Well done Huddersfield

[Quickenthetempo]

Affordable pricing for fans. People on Burnley messageboards have said for years the Bradford way isn't sustainable but it has been and keeps going.

[Sidney1st]

It's only sustainable if a sensible business model is followed.

IF clubs are able to do something similar to what we were/are doing with wages and transfer fees then well done to them.

[claretdom]

It isn't sustainable long term, hence why Bradford with such huge crowds have spent the last 12 years in the bottom 2 divisions unable to sign decent players due to having a reduced budget.

[Sidney1st]

Decent players can be signed though without need to throw a fortune at it.

It does require decent scouting though.

[jlup1980]

It's only sustainable until they hit a bump in the road and suddenly need to put the prices up to £350+. At that point the fair weather fans disappear and you're left with your initial season ticket fan base at best. Fair play to them, but it's not a long term plan; they're just cashing in on their first successful season in many a year!

[Dyched]

Fantastic for Huddersfield fans

Why'd do people need to have a dig at clubs who try to do things for their fans. Far too many Burnley fans are on their high horses over anything to do with football.

[Diesel]

How big does a horse need to be before it becomes a 'high' one?

[Dyched]

Bigger than a small one obviously

[Quickenthetempo]

It isn't sustainable long term, hence why Bradford with such huge crowds have spent the last 12 years in the bottom 2 divisions unable to sign decent players due to having a reduced budget.

Where would you expect Bradford to be in the league?

Would they be in the premier league on 10k crowds paying £30 a ticket?

[Quicknick]

Bradford's crowds have only been 'huge' since they started charging next to nothing for season tickets. Before that, they were small.

[claretdom]

Above Burton ? On a par with Preston, Barnsley, Brentford etc

I would say all of those are reasonable, wouldn't you ?


There is the other scenario too, you are in the championship and you get roughly 5m per year tv money so you slash prices to £200 and it looks great. You get relegated and the 5m tv money per year becomes something like 100k per year which it was recently, the club look at income and think we can't run at these prices so they will have to be increased, first comment would be how a fan is being charged more now they are in a lower league.

[Lancasterclaret]

It an very good attempt to capitalise on their excellent season.

Its the same issues as all clubs of this size (inc us btw) have, just how many more fans are going to make the commitment to go?

Is it going to be enough to make it worthwhile?

Are they being run by the chairman at a loss to cover this?

[Quickenthetempo]

Bradford's crowds have only been 'huge' since they started charging next to nothing for season tickets. Before that, they were small.

Apart from the premier league and maybe their promotion season, but that proves it's working.

On a side note the City centre of Bradford has benefited massively from the extra gates for trade. So it should be encouraged by local councils, even supported.

[Quickenthetempo]

Above Burton ? On a par with Preston, Barnsley, Brentford etc

I would say all of those are reasonable, wouldn't you ?


There is the other scenario too, you are in the championship and you get roughly 5m per year tv money so you slash prices to £200 and it looks great. You get relegated and the 5m tv money per year becomes something like 100k per year which it was recently, the club look at income and think we can't run at these prices so they will have to be increased, first comment would be how a fan is being charged more now they are in a lower league.

Football clubs bob up and down.

Newcastle dropped their prices 10% on relegation but I don't think they're putting them back up on promotion.

Burnley are seeing the benefit of the free child places it has had for a few years. You need to attract fans to keep coming back. One off gimmicks don't work.

[Goobs]

Bigger than a small one obviously

An average sized horse would be bigger than a small one but it doesn't necessarily mean it is a high one!

[Goobs]

Anyway I feel we may have wandered off topic here. More suited to a Rovers message board.

[Devils_Advocate]

Above Burton ? On a par with Preston, Barnsley, Brentford etc

I would say all of those are reasonable, wouldn't you ?


There is the other scenario too, you are in the championship and you get roughly 5m per year tv money so you slash prices to £200 and it looks great. You get relegated and the 5m tv money per year becomes something like 100k per year which it was recently, the club look at income and think we can't run at these prices so they will have to be increased, first comment would be how a fan is being charged more now they are in a lower league.

In post war football Bradford have only spent 13 seasons in the top two tiers and nearly half of them was due to Richmond chucking money at it and nearly killing the club. What Bradford is doing is great but where it could have limitations and become restrictive is if they mirrored our success under Dyche as that's when they would really lose out on the financial gains of being top end championship/premier league club. As it stands the club runs brilliantly for both fans and club and the last 5 years has seen them have some amazing times probably only bettered by us and Bournemouth if you exclude the big boys

[Cheshireclaret]

I remember when I was at University in Nottingham in the late 90's and when they were relegated to the old First Division in 1997, they actually put prices up. Their rationale was that they expected the team to start winning games and achieve promotion and, hence, fans would flock back. It ultimately paid off, but it was certainly a risk!

[Man of Kent]

An average sized horse would be bigger than a small one but it doesn't necessarily mean it is a high one!

The proposed White Horse of Kent, due to be 'built' at Ebbsfleet, is pretty big and surely could be described as high!

[Claretforever]

It's only of benefit to club's who have the appropriate unused ground capacity. Burnley are currently selling 97% of the home areas, so we wouldn't gain anything from reducing prices.

If we has 26-28,000 capacity ground (I'd argue we'd be averaging 2-3K more anyway), then it would be worth doing, the same as if we went down and dropped back to 12-13,000 crowds.

[Hipper]

Last season Huddersfield averaged attendance was 12,600. This season it's over 20,000.

Category A games are £30. They seem to have 15,000 season ticket holders and the prices for next season represent a £20 increase from this season. They may alter the prices if they get promotion. Ground capacity is 24,500.

[Diesel]

Bigger than a small one obviously

Surely the horse would be a 'low' horse rather than a 'small' one, in this scenario?

[ClaretTony]

Huddersfield tried it once before and it cost the owner a fortune. If they win promotion then it is not a problem to them, if not then they will be losing money.

Suggestions that it is sustainable and quoting Bradford City is, as some have side, very wide of the mark. It's been sustainable for them in Leagues One & Two where they've now been since 2004. Will be interesting again to see how they would manage things if they win promotion.

[MrTopTier]

These are Bradford's prices for 2017/18.

[Walt]

If Huddersfield don't go up and they then maintain promotion challenges on those prices then good luck to them. I'd suggest they won't.

As Tony said if they go up ticket prices aren't an issue.

To an extent you have to look on in admiration as they're giving fans fantastic value, then comes a time when they possibly have to go up significantly, potentially still in Championship or even lower. The fans would soon be moaning should that occur. Huddersfield have done remarkably well this season but they're in a very unforgiving division and it could easily go pear shaped next season.

[DCWat]

Apart from the premier league and maybe their promotion season, but that proves it's working.

On a side note the City centre of Bradford has benefited massively from the extra gates for trade. So it should be encouraged by local councils, even supported.

What evidence is there of this, Quickenthetempo? Is this just an assumption that the extra fans are spending in North Parade and the tunnels?

There are definite improvements in Bradford with the shopping centre, North Parade and the tunnels but outside of this, there are more retail units sat empty than ever before.

[BigRedrose]

Surely the only example we need to prove the model of cheap season tickets is unsustainable is down the road at ewood?

[Quickenthetempo]

What evidence is there of this, Quickenthetempo? Is this just an assumption that the extra fans are spending in North Parade and the tunnels?

There are definite improvements in Bradford with the shopping centre, North Parade and the tunnels but outside of this, there are more retail units sat empty than ever before.

My brother in law has the new music venue just off North Parade The Underground. I was in the platform bar last week (the upstairs bar) listening to a trader possibly from North Parade talking about how the football crowds had been a massive boost for the area.

[DCWat]

I've not been in there yet - North Parade itself is a great night out. It's about time Bradford had some decent venues.

Wasnt questioning what you were saying by the way, just curious.

[Quickenthetempo]

Yeah I went out round North Parade on a Friday night last year and it was very busy. Good to see.

Get yourself in they have some very good bands on. I didn't take it the wrong way it's fine.

[Royboyclaret]

A really interesting story developing at Huddersfield with Dean Hoyle, in my opinion, pinning all his hopes on promotion in either this season or next. The season ticket prices (at around £8 per game for adults) will be fine IF they achieve their objective but if they fail to win promotion in the near future then financial problems will hit hard.

A bit like us, if they made it to the PL, their matchday income will represent no more than 8% of their total income. So, in that respect, Hoyle probably views the ST prices as a risk worth taking with Wagner and his team continuing to exceed expectations on the pitch. Reach the promised land and they'll be fine financially.

Their story is not dissimilar to ours in that Dean Hoyle has loaned the club some £37m in the last six years but whereas the loans to our directors have been repaid following the last two promotions the loans in full still remain outstanding at Huddersfield. Not that Hoyle is short of a bob or two however, he was the founder of Card Factory before selling the business for a fortune a few years ago.

Worth noting that the ST prices in the OP are for the first 17,000 sold and it'll be interesting to see how those prices increase if they exceed that figure. Good luck to them, they seem a decent enough club, I hope they achieve their ambitions in which case they'll be in a similar situation to us if they can consolidate over the next season or two.

[Dark Cloud]

IF they happen to go up it's an absolute bargain tbh. And they MIGHT! Fair play to them.

[cricketfieldclarets]

Its easier to retain a customer than to win a new one. Therefore its great business sense by Huddersfield.

Many of these new fans will be fans for life. We have so many fans that first started going when we did the 35 quid season tickets. I know a few lads who first got a ticket then.

A smart club will use this as a way to make money in other ways too. Slight increase on programs, pies, shirts, beer and you will probably make most of it back anyway. That with the extra fans for the future and its a sensible and fair approach.

[RogerBest]

To decide whether this is a success you have to decide what the purpose of a football club is.

If it is to accumulate as much money as you can from a hardcore group of supporters then it is not a success.

If it is to provide enjoyment for a community at an affordable price then I think it is.

[Hipper]

Many of these new fans will be fans for life. We have so many fans that first started going when we did the 35 quid season tickets. I know a few lads who first got a ticket then.

Not convinced about the impact of this idea. I'm sure it happens but when we went down the leagues many of the 'fans for life' stopped going. When we were relegated from the Prem each time our attendances went back down to the normal, more or less. Attendances mostly reflect performance and price.

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[Hipper]

To decide whether this is a success you have to decide what the purpose of a football club is.

If it is to accumulate as much money as you can from a hardcore group of supporters then it is not a success.

If it is to provide enjoyment for a community at an affordable price then I think it is.

I don't think it is, or should be, either. It should be to attain the highest footballing level possible within an affordable budget. That would surely be true to the original concept of a typical football club, whether amateur or professional (ignoring the likes of Leipzig which exists to promote Red Bull) - players enjoying playing football and doing their best to do as well as possible.

In other words success on the field for the first team is all that matters. Everything else; community activities, youth policy, academy, ticket pricing, that feeling of pride and so on, should be subservient to the core aim.

Ticket prices are a question of marketing and impact. Marketing to make as much money as possible to reinvest in the club. Impact by judging if increasing attendance will affect the core aim, namely progress on the field. This could be by bringing in more money, directly from tickets or indirectly from other sales, to how such increasing attendances lift performances on the pitch. I'm a cynic and think that the ways clubs involve fans is just a method of using them for the club's purpose. Marketing/salesmanship.

This is why I often wonder about our investment in the youth set up. Does it, or can it, really pay for itself. I've never seen a financial case for or against it and would be interested if anyone has ever done such an assessment?

[Claretforever]

Not convinced about the impact of this idea. I'm sure it happens but when we went down the leagues many of the 'fans for life' stopped going. When we were relegated from the Prem each time our attendances went back down to the normal, more or less. Attendances mostly reflect performance and price.

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We've only gone down once, in 2010, and our attendances return to normal, which took 2-3 seasons. The last time we were relegated we lost just 600 home fans! Obviously because of the signings, expectation and positivity around the club.

[cricketfieldclarets]

Not convinced about the impact of this idea. I'm sure it happens but when we went down the leagues many of the 'fans for life' stopped going. When we were relegated from the Prem each time our attendances went back down to the normal, more or less. Attendances mostly reflect performance and price.

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Ive loads of mates who started going in the 35 quid season.

[glenlittle99]

Good development - but lets not forget:
Non-British Manager - 10 Non-British players. It works for them but if other clubs follow this model the Championship will end up like the Premiership - how will the British players and coaches then get a chance?

I know its a bit off subject - sorry.