Bitter about Aberdeen

LongSider75 · Post by **LongSider75** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 11:58 am

Only missed half a dozen games in the last 6/7 years, none at the Turf for at least 10 years, but can't get a ticket for Aberdeen. I know rules have to be adhered to but it hurts a little when you go all over the country and sit with a poor away following on a crap Tues night in the middle of winter. Loyalty points system is outdated, Thanks BFC.

Dyched · Post by **Dyched** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:03 pm

I agree. I suggest a Royal Rumble would be better.

Grumps · Post by **Grumps** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:04 pm

So what would you suggest Longside as a better system

jrgbfc · Post by **jrgbfc** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:09 pm

It's one of the prices of success I suppose. Lots of season ticket holders who had no interest in going to away games suddenly decide they want to.

Hibsclaret · Post by **Hibsclaret** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:13 pm

Agree. This is the only time in 42 years of support that I have been unable to go to a game I wanted.

It matters not that I was at Crewe in 87, Sheffield Wed in 83, every game I wanted to last season etc etc.

The club needs to upgrade to an infrastructure and staffing ability to match its current position as a business with a bigger turnover than Inter Milan....

Dyched · Post by **Dyched** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:17 pm

jrgbfc wrote:It's one of the prices of success I suppose. Lots of season ticket holders who had no interest in going to away games suddenly decide they want to.

Maybe they can only afford so many away trips a year. Maybe they have young children to look after. Maybe they’ve done all the away grounds we’d be going to in the PL this season and fancy a trip to scotland.

bfcmik · Post by **bfcmik** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:21 pm

I would like to see something like the depreciation system. Maybe:
Seasons 1 and 2: points = 100%
s3 = 90%
s4 = 80%
s5 = 70%
s6 = 55%
s7 = 40%
s8 = 25%
s9 =15%
s10 onwards = 5%
All rounded up to the nearest 10

Grumps · Post by **Grumps** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:24 pm

bfcmik wrote:I would like to see something like the depreciation system. Maybe:
Seasons 1 and 2: points = 100%
s3 = 90%
s4 = 80%
s5 = 70%
s6 = 55%
s7 = 40%
s8 = 25%
s9 =15%
s10 onwards = 5%
All rounded up to the nearest 10

If I read that correctly new fans get the advantage?

BigF · Post by **BigF** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:26 pm

Those with a great many loyalty points will always be at the "top of the list". Perhaps the loyalty points system should use up some of the points when a ticket etc is bought. (A bit like Nectar points or similar). Or is that unfair to people who have supported the club over the years?

Blackrod · Post by **Blackrod** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:27 pm

Inevitably many good fans were going to end up disappointed. Please don't read the other thread with the gloaters on though.

jrgbfc · Post by **jrgbfc** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:28 pm

Hopefully soon we'll revert back to being crap and you can turn up and pay on day at every away game.

Dyched · Post by **Dyched** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:30 pm

The only fair way of doing it is to stick them all on general sale. Stuff loyalty. You either get them or you don’t. Like gig tickets. You can see a band 50 times. It doesn’t entitle you to a ticket anymore than someone who just started listening to them.

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:39 pm

Lots of good suggestions here. None will happen. Because;

1) It doesn't happen that often. It blows up. It cools down.
2) The current system is simple. I think it's hard to imagine a more complex system would be well run.
3) Those who have the club's ear on such things are likely to be in the position of Meleagris gallopavo facing a Yuletide / No Yuletide referendum
4) It might lead to more transparency about what's exactly happening with the tickets. This week the club deleted discussions about where they were distributed on official channels such as Facebook and those debates disappeared elsewhere too.

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:44 pm

Dyched wrote:The only fair way of doing it is to stick them all on general sale. Stuff loyalty. You either get them or you don’t. Like gig tickets. You can see a band 50 times. It doesn’t entitle you to a ticket anymore than someone who just started listening to them.

It's not the same though is it. If you could buy a season ticket for every UK date on a tour, there might be an analogy. Actually, many bands do run various kinds of loyalty or fan club arrangements where you get guaranteed priority access; pretty much the same arrangement as promised by the Foundation - not a guaranteed ticket but a guaranteed better chance.

IanMcL · Post by **IanMcL** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:49 pm

As a 'traveller' my main gripe is that for hundreds of miles, round trip, on a cold, snowy, frosty, foggy, Tuesday night, I get 10 pts. Max in a season 190 points. A season ticket holder (Inc me now) gets bag loads more for walking down the road, in many cases.

It is often stated, "what a brilliant away following - helped us get through that one"

Recognition, when that away following wants to go to another away match....zero. Recognition for those whose bums never stray far from their Turf Moor seat - total.

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:59 pm

IanMcL wrote:As a 'traveller' my main gripe is that for hundreds of miles, round trip, on a cold, snowy, frosty, foggy, Tuesday night, I get 10 pts. Max in a season 190 points. A season ticket holder (Inc me now) gets bag loads more for walking down the road, in many cases.

It is often stated, "what a brilliant away following - helped us get through that one"

Recognition, when that away following wants to go to another away match....zero. Recognition for those whose bums never stray far from their Turf Moor seat - total.

Being in the EPL skews it because of TV money but, if we had 20,000 away fans at every match and none at home, we'd have gone bust. You shouldn't forget how, in very recent times, the ST income was the only thing stopping BFC going altogether. That's why some perquisites are due to those people.

bobinho · Post by **bobinho** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 1:02 pm

The current system is clearly double shite.

As someone once said "a blind man on a galloping horse can see that".

Do I have an alternative? No, not really. Doesn't mean the current system is therefore fit for purpose. Same goes for the foundation. I expect people at the club to recognise it and work on a solution, or at least have a think about it.

From all the people I have spoken to about this, the statements are pretty much the same. The system is a poor one, it always has been and unless its brought up to date, it will remain a poor one. People like the OP shouldn't be missing out on this game, and neither should foundation members who pumped their money in month after month.

With such a small allocation, it was always gonna be hard to get a ticket, but this could've been foreseen. I'm not saying the club could've solved the problems, but it COULDVE made an effort, even just putting the word out asking for viable alternatives...

People who walk to the Turf every other Saturday for a season, get a better return than those who travel (at great expense) to the darkest dingiest places in England on a wet Tuesday nite in December... how is that right? Someone suggested I stop thinking like a fan, and look at it from the clubs perspective, but I AM a fan, so I CAN'T stop looking at it like a fan.

Away games should count for more, and be distance related. Bournemouth away gets 20 points - 30 if it's midweek - Man City away gets 10 regardless of the day/time. Home games get 5, ST holders get double. Foundation get 250 tickets allocated to a raffle draw, and members contacted to see if they want them, then they go to the next person. Look, I dunno what's best, I just know what isn't. And what I DO know, is that because there is nothing in it for the club, and because any changes will need managing by an individual who will draw a wage, nowt is likely to change regarding this.

bobinho · Post by **bobinho** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 1:06 pm

thatdberight wrote:It's not the same though is it. If you could buy a season ticket for every UK date on a tour, there might be an analogy. Actually, many bands do run various kinds of loyalty or fan club arrangements where you get guaranteed priority access; pretty much the same arrangement as promised by the Foundation - not a guaranteed ticket but a guaranteed better chance.

Unaware of the "better chance" for this game for foundation members... any chance you could tell me? Not trying to be sarcy, just genuinely don't know. Foundation worked for me when serving in Germany and rode home from Hohne on my motorbike for the Wrexham home game. Got a ticket due to membership (ST not an option, obviously)

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 1:08 pm

bobinho wrote:Unaware of the "better chance" for this game for foundation members... any chance you could tell me? Not trying to be sarcy, just genuinely don't know. Foundation worked for me when serving in Germany and rode home from Hohne on my motorbike for the Wrexham home game. Got a ticket due to membership (ST not an option, obviously)

As I understand it, that didn't happen. That's why I said, "promised" .

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 1:23 pm

Dyched wrote:The only fair way of doing it is to stick them all on general sale. Stuff loyalty. You either get them or you don’t. Like gig tickets. You can see a band 50 times. It doesn’t entitle you to a ticket anymore than someone who just started listening to them.

Genuinely don't see a problem with doing that. We're all Burnley fans.

whiffa · Post by **whiffa** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 1:30 pm

As harsh as it sounds, no matter what system we adopt - somebody will always miss out, and it will always be unfair for someone.

We need to accept that we're in the big time, and we're a big club. Demand simply out-ways supply.

Claretforever · Post by **Claretforever** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 1:34 pm

A rolling 5 year points system is the way forward.

Every season moving forward means one less season counted at the back. Sure, those who were committed supporters until 5 years ago, but don’t go now, are penalised, but those who are CURRENT (5 years is quite lengthy) fans get priority. It also means that youngsters have a chance to build points over a relatively shorter period, and even have a chance of topping the points charts within 5 years plus.

This points for life thing doesn’t work very well in my opinion. Well, not fairly anyway.

Grumps · Post by **Grumps** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 1:34 pm

An away season ticket,or an away travel club??

Dyched · Post by **Dyched** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 1:37 pm

thatdberight wrote:It's not the same though is it. If you could buy a season ticket for every UK date on a tour, there might be an analogy. Actually, many bands do run various kinds of loyalty or fan club arrangements where you get guaranteed priority access; pretty much the same arrangement as promised by the Foundation - not a guaranteed ticket but a guaranteed better chance.

Bands do codes for presales. Fill in your email address and thats it. It doesnt guarantee you get a ticket. They simply release and x amount of tickets earlier that general sale. So in theory the club could release 75% of tickets tonseason ticket holders 24 hrs earlier than general sale. People will always miss out. How ever fair the system is or isn’t. IMO it shouldn’t matter the amount of away games you go or how far you travel.

All clarets should have the right to at least try to get to a football match. Wherher its your 400th or 1st away game.

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 1:45 pm

Dyched wrote:Bands do codes for presales. Fill in your email address and thats it. It doesnt guarantee you get a ticket. They simply release and x amount of tickets earlier that general sale. So in theory the club could release 75% of tickets tonseason ticket holders 24 hrs earlier than general sale. People will always miss out. How ever fair the system is or isn’t. IMO it shouldn’t matter the amount of away games you go or how far you travel.

All clarets should have the right to at least try to get to a football match. Wherher its your 400th or 1st away game.

Some bands do more with paid fan clubs that give presale access. I agree with you by the way that everyone should have a chance. Just not the same chance.

Paul Waine · Post by **Paul Waine** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 1:46 pm

Let's say we've got 10,000 regular fans who pay for STs. Let's say we've got other fans who live too far away to t'Turf to get on regularly at home - but, many of these form part of our "loyal" away supporters - but (most) can't afford to buy STs that they cannot use.

So, first game in European competition for 50 years, what should we do?

I'm OK that loyalty points are used for the first Europa game. But, maybe we should then give those who couldn't get tickets for Aberdeen a chance: maybe that once you've bought your Aberdeen away tickets you are excluded from buying tickets for the next games, and those who missed out on Aberdeen get first priority, and so on through a few more Europa away games.

How would that work out? Would those with multiple thousand loyalty points feel it's fair that they get "first dibs" on the first game, but then they move to the back of the queue for subsequent rounds? Or would they want to claim "first dibs" for every game throughout the competition?

Just saying...

UTC

mikeS · Post by **mikeS** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:07 pm

In the old days people used to queue up all night to get tickets. You could say that was fair. Then you could argue it doesn’t help those who work nights or couldn’t get to the club.
I don’t suppose that system will come back anytime soon as we have a widely dispersed membership today more than we had 30-40 years ago when Burnley fans generally lived within the local area.
Don’t know if there is a fairer system than the one we have now tbh.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:09 pm

LongSider75 wrote:Only missed half a dozen games in the last 6/7 years, none at the Turf for at least 10 years, but can't get a ticket for Aberdeen.

How on earth could you not get one with that attendance record?

Selby Claret · Post by **Selby Claret** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:19 pm

In my opinion it’s not so much a loyalty system as an ageist system

A 17 yr old for example, who has had a season ticket since he was 3, can still only accrue 14 years of loyalty points despite potentially having been here there and everywhere with the Clarets.

Yet one of my relatives who has had a season ticket for 20 years but only goes to home games - and doesn’t always go to those (he gives up his seat approx 6 times a season as he’s on holiday all the time) - is considered by the system as being more eligible for a ticket - and it is also inferred that he is more loyal.

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:19 pm

ClaretTony wrote:How on earth could you not get one with that attendance record?

I was going to say! You must have 1000s of loyalty points!

Selby Claret · Post by **Selby Claret** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:25 pm

martin_p wrote:I was going to say! You must have 1000s of loyalty points!

Not if someone always bought the away tickets on their account for him/her

I’m behind my uncle for points so whenever we go away i always buy two on my account to bolster points rather than us buying one each

And a season ticket according the club website is now only worth 350 points a year....

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:28 pm

I've always been for Burnley increasing capacity to the ground...and yes for the away fans also. But mostly shouted down as to why cater for away fans.. Leisure being a big objector.so my view is increased gates enables more away fans to attend games as in this and many.other cases.

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:30 pm

The points system is not worth diddly squat!

MarbellaClaret · Post by **MarbellaClaret** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:34 pm

Who's going without ticket ? Let's all do it .......

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:36 pm

MarbellaClaret wrote:Who's going without ticket ? Let's all do it .......

Hillsborough.

Leisure · Post by **Leisure** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:43 pm

Selby Claret wrote:Not if someone always bought the away tickets on their account for him/her

I’m behind my uncle for points so whenever we go away i always buy two on my account to bolster points rather than us buying one each

And a season ticket according the club website is now only worth 350 points a year....

You still only get 10 points no matter how many tickets you buy at the same time. ST has always been worth 350 points.

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:49 pm

LongSider75 wrote:Only missed half a dozen games in the last 6/7 years, none at the Turf for at least 10 years, but can't get a ticket for Aberdeen. I know rules have to be adhered to but it hurts a little when you go all over the country and sit with a poor away following on a crap Tues night in the middle of winter. Loyalty points system is outdated, Thanks BFC.

TbF over the last 6-7 years you have never slummed it standing on railway sleepers for terraces at Crewe, the Ash bank at Halifax, selling out of pies BEFORE kick off while watching Kendall give the most inept performance ever seen by a Burnley keeper while standing in a condemned stand in Blackpool, or had to stand on an open terrace on a Tuesday night getting beaten by Leyton Orient. I realise it was possibly only because it was before your time, but don't pretend the last six years have been hard graft..... there are hundreds on here who will just shake there heads at that.

Hope you get sorted out and yes I think regulars deserve first dibs.

pauliopaulio · Post by **pauliopaulio** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:50 pm

There were 2000 tickets. That’s not enough to make sure that everyone who has been there through thick and thin no matter what system was chosen. It’s hard lines for those who missed out, just as it would have been on those who missed out if another system was picked.

Probably could have sold the tickets at least five times over

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 3:05 pm

Selby Claret wrote:Not if someone always bought the away tickets on their account for him/her

I’m behind my uncle for points so whenever we go away i always buy two on my account to bolster points rather than us buying one each

And a season ticket according the club website is now only worth 350 points a year....

If you buy two on your account you are missing out because you only get the 10 points once. You are getting no points for the second ticket.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 3:06 pm

Selby Claret wrote:In my opinion it’s not so much a loyalty system as an ageist system

A 17 yr old for example, who has had a season ticket since he was 3, can still only accrue 14 years of loyalty points despite potentially having been here there and everywhere with the Clarets.

Yet one of my relatives who has had a season ticket for 20 years but only goes to home games - and doesn’t always go to those (he gives up his seat approx 6 times a season as he’s on holiday all the time) - is considered by the system as being more eligible for a ticket - and it is also inferred that he is more loyal.

The points system has only been in since 2005.

LongSider75 · Post by **LongSider75** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:16 pm

Pauliopaulio, don't talk to me about through thick and thin, apart from supporters clubs most games down south have an away end dominated by southern accents, people you never see at the turf. Proper loyal fans are being **** on.

dpinsussex · Post by **dpinsussex** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:10 pm

LongSider75 wrote:Only missed half a dozen games in the last 6/7 years, none at the Turf for at least 10 years, but can't get a ticket for Aberdeen. I know rules have to be adhered to but it hurts a little when you go all over the country and sit with a poor away following on a crap Tues night in the middle of winter. Loyalty points system is outdated, Thanks BFC.

Just go anyway. There will be thousands of clarets in aberdeen without tickets.
I was similar through my late teens and early 20s where I never missed a game. Moved away and was never going to hold a season ticket given the distance. Still got to a lot of away games. No idea how many points I have given that I can't remember the password for a defunct email account so can't open up my clarets membership.

Get your butt up to Aberdeen and be a part of the European adventure

padihamclaret · Post by **padihamclaret** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 8:01 pm

I've had a season ticket for years, I arrange away trips for me and my mates (Not as many as I used to due to work, family etc) and am always getting non-season ticket holding mates onto the turf. As a result, I have 7,300 loyalty points. For me, the system has worked but I genuinely feel sorry for the people who it hasn't. Wouldn't really like to suggest an alternative

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 8:07 pm

There are 2000 tickets for this one. People were always going to miss out.

Now if anyone wants to tell the 2000 who are going that they are not proper fans, knock yourself out but you know thats utter bullshit.

keith1879 · Post by **keith1879** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 11:14 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:There are 2000 tickets for this one. People were always going to miss out.

Now if anyone wants to tell the 2000 who are going that they are not proper fans, knock yourself out but you know thats utter bullshit.

Well said.

keith1879 · Post by **keith1879** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 11:24 pm

bfcmik wrote:I would like to see something like the depreciation system. Maybe:
Seasons 1 and 2: points = 100%
s3 = 90%
s4 = 80%
s5 = 70%
s6 = 55%
s7 = 40%
s8 = 25%
s9 =15%
s10 onwards = 5%
All rounded up to the nearest 10

The whole point of the loyalty system when it was started was to get people to commit to the club by buying season tickets ....at a time when far fewer did than do now. And you want to devalue the very years when buying a ticket meant most to the club.

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 11:51 pm

Nothing wrong with the points system, it's the complete refusal to communicate with supporters so they can make informed decisions that is the problem.

No reason at all why they can't tell us how many fans have points in each bracket and no reason why they can't tell us how many have been sold/are left each day.

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Sat Jul 07, 2018 11:53 pm

I think the issue for some is that these games can become Adults only matches due to kids never having enough points.

JohnDearyMe · Post by **JohnDearyMe** » Sun Jul 08, 2018 12:32 am

The ticket allocation system at Burnley is sadly far from transparent when it comes to away games.

Dyche has dragged us into the top flight on the playing front but we're still a few years behind on the ticketing system

IanMcL · Post by **IanMcL** » Sun Jul 08, 2018 1:12 am

ClaretTony wrote:The points system has only been in since 2005.

So how can folk have 8000?