Anyone notice what Ben did when Hudders scored last night ? Seems he has become more of a captain since taking the arm band off.

No

Vegas Claret wrote:Anyone notice what Ben did when Hudders scored last night ? Seems he has become more of a captain since taking the arm band off.

Yes I noticed he was deflecting responsibility as Mounie was his man

He absolutely layed into Taylor, but I definitely thought it was Mee who had allowed Mounie too much room and couldn't get his head to the ball. As with all work place cock ups, if you mess up shout loudly at the nearest person!

I think he was angry that Taylor should be covering behind him ie the far post area and he got caught ball watching and finished on the wrong side of the forward

Dark Cloud wrote:He absolutely layed into Taylor, but I definitely thought it was Mee who had allowed Mounie too much room and couldn't get his head to the ball. As with all work place cock ups, if you mess up shout loudly at the nearest person!

Cock Up in the work place making a mess then shouting loudly at the nearest person...

Bet your Office is a hoot

Bosscat wrote:Cock Up in the work place making a mess then shouting loudly at the nearest person...

Bet your Office is a hoot

Well, he does work in an owl sanctuary.

claretgimmer wrote:I think he was angry that Taylor should be covering behind him ie the far post area and he got caught ball watching and finished on the wrong side of the forward

This was my interpretation too. Mounie was behind Mee, so it was Taylor's responsibility to either deal with it or make Mee aware - he did neither, he's still learning that role in the Prem - some slack needed as he will get better.

Mee's man-marking positioning in defence has been poor this season.

Mee knew Mounie was there as he was watching him prior to the ball coming inbut then he seemed to switch off the man and focus on the ball.
Taylor notice Mounie too late to be able to get the challenge in. All in all it was just a ball delivered into exactly the right place as is was too far out for Heaton and right in between the two defenders. Best not to dwell as it didn't cost us and I'm sure Dyche will have noticed and given his feedback on it.

What concerned me more was the amount of time afforded to mpenza to deliver that cross. I think Westwood was the man nearest to him. He has to get tighter in that situation. He had a good game though so I don't want to be too critical.

Dark Cloud wrote:He absolutely layed into Taylor, but I definitely thought it was Mee who had allowed Mounie too much room and couldn't get his head to the ball. As with all work place cock ups, if you mess up shout loudly at the nearest person!

That’s good leadership skills according to the OP.

TheFamilyCat wrote:That’s good leadership skills according to the OP.

Text book I'd say!!

Anyone who thinks that the goal was Mee's fault has never played football. Taylors fault all day long

We won,get over it and give Mee a break..

TBF I actually thought Heaton was more than a little to blame. He threw the ball out when most people were expecting him to hold on to it. Admittedly he was trying to get us onto a quick counter attack, but we lost it really easily and weren't set up properly when they came back at us. (Or maybe I'm being too kind to Mee?)

Funny I saw him shout in Heatons direction first. After looking at the replay think he had a point Pope would have claimed that. Tarky was the one that had a go at Taylor, he practically screamed in his face on the way back to the centre. Those saying it was Mee's man clearly haven't grasped the way we defend. The full back should have been tight enough to atleast jump with the player running in Taylor was caught napping, Heaton could have come off his line to deal with the cross but last time he did that and Ben was nearby he dislocated his shoulder...

Mee is yesterday’s man imo he’s error prone and has been poor for most of the season ,not to say he’s not a very intelligent footballer and a good defender though .Gibson needs a run really . Not entirely Mee’s fault for the goal though as Taylor was all over the shop . Heaton did a monster attack throw which we lost possession of and they worked it a little too easily down the left .

you've all missed the point - when was the last time we conceded a goal and we saw any bollocking be handed out. Big change has happened

And that would have been high risk for any keeper to claim as was quite plain and simply the defenders job . Though you do see Lloris go for those where he clatters in ( often fails to take) then goes down immediately in a heap and inevitably gets the decision

Always sh#ts the life out of me when mee has time on the ball you just know he's going to try a difficult pass instead of playing it simple and give the ball away and put us under unnecessary pressure at least once every game , Gibson all day long for me

Safron wrote:Gibson all day long for me

So is it Gibson or Long you want for Mee?

This notion of laying the blame for everything at Ben Mee’s feet is ridiculous.

It was either Taylor’s or Heaton’s ball to win for their goal last night.

But it's mee,s overall sloppiness this season which needs addressing he constantly ball watches not a patch on his previous seasons

Safron wrote:But it's mee,s overall sloppiness this season which needs addressing he constantly ball watches not a patch on his previous seasons

Whilst he hadn't been as good as previous seasons I think apart from the Everton game he has been decent from start of December. People are jumping on anything he does. Yesterday he played well apart from one pass putting us under pressure. Tarky did two of those bad passes yet they barely got mentioned in ratings. The goal was for Heaton or Taylor to deal with as it was lifted over him. Give the lad a break or atleast be consistent in criticism of players.

I’m getting peed off with the sh1t Mee is taking on here. Every tiny lapse is highlighted whilst others get away with murder. It all comes from him holding out for the best contract he could get and is pathetic. He’s not an England class defender but he has been a great servant and deserves some respect. As SD is a defence first coach he wouldn’t be in there unless he thought he was the best man for the job.
They all make ricks, live with it.
It was his man and he should have been tighter but he also had the right to expect Taylor to be covering. We won, move on.

If Ben thought it was Taylors' job to cover anyone running in behind then who was Ben marking? Answer- no one - he was watching the ball / game but unlike the rest of us he had a premium view stood in the six yard box.

atlantalad wrote:If Ben thought it was Taylors' job to cover anyone running in behind then who was Ben marking? Answer- no one - he was watching the ball / game but unlike the rest of us he had a premium view stood in the six yard box.

nope, that's not how defending works, you stay in a space and deal with the ball when it comes into that space - you never heard Dyche talk about shape ? That's what he is on about - you simply cannot man mark everyone on the pitch

Vegas Claret wrote:nope, that's not how defending works, you stay in a space and deal with the ball when it comes into that space - you never heard Dyche talk about shape ? That's what he is on about - you simply cannot man mark everyone on the pitch

Taylor, as a full back, was behind the centre forward which was always going to give Mounie the advantage as he was goal-side of the man. Taylor should have been tighter but ultimately that was Mee’s ball to deal with.

Strewth, wait until we drop a proper clanger eh? It was a brilliant cross, whipped in at pace landing right on Mounie's head.. who for once managed to bury it with a perfectly placed header. It was a really good goal.

I can't say I saw it live and thought, s**t, what the hell is Taylor / Mee / Heaton doing there.

Vegas Claret wrote:nope, that's not how defending works, you stay in a space and deal with the ball when it comes into that space - you never heard Dyche talk about shape ? That's what he is on about - you simply cannot man mark everyone on the pitch

Keeping shape is all well and good but sometimes players need to use a bit of common sense. I've seen a post score a goal, a bar score a goal, a beach ball score a goal and even a dog score a goal(video clip) but I've never seen open "space" score a goal. Ben glanced around before the cross came in and saw Mounie coming in but decided not to move closer to him despite the fact there was no other player for him to pickup. I guess he decided you know what, I will just mark this "space" in case it has an attempt on goal.

NottsClaret wrote:Strewth, wait until we drop a proper clanger eh? It was a brilliant cross, whipped in at pace landing right on Mounie's head.. who for once managed to bury it with a perfectly placed header. It was a really good goal.

I can't say I saw it live and thought, s**t, what the hell is Taylor / Mee / Heaton doing there.

Totally agree with your analysis. So why did Ben berate Taylor/Heaton? May be thought himself was guilty ball watching and wanted to deflect blame? It sends bad vibes to so publicly berate team mates.

Vegas Claret wrote:nope, that's not how defending works, you stay in a space and deal with the ball when it comes into that space - you never heard Dyche talk about shape ? That's what he is on about - you simply cannot man mark everyone on the pitch

No point keeping shape if you’re leaving the opposition a free header. Shape is a starting position. Once the play develops, you have to track your man if the danger is close enough to goal. Mee didn’t track. Taylor was too wide. Heaton was too deep. Westwood lost the ball too easily. Cork wasn’t covering. JBG and Bardsley got caught following the dummy runs. Tarks was too tall. Wood was too Southern. Barnes fell over. McNeil was having an afternoon nap.
You can find blame anywhere if you look hard enough. But you absolutely cannot allow attackers that much space in the box. That is a certainty

I get all the arguments and its a great cross but its one striker in the box attacking it and three Burnley players could all do something about it.

We need to defend them better full stop.

Goobs wrote: was too far out for Heaton

Yet if it was Hart we'd all be saying he should have had it...

conyoviejo wrote:We won,get over it and give Mee a break..

too many slagging players off.

The Buzz from the crowd increased against Wet Spam and we got our rewards. stop trying to drag us down would be my advice to the constant moaners

deanothedino wrote:Yet if it was Hart we'd all be saying he should have had it...

Maybe some would but not me (still think he could have come for the Everton one, but I am sure that was nearer the goal / an easier claim). I was one of those who defended Hart on here although as I said before the WHU game we had changed just about everything else so maybe a change of GK was needed.

Out of the three my order of preference is currently Pope, Heaton, Hart, however like Hart, Heaton has done nothing wrong since he came in, however performances in front of him have improved (whether this is down to him being a master organiser / the team are happier and more confident with him there / luck or a combination of the three I'll leave for others to argue).

Bin Ont Turf wrote:So is it Gibson or Long you want for Mee?

Do you think they'll notice if we play with 11 outfield players?

Before the cross came in we were watching Taylor and he was wandering slowly toward the corner flag. I remember saying as the cross came in that it felt dangerous. I think Ben thought there was less room there than there was for Mounie and he was surprised to see Taylor where he was.

I’m not knocking Taylor per se, it would be a minor error, but he hasn’t proven he can do it at this level yet, whereas Mee has proven he can.

I think Mee wasn't in the best position for the cross.
He should have been alongside their forward if not a little in front and then he could
have defended the ball in better rather than have it go over him.

Mee has been a great servant to the club but has looked a tad slow and out of position
at times this season. I think Gibson is probably a better centre half than Mee
and could form a decent partnership with Tarks if given the opportunity.