Dyche ball and Dufour

[Blyclaret]

It's very obvious that with Dufour fit and still not playing that is a personality issue.
My opinion is that Dufour is too good of a footballer to play Dyche ball.
His is a wonderful classy midfielder and I'm afraid Dyche wants runners and long ball merchants.
Pity.

[Rileybobs]

It's very obvious that with Dufour fit and still not playing that is a personality issue.
My opinion is that Dufour is too good of a footballer to play Dyche ball.
His is a wonderful classy midfielder and I'm afraid Dyche wants runners and long ball merchants.
Pity.

What is Dyche ball? We played a lot of neat football on the deck today which suggests that you either didn't watch the game or you have an agenda to peddle. Either way you're chatting sh!t.

[Sidney1st]

What makes it obvious its a personality issue?

[Jamesy]

My daughter is more polite , she tells me I am chatting chocolate

[Newcastleclaret93]

Rileybobs you must have been watching a different game. We passed the ball neatly around the back four and occasionally to the CMs, however the majority of the game was spent chasing long hoofs.
One supporter in the cricket field stand nailed it today, it's a shame when your Goalkeeper is the teams main playmaker

[Steve1956]

Who''s Dufour?

[Blyclaret]

Why will he not play Dufour then
Btw Riley please this is a discussion
Go to playground if u want to talk like that

[evensteadiereddie]

Sounds like a dodgy firm of solicitors............

[Rileybobs]

Rileybobs you must have been watching a different game. We passed the ball neatly around the back four and occasionally to the CMs, however the majority of the game was spent chasing long hoofs.
One supporter in the cricket field stand nailed it today, it's a shame when your Goalkeeper is the teams main playmaker

I disagree, plenty of attempt to play the ball on the ground today. The long balls were generally aimed pretty accurately to Gray's feet/body, which he dealt considerably well with.

[Rileybobs]

Why will he not play Dufour then
Btw Riley please this is a discussion
Go to playground if u want to talk like that

He's called Defour.

I know it's a discussion, if I disagree with everything you've posted should I not contribute?

[fidelcastro]

Is Dufour in Sudan?

[Newcastleclaret93]

Different opinions then Riley bob.

There was absolutely zero quality from what I saw

[ClaretTony]

It's very obvious that with Dufour fit and still not playing that is a personality issue.
My opinion is that Dufour is too good of a footballer to play Dyche ball.
His is a wonderful classy midfielder and I'm afraid Dyche wants runners and long ball merchants.
Pity.

Ha ha ha - and it's Defour

[Bin Ont Turf]

[SGr]

We did play some neat football on the deck today.

Which is what confuses me the most about our continual long balls to Barnes/Gray. When we play it on the floor we get in behind and create chances, either for us to score, or that result in a corner or set piece, something we're useful at.

[Belgianclaret]

CT, would appreciate your take on Defour at present, taking into account you may have some information that can put things into some added perspective

Thxs

[Devils_Advocate]

Think we've played 6 times at home with 4-5-1 formation winning 4 and only losing unluckily against Arsenal and to Man City. Defour played in 5 of those games in his favoured position and Hendrick looked quality playing at the front of a three man midfield. In those 4 wins we scored 10 goals and played some great football.

Dyche decided to tighten things up and go back to a more rigid and defence minded 4-4-2 and to be fair the switch worked and we carried on winning.

The frustration for me now is that we have gone really stale with 4-4-2 and it is the perfect opportunity to get Defour back in a central midfield trio and get Hendrick further forward where he's looked best for us especially now we have a real attacking wide threat in Brady.

I dont expect to see the change back to 4-5-1 but i live in hope every week that we will go back to a more fluid attacking footballing formation

[kaptin1]

Interesting to watch Defour warming up on the touch line in the second half. Basically involved wandering to the corner of the Bob Lord stand to find the only bit of sunshine to stand in. Feels like his heart is no longer in it.

[Murger]

Interesting to watch Defour warming up on the touch line in the second half. Basically involved wandering to the corner of the Bob Lord stand to find the only bit of sunshine to stand in. Feels like his heart is no longer in it.

Probably baffled as to why Barton keeps getting picked ahead of him.

[claretspice]

Think we've played 6 times at home with 4-5-1 formation winning 4 and only losing unluckily against Arsenal and to Man City. Defour played in 5 of those games in his favoured position and Hendrick looked quality playing at the front of a three man midfield. In those 4 wins we scored 10 goals and played some great football.

Dyche decided to tighten things up and go back to a more rigid and defence minded 4-4-2 and to be fair the switch worked and we carried on winning.

The frustration for me now is that we have gone really stale with 4-4-2 and it is the perfect opportunity to get Defour back in a central midfield trio and get Hendrick further forward where he's looked best for us especially now we have a real attacking wide threat in Brady.

I dont expect to see the change back to 4-5-1 but i live in hope every week that we will go back to a more fluid attacking footballing formation

We went 442 to get Gray into the team to give us a greater threat in behind teams after 4-5-1 began to get a bit stale and we kept getting tonked playing 4-5-1 away from home. Given that Gray can't play as a lone striker - probably not in any set up, but certainly not in ours given that we use the ball into the target man as the platform on which to built our attacks - what you're in effect advocating is dropping Gray.

[Devils_Advocate]

I agree we went 4-4-2 to get Gray in but I think Grays role in the team is primarily a defensive one in that by being on the pitch he stops the opposition playing a high line and pressing us in our final third. Barnes role is also primarily defensive in that he is in the team for the hoof and to try and win free kicks and get us up the pitch.

With Vokes now injured then neither Barnes or Gray are good enough to play the lone striker however Gray actually looked decent today in the second half when we played the ball around on the deck and id like to give him a go as the lone striker.

I think like you say the looking weak away was a driving force for going back to 4-4-2 away but it hasnt exactly worked and our away form has still been rubbish. I think we are better suited to playing an attacking 4-5-1 at home and a tighter 4-4-2 away though without Vokes we might have missed that opportunity but we might as well give it ago with Gray cos we're looking increasingly poorer each game and I think we can get more out of Defour, Hendrick and Brady than we can out of Barnes and Gray

[Blyclaret]

Riley ur right Defour
But why the bad language
No need for it

[3putt]

We went 442 to get Gray into the team to give us a greater threat in behind teams after 4-5-1 began to get a bit stale and we kept getting tonked playing 4-5-1 away from home. Given that Gray can't play as a lone striker - probably not in any set up, but certainly not in ours given that we use the ball into the target man as the platform on which to built our attacks - what you're in effect advocating is dropping Gray.

The thing is claretspice, the way Barnes is playing, particularly yesterday, Gray is virtually playing as a lone striker. In my opinion, both Gray and and Defour should be starting, we can play a 4-5-1 but make at an attacking one. Gray would have plenty of support if Defour and Hendrick were given licence to get up the pitch and play more attacking roles.

[ablueclaret]

We've never played 4-5-1 with an attacking set-up, pace power and precision.

[ThinLizzy]

We played some nice stuff yesterday. A bit pedestrian but then we're lacking that pace and creativity down the flanks and an incisive passer in attacking midfield. Gray, as mentioned above was playing on his own up front yesterday anyway seeing as Barnes was totally nullified by Fellaini. That, when he wasn't running into the channels waiting for others to catch up. It may have gone unnoticed but Bailly intercepted a few lovely passes after some neat interchanges. He had an excellent game. I don't hold to the opinion that Gray can't plough a lone furrow on his own. We don't have wingers as such Gray isn't a target man anyway. He has the pace to feed off through balls. Watching his goals for Luton and Brentford. He scored a fair share of his goals from through balls and him playing off the last man. I don't foresee Dyche changing it but I'd go with Defour in an attacking role too. It's a moot point though as he always sticks to 'tried and tested' and we're at the business end of the season where points matter more than style.

[KRBFC]

I disagree, plenty of attempt to play the ball on the ground today. The long balls were generally aimed pretty accurately to Gray's feet/body, which he dealt considerably well with.

The only time we passed the ball was around the defence and it usually ended up in the stands for a United throw in. Like just after the goal, from kick off its passed around the defence then ends up out of play for a United throw near our corner flag. Tarkowski and Heaton both kicked if out of play multiple times

[Rileybobs]

The only time we passed the ball was around the defence and it usually ended up in the stands for a United throw in. Like just after the goal, from kick off its passed around the defence then ends up out of play for a United throw near our corner flag. Tarkowski and Heaton both kicked if out of play multiple times

46% possession and 71% pass accuracy (to Man Utd's 78%) suggests that we played a lot of ball on the deck. Heaton and Tarkowski did both kick the ball out of play a couple of times each but I'm not sure a goalkeeper playing a long-ball is something to be particularly critical of.

We figured out fairly early on that long balls to Barnes weren't effective and changed tact, playing balls into the channel for Gray. Perhaps Barnes should have been replaced with Defour at this point but that's a different matter.

Yesterday was as far removed from 'Dycheball' as we've seen this season.

[KateR]

we were poor, they were good, they knew the tactics and played against it Think player for player they have better than us on paper, money etc stats all say that to so not just my opinion, so no disgrace in the defeat. They wanted it as much as we did, they ran and showed as fit as we did, for the life in me I can not see why anyone thought/thinks bringing Defour on would have made the result different, which is what counts at the end of the day, if you are a football purist go watch/support someone else.

In fact we may have lost by more had he come on, we will never know, next game, it's one game at a time, that ones gone. Its how do we beat the next team and the one after, for four games, that's what counts, stop being reactive and be proactive, not just "I think Defour should play", I want to read some intelligent insight, why should he play the next game, how will they set up, what should our tactics be and why. Am sure SD is not sat there today thinking, I could have played Defour, then we would have won 3 - 1, he will be looking at stat's probable team selection of the opposition, videos of how they have played in the last 5/6 matches or whatever number, trying to work out how to stop them, how to exploit individual players, then taking it to the team and training.

[3putt]

we were poor, they were good, they knew the tactics and played against it Think player for player they have better than us on paper, money etc stats all say that to so not just my opinion, so no disgrace in the defeat. They wanted it as much as we did, they ran and showed as fit as we did, for the life in me I can not see why anyone thought/thinks bringing Defour on would have made the result different, which is what counts at the end of the day, if you are a football purist go watch/support someone else.

In fact we may have lost by more had he come on, we will never know, next game, it's one game at a time, that ones gone. Its how do we beat the next team and the one after, for four games, that's what counts, stop being reactive and be proactive, not just "I think Defour should play", I want to read some intelligent insight, why should he play the next game, how will they set up, what should our tactics be and why. Am sure SD is not sat there today thinking, I could have played Defour, then we would have won 3 - 1, he will be looking at stat's probable team selection of the opposition, videos of how they have played in the last 5/6 matches or whatever number, trying to work out how to stop them, how to exploit individual players, then taking it to the team and training.

I think you are completely missing the point. Clearly they are better than us on paper. They are in a completely different league to us in terms of stature and money.

I don't think anybody is saying playing Defour would of led to a different result, but we were once again clearly lacking a play maker in midfield.

The question on this thread is why isn't Defour starting in most games? He clearly is our most gifted player by some distance and we're certainly not picking up the same number of wins as we were when he was playing regularly.

If you can't recognise the class and outstanding ability that Defour has, you are watching a different game to most of us.

[CrosspoolClarets]

46% possession and 71% pass accuracy (to Man Utd's 78%) suggests that we played a lot of ball on the deck. Heaton and Tarkowski did both kick the ball out of play a couple of times each but I'm not sure a goalkeeper playing a long-ball is something to be particularly critical of.

We figured out fairly early on that long balls to Barnes weren't effective and changed tact, playing balls into the channel for Gray. Perhaps Barnes should have been replaced with Defour at this point but that's a different matter.

Yesterday was as far removed from 'Dycheball' as we've seen this season.

I agree. We went long early but then changed it and made only 74 long passes in the game. It may surprise some to know that Brady completed nearly twice as many passes in the final third (20) as anyone on the pitch. We created many of our chances (bar set pieces) through the middle. Given those three stats, having Defour there to interchange with Brady would have been a mouth watering prospect.

Sadly, he wasn't.

[lakesclaret]

Tarkowski and Heaton both kicked it out of play multiple times

Complete and utter ******** ,if you must post deluded attention seeking bullsh1t KBRFC at least get your facts right.While Tarky did put Heaton under unnecessary pressure ,to allude that they both wellied it into to the stands " multiple times" shows an outstanding talent of bellendery

[KateR]

I think you are completely missing the point. Clearly they are better than us on paper. They are in a completely different league to us in terms of stature and money.

I don't think anybody is saying playing Defour would of led to a different result, but we were once again clearly lacking a play maker in midfield.

The question on this thread is why isn't Defour starting in most games? He clearly is our most gifted player by some distance and we're certainly not picking up the same number of wins as we were when he was playing regularly.

If you can't recognise the class and outstanding ability that Defour has, you are watching a different game to most of us.

I fully understand what people are saying but by your analogy SD is watching a completely different game to most of you, isn't he? My point is to the point most are raising is that it is not about flair right now, would I like to see more flair, absolutely, but one flair player does not make a "flair team" and we are playing for survival. Therefore I can not understand all the angst as I said and why it was opened up again particularly after the MU game, I may be wrong but I can not/will not believe SD is playing him because of some personal issue as has been suggested and therefore logic dictates that he is simply not right for the team, the framework, the set up that SD wanted us to play.

I hope you can understand a little better what I am trying to say in regard to Defour, it's not like this has just happened is it, but he has played him and maybe/just maybe if we had played 1 upfront Defour would have been in the team in place of Barnes/Gray but we did not.

Also I have still not seen why he should play the next game yet from anyone but I will keep looking for that nugget in the dirt

[3putt]

3putt wrote:
I think you are completely missing the point. Clearly they are better than us on paper. They are in a completely different league to us in terms of stature and money.

I don't think anybody is saying playing Defour would of led to a different result, but we were once again clearly lacking a play maker in midfield.

The question on this thread is why isn't Defour starting in most games? He clearly is our most gifted player by some distance and we're certainly not picking up the same number of wins as we were when he was playing regularly.

If you can't recognise the class and outstanding ability that Defour has, you are watching a different game to most of us.

Kate R wrote:

I fully understand what people are saying but by your analogy SD is watching a completely different game to most of you, isn't he? My point is to the point most are raising is that it is not about flair right now, would I like to see more flair, absolutely, but one flair player does not make a "flair team" and we are playing for survival. Therefore I can not understand all the angst as I said and why it was opened up again particularly after the MU game, I may be wrong but I can not/will not believe SD is playing him because of some personal issue as has been suggested and therefore logic dictates that he is simply not right for the team, the framework, the set up that SD wanted us to play.

I hope you can understand a little better what I am trying to say in regard to Defour, it's not like this has just happened is it, but he has played him and maybe/just maybe if we had played 1 upfront Defour would have been in the team in place of Barnes/Gray but we did not.

Also I have still not seen why he should play the next game yet from anyone but I will keep looking for that nugget in the dirt



Actually SD is watching a completely different game to most of us, in respect of not playing Defour as regularly as he should.

As brilliant as SD has been for the club, it doesn't mean he is always right. He played Ben Mee as a left back for far too long when it was plain for most to see that he should of been playing in the middle.

We are sadly lacking creativity and a player who can spot and make the killer pass, Defour is the one player we have who can do this.

We were winning more games when Defour was starting and playing for his 70 minute stints. It's looking like we might just about survive (hopefully) and I believe the solid framework that SD has been applying recently has made the task of survival that bit harder.