Wasnt in the squad yesterday. Injured, rested or on his way out?

ClaretsPlayer were discussing this but didn't seem to know much about it. They think it's most likely that he picked up a niggle and has been rested to let it settle.

If he doesnt make a squad all season we will be a better team for it

I'd say he was 4th choice anyway

Devils_Advocate wrote:If he doesnt make a squad all season we will be a better team for it

Agreed. We could definitely do without his goals - especially the vital ones.

IndigoLake wrote:Agreed. We could definitely do without his goals - especially the vital ones.

Yes cos if he didnt play there is no chance whatsoever that whoever takes his place could possibly do better and scores more goals.

Devils_Advocate wrote:Yes cos if he didnt play there is no chance whatsoever that whoever takes his place could possibly do better and scores more goals.

I'm all for improving the team but you could say what you said about Ashley Barnes and apply it anywhere across the team. There's always room for improvement. I struggle to see why Ashley Barnes is under appreciated by many on this forum. Sure, he's not the most skilful player in the world. However, he offers the physicality that we need in order to survive in the Premier League. I love Sam Vokes but he doesn't put himself about anywhere near as much.

Let's face it, we weren't going to out-football teams and stay in the PL. So having players like Ashley Barnes (this season included) helps us cause them problems. Plus, he'll occasionally surprise with a nice bit of quality. Factor in that he has a habit of popping up for important goals and we've got a very useful squad player.

Devils_Advocate wrote:If he doesnt make a squad all season we will be a better team for it

Look at me, look at me.

My original post was a little tongue in cheek but like you say we should be all for improving the team.

Why Barnes, well i think we are weak up front and have 4 strikers who are at best 2nd choice and more 3rd choice strikers at this level and i think Barnes is the worst of them.

Therefore if we improve this position which I think we need to that could well see Barnes slip out of the reckoning ergo him not making the squad and us being better off for it.

Just my opinion though

A good man to come on from the bench, and he always gives it 100% and lets the opposition know that he's on the pitch...not much wrong with that.

- is Barnes going to be this season's 'target'?..

Devils_Advocate wrote:My original post was a little tongue in cheek but like you say we should be all for improving the team.

Why Barnes, well i think we are weak up front and have 4 strikers who are at best 2nd choice and more 3rd choice strikers at this level and i think Barnes is the worst of them.

Therefore if we improve this position which I think we need to that could well see Barnes slip out of the reckoning ergo him not making the squad and us being better off for it.

Just my opinion though

Fair enough. I also think we need another striker though I would like to see one who is a marked improvement on all of those we currently have in the squad. Needless to say, that would cost a fair bit of coin but we have the money to do so.

Regardless, if we do bring in another striker, I think it's more likely to be one who is of the Gray type rather than a physical target man. Whoever we bring in (if we bring in anyone at all), I still think there's a place for Gray, Vokes and Barnes depending on the opposition and our tactical setup.

Barnes is my favourite Burnley player so I'm always going to be a little biased regarding him. I like what he gives for the team and the nightmare he can be for opposition defenders. I accept he has his limitations but he wouldn't be at Burnley if he didn't!

Not a fan personally.

BUT!!!!! This season I think his type of play will be vital in grabbing us points. The way Brady has been delivering set pieces this pre season I think Barnes' unattractive style of winning free kicks could be vital for us

Barnes will be very useful this season. He offers something different and I like watching committed players.

Walters has been brought into do the Barnes role and he needs all the pre season minutes he can get. Looks overweight still.

Ash Barnes is perfect at coming on from the bench. Many players can't get into a match, as subs, he always comes on ready for action and trying to affect things. Not a starter though.

Quickenthetempo wrote:Walters has been brought into do the Barnes role and he needs all the pre season minutes he can get. Looks overweight still.

Walters didn't look overweight at his medical, so how is he now?

Doesn't look overweight to me. In fact I thought he looked in decent condition.

Quicknick wrote:Walters didn't look overweight at his medical, so how is he now?

The simple answer is that he is not overweight.

Walters does look a big lad, but to be fair to him he also looks very mobile too.

Quickenthetempo wrote:Walters has been brought into do the Barnes role and he needs all the pre season minutes he can get. Looks overweight still.

Are you serious? I can assure you he'd be nowhere near the pitch if he was overweight or unfit.

As for this thread, did we get one similar for Ashley Westwood after Tuesday's game when he wasn't in the squad? I'd presume, like that one, Barnes' absence could have been a precaution.

That's why I asked if he had been rested.

I remember Stoke at home last season when we were 1 up but they were looking far more likely to score than we did. Barnes came on and totally messed Stoke up and we got a well needed 3 points. It's games like those why we need Barnes. I know we need to get upgrades over time nut AB is just fine being in our squad.

Our strike force isnt shaping up to good by the looks of it. We've got Barnes whose game is mainly made up of fouling and diving with little quality on the ball, we have Gray the one trick pony who doesnt want to be here and Walters who just looks old and fat.

That leaves a lot resting on the shoulders of Vokes and im not sure he is good enough at this level to carry the other three. Hopefully Dyche will sort things out by the end of the window and get a top quality striker into the club

Between Vokes, Barnes and Gray last season, didn't they manage 25/26 goals? That's not too bad from a striker who doesn't want to be here (no idea when AG has come out publicly stating this but assume he rang you personally DA?) and two strikers who aren't up to it at this level?!

Together with the Walters is fat comment I think I can safely, 100% disagree with your entire post #23.

What Gray not wanting to be here this season has to do with him scoring goals last season I do not know. Also i did not state Vokes is not up to it just that he isnt up to carrying the other three.

Apart from that I wholeheartedly accept your disagreement

Barnes is very good on the ball. Far better than many of our other players.

Barnes is my favourite current Burnley player. He winds the opposition up no end and is the best in the world at winning free kicks high up the pitch!!
Kind of player you like if he plays for you but would hate otherwise.

Devils_Advocate wrote:If he doesnt make a squad all season we will be a better team for it

Doubt that

His 10 minute cameo to close out the win v Stoke was a joy to behold.

Barnes is our best forward technically speaking. His return is close to vokes' and work rate / defensive contribution higher.

it would be suicide to let Ashley go anywhere imho

Goodclaret wrote:I remember Stoke at home last season when we were 1 up but they were looking far more likely to score than we did. Barnes came on and totally messed Stoke up and we got a well needed 3 points. It's games like those why we need Barnes. I know we need to get upgrades over time nut AB is just fine being in our squad.

I remember that game well. Barnes was brilliant - completely disrupted the flow of the game for them and gave Martins Indi in particular a torrid time. Helped secure a very valuable 3 points that day.

Regardless of any new formations or tactics, Barnes is a very important option to the squad.

To suggest that he should leave is nonsense.

I like Ashley Barnes.

Really don't see much from Walters that improves our striking options

Only the bottom 3 clubs scored less goals than us last season - yes, that was enough for safety, but this is an area of concern for me

That's cause we didn't create enough chances, with an on form Brady, Defour and JBG we will create more I feel

I would suggest a vastly upgraded midfield with the signing of Cork; Defour, Hendrick, Westwood and Brady having had a proper SD pre-season alongside Arfield and Gudmundsson will provide much better service to our strikers as well as being able to provide support to them.

I fancy we will score more consistently this season but will also take a couple of big defeats and see fewer clean sheets.

Ashley Barnes can be a very useful player. Depends on the opposition and the state of the game. Defenders nightmare is Barnes. Bit of a marked man now with the refs who give more against him than for him.

Ashley Barnes can be a very useful player. Depends on the opposition and the state of the game. Defenders nightmare is Barnes. Bit of a marked man now with the refs who give more against him than for him.

jojomk1 wrote:Really don't see much from Walters that improves our striking options

Only the bottom 3 clubs scored less goals than us last season - yes, that was enough for safety, but this is an area of concern for me

Particularly as I don't see how our defence isn't anything but weakened.

Hope Ash is OK. For me he'd be in the starting 11 v Chelsea.

gawthorpe_view wrote:I like Ashley Barnes.

Me too.

We aren't going to get anything at chelsea by playing football, so we must roll out plan B. Barnes is the man to spread the fear of lighting into the chelsea back 4.

When you play against Ashley Barnes you certainly no you have been in a game, ask any EPL defender

Our bargain buy in our current team.Ash is a great competitor and will be an integral part of our team.
I would play him upfront v Chelsea they hate to face him.
Also Ash can bring others into play

A shame wotisname (Matic?) has left Chelsea for Manyoo, there could have been some decent sport to be had.

I thought Walters looked overweight when I first saw him warming up at Preston, but then I realised he's just absolutely stacked. As with the rest of our squad, he'll be as fit as a fiddle.

Whether we use Walters off Gray, or wide on the right, I'm do think he'll be a real asset for us this season. He should offer us a slightly more refined version of Barnes' mobile target man option if he plays off the front, being a pest and a nuisance out of possession but offering a touch more quality on the ball than Barnes tends to offer. If he plays wide right, he'll offer us an option to hold the ball up in wide areas which might allow us to play a 4-5-1 with Gray as the lone striker.

As for the strikers, I'll have a guess that few, if any, of the teams in the bottom half of the table had strikers who managed more than 26 goals between them last season. Our biggest failing last season was (i) we didn't create enough chances last season, and (ii) we didn't score enough goals from midfield last season. Walters will help with (i) (I think he'll provide a better through ball to Gray when their on the pitch at the same time than Barnes or (to a lesser extent) Vokes ever managed - that was a failing last season when we played 4-4-2), as will the fact Brady has had a full pre-season. And all of Brady, Hendrick and Defour should be targeting 5 league goals this season. If they do that, and the strikers only match last season's total, then we'll have 41 goals, before the centre backs, other wide players and so on have chipped in.

Just saying "oh we didn't score enough goals, that's the strikers' fault" is basic football illiteracy.

IndigoLake wrote:Ashley Barnes is under appreciated by many on this forum. Sure, he's not the most skilful player in the world.

Actually, Ashley has pretty good control and an ability to shoot and head. Much better than Gray, for instance.

I like Ashley Barnes, loved it when he made Ivanovic cry, and Matic...enough said.
Also where was it when he got fouled in the box, just got up and crossed for a goal? Proper player, no frills

IanMcL wrote:Actually, Ashley has pretty good control and an ability to shoot and head. Much better than Gray, for instance.

Agreed. Technically he is better than Vokes or Gray. They have other strengths that Ash doesn't, but we would be mad to lose him.

boatshed bill wrote:I like Ashley Barnes, loved it when he made Ivanovic cry, and Matic...enough said.
Also where was it when he got fouled in the box, just got up and crossed for a goal? Proper player, no frills

West Brom at home I think that was