear that these aren't their decisions.

[Bordeauxclaret]

That is bonkers, and why isn't it possible for them to do both.

It certainly is bonkers.

[CoolClaret]

I am just not dumb enough to think I am being forced into doing anything.

You have banged on about this a few times and each time it comes across dumber and dumber. You aren't being forced to do anything, you don't like the royals and you need to let everyone know.

It just depends what happens first I guess, will you move on or grow up ?

The concept of a royal family in 2022 is quite frankly absurd, I had some respect for the Queen is a good stateswomen but crying out loud really - a fecking royal family?

In regards to ‘forced mourning’ quite a lot of folk on here /the airwaves have mentioned that events have been cancelled for a period of national mourning - that’s forced by anyones definition.

[AlargeClaret]

Be interesting to see how many of the purported Royalists here/nationwide demanding that more ‘respect’ should be shown for simply stating that cancelling/postponing leisure activities in order to forcefully mourn an unelected official is a false equivalence/a bit daft are also Brexiteers that voted leave due to ‘unelected officials having control over our lives’…..

Strange old world

The “ unelected official “ ( I’m sure you’re a huge fan of elected ones as well ) was your and many millions Queen ,with a lifetime of pristine service , her tenure and passing is unprecedented. Nobody is forcing you to mourn ,it’s 1 weekend without football . Go out for a few beers / sh@g your bird / work out /see a film /meal /gig/xbox:binge watch /whack off to porn all day , there’s a lot of choice .

As for your “ Brexiteers” bit ?? what on earth has Brexit gotta do with the death of the Queen ?