Someone has to say it, so I will.

He isn't good enough.

He played much better today. His technique let's him down however.

Needs to up his game. Very wasteful.

Thought he was bright, caused Dier problems constantly, a confident Andre would have scored today though.

He's getting better with every start. Had a tough time ( of his own making ) and not played for a while which can't be easy at this level

Never makes something for himself, when he gets it down the channels his awareness, touch and passing is poor and we arent a good enough team to give him enough of the chances he likes and needs to score goals like he did last year.

Trouble is none of the other strikers are good enough at this level so we're just have to make the best out of what we've got and hope between the three of them we just have enough to keep us up

In the first half a ball was played into his feet with his back to the goal, his first touch sent the ball about 8ft up in the air and about 10ft away from him.

Come on Andre!

I think Gray needs a few starts and obviously a goal and then
he might just setlle down and prove that he can do well at this level.

Way short of confidence and it shows, particularly with the sitter he fired straight at Lloris.

Looked a lot better though as the passes were played in behind for him to run on to and he certainly seems to work better off Barnes in the PL, so I would persevere.

Good enough and getting better.

Did much better at getting down the sides of the Spurs CH's today and did well on a couple of occasions in the box.

He does lack quality though and, again, needs to keep working on that first touch and weight of pass.

Thought AG did ok really looked v willing tho spuds defence is classy.Bearing in mind were a horribly weak side in the prem ( even more so without Gud and Defour) they're all playing to their absolute max capability ,so churlish to complain imo.

Andre did really well today, just like the rest of the team. If we continue to play in this way away from home we won't be going down for sure.
And let's not forget Andre is still a young player and learning all the time.
Now is the time to back him, not snipe at him.
Contrast in performance from wed to today is massive.

Apart from his control and ability to beat a man when 1 v 1 ( which his pace should make it easier ) he is getting better.

Where waa he 2/3 years ago?
He has jumped up a level a season nearly.

That said if we are wanting to keep him I would tie him down now or sell him. No point playing into form for him to bugger off elsewhere without him contributing to our cause.

Vokes is not hacking it though either, his every second touch is a tackle.

Someone has to say it, so I will.

An utterly pointless thread.

He should be coached as a 'two touch' player, control and pass or ideally, one touch shot off, footballing ability wise he is miles away.

We're not good enough, 1 thru to 46

Lets give the lads some credit,they are decent championship players,being asked to compete with multi talented superstars.In my opinion,they are working their plums off for the cause.Lets get behind them in 2017.UTC.

Well said HYF

holdyourfire wrote:Lets give the lads some credit,they are decent championship players,being asked to compete with multi talented superstars.In my opinion,they are working their plums off for the cause.Lets get behind them in 2017.UTC.

Scenario: We're 2-1 down in the 87th minute, Andre has the ball on the edge of their box, the penalty area is loaded with Clarets....what does he do? He tries a stupid a fancy dinky cross? that hits the stomach of the first defender! As I've said, not good enough.

All good RUSH fans think alike!

here here HYT

Best performance of the season today.
After an improved performance at West Ham.
Might be finding his feet at last and he looked to be moving better and quicker.

When he has time to weigh up a cross or pass i think he struggles. Far better when he has little reaction time and has to be more instinctive

Gray wasn't good enough last year against the top sides so it was hard to see him being good enough this year, but he is full of potential and may well improve over the season (albeit will never master his first touch). He also stretches the opposition. I think as well his misses against Sours and West Ham were more to do with his confidence not his weaknesses.

Let's be frank though, whatever Gray is he is a darn sight better than the likes of Juke and Sordell so let's be grateful we are stronger this time.

KRBFC wrote:Thought he was bright, caused Dier problems constantly, a confident Andre would have scored today though.

Confident or not he should of scored that chance, his pass for Boyd on that counter was terrible. Got laughed at in the summer on here for suggesting he wouldn't score 10 goals in a season at this level.

I think Gray and Barnes are decent subs to have to chase a game or help defend a lead. What we are missing is a quality lone striker to start in the 4-5-1 formation who has a good all round game like a Deeney or a Rodriguez and could play with either Barnes or Gray in a 4-4-2

Unfortunately strikers of that quality cost more money than we have and if there's one area of weakness with Dyche its his ability to spot a good striker who doesn't cost the earth or the ability to get one in on loan

Cost more money then we have?

Deeney and Jay both came up from lower leagues, along with Vardy and Ulloa.

Its about finding the right player, not the amount they cost.

needs to lose some of his muscle bulk to be effective, no question in my mind that he's lost a yard of pace over the summer. Thought he was ok today, probably his best performance - he at least looked interested

CrosspoolClarets wrote:Gray wasn't good enough last year against the top sides so it was hard to see him being good enough this year, but he is full of potential and may well improve over the season (albeit will never master his first touch). He also stretches the opposition. I think as well his misses against Sours and West Ham were more to do with his confidence not his weaknesses.

Let's be frank though, whatever Gray is he is a darn sight better than the likes of Juke and Sordell so let's be grateful we are stronger this time.

Gray wasn't good enough against the top sides ?

Didn't he score against Brighton home and away ? Sheffield Wednesday, Derby.....and no doubt numerous others if I could be bothered to check.

Not sure what some fans want or the basis for some of their views.....leading goal scorer - 24/25 goals etc etc

i think Barnes and Gray will form a good partnership!
They just need some good service. Really want to see them play from the start with Defour, Gray needs the ball on the deck.
Think we'll be all right.

Sidney1st wrote:Cost more money then we have?

Deeney and Jay both came up from lower leagues, along with Vardy and Ulloa.

Its about finding the right player, not the amount they cost.

Yeah but the problem is you need an effective scouting network for that.

Thought he didn't well today, couple of dodgy touches and one missed opportunity but covered a lot of ground and caused problems.

Vegas Claret wrote:needs to lose some of his muscle bulk to be effective, no question in my mind that he's lost a yard of pace over the summer. Thought he was ok today, probably his best performance - he at least looked interested

Im sure if Dyche knows what he's doing, he'll be telling him to do just that.

As a confidence player he needs to be playing , a couple of goals and h will be flying

TVC15 wrote:Gray wasn't good enough against the top sides ?

Didn't he score against Brighton home and away ? Sheffield Wednesday, Derby.....and no doubt numerous others if I could be bothered to check.

Not sure what some fans want or the basis for some of their views.....leading goal scorer - 24/25 goals etc etc

Sheff weds and Brighton away were tap ins on the goal line, derby and Brighton at home were penalties.
He struggled against any team with decent centre halves and is really struggling in the premier league

I suspect whoever it may be he will play from this point more games in the top division than lower.

I think he will be fine and is just getting his sharpness back.

He needs the correct service mind, today he hit the target

SkiptonClaret wrote:Yeah but the problem is you need an effective scouting network for that.

Then we need an effective transfer negotiation team.....

We're buggered then.

bumba wrote:Sheff weds and Brighton away were tap ins on the goal line, derby and Brighton at home were penalties.
He struggled against any team with decent centre halves and is really struggling in the premier league

F-uck me some fans will clutch at any straw when they have it in for a player.

Gray scored an absolute bag full and tore apart plenty of good centre backs and defences

Nobody is going to play well in every game - exactly which top teams did he struggle against ?.....as all of the team struggled against Boro and Hull - yet we still won the division and finished higher than them....and we would not have done that with Gray.

Whether he's good enough for the Premier League none of us know yet - but you can say that for all of our team - with the exception of Heaton and Keane.

But for fans to say they knew Gray was not good enough based on his "pathetic" 25 goals in the Championship winning side is pretty embarrassing

He shot straight at Lloris or did Lloris make a good save?

Kane shot straight through Heatons legs only to hit his foot or did Heaton make a good save?

Fine margins for Strikers and Keepers alike.

Andre's first touch has let him down since the day he pulled on a Claret shirt but he is still the best we have got and must continue to play.

He was never going to be prolific at this level but he will score a few and could be the difference between Premier League and Championship next season.

UTC

CrosspoolClarets wrote:Let's be frank though, whatever Gray is he is a darn sight better than the likes of Juke and Sordell so let's be grateful we are stronger this time.

We had Danny Ings last time.

Can't pass to save his life

I'll admit waiver in the "don't think it has what it takes" camp. There's something there for sure, but he does have some flaws, and his biggest assists, his pace and strength and less are so if the PL, you need other things to your game.

I also don't like that it means we have Vokes "in the hole" no.10 role, and Gray up top, rather than Vokes up top and a "Ings" type player in the hole, like last time, asks to much of Vokes IMO.

But all three of our strikers have flaws, personally I'm a Barnes Man myself.

Gray needs an amc just behind him playing him through 1 on 1. Until he's getting that type of service it's hard to tell if he's up to it. I'd like to see a 4-5-1 with defour or hendrix just In behind gray, think defour would play some lovely waited balls through to gray.

All be it for just one game Gray looked lost up front on his own at Leicester in a 4-5-1 as he just hasnt got the ability to hold up the ball and bring the 3 supporting players into the game. Likewise Defour looked equally as poor that day playing in the hole as he doesnt get the space to pull the strings and pick passes and he isnt mobile or strong enough to link our midfield and attack together

In better teams who have more possession further up the pitch both might be able to play those roles but for Burnley Defour needs to play deeper and be the playmaker and if Gray plays he needs a partner in a 4-4-2

As a result i struggle to see them in the same team unless Hendrick or Marney plays the Boyd or Arfield role in a 4-4-2

Gray is powerful, reasonably quick, and has a vicious shot. However at this level his close control is generally poor, he regularly switches off mentally during the game, and his ability to bend his runs to evade the offside trap is lacking. Moreover he's not scoring, where in championship he was.

Bin Ont Turf wrote:In the first half a ball was played into his feet with his back to the goal, his first touch sent the ball about 8ft up in the air and about 10ft away from him.

Come on Andre!

I've been saying that his first touch is school boy level all season

[quote="JohnMac"]He shot straight at Lloris or did Lloris make a good save?

He did what all strikers should do,he hit it hard,kept it low and was on target.

bartons baggage wrote:

Agreed, it is instinctive and 9 times out of 10 it's a goal.

I have no problem with Andre.