Weghorst

[daveisaclaret]

Think the idea we might have made a profit on the £12 million transfer fee and big wage we wasted on this lump is quite silly

[IanMcL]

https://footballleagueworld.co.uk/ajax- ... -weghorst/

[Woonderbah]

You've got a contract with Burnley?

Churlinov?

#lifts mask#.. and if it wasn't for you pesky meddling fans I'd ave got away with it

[ElectroClaret]

I'd give him to them (Ajax) for free if they take care of the remainder of his contract.

But maybe the new bloke might want him.

[Jamesy]

Think the idea we might have made a profit on the £12 million transfer fee and big wage we wasted on this lump is quite silly

Meanwhile, let’s conveniently ignore the sizeable amount of money Kompany wasted on the likes of Amdouni and Tresor and others.
Oh, and trousered a percentage of the transfer fees too via Mud Analytics.
One hundred million down the drain, Vincent Kompany cashes in again. Bordering on criminal what the big Belgian chancer did to Alan Pace.

[daveisaclaret]

Meanwhile, let’s conveniently ignore the sizeable amount of money Kompany wasted on the likes of Amdouni and Tresor and others.
Oh, and trousered a percentage of the transfer fees too via Mud Analytics.
One hundred million down the drain, Vincent Kompany cashes in again. Bordering on criminal what the big Belgian chancer did to Alan Pace.

What?

[agreenwood]

Meanwhile, let’s conveniently ignore the sizeable amount of money Kompany wasted on the likes of Amdouni and Tresor and others.
Oh, and trousered a percentage of the transfer fees too via Mud Analytics.
One hundred million down the drain, Vincent Kompany cashes in again. Bordering on criminal what the big Belgian chancer did to Alan Pace.

Well he might make some money through the courts if he reads this post.

[nil_desperandum]

Meanwhile, let’s conveniently ignore the sizeable amount of money Kompany wasted on the likes of Amdouni and Tresor and others.
Oh, and trousered a percentage of the transfer fees too via Mud Analytics.
One hundred million down the drain, Vincent Kompany cashes in again. Bordering on criminal what the big Belgian chancer did to Alan Pace.

Libel alert!!!!

[Jamesy]

Well he might make some money through the courts if he reads this post.

I doubt he will, as he doesn’t care about Burnley FC so won’t be reading this board. And I only said bordering on criminality, there is a difference.
I said right from the outset though that using Mud Analytics for our player recruitment doesn’t sit right with me. Although not illegal, our manager at the time shouldn’t have been profiting from signings. Most of them poor signings which makes it even more unpalatable.

[NewClaret]

Meanwhile, let’s conveniently ignore the sizeable amount of money Kompany wasted on the likes of Amdouni and Tresor and others.
Oh, and trousered a percentage of the transfer fees too via Mud Analytics.
One hundred million down the drain, Vincent Kompany cashes in again. Bordering on criminal what the big Belgian chancer did to Alan Pace.

[daveisaclaret]

I doubt he will, as he doesn’t care about Burnley FC so won’t be reading this board. And I only said bordering on criminality, there is a difference.
I said right from the outset though that using Mud Analytics for our player recruitment doesn’t sit right with me. Although not illegal, our manager at the time shouldn’t have been profiting from signings. Most of them poor signings which makes it even more unpalatable.

But what's it got to do with Weghorst?

[RVclaret]

I doubt he will, as he doesn’t care about Burnley FC so won’t be reading this board. And I only said bordering on criminality, there is a difference.
I said right from the outset though that using Mud Analytics for our player recruitment doesn’t sit right with me. Although not illegal, our manager at the time shouldn’t have been profiting from signings. Most of them poor signings which makes it even more unpalatable.

How do you know the manager is set to profit from signings?

[Jamesy]

But what's it got to do with Weghorst?

Whilst many are scapegoating Weghorst they are ignoring all the sh1te signings Vincent facilitated via Mud Analytics.

[Jamesy]

How do you know the manager is set to profit from signings?

Well he is the major shareholder of the company that sourced all of the signings so there may be a clue there right in front of your nose?
If you don’t think he has profited in any way, then you must be naive.

[Robbie_painter]

I’m with Jamesy on this one.It stinks.

[RVclaret]

Well he is the major shareholder of the company that sourced all of the signings so there may be a clue there right in front of your nose?
If you don’t think he has profited in any way, then you must be naive.

Hasn’t it been confirmed by CP that VK is not listed as a shareholder anymore?

The company may have been paid as an external recruitment consultant yeah, but that doesn’t mean they profit from transfers - I mean it doesn’t take a complicated algorithm and detailed analytics to pick up England u21 star James Trafford from Man City does it?

[Jamesy]

Hasn’t it been confirmed by CP that VK is not listed as a shareholder anymore?

The company may have been paid as an external recruitment consultant yeah, but that doesn’t mean they profit from transfers - I mean it doesn’t take a complicated algorithm and detailed analytics to pick up England u21 star James Trafford from Man City does it?

Of course it doesn’t, however my understanding is that all transfers last season were facilitated by Mud Analytics.
If you know any different please let us have the evidence.

[bfcjg]

https://find-and-update.company-informa ... ng-history
Kompany is a director of MUD Analytical, perhaps some of the accountants on here could check out the sort of money they are making ?

[Jamesy]

And I think you will find he is still very much a shareholder.

[AfloatinClaret]

Of course it doesn’t, however my understanding is that all transfers last season were facilitated by Mud Analytics.
If you know any different please let us have the evidence.

Not wishing to enter the debate nor indeed knowing enough about the facts to do so, but this post smacks of double standards: Nobody should contradict your 'understanding' without providing evidence; is your own 'understanding'' evidentially based?

[Jamesy]

Not wishing to enter the debate nor indeed knowing enough about the facts to do so, but this post smacks of double standards: Nobody should contradict your 'understanding' without providing evidence; is your own 'understanding'' evidentially based?

Please tell me just how the post smacks of double standards?

[Rileybobs]

I thought I read on here that there were accounts showing that MUD had recorded minimal revenue, which would indicate to me that any revenue generated would be a commission paid on future sales of players identified by the company. This was why I was concerned about Kompany’s conflict of interest.

[NewClaret]

And I think you will find he is still very much a shareholder.

That actually means he’s a director. You don’t have to be a shareholder to be a director.

[NewClaret]

I thought I read on here that there were accounts showing that MUD had recorded minimal revenue, which would indicate to me that any revenue generated would be a commission paid on future sales of players identified by the company. This was why I was concerned about Kompany’s conflict of interest.

Yes, it was small numbers although not much from can tell from micro accounts (but micro accounts are themselves a proof there is not much money running through the company).

… Or they just sell a software package to the club and receive quite a minimal fee for licensing the software?

I’m pretty sure Kompany stood to benefit from player sales while he was under contract here but not via MUD analytics.

[RVclaret]

Of course it doesn’t, however my understanding is that all transfers last season were facilitated by Mud Analytics.
If you know any different please let us have the evidence.

First, what evidence do you have that all transfers were facilitated by MUD? When you say facilitated what exactly are you suggesting? What actually is MUD analytics?

Are we saying MUD identified Sander Berge and Nathan Redmond? As well as a guy who just recorded the most assists in Europe and was linked with RB Leipzig, West Ham, Palace and Napoli (Mike Tresor)?

[Rileybobs]

I’m pretty sure Kompany stood to benefit from player sales while he was under contract here but not via MUD analytics.

How would such a mechanism work, do you mean a bonus paid on player sales? I think this is far less likely than BFC paying a commission to the analytics company as a percentage of future sales. Otherwise, what are the other shareholders of MUD gaining from this?

[Swizzlestick]

And I think you will find he is still very much a shareholder.

These are directors, not necessarily shareholders.

You'll have to look at last updated Confirmation Statement or the Annual Return (RIP) for the shareholder info.

[AfloatinClaret]

Please tell me just how the post smacks of double standards?

I thought my post detailed precisely how, apparently not. I'm not sure how I can explain it in words of just one syllable, nor competent enough on the phone to draw pictures to explain it for you, so I'll move on.

[Rileybobs]

First, what evidence do you have that all transfers were facilitated by MUD? When you say facilitated what exactly are you suggesting? What actually is MUD analytics?

Are we saying MUD identified Sander Berge and Nathan Redmond? As well as a guy who just recorded the most assists in Europe and was linked with RB Leipzig, West Ham, Palace and Napoli (Mike Tresor)?

I’m pretty sure the vast majortiy of players signed for Premier League clubs are known by these clubs - be that Sander Berge or Luca Koleosho. The analytics firm will be used to identify appropriate players to suit the club’s model.

[RVclaret]

I’m pretty sure the vast majortiy of players signed for Premier League clubs are known by these clubs - be that Sander Berge or Luca Koleosho. The analytics firm will be used to identify appropriate players to suit the club’s model.

The club also use StatsBomb which is a data/analytics company used by many others. So who really knows what our structure and process was.

I’ll wait to see what evidence Jamesy has that every single transfer was facilitated by MUD.

[Jamesy]

That actually means he’s a director. You don’t have to be a shareholder to be a director.

If you want to spend ten minutes on Companies House and follow the trail of all the associated businesses, you will see he is a major shareholder. It is long winded but you will see if you care to look properly.

[Jamesy]

The club also use StatsBomb which is a data/analytics company used by many others. So who really knows what our structure and process was.

I’ll wait to see what evidence Jamesy has that every single transfer was facilitated by MUD.

I don’t have evidence that EVERY SINGLE transfer was facilitated by MUD. However, I do know that they were responsible for our player recruitment last season which was well documented on this board. And I do know that Vincent Kompany is a Director and Shareholder of said business.

[Rileybobs]

The club also use StatsBomb which is a data/analytics company used by many others. So who really knows what our structure and process was.

I’ll wait to see what evidence Jamesy has that every single transfer was facilitated by MUD.

Yes, don’t mean to step into your debate with Jamesy, but pointing out that we won’t use an analytics company to just find players that nobody is aware of - because in this day and age, and at PL level those players will be extremely rare.

In terms of evidence, this will likely be hard to come by. But I would be very confident that Kompany, through his analytics company, will be set to gain financially from signings made by Burnley, if he hasn’t already.

[Jamesy]

I thought my post detailed precisely how, apparently not. I'm not sure how I can explain it in words of just one syllable, nor competent enough on the phone to draw pictures to explain it for you, so I'll move on.

Yes please do.

[RVclaret]

I don’t have evidence that EVERY SINGLE transfer was facilitated by MUD. However, I do know that they were responsible for our player recruitment last season which was well documented on this board. And I do know that Vincent Kompany is a Director and Shareholder of said business.

How do you know they were responsible?

There seems to be a real lack of knowledge of who they are and what they do on here. And you are speaking in facts despite not being able to answer questions, while asking me for evidence but not providing any of your own (surely you aren’t using ‘well documented on here’ as evidence?).

Yes, don’t mean to step into your debate with Jamesy, but pointing out that we won’t use an analytics company to just find players that nobody is aware of - because in this day and age, and at PL level those players will be extremely rare.

In terms of evidence, this will likely be hard to come by. But I would be very confident that Kompany, through his analytics company, will be set to gain financially from signings made by Burnley, if he hasn’t already.

I would expect an external recruitment consultant company to be there to search for the ‘hidden gems’ to be honest. I’d probably accept the likes of Koleosho and Odobert but that’s about it. Like I said the club already use StatsBomb for technical analysts. I personally can’t see how or why Kompany makes money from the club selling James Trafford and Nathan Redmond, to name a couple.

[NewClaret]

How would such a mechanism work, do you mean a bonus paid on player sales? I think this is far less likely than BFC paying a commission to the analytics company as a percentage of future sales. Otherwise, what are the other shareholders of MUD gaining from this?

A bonus would be one method, just as there will be incentives for wins, promotion, etc - it’s plausible there were incentives for success in the transfer market. But there are other ways such as share options granted on achieving transfer profits, etc.

As I understand, MUD analytics is just a data and analytics platform that the club buy, I very much doubt we write them in to a commission on who we chose to buy from the data it provides.

Either way, we’ll know soon because if they file micro accounts again we’ll know they’re not really actually making that much money in the scheme of things.

[NewClaret]

If you want to spend ten minutes on Companies House and follow the trail of all the associated businesses, you will see he is a major shareholder. It is long winded but you will see if you care to look properly.

Could you save me the bother and just tell me how many shares he has in MUD (or its parent companies) if you’ve already done the research?

[aggi]

How do you know the manager is set to profit from signings?

I'm willing to bet that within about 5 years, even though there will never be any evidence, loads of people will be repeating this as gospel.

[aggi]

Could you save me the bother and just tell me how many shares he has in MUD (or its parent companies) if you’ve already done the research?

Kompany is the major shareholder. I can't remember off the top of my head but it might be 75% or so.

[dougcollins]

So what about this Weghorst bloke?

[Rileybobs]

I'm willing to bet that within about 5 years, even though there will never be any evidence, loads of people will be repeating this as gospel.

Do you not think that Kompany will profit if signings facilitated by MUD are sold for a profit by BFC?

I’m not going to say this has or will happen as gospel, just that I’m very confident that it will be the case. Otherwise, how else is VK benefiting from owning an analytics company that doesn’t appear to pay him a salary?

[Jamesy]

How do you know they were responsible?

There seems to be a real lack of knowledge of who they are and what they do on here. And you are speaking in facts despite not being able to answer questions, while asking me for evidence but not providing any of your own (surely you aren’t using ‘well documented on here’ as evidence?).


I would expect an external recruitment consultant company to be there to search for the ‘hidden gems’ to be honest. I’d probably accept the likes of Koleosho and Odobert but that’s about it. Like I said the club already use StatsBomb for technical analysts. I personally can’t see how or why Kompany makes money from the club selling James Trafford and Nathan Redmond, to name a couple.

Without trawling back through the multiple threads it is widely known that we used Mud for player recruitment last season. If you don’t think this was the case then you are definitely in the minority or are just arguing for arguments sake.
Furthermore, do you really believe that Kompany as a Director and Shareholder isn’t benefiting financially from Mud recruitment’s involvement with Burnley Football Club?

[BurnleyFC]

And I think you will find he is still very much a shareholder.

That’s a different Vincent Kompany.

The Vincent Kompany you’re on about’s address is:

FC Bayern München
Säbener Straße 51-57
München
Deutschland

[RVclaret]

Without trawling back through the multiple threads it is widely known that we used Mud for player recruitment last season. If you don’t think this was the case then you are definitely in the minority or are just arguing for arguments sake.
Furthermore, do you really believe that Kompany as a Director and Shareholder isn’t benefiting financially from Mud recruitment’s involvement with Burnley Football Club?

I just did a quick search and ‘blatherwickstattoo’ started a thread saying it, this is a poster who quite frequently posts absolute sh1te on here with his ‘itk’ comments. Typically of this board most on that thread ran with it. I’m not accepting this as it being ‘widely known’ and ‘evidence’ that ‘all transfers were facilitated using MUD’.

The problem I’m having here is that no one is able to explain to me, and I can’t find online anywhere, what MUD is. In fact, the only interview with co-founder Lee Mooney points towards analytics being done on a clubs performance vs spend, rather than recruitment.

https://trainingground.guru/articles/le ... ridiculous

Their website/app just says ‘Making unbiased decisions’. Is it possible MUD is an analytics package used for training ground / match performance analytics to optimise performance? Of course I’m also open to it being used in recruitment but the club already have StatsBomb which is typically used in that process.

[Jamesy]

Could you save me the bother and just tell me how many shares he has in MUD (or its parent companies) if you’ve already done the research?

No I won’t save you the bother. You are the argumentative doubting one. I’ve told you where to look. If you care to bother and take the time you will eventually find the answer.

[NewClaret]

No I won’t save you the bother. You are the argumentative doubting one. I’ve told you where to look. If you care to bother and take the time you will eventually find the answer.

I don’t really care that much, that’s the point, but aggi has kindly answered the question from memory.

[RVclaret]

So after a bit more digging on here and LinkedIn it does seem the club & Mud employed Marc Boixasa as international technical scout which would suggest Mud was at least part of recruitment.

But still, it doesn’t provide evidence Mud facilitated every single transfer (as stated) or that Kompany will definitely profit off signings.

This was a post CP made a month or two ago:

Must say I am interested why this is an issue for some now, It wasn't any other time I brought it up - even when I speculated about the potential for the club to be very deeply reliant on Kompany's business empire. Since that time all of Kompany's business interests have filed accounts that overlap his first year at our club.

I will repeat - there is no evidence currently available that the club are allowing Kompany's business to profit from them

[NewClaret]

Kompany is the major shareholder. I can't remember off the top of my head but it might be 75% or so.

That surprises me, mainly since it’s clear that Lee Mooney is the brains behind MUD so if he were not the main shareholder it can only really mean there was big up front investment required (perhaps to build the platform). It makes me think even more that it’s just a data/analytics platform.

[aggi]

Do you not think that Kompany will profit if signings facilitated by MUD are sold for a profit by BFC?

I’m not going to say this has or will happen as gospel, just that I’m very confident that it will be the case. Otherwise, how else is VK benefiting from owning an analytics company that doesn’t appear to pay him a salary?

It's possible, doesn't strike me as that likely. That kind of thing gets overly complicated very quickly which is why it tends to not happen.

Personally my guess would be that they're on a flat fee and Kompany hopes to make a decent return by selling the company on at some point.

[Jamesy]

I don’t really care that much, that’s the point, but aggi has kindly answered the question from memory.

So you are satisfied with aggi’s memory then? You don’t require any further evidence?