Players future

[123EasyasBFC]

Just like with many signings this season, that amount included potential add ons which were never realised. It’s why I’ve been highlighting on here all season long we won’t have spent as much as is out there.

An actual example of people believing the numbers straight out of the media and running with them this season is Maatsen. At the time it was everywhere that it was 32m. I still see people run with that now. That’s despite follow up articles from the same journo saying it was under 20, Matt Williams saying it was nowhere near 32 and ClaretTony also backing up that premise.

Gibson was a club record fee and we made a loss on him.

By your own argument then you can’t use selling Collins, Keane and gray as good sales because the fees we supposedly got for them won’t be as high because they include add ons. That’s furthering the point that we have never been good at selling players

[RVclaret]

Gibson was a club record fee and we made a loss on him.

By your own argument then you can’t use selling Collins, Keane and gray as good sales because the fees we supposedly got for them won’t be as high because they include add ons. That’s furthering the point that we have never been good at selling players

No, that’s only IF the deals included add ons and what was the base fee. Collins was reported at a minimum 21m with add ons potentially reaching 25. Keane has played loads for Everton and England so it’s highly likely his full fee was realised. We got 20m for McNeil, 17.5m for Cornet. Decent enough fees after relegation. So I can’t really agree we’ve ’never Been good’ at it.

[NewClaret]

Out of the 3 relegated clubs I think Luton will lose the least but they will need a new midfield. Sheff united have loads of out of contract players.

For me our summer is on 5 potential outgoings, muric, beyer, berge, odobert and koleosho. Those 5 will 100% have suitors but I just hope we can keep them

Yes, agree on those albeit O’Shea and Esteve more critical than Beyer in my opinion.

We need stability now and to form a core, how that will map out with the need for sales will be interesting to see.

[123EasyasBFC]

No, that’s only IF the deals included add ons and what was the base fee. Collins was reported at a minimum 21m with add ons potentially reaching 25. Keane has played loads for Everton and England so it’s highly likely his full fee was realised. We got 20m for McNeil, 17.5m for Cornet. Decent enough fees after relegation. So I can’t really agree we’ve ’never Been good’ at it.

So your not using the Collins reported fee but don’t want to use the reported fee for Gibson at 15m because it doesn’t suit your argument

[deanothedino]

Just like with many signings this season, that amount included potential add ons which were never realised. It’s why I’ve been highlighting on here all season long we won’t have spent as much as is out there.

An actual example of people believing the numbers straight out of the media and running with them this season is Maatsen. At the time it was everywhere that it was 32m. I still see people run with that now. That’s despite follow up articles from the same journo saying it was under 20, Matt Williams saying it was nowhere near 32 and ClaretTony also backing up that premise.

Looked good until the last 7 words

[123EasyasBFC]

Yes, agree on those albeit O’Shea and Esteve more critical than Beyer in my opinion.

We need stability now and to form a core, how that will map out with the need for sales will be interesting to see.

O’Shea and esteve have been very good but we are forgetting how good Beyer was last season, from his 20min cameo at Preston away we never looked back

However if we do get similar money to what we paid for Beyer then we will sell

[Elizabeth]

Selling Trafford at 21 after such a big investment is daft. He's very highly regarded in the game, and had a bad season. It happens, especially when you're thrown in the deep end without armbands. Maybe with a more stable pairing like Mee and Tarks he'd have faired better, but he should never have had the responsibility of being no.1 this year.

I'm minded of De Gea, who was written off in his first season at a similar age. And for similar reasons; not physical enough etc. Are we that short sighted that we can't imagine a world where this board is full of statements like "hes turned into a class goalkeeper, so much more confident blah blah". Whether it's players or the manager, fans have zero sense of time. Baby out with the bath water every time a bit of sh*t hits the fan. Same with Amdouni, Ramsey, Tresor and others. Maybe they get moved on, but there's potential in all of them. Now I'm not saying they all work out, but at least be open to the possibility.

Excellent post.

On Trafford I hope he goes to the Euros as number 3 goalie and starts next season for us in the Championship with Muric sold. The arguments over them have been too a big distraction and were basically simply over 2 keepers, both not good enough for the PL this season. I'm firmly of the opinion that Trafford will be good enough, Muric won't , and that we will get a big transfer out of Trafford in a season or two.

I also agree wholeheartedly with your assessment of the other potential we have and if any of them stays, some will, I'm confident we will see better performances from them in a league markedly inferior to the one we've struggled so badly in

[Woodleyclaret]

McNeil?

[taio]

Collins, cornet and gray sold not far off what we paid for them. Would release clause so that’s not us being good at selling players, Keane is the only one in there

This isn't the case at all. Some material profits against those.

[Big Vinny K]

Collins, cornet and gray sold not far off what we paid for them. Would release clause so that’s not us being good at selling players, Keane is the only one in there

Is this some kind of joke ?
We made around £25m profit on those 3 signings alone.
Plus plenty more players have already been given as further examples of good profit on this thread in addition to Keane.

[123EasyasBFC]

Is this some kind of joke ?
We made around £25m profit on those 3 signings alone.
Plus plenty more players have already been given as further examples of good profit on this thread in addition to Keane.

No we don’t
Collins 18m - sold for 21m
Cornet 13m - sold for 17m
Gray 10m - sold for 18m

[taio]

No we don’t
Collins 18m - sold for 21m
Cornet 13m - sold for 17m
Gray 10m - sold for 18m

We didn't pay £18m for Collins

[Big Vinny K]

No we don’t
Collins 18m - sold for 21m
Cornet 13m - sold for 17m
Gray 10m - sold for 18m

Collins £12m
Cornet sold for £17.5m
Gray bought for £6m with a reported £3m additional fee if we went up (though Dyche talked a lot about how exaggerated the reports were on what we paid for Gray)
We also sold him for £18.5m.
So that’s the best part of £25m profit yes.

But what point are you actually trying to make ?
Is it that we haven’t done well in the last decade from transfer fees ?
How do you think we managed to avoid making a loss under Dyche for his tenure ? Profit from the tuck shop ?

[Corway]

Interesting
Liverpool recruitment delegates have watched Trafford on a number of occasions this season and that their interest in Trafford is 'concrete'.
Would City want their first option

[123EasyasBFC]

Collins £12m
Cornet sold for £17.5m
Gray bought for £6m with a reported £3m additional fee if we went up (though Dyche talked a lot about how exaggerated the reports were on what we paid for Gray)
We also sold him for £18.5m.
So that’s the best part of £25m profit yes.

But what point are you actually trying to make ?
Is it that we haven’t done well in the last decade from transfer fees ?
How do you think we managed to avoid making a loss under Dyche for his tenure ? Profit from the tuck shop ?

We avoided making a loss under dyche because we stayed in the premier league for as long as we did.

We had a summer of buying will Norris and dale stephens that also help with the finances.

Again you are one who is using add ons with prices we paid for players but not when selling players

[123EasyasBFC]

Interesting
Liverpool recruitment delegates have watched Trafford on a number of occasions this season and that their interest in Trafford is 'concrete'.
Would City want their first option

Absolutely no chance city want their option, they wouldn’t of let him go to start with

[Big Vinny K]

We avoided making a loss under dyche because we stayed in the premier league for as long as we did.

We had a summer of buying will Norris and dale stephens that also help with the finances.

Again you are one who is using add ons with prices we paid for players but not when selling players

Maybe have a look at our audited accounts during the time we were in the premier league and you will see how many years the profits we made were down to the players sales. Without those we would have been making losses or breaking even at best in a number of those years. Not sure what your point is about the summer we bought Dale Stephens and that transfer window. Have you missed the hundreds of threads on this board about the sale of the club and what Garlick was doing in preparation of the sale ? Oh and btw our wage bill at that time was the highest in the history of the club.

I mentioned add ons for the Gray transfer - but that £3m is not in the £25m I quoted. It’s nearer to £28m if you put that £3m in.

Again I’m not sure what point you are trying to make. There’s been a number of posts on this thread that show we have made significant profits out of many players in the last few years but rather than accept the facts being put in front of you for whatever reason you keep on trying to defend some point or other. What is it exactly you are trying to say ?

[123EasyasBFC]

Maybe have a look at our audited accounts during the time we were in the premier league and you will see how many years the profits we made were down to the players sales. Without those we would have been making losses or breaking even at best in a number of those years. Not sure what your point is about the summer we bought Dale Stephens and that transfer window. Have you missed the hundreds of threads on this board about the sale of the club and what Garlick was doing in preparation of the sale ? Oh and btw our wage bill at that time was the highest in the history of the club.

I mentioned add ons for the Gray transfer - but that £3m is not in the £25m I quoted. It’s nearer to £28m if you put that £3m in.

Again I’m not sure what point you are trying to make. There’s been a number of posts on this thread that show we have made significant profits out of many players in the last few years but rather than accept the facts being put in front of you for whatever reason you keep on trying to defend some point or other. What is it exactly you are trying to say ?

You have got way to deep about this bud, it’s not that big of a deal, I don’t think we have been good in regards to selling players and referenced letting players like Vydra, Brady and hendrick leave for free and you can throw tarky in there to. For me a club like Burnley cannot let anyone under the age of 30 who is proper first team player leave for free

[ClaretPete001]

You have got way to deep about this bud, it’s not that big of a deal, I don’t think we have been good in regards to selling players and referenced letting players like Vydra, Brady and hendrick leave for free and you can throw tarky in there to. For me a club like Burnley cannot let anyone under the age of 30 who is proper first team player leave for free

I think for the last 20 years or certainly from 2004 up to Mike Garlick wanting to sell the club - you could easily argue we've been the best run small club in English football.

You can cite errors but for the most part this club has punched above it's weight.

[123EasyasBFC]

I think for the last 20 years or certainly from 2004 up to Mike Garlick wanting to sell the club - you could easily argue we've been the best run small club in English football.

You can cite errors but for the most part this club has punched above it's weight.

Being a well run club doesn’t necessarily mean we have done well at selling players in my opinion. Not deviating away from our wage bill structure and over paying for players helped. We had a coaching team who got the best out of players to.

I can think we had a well run club without being good at selling players. Whilst being well run club we did make some poor decisions in the transfer market, that doesn’t make us badly run

[Big Vinny K]

Being a well run club doesn’t necessarily mean we have done well at selling players in my opinion. Not deviating away from our wage bill structure and over paying for players helped. We had a coaching team who got the best out of players to.

I can think we had a well run club without being good at selling players. Whilst being well run club we did make some poor decisions in the transfer market, that doesn’t make us badly run

Ok put it another way.
During the period Dyche was in charge which other club in the EPL had a better net transfer spend than Burnley ?

[CoolClaret]

See I think that’s a bit overblown. Muric was worse with his feet yesterday than anything I’ve seen from Trafford all season. Trafford was in goal for the 5-0 home win against another (let’s call them top end Champ team) Sheffield United. Interestingly the comments on post match ratings from that game rate his passing as very good. As for physicality, Leicester’s keeper Hermansen is a bit slight like JT but was the best keeper in the league, and I don’t buy into the Champ being a bigger test of physicality than the Prem, which, for me, is the most physically challenging league in the world by far.

This is just b0llocks, sorry.

Easy to 'not make a mistake' with the ball at feet when you play boring/safe/slow/predictable passes most of the time, it just passes the buck elsewhere.

You clung on to JT all season and still are even now - it's quite obvious that his inclusion from day one was one of the main pitfalls of our season.

[123EasyasBFC]

Ok put it another way.
During the period Dyche was in charge which other club in the EPL had a better net transfer spend than Burnley ?

Jesus are you still at it? Do you have a problem with others having an opinion.

Net spend doesn’t mean we are good at selling players and in my opinion we haven’t been great at selling players and have let far to many leave on frees or for reduced fees

[Big Vinny K]

Jesus are you still at it? Do you have a problem with others having an opinion.

Net spend doesn’t mean we are good at selling players and in my opinion we haven’t been great at selling players and have let far to many leave on frees or for reduced fees

Still at it ?
Nobody has posted as much as you have on this board today….and most of it utter sh-ite.

I’ll leave it there though as honestly if you do not think that net spend means we have been successful at selling players (together with the long list of examples of players we have sold at huge profits)…..then I completely agree there’s not much point carrying on the debate. You crack on arguing with everyone else though on multiple threads.

[123EasyasBFC]

Still at it ?
Nobody has posted as much as you have on this board today….and most of it utter sh-ite.

I’ll leave it there though as honestly if you do not think that net spend means we have been successful at selling players (together with the long list of examples of players we have sold at huge profits)…..then I completely agree there’s not much point carrying on the debate. You crack on arguing with everyone else though on multiple threads.

You decided to argue with me for having an opinion, take a look at yourself bud

[warksclaret]

Did not go to Spurs yesterday, but reading the player scores from those that went show Foster averaged around 4 marks, with many commenting he just did not look interested. Seems to have been a familiar pattern since he returned from injury in the new year. Sensational in the first half dozen games but now lucky to get a starting spot. THe forward line for next year seems to pose a real challenge-Jay is off, Fofana returns to Chelsea, Amdouini might want to be away and Obefemi short of a miracle will probably not feature. We will be stuck with Foster as his mental issues last Summer were well documented and will put clubs off.He did not seem to enjoy playing in the Championship . By my reckoning it leaves us with Mellon and Larsen assuming he signs on permanently.Lets hope we can believe VK when he says the planning starts this week for our return to the Championship

[ClaretPete001]

Being a well run club doesn’t necessarily mean we have done well at selling players in my opinion. Not deviating away from our wage bill structure and over paying for players helped. We had a coaching team who got the best out of players to.

I can think we had a well run club without being good at selling players. Whilst being well run club we did make some poor decisions in the transfer market, that doesn’t make us badly run

We can be a well run club and make mistakes: true. We can also be reasonably good in the transfer market and make poor decisions.

But you cannot be a small club with limited finances and be bad in the transfer market but spend 7 years out of 10 in the PL.

It's not possible. The only truly objective measure of whether you are good in the transfer market is your performance on the pitch.

If you said we were good in the transfer market up to 18/19 but after that lost our way because of the buyout I would agree.

[Middle-agedClaret]

I said yesterday that my fear is we are no longer good at selling players, and may need to recruit specialists at networking with agents/selling on players. Its our biggest challenge this Summer so that some of funds can be reinvested.

Recruit specialists to help us sell players?
Mmmm…didn’t we do something similar this season to help buy players?
How did that turn out then…

[deanothedino]

Absolutely no chance city want their option, they wouldn’t of let him go to start with

They put the option in for a reason, they also didn’t put an option in the Muric deal for a reason… and it’s nothing to do with being homegrown as they both count.

[123EasyasBFC]

They put the option in for a reason, they also didn’t put an option in the Muric deal for a reason… and it’s nothing to do with being homegrown as they both count.

Almost every big club puts in buy back options on young players, there’s no chance city use the 40m buy back on Trafford.

Your right they also wouldn’t do it on muric either but after this season they would be more likely to sign muric than Trafford

[deanothedino]

Almost every big club puts in buy back options on young players, there’s no chance city use the 40m buy back on Trafford.

Your right they also wouldn’t do it on muric either but after this season they would be more likely to sign muric than Trafford

They might not but the fact there is one for him and there isn’t for Muric tells you who they think has the brighter future.

[123EasyasBFC]

They might not but the fact there is one for him and there isn’t for Muric tells you who they think has the brighter future.

Right and what does it matter what Man City think about who has a bright future or not, Liverpool put a buy back clause on Jordan ibe when he moved to Bournemouth and isn’t he playing non league now

[Newcastleclaret93]

Right and what does it matter what Man City think about who has a bright future or not, Liverpool put a buy back clause on Jordan ibe when he moved to Bournemouth and isn’t he playing non league now

Not a great example Ibe had crippling depression and numerous other mental issues.

[123EasyasBFC]

Not a great example Ibe had crippling depression and numerous other mental issues.

The point is it doesn’t matter who clubs think have potential doesn’t mean they reach it. Liverpool did the same with Brad smith that they sold to Bournemouth

[deanothedino]

Right and what does it matter what Man City think about who has a bright future or not, Liverpool put a buy back clause on Jordan ibe when he moved to Bournemouth and isn’t he playing non league now

Because they know more about football than 123EasyasBFC off up the clarets.

[Jakubclaret]

Almost every big club puts in buy back options on young players, there’s no chance city use the 40m buy back on Trafford.

Your right they also wouldn’t do it on muric either but after this season they would be more likely to sign muric than Trafford

If you lost the zero at the end of the 4 I still don't think they'd exercise it. It's the oldest trick in the book & we fell for it thinking we had the next buffon on our hands.