Euro 2024

[Swizzlestick]

Last year Scotland beat Spain 2-0 in the qualifying games.

A spanish team whinch included Rodri

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oC5Z-IJwwak

Rodri played but the rest of the starting 11 barely resembled the one at these Euros. No Simon, Laporte, Cucurella, Fabian Ruiz, Yamal, Williams or Morata.

[Elizabeth]

'It's coming home' is now a parody of course. If we beat Spain it will be the first time in Southgate's 8 year stint( it feels longer) that he has managed an England team that has beaten a top ranking international tournament team
If it happens it will make me believe in ghosts

[kentonclaret]

'It's coming home' is now a parody of course. If we beat Spain it will be the first time in Southgate's 8 year stint( it feels longer) that he has managed an England team that has beaten a top ranking international tournament team
If it happens it will make me believe in ghosts

Which just goes to confirm my point that England have yet to face a nation in this tournament that was priced at under 16/1 to win the competition whilst we were 3/1 outright favourites.
Hopefully we can nick it in a one off game and bring football back home (whatever that means).

[claretskeith]

Which just goes to confirm my point that England have yet to face a nation in this tournament that was priced at under 16/1 to win the competition whilst we were 3/1 outright favourites.

Do you not think that's a strange mindset though? To have your country in the final of a major competition and you're demoting the achievement because of who we played to get there?

[Dyched]

They just keep clinging to weird myth that eventual winners beat top team after top team after top team. As I pointed out on another thread, most winners play 2 or 3 top teams max. Average is around 2. One on the away to the final and one in it.

It’s weird that English football supporters are getting upset about their country being in a final (ANOTHER). It’s a very strange mentality to have.

[chekhov]

'It's coming home' is now a parody of course. If we beat Spain it will be the first time in Southgate's 8 year stint( it feels longer) that he has managed an England team that has beaten a top ranking international tournament team
If it happens it will make me believe in ghosts

Well we did beat Germany but in 2021 (if that counts), and we’ve just beaten the Netherlands (could they be classed as a top ranked tournament team possibly?).

[claretskeith]

They just keep clinging to weird myth that eventual winners beat top team after top team after top team. As I pointed out on another thread, most winners play 2 or 3 top teams max. Average is around 2. One on the away to the final and one in it.

It’s weird that English football supporters are getting upset about their country being in a final (ANOTHER). It’s a very strange mentality to have.

Yup. Not sure how that works psychologically. In the earlier rounds I'd put it down to attention-seeking or a defence mechanism so that if we do get eliminated they've warmed themselves up and aren't as gutted.

But in the final? I don't get that at all.

[martin_p]

Well we did beat Germany but in 2021 (if that counts), and we’ve just beaten the Netherlands (could they be classed as a top ranked tournament team possibly?).

Before Wednesday the claim was we hadn’t beaten many top 10 teams, the Netherlands are ranked 7th in the world so now the claim has changed to something more nebulous such as ‘top tournament team’ or based on betting odds. The fact that England are undoubtedly a ‘top tournament team’ seems to escape them.

[Murger]

Germany were ranked 12th in 2021.

[Jakubclaret]

I hope we win nation aside it might shut the anti Southgate gobsh1tes up who throughout his tenure have found reason to incessantly moan escaping the fact that whoevers managed us previously we have ended up failing. Could understand it more if we have been used to winning lending to higher expectations.

[Elizabeth]

If Southgate manages England to beat Spain tomorrow it will change a lot of people's perception of him . Until that happens he will always be regarded as a lucky England manager.
I hope he does it because I want to get rid of this feeling that he impresses well when talking in the media conferences but would probably push the door on going out when it says pull

[claretskeith]

Before Wednesday the claim was we hadn’t beaten many top 10 teams, the Netherlands are ranked 7th in the world so now the claim has changed to something more nebulous such as ‘top tournament team’ or based on betting odds. The fact that England are undoubtedly a ‘top tournament team’ seems to escape them.

Which still begs the question: Why? Why do some people think like that?

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Which still begs the question: Why? Why do some people think like that?

Haters will move whatever goalposts they can to push their agenda

[willsclarets]

I just hope we're aggressive and positive against a side which while good, isn't a great side. When you consider what they had around 2010:
Xavi
Iniesta
Busquets
Alonso
David Silva
Ramos
Puyol
Pique
Torres
Fabregas
Villa

And probably others I've forgotten. The side they have now are nowhere near that, and to be fair most sides in history aren't. But while they've had a good tournament I don't see it as an impossible task. Far from it.

[CaptainKirk]

If Southgate manages England to beat Spain tomorrow it will change a lot of people's perception of him . Until that happens he will always be regarded as a lucky England manager.
I hope he does it because I want to get rid of this feeling that he impresses well when talking in the media conferences but would probably push the door on going out when it says pull

One of the best things about winning would be to stuff this rubbish back where it belongs.

[claretskeith]

One of the best things about winning would be to stuff this rubbish back where it belongs.

But if we win, the clueless will say Southgate was lucky.

[Winstonswhite]

Imagine being an English football fan and not enjoying us being in the final of a major tournament!

[CaptainKirk]

I might be slow but, what is Kane’s role here?

[Lip]

Get Kane off NOW!

[RickyBobby]

I would like to know how much the ball was in play in injury time.
European refs are something else.

[BigGaz]

What are the other metrics?

All I had to do was wait In total confidence to give you your answer.

The metric that many others have already discussed. That he is quite capable of beating the also rans of the world but when he meets sides that can give him a game tactically he is left wanting.

That's his legacy Martin, unfortunately.

[Sproggy]

But if we win, the clueless will say Southgate was lucky.

We didn’t. He’s crap. His luck always runs out and he has nothing to offer. Hopefully his last game as manager.

[Conroysleftfoot]

Everybody keeps saying we have great players and should be winning tournaments. But are these players great or do they look good playing in the Prem because they have teammates who come from abroad. Look at Phil Foden for example. People gush about his talent but does he look good because he has Rodri, De Bruyne, Bernardo Silva around him.

[Poulton-le-Claret]

Everybody keeps saying we have great players and should be winning tournaments. But are these players great or do they look good playing in the Prem because they have teammates who come from abroad. Look at Phil Foden for example. People gush about his talent but does he look good because he has Rodri, De Bruyne, Bernardo Silva around him.

I am starting to believe that Foden doesn't know what to do unless he has Pep giving him instructions. Unbelievable talent, just no brain.

Been pretty poor for the majority of the tournament and we've barely seen Gordon, who has got a brain (+ talent).

[dsr]

We reverted to type when we equalised. When we're behind, we attack and try to score. When we're level, we try and hold on and hope that a goal happens (at the right end, of course. Which it usually isn't, if we're playing someone good.)

[taio]

We reverted to type when we equalised. When we're behind, we attack and try to score. When we're level, we try and hold on and hope that a goal happens (at the right end, of course. Which it usually isn't, if we're playing someone good.)

Pretty much sums it up.

[Anonymous Claret]

We reverted to type when we equalised. When we're behind, we attack and try to score. When we're level, we try and hold on and hope that a goal happens (at the right end, of course. Which it usually isn't, if we're playing someone good.)

Completely agree. 1-0 down we made positive changes to do everything possible to equalise. We score, Spain are rocked, the crowd are in great voice and we have the momentum. We start to sit back and with 5 minutes left Southgate looks to bring on Gallagher and Trippier. They score and he changes it by bringing Toney on instead. Why didn't he bring Toney and Gordon on after equalising and go and try and win the game?

Keeping it simple Spain tried to win that game whereas we tried to make sure that we didn't lose it.

[roperclaret]

Completely agree. 1-0 down we made positive changes to do everything possible to equalise. We score, Spain are rocked, the crowd are in great voice and we have the momentum. We start to sit back and with 5 minutes left Southgate looks to bring on Gallagher and Trippier. They score and he changes it by bringing Toney on instead. Why didn't he bring Toney and Gordon on after equalising and go and try and win the game?

Keeping it simple Spain tried to win that game whereas we tried to make sure that we didn't lose it.

It’s a mindset that will never change. He doesn’t try to win games, he just tries not to lose them. Which is why he has such a good record in tournament football but would be rubbish in the Prem for a top 6 team. He’d probably do a job for a team who is just trying to stay up.

[AGENT_CLARET]

Starting that final without Kane and Foden and we'd of probably won it

[Spijed]

As it was said elsewhere when you have Watkins and Toney as your two main strikers on the pitch it raises questions as to whether England really do have the best squad, as neither would get in any other top side.

[Tribesmen]

The best side in the Euro's won it , so that's now 58 years and counting for England .

[martin_p]

If you define being successful with the sole metric being 'progression in major tournaments' then factually, yes that's true, he is the most successful manager in the last 50 years.

Its not going to be, and isn't the sole metric he gets judged on though.

Ok, you’ve (finally) defined your other metric. Use it to list the more successful England mangers in the last 50 years.

[BigGaz]

What success? None of them have been successful.

[warksclaret]

As it was said elsewhere when you have Watkins and Toney as your two main strikers on the pitch it raises questions as to whether England really do have the best squad, as neither would get in any other top side.

And would Southgate play Marrata for England if he was English

[CoolClaret]

Can't help but feel like England has properly blown two golden chances at silverware...

[warksclaret]

Can't help but feel like England has properly blown two golden chances at silverware...

Agreed and I dont get the acceptance of people saying how well we have done to get to two Euro finals and a semi and quarter of the World Cup.I watched the 66 world cup win and am an avid follower of football and watched the team progress or dip in that period. But Southgate has particularly in the past 4 years acquired some of the worlds leading players, and in a 102 games not managed to win anything. Coaching has moved on immensely since he managed at Boro, but he has not and does not have the killer instinct you need to change games. He is too close and too loyal to the players-for me more of an HR Manager than a smart football coach.Top managers like Pep, Klopp, Arteta, Moreno would not have started Kane yesterday after 6 poor performances, and now we hear he had a back injury since the tournament started. If the authorities are serious about England winning trophies they will start their search for the right man, and I dont mean the likes of Potter or Howe. Klopp is out of work, and Pep's contract runs out in 12 months. For me picking the likes of one of these shows we are serious and whilst foreign, both understand and know the English players in this country

[Poulton-le-Claret]

He is too close and too loyal to the players-for me more of an HR Manager than a smart football coach.

Southgate would have started Maguire every game had he been fit and available. That just sums him up as a manager for me.

[dandeclaret]

Maguire is a very good team player.

I'm amazed how many of you watched Dyche sides for years, showing that a team that works as a unit, is more important than individuals.

No left sided unit that works, weak in the pivot position with players who are clumsy in possession, and a front 3 that didn't interplay too well at all.

Centre halves and GK about the only unit that played consistently as a UNIT.

[Swizzlestick]

Southgate would have started Maguire every game had he been fit and available. That just sums him up as a manager for me.

Has Maguire ever let England down at major tournaments?

[Sproggy]

The good news is that Konsa and particularly Guehi should have moved ahead of him in the pecking order.

[Poulton-le-Claret]

Has Maguire ever let England down at major tournaments?

I'm not digging out his prior tournament performances, he was good once. Just that he is no where near the quality required for an international tournament in the present day and Southgate has a blind spot for his favourites.

As evidenced by playing Kane who is either finished or injured, either way he should have been dropped in the group stages.

[warksclaret]

The good news is that Konsa and particularly Guehi should have moved ahead of him in the pecking order.

One of the real positives, plus Braithwaite too who should have played a friendly by now but came on only for part of the second half of a recent friendly. They are our future. Regarding Maguire-I agree he has played OK for England, but hard as Man Utd tried to sell him over two seasons, he is still there.He definitely is not the future

[CaptainKirk]

My thread, so I can have the last word!
Once again, a case of what might have been I guess.
The haters will feel justified and the rest will keep on waiting.
It’s definitely coming home next time - whether we win it or not is a different matter!
Back to normal life now so - Come on you Clarets!