Children in Need

[Sheedyclaret]

Celebrities shouldn't be paid for doing charitable work even if it is promoting the exposure. It's contradicting the essence of the cause in my view.

I’m not talking about the celebrities being paid the ceo of children in need is on 160k a year absolutely staggering seen reports the average salary is 47k ludicrous

[Sheedyclaret]

Which wage bill?

They run themselves like a company the wage bill is around 6 million the ceo pays himself 160k annually

[Jakubclaret]

I’m not talking about the celebrities being paid the ceo of children in need is on 160k a year absolutely staggering seen reports the average salary is 47k ludicrous

I know all this. I'm suggesting that anybody representing any charity in any shape or form shouldn't be getting paid for doing so.

[Rileybobs]

I know all this. I'm suggesting that anybody representing any charity in any shape or form shouldn't be getting paid for doing so.

Ridiculous suggestion.

[Jakubclaret]

Ridiculous suggestion.

Why?

[bfcmik]

I know all this. I'm suggesting that anybody representing any charity in any shape or form shouldn't be getting paid for doing so.

This is a multi-million £ organisation. It needs someone with the appropriate skills to manage the team who collect the donations, review the tens of thousands of applications for funds, determine how much each successful application is worth, and then disperse the grants and monitor outcomes. There are simply not enough volunteers of the right quality and calibre to do these FULL TIME jobs.

In fact most charitable causes suffer from a lack of volunteers, especially when it comes to getting their hands dirty doing actual work rather than just talking about it!

Just looked on Google and at least 95% of all income is used for grants. Less than 5% organisation costs, although they do use the grant aid and licencing fees to balance the burden. <5% is a very good number!

[Row x]

They run themselves like a company the wage bill is around 6 million the ceo pays himself 160k annually

I thought you meant paddy Mc

Most charities have CEOs on big money, much more than those on children in need. And full time staff tend to get paid.

[Row x]

I know all this. I'm suggesting that anybody representing any charity in any shape or form shouldn't be getting paid for doing so.

Pick any big charity, and look how much they spend in wages,
Save the children
Red Cross
Prince's trust
Save the whales etc etc

[Dark Cloud]

I know all this. I'm suggesting that anybody representing any charity in any shape or form shouldn't be getting paid for doing so.

Unfortunately it really doesn't work like that and hasn't for many years now. As already mentioned, it's definitely a business. A few years ago a lady I knew was high up in the regional structure of Age UK. It was her job and actually her career. She was extremely well paid and that salary and the salaries of all those working under her was extracted from the charitable donations which the public made. People can have extremely good careers working in the "charitable sector". Even those (usually chatty, young) people who approach you in town centres getting you to sign up for donations to a myriad of charities aren't doing it because they love it. It's their job and they're getting paid a chunk of whatever you agree to donate. Large charities could never function with hundreds and hundreds of staff who were all simply volunteers (sadly).

[Jakubclaret]

Unfortunately it really doesn't work like that and hasn't for many years now. As already mentioned, it's definitely a business. A few years ago a lady I knew was high up in the regional structure of Age UK. It was her job and actually her career. She was extremely well paid and that salary and the salaries of all those working under her was extracted from the charitable donations which the public made. People can have extremely good careers working in the "charitable sector". Even those (usually chatty, young) people who approach you in town centres getting you to sign up for donations to a myriad of charities aren't doing it because they love it. It's their job and they're getting paid a chunk of whatever you agree to donate. Large charities could never function with hundreds and hundreds of staff who were all simply volunteers (sadly).

I know all this. As I've already said charity should exactly be charity & 100% should be ploughed into the cause & distributed accordingly. The meaning of a charity to me suggests some sort of a worthwhile cause I can subscribe & endear myself to. I'm fully aware charities are businesses with paid employees but that doesn't stop me disagreeing with that fact & aligning myself with the notion that charities should be run centred on the policy that everything received goes towards helping that independent cause in its entirety.

[taio]

I know all this. As I've already said charity should exactly be charity & 100% should be ploughed into the cause & distributed accordingly. The meaning of a charity to me suggests some sort of a worthwhile cause I can subscribe & endear myself to. I'm fully aware charities are businesses with paid employees but that doesn't stop me disagreeing with that fact & aligning myself with the notion that charities should be run centred on the policy that everything received goes towards helping that independent cause in its entirety.

The fact that charities operate with paid staff should tell you that they would not be effective or sustainable without them. Take Pendleside Hospice, for example, which relies on paid staff, along with volunteers, to deliver their services and raise much needed funding.

[Jakubclaret]

The fact that charities operate with paid staff should tell you that they would not be effective or sustainable without them. Take Pendleside Hospice, for example, which relies on paid staff, along with volunteers, to deliver their services and raise much needed funding.

Have experiments ever been carried out on a like for like basis comparing the 2 entities or are we just accepting the norm is more successful. I don't wish to get into a argument about this because we won't change each others mind - charities to me should exactly be that & not some offshoot where somebody else can profiteer. Money raised should go towards the intended cause on a 100% basis.

[taio]

Have experiments ever been carried out on a like for like basis comparing the 2 entities or are we just accepting the norm is more successful. I don't wish to get into a argument about this because we won't change each others mind - charities to me should exactly be that & not some offshoot where somebody else can profiteer. Money raised should go towards the intended cause on a 100% basis.

A hospice couldn't function without paying nurses and healthcare assistants to provide end of life care.

[Jakubclaret]

A hospice couldn't function without paying nurses and healthcare assistants to provide end of life care.

It could quite easily. You are essentially answering your own question with the end of life care. I'd certainly trust a close family member with the task of administering morphine & effectively greeting & meeting members of the family & assisting with other duties.

[Row x]

Have experiments ever been carried out on a like for like basis comparing the 2 entities or are we just accepting the norm is more successful. I don't wish to get into a argument about this because we won't change each others mind - charities to me should exactly be that & not some offshoot where somebody else can profiteer. Money raised should go towards the intended cause on a 100% basis.

In which case charities would not exist, and no help for those in needs would be available
You really have no idea about the real world

[taio]

It could quite easily. You are essentially answering your own question with the end of life care. I'd certainly trust a close family member with the task of administering morphine & effectively greeting & meeting members of the family & assisting with other duties.

Absolute complete and utter rubbish. Imagine thinking family members are skilled to provide palliative care assessment, advance care planning and end of life medication. It's like you go out of your way to write total ******** on here.

[Row x]

It could quite easily. You are essentially answering your own question with the end of life care. I'd certainly trust a close family member with the task of administering morphine & effectively greeting & meeting members of the family & assisting with other duties.

Is that an untrained family member?

[Jakubclaret]

Absolute complete and utter rubbish. Imagine thinking family members are skilled to provide palliative care assessment, advance care planning and end of life medication. It's like you go out of your way to write total ******** on here.

Close family members are perfectly positioned with sensitive investment. I've known people assisting Macmillan nurses.

[taio]

Close family members are perfectly positioned with sensitive investment. I've known people assisting Macmillan nurses.

Assisting paid nurses. Exactly.

[Jakubclaret]

Assisting paid nurses. Exactly.

Close family members would be perfectly capable. More often than not if you are living & caring for somebody for years you are well familiar with the task in hand & know about somebody's particular needs & illness.

[taio]

Close family members would be perfectly capable. More often than not if you are living & caring for somebody for years you are well familiar with the task in hand & know about somebody's particular needs & illness.

Family members typically don't have the clinical skills. That's why we have doctors and nurses.

[Jakubclaret]

Family members typically don't have the clinical skills. That's why we have doctors and nurses.

Hospices are mainly about making everybody as comfortable as possible. You are resigned more or less to a certain outcome.

[taio]

Hospices are mainly about making everybody as comfortable as possible. You are resigned more or less to a certain outcome.

Through medication that can only be prescribed and administered by a clinician as required by the law.

[Jakubclaret]

Through medication that can only be prescribed and administered by a clinician as required by the law.

Yes that's the stumbling block. But apart from that there's no real reason why the family members couldn't be left to it. You can easily show somebody how to insert a syringe & become meds trained.

[taio]

Yes that's the stumbling block. But apart from that there's no real reason why the family members couldn't be left to it. You can easily show somebody how to insert a syringe & become meds trained.

No you couldn't. And more significantly a family member doesn't have the knowledge, training or skills to prescribe the medication to be administered.

[Jakubclaret]

No you couldn't. And more significantly a family member doesn't have the knowledge, training or skills to prescribe the medication to be administered.

Support workers are left to it after an afternoons induction I've done it! I was dishing out diazepam & alsorts after just 2 hours in a classroom.

[taio]

Support workers are left to it after an afternoons induction I've done it! I was dishing out diazepam & alsorts after just 2 hours in a classroom.

That's not prescribing

[Jakubclaret]

That's not prescribing

The people in hospices will already be on existing medication.

[taio]

The people in hospices will already be on existing medication.

That's nonsense too. And by the way hospices don't just provide end of life and palliative care actually inside a hospice.

[Jakubclaret]

That's nonsense too. And by the way hospices don't just provide end of life and palliative care actually inside a hospice.

If you don't believe that close family members aren't knowledgeable or well equipped to provide the needs after looking after the poorly 1s for years there's little point in discussing this further.

[Row x]

Support workers are left to it after an afternoons induction I've done it! I was dishing out diazepam & alsorts after just 2 hours in a classroom.

God help those people
I wouldn't trust you with an aspirin, never mind anything else.

[Burnley1989]

And what about if they have a full time job and are unable to be 24/7 care? It's about making the last weeks/months of their life as comfortable as possible and taking as much stress as possible away from their close ones

[taio]

If you don't believe that close family members aren't knowledgeable or well equipped to provide the needs after looking after the poorly 1s for years there's little point in discussing this further.

Carers and family members play important role obviously. But not without clinicians. You think that clinicians aren't needed. I think they play the most crucial role along with family members etc. What you have suggested isn't legal for a start for good reason. So there's little point in discussing this further because you couldn't be any more wrong, as per the law.

[Burnley1989]

Carers and family members play important role obviously. But not without clinicians. You think that clinicians aren't needed. I think they play the most crucial role along with family members etc. What you have suggested isn't legal for a start for good reason. So there's little point in discussing this further because you couldn't be any more wrong, as per the law.

But he ALWAYS knows best, what do you mean?

[Rileybobs]

Why?

Because how is it realistic to expect people to work full time jobs without a salary?

[Rileybobs]

You’ve had a mare, Jakub. Sometimes it’s better, and less embarrassing, to admit you’re wrong.

[mdd2]

I did my several years as VC of a small medical charity for £0
and rightly so as it was a part time role about 1-2 hr/week

[Jakubclaret]

You’ve had a mare, Jakub. Sometimes it’s better, and less embarrassing, to admit you’re wrong.

I admitted it's not possible because certain people have to be professionally competent to prescribe medication. I'm still of the opinion if it wasn't law there wouldn't be any obstacles in preventing people from independently caring for their loved ones providing some degree of basic medical training was undertaken prior to going solo.

[Leisure]

Because how is it realistic to expect people to work full time jobs without a salary?

Still waiting to read Jakub's response to this?

[taio]

I admitted it's not possible because certain people have to be professionally competent to prescribe medication. I'm still of the opinion if it wasn't law there wouldn't be any obstacles in preventing people from independently caring for their loved ones providing some degree of basic medical training was undertaken prior to going solo.

You are a fool if you think those who are sadly at end of life don't have complex health and care plans and needs that can be provided without clinical input.

[Jakubclaret]

You are a fool if you think those who are sadly at end of life don't have complex health and care plans and needs that can be provided without clinical input.

The main objective is to make the patient as comfortable as possible first & foremost. In a hospice type setting as you insist on referencing it's not a case of recovery more a case of managing the inevitable. It's remiss to undermine the importance the loved 1s can provide in the final days.

[taio]

The main objective is to make the patient as comfortable as possible first & foremost. In a hospice type setting as you insist on referencing it's not a case of recovery more a case of managing the inevitable. It's remiss to undermine the importance the loved 1s can provide in the final days.

Making them comfortable through skilled clinical intervention. There is no more important time than getting someone's health care right when they are dying. I've not once undermined the importance of loved ones - not once - it's you who thinks such situations can be managed without clinical input. Now, tell me where - just one reference will do - I have undermined the importance of family. You are embarrassingly clueless and it's there for all to see.

[Jakubclaret]

Making them comfortable through skilled clinical intervention. There is no more important time than getting someone's health care right when they are dying. I've not once undermined the importance of loved ones - not once - it's you who thinks such situations can be managed without clinical input. Now, tell me where - just one reference will do - I have undermined the importance of family. You are embarrassingly clueless and it's there for all to see.

I think it's more important for the loved 1s to be nearby & in total control offering sips of water etc. The impression I'm getting from you is that you draw more preference/importance into stricken gravely people being pumped full of drugs so they don't know what day it is. I think that's where we differ. Good evening.

[Rileybobs]

Got to love the Jakub ‘good evening’ mic drop.

[Row x]

I think it's more important for the loved 1s to be nearby & in total control offering sips of water etc. The impression I'm getting from you is that you draw more preference/importance into stricken gravely people being pumped full of drugs so they don't know what day it is. I think that's where we differ. Good evening.

Make your mind up, are loved ones giving sips of water, or shots of morphine, you're jumping all over the place

[ClaretAL]

Wow, this has to be in the top 5 of all that’s bad in putting it out there. Same posters as always.

[Row x]

Still waiting to read Jakub's response to this?

Aren't we all, how sad are we

[Stalbansclaret]

Just read this thread and think Jakubclarets suggestion that all charitable causes should operate with no paid employees is, in a strong field, the single most ridiculous opinion I have ever read on here. Genuinely astonishing.

[ecc]

Just read this thread and think Jakubclarets suggestion that all charitable causes should operate with no paid employees is, in a strong field, the single most ridiculous opinion I have ever read on here. Genuinely astonishing.

Yes, it's a major contender, I have to agree.

His ideas on volunteer-only hospices are rather frightening.

I guess he'd be up for Charles Bronson replacing the GMP.

[Swizzlestick]

Visions of Auntie Margaret dishing out jabs of super strong opiates to all and sundry while doing the Take A Break word search.