Pope out of England squad

[FCBurnley]

Pope needs to kick his game up or Sean might just be thinking of giving him a rest !!

[tiger76]

Collins and Hendrick in the ROI squad, as is Will Keane the twin brother of Michael.

I fail to say why there's surprise that Pope has been left out of the England squad, he's looked off his game ever since he returned from his shoulder surgery.

And the best way for NP to answer GS and his critics is by keeping clean sheets in the PL. And even the most fervent Burnley fan can see that Pope's kicking is an issue, and at international level that is a major consideration now.

[boatshed bill]

I fail to say why there's surprise that Pope has been left out of the England squad, he's looked off his game ever since he returned from his shoulder surgery.

Not much has been said about the shoulder problem, which was overshadowed by his knee surgery.
I sincerely hope he's not had a problem due to having dislocated his shoulder a couple of ears ago.

[tiger76]

Not much has been said about the shoulder problem, which was overshadowed by his knee surgery.
I sincerely hope he's not had a problem due to having dislocated his shoulder a couple of ears ago.

Thought he was carrying a shoulder injury late last season, but I may well be wrong, either way he's definitely not hitting his form from a couple of seasons back when he challenged Ederson for the GG.

And he's making far more errors which are leading to goals than he'd normally make in an entire season, which is a worry because if we can't keep clean sheets we aren't going to win many games in the Prem given our lack of goals.

[Newcastleclaret93]

I said it when Pope made a few appearances for England last season, that Southgate would try to shift him out of the squad ASAP. He was like a fish out of water in them games.

Probably works better for us as Pope can prioritise getting back to his peak performance and force Southgate to include him.

I must admit he hasn’t looked the same this season. Southgates comments about his injury are interesting.

[CrosspoolClarets]

Not a fan of Southgate at all. Look at Ramsdale and Arsenal messing about at the back against us - nearly cost them. As it will England at some point. I tend to believe keepers are there to stop goals.

Saying that though, Nick has been poor this season, Vardy’s winner was a rash decision, there have been other mistakes too. His kicking is even worse than usual.

Only just realised I thought Vardy had scored a winner - that’s how it felt at the time

Lack of edit making me look daft, not difficult at times

[karatekid]

In form players have to be picked, simple.

[warksclaret]

Most neutral followers of football would have gone with those three picked by Southgate. Its down to NIck to rediscover his form and consistency. Agree with a number on here-he has not been up to his usual best since coming back from injury

[MACCA]

World cup semi-final 2018

European finalists 2020

One thing southgate is not, is a clueless buffoon

He's made a choice, and based on form and style, its very hard to argue with it.

In spite of, not because of...

[Newcastleclaret93]

In spite of, not because of...

The most successful manager in forever.

Give your head a wobble. That is literally like saying Burnley are in the prem in spite of Dyche.

[AlargeClaret]

People forget the likes of Ramsdale ( whose been in the Eng set up for yrs) and Pickford were prodigies who were earmarked from kids as future serious talent (and both had the required “ feet” .Pope was always a low league keeper with awful feet , who grafted hard , learnt how to kick with his left as well , got a lucky break and grabbed it with both hands . His 1st ever kick at BFC went flying into the stand . He’s brilliant for us and our style and fully deserved his call ups but let’s not kid ourselves about what’s required in regard to footwork at international level .

[MACCA]

The most successful manager in forever.

Give your head a wobble. That is literally like saying Burnley are in the prem in spite of Dyche.

I disagree, we have got the strongest squad and group of English players possibly ever , whilst some of the usually stronger countries have been struggling.

We have the best set of individuals however "the manager " struggles to get the best out of them, and often plays head scratching formations and players in arrange positions.

We made 1 semi final and got beat by the first half decent team we played after basically byes.

Basically the same again this time and quite possibly the worst home nation finals performance with was it 1 or 2 shots in target in 120 minutes.

He lost us the final after getting a 1 goal head start.

But if you think that was a good management performance then I respect that, but I called what was going to happen, shame the best manager in the nations history couldnt.

I try to be balanced, and ask if Mancini was our coach in that final do we still lose it, and the answer every time is no.

[Local cricketer]

The most successful manager in forever.

Give your head a wobble. That is literally like saying Burnley are in the prem in spite of Dyche.

Sorry just repeat that claim? I’ve looked at it 4 times now and you are still claiming that Southgate is the most successful manager in forever?

Are you on drugs?

[Elizabeth]

Pope can have no complaints and I’m sure he’s focussing on improving his Burnley performances

[Newcastleclaret93]

Sorry just repeat that claim? I’ve looked at it 4 times now and you are still claiming that Southgate is the most successful manager in forever?

Are you on drugs?

Ok name me a more successful England manager in the last 50 years?

[Longtimeclaret]

Southgate is an imposter at the level he is employed
A complete failure at League level,his path to the job is related to his England playing career and his ability to appear articulate and thoughtful
As a coach he has been found wanting when it really mattered , but for the suits within the FA he is the perfect fit post Allardyce
If you read between the lines from the quotes for Sean Dyche, when he omits Tarky and Nick Pope, it doesn’t take a genius to work out that he thinks that Southgate is way above his pay grade

At best he is a Championship Manager

[MACCA]

Southgate is an imposter at the level he is employed
A complete failure at League level,his path to the job is related to his England playing career and his ability to appear articulate and thoughtful
As a coach he has been found wanting when it really mattered , but for the suits within the FA he is the perfect fit post Allardyce
If you read between the lines from the quotes for Sean Dyche, when he omits Tarky and Nick Pope, it doesn’t take a genius to work out that he thinks that Southgate is way above his pay grade

At best he is a Championship Manager

Agreed

People say we have been in a major competition semi final and final whilst he has been in charge, however you could argue a strong case with someone a bit more tactically aware or better man manager we would have been a finalist and then a winner in the same period...

I just cannot see past really poor management.
I use the term in spite of not because of, as some of the decisions he makes are baffling, and you just wonder what a really good tactician could do with arguably the best England squad, most exciting and attacking young players we have had in our history.

[Elizabeth]

The criticism of Southgate is unfair

[Newcastleclaret93]

Agreed

People say we have been in a major competition semi final and final whilst he has been in charge, however you could argue a strong case with someone a bit more tactically aware or better man manager we would have been a finalist and then a winner in the same period...

I just cannot see past really poor management.
I use the term in spite of not because of, as some of the decisions he makes are baffling, and you just wonder what a really good tactician could do with arguably the best England squad, most exciting and attacking young players we have had in our history.

Still waiting for anyone to name a more successful manager of the last 50 years for England.

People keep saying his baffling decisions, I can’t think of any.
Is it not just you and others are upset he hasn’t picked Burnley players?

[dermotdermot]

I had no idea that Tomori was English.

[Local cricketer]

Ok name me a more successful England manager in the last 50 years?

Been a successful England manager doesn’t make him one of the most successful managers ever?

[Newcastleclaret93]

Been a successful England manager doesn’t make him one of the most successful managers ever?

We were talking about England I thought it was quite clear I was referring to England managers

[Wokingclaret]

Well, another reason not to watch another dire international window

Waistcoat couldn't wait for the 1st opportunity could he.....

[bfcjg]

Pope hasn't been up to his very high standards since his injury but he will get there, if Southgate is judging solely on club form though it's unfair as Pickford hasn't been brilliant either.

[Vegas Claret]

when Pope first got called up him merited it, he's not even close to his own standard at the moment imho so was never going to be called up for these games (which are pointless anyway, U23's should win both games)

[BurnleyFC]

Probably the correct decision, as disappointed as I am for Nick.

As long as he puts the performances in for us, though, I couldn’t give a stuff about England.

[BurnleyFC]

Ok name me a more successful England manager in the last 50 years?

Big Sam. Mr 100%.

[elwaclaret]

Still waiting for anyone to name a more successful manager of the last 50 years for England.

People keep saying his baffling decisions, I can’t think of any.
Is it not just you and others are upset he hasn’t picked Burnley players?

May not have had the same quality to work with but I’d take Bobby Robson and ElTel over Southgate in every single part of the job.

[Belial]

The correct decision based on Pope's form. Plus the fact that Ramsdale has joined Arsenal gives him the 'plays for a bigger club so it's ok to choose him now' boost.

[warksclaret]

Southgate is fair in selection and has integrity. Heaton, Pope , Tarkowski, Cork, and Keane all got capped as Burnley players-maybe even Ings (cant remember if he had left us when first capped)

[Papabendi]

The real weirdness on this thread is toward Pickford. Do tell me what he did wrong during the Euros and would you honestly think in your right minds Pope would have done better?

[Wile E Coyote]

pickford is not a better keeper than pope, but southgate is blinkered like a lot of also ran type coaches. He has not got the pedigree to choose keepers properly. Its possibly a loyalty issue,but as gareth has never won a single trophy what do you expect.

[Newcastleclaret93]

pickford is not a better keeper than pope, but southgate is blinkered like a lot of also ran type coaches. He has not got the pedigree to choose keepers properly. Its possibly a loyalty issue,but as gareth has never won a single trophy what do you expect.

Next you will be saying Tarks is better than Van Dijk

Come on, pickford is another level to Pope as is Ramsdale.

[superdimitri]

Ramsdale looked good against us. Was surprising when so many here we're shocked at the money involved in his deal. He's very young for a goalkeeper and may well be Englands number one for years.

Pickford is part of the furniture and 2 years younger than Pope.

Johnstone is a bit weird but even he's younger than Pope.

I really don't think there's much in it other than age and playing out from the back.

For the record I think Pope is much better than Pickford or Johnstone at keeping the ball out of the net but also embarrassingly bad at kicking. Ramsdale has a lot to prove but at the minute looks very good despite his young age.

I'm usually realistic with how our players compare and I do think Pope is arguably the best out of the four but you can see why he's not picked. If he was either better at kicking or younger he'd be 1st choice and was looking to be first choice before anyway before injury.. so really I think we need to cut Southgate some slack.

[MACCA]

Still waiting for anyone to name a more successful manager of the last 50 years for England.

People keep saying his baffling decisions, I can’t think of any.
Is it not just you and others are upset he hasn’t picked Burnley players?

Absolutely "successful", he inherited the best English squad forever, and the best chance to write some more English football history, however IMO did no more than John Coleman or any other person in that career could have done.

Like I said, IF Mancini was managing England ( just using him as that's who was in the opposite dug out ) we would have been finalists at minimum, and then winners.
Southgate got found found out soon as a half decent team got put in front of him, who were tactically better, and the pressure was on.
He even had the benefit of being 1-0 up at HT and STILL blew it.

But fair play, he has had a bit of good fortune with the routes to this "success" and is a nice guy.
Still a poor manager that has had an will have no success in English club football, and the reason... . he wont inherit the Man City squad like he did the equivalent in international football.

We will agree to disagree though, I understand you think he is great and been successful, I think he is boring, negative and holding the team back.

[Newcastleclaret93]

Absolutely "successful", he inherited the best English squad forever, and the best chance to write some more English football history, however IMO did no more than John Coleman or any other person in that career could have done.

Like I said, IF Mancini was managing England ( just using him as that's who was in the opposite dug out ) we would have been finalists at minimum, and then winners.
Southgate got found found out soon as a half decent team got put in front of him, who were tactically better, and the pressure was on.
He even had the benefit of being 1-0 up at HT and STILL blew it.

But fair play, he has had a bit of good fortune with the routes to this "success" and is a nice guy.
Still a poor manager that has had an will have no success in English club football, and the reason... . he wont inherit the Man City squad like he did the equivalent in international football.

We will agree to disagree though, I understand you think he is great and been successful, I think he is boring, negative and holding the team back.

So what about all the managers that we had throughout the golden generation. In reality this squad is one of the youngest international squads out there. He’s working wonders and has achieved more than any other manager for a long time.

In reality Southgate is probably going to have a better career at a higher level than Dyche. I imagine the likes of Everton, Spurs etc… would prefer to sign Southgate given his success at international level.

[claretonthecoast1882]

So what about all the managers that we had throughout the golden generation. In reality this squad is one of the youngest international squads out there. He’s working wonders and has achieved more than any other manager for a long time.

In reality Southgate is probably going to have a better career at a higher level than Dyche. I imagine the likes of Everton, Spurs etc… would prefer to sign Southgate given his success at international level.

When you wrongly claimed Southgate is the most successful manager forever is there a reason you then limited it to 50 years and not forever ?

It is almost like you have been told England have had a more successful manager and then gave you more help by telling how many years it is since. When we looked clueless against mighty Scotland and Southgate was too scared of losing to try and win the game, when we took the lead against Italy and then managed 1 more shot on target in 118 minutes did you find yourself thinking well done Gareth or did you see it as a massive opportunity lost ?

[jojomk1]

Pope has looked erratic this season
Still weaker when the ball is fired at him low and he can't get his size 12's to the ball
Distribution with his kicking is way off the standard of a Prem keeper
Would not be worried if Hennessey was called in to cover

[Newcastleclaret93]

When you wrongly claimed Southgate is the most successful manager forever is there a reason you then limited it to 50 years and not forever ?

It is almost like you have been told England have had a more successful manager and then gave you more help by telling how many years it is since. When we looked clueless against mighty Scotland and Southgate was too scared of losing to try and win the game, when we took the lead against Italy and then managed 1 more shot on target in 118 minutes did you find yourself thinking well done Gareth or did you see it as a massive opportunity lost ?

A massive opportunity missed. However at the same time it was great achievement actually getting there with such a young squad.

Great experience for the squad and hopefully this bunch can push on and go the extra mile now.

Southgate has been great for England

[claretonthecoast1882]

A massive opportunity missed. However at the same time it was great achievement actually getting there with such a young squad.

Great experience for the squad and hopefully this bunch can push on and go the extra mile now.

Southgate has been great for England

You missed out the first part, why when claiming most successful manager forever have you now limited it to 50 years ?

Now you are saying he has been great, not the most successful or even successful just great ?

[Newcastleclaret93]

You missed out the first part, why when claiming most successful manager forever have you now limited it to 50 years ?

Now you are saying he has been great, not the most successful or even successful just great ?

In forever was an expression. I don’t literally mean since the dawn of time.

He is the most successful manager in at least the last 50 years probably even longer.

Do you not agree? Given we have reached something like 5 Semi finals in international football and Southgate is responsible for 2 of them.

[claretonthecoast1882]

In forever was an expression. I don’t literally mean since the dawn of time.

He is the most successful manager in at least the last 50 years probably even longer.

Do you not agree? Given we have reached something like 5 Semi finals in international football and Southgate is responsible for 2 of them.

Even longer ?

Alf Ramsey was England manager until the early 70s do you think Southgate is more successful than him ?

[warksclaret]

If anyone needs convincing that Pope is not playing at his best right now just look at the Leicester game last week. The casual leg out for Vardys first goal and the half hearted attempt to come out for the second. With the Pope of last season we would have left with all 3 points

[SalisburyClaret]

If anyone needs convincing that Pope is not playing at his best right now just look at the Leicester game last week. The casual leg out for Vardys first goal and the half hearted attempt to come out for the second. With the Pope of last season we would have left with all 3 points

I don't think anyone would give you any argument about Pope not being at his sparkling best so far this season - unfortunately, the evidence is all too clear.
The point is more about how two-faced Southgate is being saying he picks on loyalty when it suits him to use that as an excuse and saying he picks on form to justify other selections. He has some of the best players at his disposal that England have ever had, so he can't go too far wrong in his selections but even so he still manages to make a mess of it.

[Down_Rover]

Still waiting for anyone to name a more successful manager of the last 50 years for England.

People keep saying his baffling decisions, I can’t think of any.
Is it not just you and others are upset he hasn’t picked Burnley players?

Bobby Robson was easily a better manager than Southgate

He inherited a wayward squad and was pitched against all the top teams when they were much stronger than they are now.

in both world cups he was largely without Bryan Robson, his key player, but reached the quarters and semis. in one he was beaten b the hand of God and the other in a penalty shoot out v Germany.

Most importantly he was not averse to changing tactics and formation as he dis when things did not start well in Mexico and when playing Holland in the World cup.

Southgate has probably the best set of players in world football but sets up not to lose. A more adventurous manager would have won the Euros

[Rileybobs]

Hilarious that some of you don’t consider England finishing as the runner up in the European Championships a success, yet would consider Burnley finishing 17th in the league just that.

[kazza]

Regarding the best manager, Southgate has the best England squad from at least the last 35-40 years. At least. So very difficult to compare with managers of different generations. We've had England squads where Stuart Ripley has got in!

[Rileybobs]

Regarding the best manager, Southgate has the best England squad from at least the last 35-40 years. At least. So very difficult to compare with managers of different generations. We've had England squads where Stuart Ripley has got in!

We’ve had comparable squads, maybe even stronger ones in the last 35-40 years. Declan Rice and Kelvin Phillips wouldn’t have got near some of our teams of the past.

[kazza]

We’ve had comparable squads, maybe even stronger ones in the last 35-40 years. Declan Rice and Kelvin Phillips wouldn’t have got near some of our teams of the past.

I disagree. And I'm talking squad not team. I've not seen the strength in depth that we have now.

[Devils_Advocate]

Bobby Robson was easily a better manager than Southgate

He inherited a wayward squad and was pitched against all the top teams when they were much stronger than they are now.

in both world cups he was largely without Bryan Robson, his key player, but reached the quarters and semis. in one he was beaten b the hand of God and the other in a penalty shoot out v Germany.

Most importantly he was not averse to changing tactics and formation as he dis when things did not start well in Mexico and when playing Holland in the World cup.

Southgate has probably the best set of players in world football but sets up not to lose. A more adventurous manager would have won the Euros

Robsons overall competitive record for England was pretty poor. The below includes qualification and group games

Failed to qualify to '84 Euros from a group consisting of Hungary, Greece, Luxemburg and Denmark

In the whole of the '86 campaign we managed to beat Finland, Turkey, N. Ireland, Romania, Poland and Paraguay

In the whole '88 campaign we managed to beat N. Ireland, Yugoslavia, Turkey and we lost all three games in the tournement

In the whole '90 campaign we managed to beat Albania, Poland, Egypt, Belgium and Cameroon

So in 8 years and 4 competitions the only decent team we managed to beat was Belgium with the last kick of extra time