Jury Service

ThinLizzy · Post by **ThinLizzy** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:00 pm

In a nutshell. I've been called up for September.
I am a belligerent bugger at the best of times so don't appreciate being TOLD to do this.
I am not religious and am a Republican so I can't swear on the bible or on the crown.
I don't want to be there, they're not paying me as I am self employed and I am being forced to be there. SO what is in it for me? Nothing.

How can this be fair for the poor defendant who may be innocent?

I don't want to be there. I won't care, nor pay any interest in it at all and quite possibly if it goes down to a one person majority, would happily send an innocent person to jail so I can just get it over with.
Surely there has to be a better way of getting jurors in? One thing is for certain. Simply by telling me I HAVE TO has already got my hackles up. That will, and always has got me swimming against the tide.

Serious replies please. I'm trying to figure out why I should sit there, possibly for weeks on end with absolutely no benefits to myself.

conyoviejo · Post by **conyoviejo** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:03 pm

I've done it,it's a privilege to do it ..stop Phookin moaning and enjoy it..

wilks_bfc · Post by **wilks_bfc** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:06 pm

They will pay for loss of earnings

You can decline, but can only do this once and next time you are called you can't decline that one.

Whether it's worth it all depends on the case tbh.
I got a crappy burglary case whereas other jurors got a grooming one

bedfords · Post by **bedfords** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:07 pm

"What's in it for me"

What a society we live in these days.

What has the law ever done for me.....ffs.

conyoviejo · Post by **conyoviejo** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:08 pm

wilks_bfc wrote:They will pay for loss of earnings

You can decline, but can only do this once and next time you are called you can't decline that one.

Whether it's worth it all depends on the case tbh.
I got a crappy burglary case whereas other jurors got a grooming one

I got a video nasty case..very interesting indeed..

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:08 pm

Bring back national service for people who refuse to do jury service.

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:14 pm

I've done it too - and was also pleased to do "my duty'. I had 2 cases and the second one was distressing for all the jury but as distressing as it was it was nothing compared to what the victims went through. Moaning about having to take time from work or the British Justice system would have been pretty inappropriate and selfish when you consider what the victims have gone through.

So if I was you I would just go ahead and do it and try not to be as negative when you are there as you seem to be at the prospect of it. Our justice system is one of the best in the world. I agree that the way they allocate jury service is not perfect and could be improved - but not for the same reasons you are suggesting. My issue is that you can get a couple of very young people with little or no life experience having to sit on a jury for a case that needs maturity and experience - we had exactly this situation on the second case I referred to and both of the young jurors admitted that this was the case and really struggled with the 2 weeks.
The other point is that there is a hell of lot of sitting round waiting and doing nothing for jurors and I am sure that the system could be miles more efficient and less costly.

claretbob · Post by **claretbob** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:16 pm

I found jury service a fabulous experience. It certainly helped that the first person I talked to was a Rovers fan and this the day after we had beaten them at the Turf. Fair to say he didn't take the defeat well and we never spoke to each other again for the whole two week period! Apart from him it was quite humbling how decent everyone was and if you want a fair and open criminal legal system you have to be prepared to support it.

conyoviejo · Post by **conyoviejo** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:16 pm

wilks_bfc wrote:They will pay for loss of earnings

You can decline, but can only do this once and next time you are called you can't decline that one.

Whether it's worth it all depends on the case tbh.
I got a crappy burglary case whereas other jurors got a grooming one

You can't decline it ,only defer it,unless the law has changed

wilks_bfc · Post by **wilks_bfc** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:21 pm

conyoviejo wrote:You can't decline it ,only defer it,unless the law has changed

That's kinda what I said.

You decline the first call but can't the second = a deferral

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:21 pm

You have to have a very good reason to decline it once and you can't decline it again.

The pathetic rationale you came out with in your OP I am pretty sure does not count as a very good reason - but if you want to check try googling :
"Jury service for the feckless selfish lazy can't be arsed"

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:26 pm

" I don't want to be there. I won't care, nor pay any interest in it at all and quite possibly if it goes down to a one person majority, would happily send an innocent person to jail so I can just get it over with"

And that part of your post must go down as one of the legendary idiotic quotes ever seen on this board - what a f-ucking moron you sound.....on second thoughts why don't you apply for not serving based on the grounds of mental incapacity

LeadBelly · Post by **LeadBelly** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:38 pm

I did jury service c 20 years ago. My employees were very supportive & I vaguely kept up with work by doing a couple of hours after service + during odd half-day delays.
I found the case and procedures really interesting & also enjoyed the (fairly lengthy) deliberations with the rest of the jury group. Jury started out with a range from one extreme to the other ("guilty/string em up now" to "too nice to have done something like that"). The interactions of the various jury personalities in coming to consensus was very illuminating.
Really glad I did it and supported our "trial by jury" system. I'd like to think that if ever I was in the dock, there'd be a group of my responsible peers judging me.

Rick_Muller · Post by **Rick_Muller** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:44 pm

[quote]ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country.[/quote]

JFK

SammyBoy · Post by **SammyBoy** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:45 pm

As long as they compensate you for loss of earnings you should probably do it.

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:47 pm

Get nicked. You wont have to do it then!

ThinLizzy · Post by **ThinLizzy** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:53 pm

I was asking a fair and honest opinion, not some reason to have a go. No need to have a go at me.

It seems some people took real enlightenment out of it, some enjoyed the experience. I won't. My point is, why don't they ask people who would rather than forcing those who clearly wouldn't?

I don't care what some of you think of me on this. Personally. If I am forced to go through it. I won't pay the blindest bit of attention to it. AT ALL. So it's not really fair all round, but hey ho!

bobinho · Post by **bobinho** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:55 pm

Utterly bizarre.

claretdom · Post by **claretdom** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:56 pm

Imagine your delight if you turn up and Simon Garner is on trial

NottsClaret · Post by **NottsClaret** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:03 pm

bobinho wrote:Utterly bizarre.

Quite. I worry I'm a little selfish at times, but the OP has put my mind at rest for now.

beddie · Post by **beddie** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:10 pm

ThinLizzy. Is there a form supplied that allows you to explain why you do not wish to attend. If you have issues about it then write them down. If you have more pressing commitments then again go into detail. "they will pay for loss of earnings" not as clear cut as that with you being self employed. I think you have to be honest and go into detail. No guarantee of course but if you are excused then you may get a call again, although that could be some considerable time later. Good luck with whatever you decide.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:20 pm

It's 42 years since I did it - five days but only used for one of those days.

Inchy · Post by **Inchy** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:35 pm

"It seems some people took real enlightenment out of it, some enjoyed the experience. I won't."

DAVETHEVICAR · Post by **DAVETHEVICAR** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:49 pm

I did jury service at Burnley Crown Court about 30 years ago
Had one case which lasted three days in the two week period.
Tommy Cummings was also there but not selected on my case
Most days was sent home early
It was a facinating case and the guy was found guilty
Really enjoyed the experience

MACCA · Post by **MACCA** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:52 pm

Great news if you work for a company, as you get a bit of a jolly. Poor if you are self employed mind.

I've not been asked yet, but would be happy to oblige.

pureclaret · Post by **pureclaret** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 4:02 pm

You should be careful what you put Thin lizzy as you could be on a thin line between freedom of speech and contempt of court.
Freedom of speech would be I dont feel I could give an unbiased opinion on some subjects Contempt is '' I wont pay the blindest bit of attention' could find your self in the dock with no pay for as long as it is felt necessary or until you comply. I know of a guy who was self employed who said the same thing in a pub the night before going to do jury service was questioned about his feelings and if he had said he would not listen and just vote the way everyone else did ,locked up for 48 hrs until the judge was free to hear his apology then forced to do 3 weeks service with only expenses paid. now you have put it on here for every one to see not easy to take back. Let us know which cell you are sent to we could maybe send you a food parcel

box_of_frogs · Post by **box_of_frogs** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 4:07 pm

UpTheBeehole wrote:Bring back national service for people who refuse to do jury service.

We don't want them!!!!

harpers_perm · Post by **harpers_perm** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 4:29 pm

I can only assume this is attention seeking.

If you wouldn't pay the 'blindest bit of attention' to a victim of child abuse or a myriad of other crimes then that is truly astonishing.

Man of Kent · Post by **Man of Kent** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 4:49 pm

It was a brilliant experience for me. It restored my faith in the idea of being judged by 12 of your peers and showed me that it's the best system there is, if not absolutely perfect. It was fascinating to be part of the jury system for three weeks. They fed me well at lunchtime, offered compensation for loss of earnings (I didn't take it), everybody treated me with respect and I met some interesting people. You don't have to swear on the Bible either. And don't try any passive resistance tricks either. The court ushers who look after you have seen them all before and you won't beat the system. The judge might be having a word if you try to be clever. You can decline the call to jury service once but rest assured, they'll come back for you a few weeks later. Stop whinging and accept it as one of life's experiences.

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:13 pm

ThinLizzy wrote:I was asking a fair and honest opinion, not some reason to have a go. No need to have a go at me.

It seems some people took real enlightenment out of it, some enjoyed the experience. I won't. My point is, why don't they ask people who would rather than forcing those who clearly wouldn't?

I don't care what some of you think of me on this. Personally. If I am forced to go through it. I won't pay the blindest bit of attention to it. AT ALL. So it's not really fair all round, but hey ho!

There's every need to have a go at you - if you don't want people to "have a go" then either think before you post or preferably grow up and grow some boll-ocks.

If you think life is all about doing things you want then you are in for a bit of a shock.

How the f-uck would you feel if you got attacked or abused and the perpetrator ended up in court with a clever barrister who somehow manages to split the jury....and then one member of that jury who has been an arse all week and is keen to go home to watch Jeremy Kyle thinks I'll just let him off so we can all finish early ?

Feckin moron

wilks_bfc · Post by **wilks_bfc** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:18 pm

Edit. Posted twice

wilks_bfc · Post by **wilks_bfc** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:19 pm

So the OP asks for advice & "serious replies only" and when he get them because they aren't the answers he wants, says we are all having a go at him?

conyoviejo · Post by **conyoviejo** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:48 pm

ThinLizzy wrote:I was asking a fair and honest opinion, not some reason to have a go. No need to have a go at me.

It seems some people took real enlightenment out of it, some enjoyed the experience. I won't. My point is, why don't they ask people who would rather than forcing those who clearly wouldn't?

I don't care what some of you think of me on this. Personally. If I am forced to go through it. I won't pay the blindest bit of attention to it. AT ALL. So it's not really fair all round, but hey ho!

Get on with it as somebodies future is on trial.. Listen to the facts and make your decision as you think it should be instead of being a mard phooker and throwing your toys out of the or pram..

Claretmatt4 · Post by **Claretmatt4** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:08 pm

I did it at Burnley in the last six months. The case was horrible but like many others on here it somewhat restored my faith in the legal system. Everyone was polite even if they had strong views and everyone got a say. It was a complicated case but I can live with the decision.

It's an experience for sure, you should welcome it.

Burnley Ace · Post by **Burnley Ace** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:25 pm

Self employed as what?

Darthlaw · Post by **Darthlaw** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:30 pm

ThinLizzy wrote:
I don't want to be there. I won't care, nor pay any interest in it at all and quite possibly if it goes down to a one person majority, would happily send an innocent person to jail so I can just get it over with.

Surely this is a wind up? If not hopefully you'll be put in contempt of court and get a juror with a similar perspective.

Jakubclaret · Post by **Jakubclaret** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 9:58 pm

ThinLizzy wrote:I was asking a fair and honest opinion, not some reason to have a go. No need to have a go at me.

It seems some people took real enlightenment out of it, some enjoyed the experience. I won't. My point is, why don't they ask people who would rather than forcing those who clearly wouldn't?

I don't care what some of you think of me on this. Personally. If I am forced to go through it. I won't pay the blindest bit of attention to it. AT ALL. So it's not really fair all round, but hey ho!

I'm not having a go i understand where you are coming from you don't want to do it when all is said & done plain & simple. Why should anybody be compelled! The system needs to change rather than getting people who can't be bothered. If the justice process hinges upon people like you serious mistakes will happen it needs reviewing & revising.

cloughyclaret · Post by **cloughyclaret** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 10:02 pm

Jakubclaret wrote:I'm not having a go i understand where you are coming from you don't want to do it when all is said & done plain & simple. Why should anybody be compelled! The system needs to change rather than getting people who can't be bothered. If the justice process hinges upon people like you serious mistakes will happen it needs reviewing & revising.

Judging from the replies to this thread it doesnt hinge on attitudes shown in the OP.
Everyone has said the process can be bettered, but not one has mentioned this is as the reason why.

Jakubclaret · Post by **Jakubclaret** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 10:07 pm

cloughyclaret wrote:Judging from the replies to this thread it doesnt hinge on attitudes shown in the OP.
Everyone has said the process can be bettered, but not one has mentioned this is as the reason why.

I beg to differ its a flip of a coin scenario where this bloke is concerned in a close call if i was in the dock & innocent but unsure on the verdict this stuff is made of nightmares.

Claretrew · Post by **Claretrew** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 10:13 pm

Thinlizzy your op puts you in the Tim sherwood group.

DCWat · Post by **DCWat** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 10:17 pm

Not all companies pay their staff to attend, although I do think that they should have to.

It's an interesting experience, albeit often pretty boring with loads of waiting around and hoping to get picked. I did days just sat in a room waiting, and the two cases that I sat on weren't the most interesting.

Whatever the perceived severity of the case being heard, the accused should rightly expect that each and every juror 'gives a ****' about arriving at the right outcome.

In the unlikely event that I end up in the dock, I'd be damn well expecting it too.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 1:04 am

Why should you do it? Because living in this country, you have a lot of rights, but you also have responsibilities. If the system was that everyone could demand all their rights but no-one was responsible for providing those rights, it wouldn't work. For centuries it has been the general principle that you are tried by your peers, not by someone appointed by the government - they won't change that just for you.

PaintYorkClaretnBlue · Post by **PaintYorkClaretnBlue** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 3:13 am

The justice system would collapse if everyone thought like you! Do your duty!

Suratclaret · Post by **Suratclaret** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 4:10 am

If and when the OP is actually selected for the jury, he can make his views known to the jury bailiff who, I am sure , would only be too happy to pass them onto the Judge who might then have a word. If, however, a trial goes ahead and it is obvious that any member of a jury isn't paying the slightest bit of attention, then the Judge will definitely have a word...I've seen that happen on more than one occasion and Judges don't like being messed about.
As DSR said ...if you want rights then you have to accept responsibilities.

yorkyclaret · Post by **yorkyclaret** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 9:11 am

Be great if the defendant was a bar steward, who could prove he was innocent but you managed to get him sent to chokey anyway.

Hipper · Post by **Hipper** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 11:53 am

Why not visit your local Crown Court and sit in the public gallery for a while. It costs nothing except time and might make you look at things in a different light.

Remember also that you could end up in the dock for unexpected reasons and would presumably want and expect a fair hearing.

StuffyClaret · Post by **StuffyClaret** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 12:09 pm

As a self employed person your accountant will be able to provide a reference confirming your lost income and this will be reimbursed. it was quite lucrative when I did it because business was a little quiet but i got paid based on the previous 12 months accounts

FulledgeClaret · Post by **FulledgeClaret** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 3:09 pm

Somebodies future or the safety of others is depending on you and 11 others, would you be happy to see a murderer/rapist/Peado go free because you couldn't give a **** and there was nothing in it for you.
suck it up buttercup and get it done to the best of your ability.