I hardly ever start new threads, but I'm surprised this has escaped attention on here. Having closely followed this for a week, it now looks nearly certain Thomas Cook is about to collapse, probably within 24h. Rescue planes are being mobilised this evening. This is quite a serious event.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49790609" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Anyone currently on a Thomas Cook holiday? Or about to have one? What's happening? There are tales coming out of Tunisia of guests being barricaded in their hotels unless they pay for their hotel again, having already paid Thomas Cook for it once (the ones that did pay up were refunded by Thomas Cook on this occasion, but that probably won't happen once it has collapsed). Anybody wondering if this will be repeated at their hotel, and if so, any plan as to what you'd do if it did?

I went into Thomas Cook about 1 week ago just to inquire about a honeymoon in Thailand

And then I went back in a few days later to say that I had changed my mind

The holiday they had lined up for me would have cost me over £4000

And I was told that the money would have to be paid at same time as booking which I thought was a bit strange and now I think it was very wrong of them

My brothers going with them on wednesday.

Great shame. Had some excellent holidays with Thomas Cook. Always used them if we go further afield. And had excellent service every single time. Especially from the one in burnley next to Natwest.

Be a real shame for a lot of people. Holiday makers and staff.

To be fair. With the advent if skyscanner. Booking.com airbnb etc im not that surprised.

The Indy are now reporting it has indeed gone into administration (10 minutes after my post), and no more flights will take place.

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/ne ... 16031.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This is shocking, it really is.

If it be your will wrote:The Indy are now reporting it has indeed gone into administration (10 minutes after my post), and no more flights will take place.

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/ne ... 16031.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This is shocking, it really is.

Will abta cover people losing holidays?

great business strategy from tunisians !
just start getting bookings building up after the devastating slump due to terror attacks, then treat tourists like **** the minute there is a delay with monies owed.
Disgrace, and shameful.

Wile E Coyote wrote:great business strategy from tunisians !
just start getting bookings building up after the devastating slump due to terror attacks, then treat tourists like **** the minute there is a delay with monies owed.
Disgrace, and shameful.

Tbf its probably just media trying to dramatise it

cricketfieldclarets wrote:Will abta cover people losing holidays?

Mainly Atol (I had to quickly look up the difference https://www.thesun.co.uk/travel/8487872 ... abta-atol/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ) They will cover all pre-booked (for a refund - not a fulfillment of the holiday) or current holidays (to their conclusion).

But flight only, separately paid events, separately paid car hire etc and you're relying on credit card refunds or travel insurance. The Indy article has more details.

cricketfieldclarets wrote:Will abta cover people losing holidays?

Package holidays yes (atol is it) but if youve booked hotels and flights individually and built your own holiday I think its down to your personal holiday insurance

cricketfieldclarets wrote:Tbf its probably just media trying to dramatise it

doubt it, there were interviews with hotel guests on BBC today.

Pretty sure hes booked a package.

That said will probably take longer to get his money than we did for ings.

Sad but their business model is dieing. Some people go to a travel agent still but not many. More people (most?) prefer to sort out their own arrangements which avoids all the cost of staff, stores, tour guides, meeters and greeters etc.

An uncontrolled collapse like this, however, is horrible for nearly everyone involved.

The website is still selling holidays https://www.thomascook.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I've a feeling the Independent might have jumped the gun here. No one else is reporting what they have. I wasn't aware it was going to collapse within 10 minutes of my opening post.

If it be your will wrote:The website is still selling holidays

Making them available, yes. I'd be surprised if they were selling many.

It did say the other day on BBC news that if they went into administration it would be announced on Sunday evening for some reason or other

thatdberight wrote:Sad but their business model is dieing. Some people go to a travel agent still but not many. More people (most?) prefer to sort out their own arrangements which avoids all the cost of staff, stores, tour guides, meeters and greeters etc.

An uncontrolled collapse like this, however, is horrible for nearly everyone involved.

Correct. I was booking a £6500 holiday to mexico 3 years ago and when i went in store it was £100 dearer as the lass said she could not apply the online discount.
these companies are the maker of their own downfall

chipbutty wrote:Correct. I was booking a £6500 holiday to mexico 3 years ago and when i went in store it was £100 dearer as the lass said she could not apply the online discount.
these companies are the maker of their own downfall

I think the fact we can all get the knowledge which was the exclusive preserve of the travel agent is their downfall. I can find flights to Mexico. I can find places to stay in Mexico and compare them. I can find different options for whatever else I need. What would I pay Thomas Cook for?

They reckon 2am will be the choice of time to announce it, as all planes will be grounded for the night.

It will cost over the 200m needed to save it to fly everyone back.

The Guardian saying that yes, it is going bust, flights have been pulled from the websites.

All this should be on the Brexit thread really

Quickenthetempo wrote:It will cost over the 200m needed to save it to fly everyone back.

Are you suggesting ATOL should cash in their funds and invest?

thatdberight wrote:I think the fact we can all get the knowledge which was the exclusive preserve of the travel agent is their downfall. I can find flights to Mexico. I can find places to stay in Mexico and compare them. I can find different options for whatever else I need. What would I pay Thomas Cook for?

Always used them for more exclusive or further afield holidays to get their insight and experience. Sometimes better paying for that than saving a few quid.

We can buy pretty much anything doing it our own. Cars. Houses. Clothes. Whatever. But usually still use the tried and tested methods for bigger investments.

Quickenthetempo wrote:They reckon 2am will be the choice of time to announce it, as all planes will be grounded for the night.

It will cost over the 200m needed to save it to fly everyone back.

That makes sense, otherwise ground staff might not turn up.

This looks interesting: https://twitter.com/flightradar24/statu ... 9391809536" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It looks like they're all coming home, though lower down the twitter thread people are saying this is normal for Sunday evening.

thatdberight wrote:Are you suggesting ATOL should cash in their funds and invest?

I was more thinking of the people stranded without travel insurance that the government will have to get back.

It the all company affected? Used TC airlines a lot of the past few years. £280 returns to NYC or £360 returns to LA. Even their one way flights were crazy cheap.

TC's financial difficulties have been commented on for a few days on the Naked Brexit thread. Media has been reporting from wed/thurs onwards.

TC has 22,000 employees, 9,000 in the UK - larger number in Germany and Scandinavia. It runs it's own hotels as well as airline and the travel agents.

It's been in financial difficulties for several years - too much debt. 30-Sept it's ATOL bond expires - at it seems it was struggling to be able to put a new bond in place.

It's been reported that 150,000 UK customers would be overseas and gov't would need to arrange flights home (I'm not sure how much ATOL would cover). There are also 500,000 other customers, mainly German and Scandinavian.

There've been various costs reported for repatriating 150,000 UK customers, £600 million, £200 million and £100 million are the figures I've seen. I've no idea how these figures are worked out. £600m = £4,000 per passenger. £100m = £667 per passenger. Where are all these passengers staying? Are they all in Thailand and similar long distance locations? Or, are they all asking for upgrades to first class? £100m sounds like a decent estimate. Based on Dyche's £380 LA return, maybe even £100m is on the high side.

Wile E Coyote wrote:great business strategy from tunisians !
just start getting bookings building up after the devastating slump due to terror attacks, then treat tourists like **** the minute there is a delay with monies owed.
Disgrace, and shameful.

I wouldn't be too critical of the hotel owners. They've supplied the hotel rooms on trust that TC will pay them. Would you continue to supply when you know you are no longer going to be paid?

Maybe the question should be, why do TC and the like take payment from customers and don't immediately pay the bill to the hotels?

Paul Waine wrote:I wouldn't be too critical of the hotel owners. They've supplied the hotel rooms on trust that TC will pay them. Would you continue to supply when you know you are no longer going to be paid?

Maybe the question should be, why do TC and the like take payment from customers and don't immediately pay the bill to the hotels?

I don't have the spine for this capitalism lark. If I owned a hotel, and I had guests that had paid up fair and square, there's no way I would imprison them in my hotel and demand they pay again! Not even if it meant I otherwise went bankrupt!

Some things you just don't do, surely?

Sympathies for the potential thousands losing their jobs. Interesting to see the next moves from TUI and jet2

My daughter and husband flew to Vegas with tc yesterday. Sounds like they might be here for some time ! Let’s see what happens

I expected the demise much sooner tbh - they did post losses of £1.5 Billion in May!!

It's gone.

Last one out please turn off the lights.

A TC flight is due into Manchester in 15 mins from Antalya. So they've been lucky, as the 4 hour flight has been in the air when the company has collapsed.

I walked past a branch yesterday and was amazed to see customers inside, although they could well have existing customers concerned about their booking rather than new customers booking holidays.

can’t say I’m surprised that TC has gone. They have been struggling for at least the last 10-12 years. No doubt Brexit is going to take some proportion of the blame just to maximise political point scoring.

Inevitable really. The traditional package holiday isn’t as popular as it was 15 years ago, and the boom in budget airlines, and services like Expedia have further marginalised the old-fashioned travel agent.

I suspect there will still be a market for high end, online travel agents. I would be happy to book a family holiday to Disneyland through Virgin Atlantic so that everything is covered, but I wouldn’t use a travel agent to book a week in Spain any more.

We are, or should I say were due to fly to the Canaries in October. Package booking but with TC as the airline. Early notification from the travel company is that either they will source a replacement airline or we will receive a full refund through ATOL. I would guess that there will be airlines that will take up the opportunity to fill any vacant seats they have on their flights, just have to wait and see how it all pans out.

Sure there was a thread on this already

If you think this is all to do with Brexit, you are wrong as TC have been running a out of date travel model for a while

If you think this is nothing to do with Brexit, you are wrong as its abundantly clear that its finished them off.

Either way, its 9000 people who haven't got a job anymore and that is pretty shite.

Quite worrying as well that Johnson didn't want to bail them out as it would set a "precedent for failed firms"

Be interesting if he sticks to that after Oct 31st to put it mildly

They were looking for a £200m bale out from the Government which they didn't get. Now 9000 people are out of work. We helped out the Banks so why couldn't Boris the Buffoon help out TC.

Corky wrote:They were looking for a £200m bale out from the Government which they didn't get. Now 9000 people are out of work. We helped out the Banks so why couldn't Boris the Buffoon help out TC.

I’m certainly no defender of this government, but banks are central to the way our economy, and entire country operates. Thomas Cook isn’t.

If it be your will wrote:I don't have the spine for this capitalism lark. If I owned a hotel, and I had guests that had paid up fair and square, there's no way I would imprison them in my hotel and demand they pay again! Not even if it meant I otherwise went bankrupt!

Some things you just don't do, surely?

Hi iibyw, it's always one of those conundrums. The holiday makers have paid the travel agency, but the travel agency hasn't paid the hotel. Closing the gates is not a solution. Putting your own hotel business at risk is also not a solution, all your hotel staff would lose their jobs and all future hotel guests would lose their holidays. Hotels insuring against non-payment by the travel agency paid be a solution - until the insurance companies decide that Thomas Cook is not insurable. Holiday makers should always have their own travel insurance against their travel agency failing - and it would also cover all the other "unexpected costs" of something going wrong on holiday. Before the internet, travel agents would commonly include travel insurance in your package. We also have the credit card rule, so using your credit card to pay for even part of the booking allows (>£100) you to reclaim from the credit card company. The card companies often protect themselves against this risk by not paying the money they've rec'd to the travel agent (or airline) until the holiday has taken place. It will be interesting how much the credit card companies are holding that is due to TC and is available for release to pay the hotel bills and the rest...

Corky wrote:They were looking for a £200m bale out from the Government which they didn't get. Now 9000 people are out of work. We helped out the Banks so why couldn't Boris the Buffoon help out TC.

At what point do you draw a line though?

Banks are slightly different due to the amount of money they have that belongs to normal people and businesses.

A travel agent isn't anything other then just that.
£200 million wasn't going to be enough to save TC either in the long term, they were knackered.

Lancaster sums it up perfectly.

Corky wrote:They were looking for a £200m bale out from the Government which they didn't get. Now 9000 people are out of work. We helped out the Banks so why couldn't Boris the Buffoon help out TC.

Basically, bailing out the banks saved all of us with money deposited in the banks, plus all the mortgages, plus the functioning of the economy. Don't forget the biggest part of the bail out was RBS and Lloyds who were taken into state ownership. The shareholders of the banks lost pretty much everything - they weren't bailed out.

Amazing how a failed business model manages to get 150,000.00 people to book a holiday with them?

I am sure that the cost of hiring planes and repatriating all of these people currently on a Thomas Cook holiday will not leave much change out of £200m.

I think the credit card companies held back about £5o million. TC we’re trying to get them to release it

The £200m would just have been a stopgap.

Very sad for the staff.

With around 2000 betting shops set for closure nationwide, and now the loss of Thomas Cook branches, there will be a few more column inches and TV documentaries focusing on Britain's "disappearing" High Streets.

kentonclaret wrote:Amazing how a failed business model manages to get 150,000.00 people to book a holiday with them?

I am sure that the cost of hiring planes and repatriating all of these people currently on a Thomas Cook holiday will not leave much change out of £200m.

Just getting bookings isn't a business model. You have to make a profit?

If your second point is a suggestion that the government should have thrown money into a Thomas Cook shaped hole instead of spending it on a government function - bringing back people stranded abroad - I don't know why they'd do that. Thomas Cook was not a national asset; just a travel agent.

kentonclaret wrote:With around 2000 betting shops set for closure nationwide, and now the loss of Thomas Cook branches, there will be a few more column inches and TV documentaries focusing on Britain's "disappearing" High Streets.

If we lost all the betting shops and their online presences we wouldn't have lost anything of value.

As for high streets, no point bemoaning their loss any more than crying that the local blacksmith, fletcher and cooper aren't in your vicinity any more. Time's moved on.

Bring back the herbalist shops and take me back to the 1960's I can't cope with modern life any more.