Obviously overshadowed by current events but they will supposedly have a new leader on Saturday. The fact that it’s taken them four months to elect the new leader just about beggars belief. Who will win, I wonder? I personally sense a behind close doors stitch up.

Who?

Can't see this one getting much air time.

As long as Mr C goes, it will be a step forward.

I reckon they have forgotten. Conveniently allowing Jezza to stay in control.
Long may this continue to happen for the good of the UK

Tubeworm Woman was on Question Time tonight.

Still interested in getting elected then... A surprise but we need a functioning opposition so it's good.

Elected as new leader of Labour party.(BBC)
Angela Rayner deputy leader.

Well surprise, surprise. After all this time it's Keir Starmer. Who'd a thought it!
Why did it take 3 months for such a foregone conclusion to be reached?
Meanwhile we've effectively had no official opposition,

Good news at least.

Bordeauxclaret wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 11:00 am

Good news at least.

Good news at last!

So the Labour membership are keen to be electable? Who knew?

No more Mr C. Hooray.

Well it took long enough but hopefully Kier Starmer can finally get rid of the filth that has taken over his party over the last few years.

Great result for labour a proper leader

They should rebrand the Labour party just like Blair did with 'New Labour', maybe they could call it 'London Labour Pressure Group' because this guy Starmer isn't going to win back Scotland, he's not going to get votes in the North the only area where they are going to strengthen their vote is in London.

This is the guy that came up with Labour's Brexit policy at the last election, which was to negotiate a deal with the EU then have a referendum on that deal, a deal which he would have voted against.

The wilderness years will continue for Labour.

Hopefully they will now distance themselves from the momentum loons, and give everyone an alternative to the Tories

I see the Sun is already attacking Starmer and looking at ways to smear him before he started.

The right wing press will be doing a real hatchet job on him to make sure the Tory's don't have any opposition and the idiots who lack any critical thinking skills will just lap it up and let it become their new truth

Well done to Starmer on winning. Hope that he now forms a credible shadow cabinet. Good luck.

With Diane Abbott as Shadow Chancellor !!

Sir Keir Starmer? How dare they? Absolutely sexist. Some labour women will be throwing themselves under virtual horses this afternoon.

In a brave, decisive and revolutionary move, the Labour party has elected a male, white, middle class, privately educated Knight of the Realm as Leader. The previous Leader's Constituency of Islington North is right next to Holborn & St.Pancras ....

More seriously, we now have a mainstream Centre-left Leader, up against a party who's Committees and their Chairs, are now largely controlled by the ideological far left, " Momentum " types. It may get messy .... pass the popcorn

Clarets4me wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:05 pm

In a brave, decisive and revolutionary move, the Labour party has elected a male, white, middle class, privately educated Knight of the Realm as Leader. The previous Leader's Constituency of Islington North is right next to Holborn & St.Pancras ....

More seriously, we now have a mainstream Centre-left Leader, up against a party who's Committees and their Chairs, are now largely controlled by the ideological far left, " Momentum " types. It may get messy .... pass the popcorn

Yep. It’s not just anti semitism he needs to root out...

Damo wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:36 pm

Hopefully they will now distance themselves from the momentum loons, and give everyone an alternative to the Tories

Hopefully although that could be harder than expected.

Momentum 'to hold Keir Starmer to account'
The Momentum campaign, which as we were saying earlier backed Rebecca Long-Bailey, has congratulated Keir Starmer and Angela Rayner on their victories.

A spokesperson said the group looks forward to working with them to elect a Labour government will "bold, transformational policies".

They added they would like to thank Mrs Long-Bailey for running a "principled, left wing campaign full of big ideas".

But the group notes that Sir Keir has pledged support for "most of the programme" endorsed by Jeremy Corbyn - and calls on him to appoint a "broad shadow cabinet who believe in the policies".

And they say: "We’ll hold Keir to account and make sure he keeps his promises."

This is the verdict of Paul Waugh, the Huffington Post's executive editor for politics,.

Although this might help Keir in his quest to bring the Labour Party back to credibility.

Victory for Starmer supporters on ruling body
Away from the main contests, there will also be changes today to the make-up of the National Executive Committee, Labour’s ruling body.

Sir Keir's supporters have won effective control of the body following victories in a series of separate elections.

BBC political editor Laura Kuenssberg reports that Sir Keir's team are delighted with the results, which they didn't expect at the start.

She adds that trying to run the party without control of the NEC is hard, as Jeremy Corbyn team found out before they won control in 2017 polls.

I have severe doubts about Rayner as deputy,but as long as Starmer appoints a sensible shadow cabinet,her influence shouldn't unduly matter.

mikeS wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:56 pm

Well done to Starmer on winning. Hope that he now forms a credible shadow cabinet. Good luck.

We'll find out soon,but the early signs are promising.

Shadow cabinet appointments expected tomorrow
Now Sir Keir Starmer is in charge of the Labour Party, the next step is to appoint his new top team.

BBC political editor Laura Kuenssberg says we can expect the first appointments to come tomorrow...

More on shadow cabinet...
Our political editor says that during the campaign, Sir Keir Starmer promised jobs for the others in the leadership race in his shadow cabinet.

She adds: "It sounds like he will favour the rising generation for big jobs, rather than bringing back people who have already had ministerial experience into big roles, but let's see.

"The rumour mill is turning already.

The advantage for Starmer and Labour is the next election is at least 4 years hence,so anybody appointed to the shadow cabinet has plenty of time to learn their brief before taking office,if Labour triumph in 2024.

It's just a relief to finally have grown-up politics from the left again,already Stamer is offering to assist the sitting government during a period of national crisis,this is what the country needs right now,practical decision making,and not opposition for opposition's sake.

Will i vote for Labour in 2024 IDK,but i'll consider it,would i have ever voted for a Corbyn led Labour,not on your Nelly Furtado.

Devils_Advocate wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:47 pm

I see the Sun is already attacking Starmer and looking at ways to smear him before he started.

The right wing press will be doing a real hatchet job on him to make sure the Tory's don't have any opposition and the idiots who lack any critical thinking skills will just lap it up and let it become their new truth

Play the ball,not the man,i wouldn't expect anything less from the Sun,but they'll find it much harder to smear Keir Starmer,than Jeremy Corbyn.

For context his 10 proposals, are as follows.

Sir Keir Starmer has won the Labour leadership election, but what pledges did he make in his campaign?

The former shadow Brexit secretary published a list of 10 proposals, and here are the first five:

Economy: An increase to income tax for the top 5% of earners, a reversal of Tory cuts in corporation tax, and a clamp down on tax avoidance, particularly of large corporations.

I'd agree with a lot of this,how you could enforce these measures in practice is the difficult part.

Social issues: Abolish Universal Credit, set a national goal for wellbeing to make health as important as GDP, investment into preventative science, support the abolition of tuition fees, investment in “lifelong learning”, and protection from the NHS

Universal Credit has been an unmitigated disaster,and i'd be curious what alternative Labour have to offer.

This is an opportune time to assess whether rising GDP is benefiting people's lives,sure it's great having more money in your pocket,but being wealthier doesn't necessarily equate to a better daily lifestyle,work/life balance can also play a part in this.

I imagine many people would agree prevention's better than cure,so a tick from me for this,again more details needed.

Tuition fees this is an area where i'd disagree with Labour,means tested perhaps,and those that can afford to pay should pay,but an outright abolishment,not for me.

Investment in "lifelong learning"-An educated society should be sought after,again i'd need to hear the nuts and bolts.

Protection from the NHS-this should be a universal right as we all pay into the pot.

Climate change: Continuing Labour’s plans for a “green new deal”, introducing a clean air act to tackle pollution, and demanding international action on climate rights

Climate change will be the number 1 issue in the next decade,and yes to achieve results you need international co-operation,easier said than done however.

Human rights: “No more illegal wars”, introduction of a Prevention of Military Intervention Act, putting human rights “at the heart of foreign policy”, reviewing of UK arms sales

"illegal wars" is an emotive phrase,but i'd agree we should try and avoid getting dragged into America's Middle East conquests,I've got no idea what a Prevention of Military Intervention Act entails,so again further info required.

Hiuman rights is always a controversial topic,that'll be a tough sell,definitely agree on UK arms sales,especially to the likes of Saudi Arabia.

Common ownership: Support common ownership of rail, mail, energy and water, end outsourcing in the NHS, local government and justice system.

Not convinced nationalising these industries would ensure they performed better or offered the taxpayers value for money,agree on outsourcing in the NHS,i don't know enough about local government or the justice system to make a judgement.

What else has Sir Keir promised as leader?
There were more pledges made in the campaign from Labour's new leader.

Here are the final five:

Migrant rights: Giving full voting rights for EU nationals, backing free movement in the EU, a new immigration system “based on compassion and dignity”, an end to indefinite detention and calls for the closure of centres such as Yarl’s Wood

This maybe Keir's hardest sell,if you want to ensure migrants are treated with dignity,then you need to have a quicker process and appeal's system,there's far too many migrants left in limbo,while their cases are heard.

Full voting rights for EU nationals,I've no problem with if they're seeking permanent residence in the UK,seems fair enough to me.

Worker’s rights: Work with trade unions to stand up for working people, tackle insecure work and low pay, repeal the Trade Union Act

This is traditional Labour politics,so whoever was leader i suspect this core value wouldn't change,this current crisis has highlighted the issues around zero-hours contracts,and the "gig" economy,so any attempt to protect workers will be applauded by me.

Devolution: Promise to “push power, wealth and opportunity away from Whitehall”, create a federal system to devolve powers – including through regional investment banks and control over regional industrial strategy, abolish the House of Lords, replace it with an elected chamber of regions and nations

Interestingly this is one of the policies Johnson pushed in the election campaign,this could be an area of compromise between the 2 main parties.

I can't see the House of Lords being abolished i'm afraid,but really in the 21st century it's place in civic society is questionable,i'd much prefer a streamlined elected chamber,say 200-300 max.

Equality: No specific policy but promise to “pull down obstacles that limit opportunities and talent”

All parties spout about equality,even the tories,but without concrete policies,this could be empty words,i'll wait and see on this.

Effective opposition: Promise to “never lose sight of the votes ‘lent’ to the Tories in 2019”, to unite the party, promote pluralism and improve Labour’s culture, action to eradicate anti-Semitism, maintain link with unions.

Sound's great whether he'll be able to unite the MP'S and the grass roots is the big question.

As i reside in Scotland much of this won't directly impact me personally,as many of the day-to-day issues are now devolved,but as somebody mentioned,Labour won't form a government without winning a lot of seats in Scotland & Wales.

I don't agree with all Keir's answers,but compared to Corbyn he's a breath of fresh air,and at long last we should have a functioning opposition.

That can only be good for the country,for too long Labour has been the party of protest,not the government in waiting.

tiger76 wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 5:23 pm

Play the ball,not the man,i wouldn't expect anything less from the Sun,but they'll find it much harder to smear Keir Starmer,than Jeremy Corbyn.

For context his 10 proposals, are as follows.

Sir Keir Starmer has won the Labour leadership election, but what pledges did he make in his campaign?

The former shadow Brexit secretary published a list of 10 proposals, and here are the first five:

Economy: An increase to income tax for the top 5% of earners, a reversal of Tory cuts in corporation tax, and a clamp down on tax avoidance, particularly of large corporations.

I'd agree with a lot of this,how you could enforce these measures in practice is the difficult part.

Social issues: Abolish Universal Credit, set a national goal for wellbeing to make health as important as GDP, investment into preventative science, support the abolition of tuition fees, investment in “lifelong learning”, and protection from the NHS

Universal Credit has been an unmitigated disaster,and i'd be curious what alternative Labour have to offer.

This is an opportune time to assess whether rising GDP is benefiting people's lives,sure it's great having more money in your pocket,but being wealthier doesn't necessarily equate to a better daily lifestyle,work/life balance can also play a part in this.

I imagine many people would agree prevention's better than cure,so a tick from me for this,again more details needed.

Tuition fees this is an area where i'd disagree with Labour,means tested perhaps,and those that can afford to pay should pay,but an outright abolishment,not for me.

Investment in "lifelong learning"-An educated society should be sought after,again i'd need to hear the nuts and bolts.

Protection from the NHS-this should be a universal right as we all pay into the pot.

Climate change: Continuing Labour’s plans for a “green new deal”, introducing a clean air act to tackle pollution, and demanding international action on climate rights

Climate change will be the number 1 issue in the next decade,and yes to achieve results you need international co-operation,easier said than done however.

Human rights: “No more illegal wars”, introduction of a Prevention of Military Intervention Act, putting human rights “at the heart of foreign policy”, reviewing of UK arms sales

"illegal wars" is an emotive phrase,but i'd agree we should try and avoid getting dragged into America's Middle East conquests,I've got no idea what a Prevention of Military Intervention Act entails,so again further info required.

Hiuman rights is always a controversial topic,that'll be a tough sell,definitely agree on UK arms sales,especially to the likes of Saudi Arabia.

Common ownership: Support common ownership of rail, mail, energy and water, end outsourcing in the NHS, local government and justice system.

Not convinced nationalising these industries would ensure they performed better or offered the taxpayers value for money,agree on outsourcing in the NHS,i don't know enough about local government or the justice system to make a judgement.

What else has Sir Keir promised as leader?
There were more pledges made in the campaign from Labour's new leader.

Here are the final five:

Migrant rights: Giving full voting rights for EU nationals, backing free movement in the EU, a new immigration system “based on compassion and dignity”, an end to indefinite detention and calls for the closure of centres such as Yarl’s Wood

This maybe Keir's hardest sell,if you want to ensure migrants are treated with dignity,then you need to have a quicker process and appeal's system,there's far too many migrants left in limbo,while their cases are heard.

Full voting rights for EU nationals,I've no problem with if they're seeking permanent residence in the UK,seems fair enough to me.

Worker’s rights: Work with trade unions to stand up for working people, tackle insecure work and low pay, repeal the Trade Union Act

This is traditional Labour politics,so whoever was leader i suspect this core value wouldn't change,this current crisis has highlighted the issues around zero-hours contracts,and the "gig" economy,so any attempt to protect workers will be applauded by me.

Devolution: Promise to “push power, wealth and opportunity away from Whitehall”, create a federal system to devolve powers – including through regional investment banks and control over regional industrial strategy, abolish the House of Lords, replace it with an elected chamber of regions and nations

Interestingly this is one of the policies Johnson pushed in the election campaign,this could be an area of compromise between the 2 main parties.

I can't see the House of Lords being abolished i'm afraid,but really in the 21st century it's place in civic society is questionable,i'd much prefer a streamlined elected chamber,say 200-300 max.

Equality: No specific policy but promise to “pull down obstacles that limit opportunities and talent”

All parties spout about equality,even the tories,but without concrete policies,this could be empty words,i'll wait and see on this.

Effective opposition: Promise to “never lose sight of the votes ‘lent’ to the Tories in 2019”, to unite the party, promote pluralism and improve Labour’s culture, action to eradicate anti-Semitism, maintain link with unions.

Sound's great whether he'll be able to unite the MP'S and the grass roots is the big question.

As i reside in Scotland much of this won't directly impact me personally,as many of the day-to-day issues are now devolved,but as somebody mentioned,Labour won't form a government without winning a lot of seats in Scotland & Wales.

I don't agree with all Keir's answers,but compared to Corbyn he's a breath of fresh air,and at long last we should have a functioning opposition.

That can only be good for the country,for too long Labour has been the party of protest,not the government in waiting.

There's people already on this thread talking about how rich he is, where he is from and that he is knighted rather than focusing on his policies like you have rightly done.

My hope is that people play the ball but my belief is that rubbish and irrelevances will be pedaled my the Murdoch press until there's a whole section of voters (some who would really benefit from Labour policies) that will just hold a view that is told to then and not one they have arrived at by weighing up all the facts and evidence

Time will tell but Im calling it out now cos once it gets to that stage if you try and call out bias you get the abuse and name calling Andrew and others get in their defence of Corbyn

nil_desperandum wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:57 am

Well surprise, surprise. After all this time it's Keir Starmer. Who'd a thought it!
Why did it take 3 months for such a foregone conclusion to be reached?
Meanwhile we've effectively had no official opposition,

Because they were hoping they could eventually get RLB into the seat. Thank God for the party AND for the country that particular extreme has been rejected. Bet Corbyn, Abbott et al are spewing now they didn't get their girl in the seat.

dermotdermot wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 11:06 am

Well it took long enough but hopefully Kier Starmer can finally get rid of the filth that has taken over his party over the last few years.

One of the things I most dislike about the influence of our right wing media, is their propensity for the language of hatred, which is then taken up by people to pretend they speak with political gravitas.

I think Starmer will do a decent job. And I hope he appoints Nandy as a key member of his shadow cabinet. Long Bailey will unfortunately be part of it - she's big buddies with the deputy leader. There should now be a credible opposition which can only be a good thing.

Clarets4me wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:05 pm

In a brave, decisive and revolutionary move, the Labour party has elected a male, white, middle class, privately educated Knight of the Realm as Leader. The previous Leader's Constituency of Islington North is right next to Holborn & St.Pancras ....

More seriously, we now have a mainstream Centre-left Leader, up against a party who's Committees and their Chairs, are now largely controlled by the ideological far left, " Momentum " types. It may get messy .... pass the popcorn

Momentum is just one of many sub groups within Labour. They hold an advantage over others because unlike groups such as Progress set up by rich donors, Momentum has real people in it, willing to campaign and knock on doors.

This is where you've been influenced by Tory propaganda. "Far left" is not an applicable term to describe Momentum. If you took the time to look at their aims, the abolition of private property isn't one of them, and nor is anything you could reasonably describe as "hard left". The Tory papers and party want you to think they're far left to discredit them. You're free to have your own opinions based on facts, and these might be negative toward Momentum and their aims, but if you claim they're "far left" you have been duped.

The reason the Tory Party are so keen to discredit Momentum is they're terrified of them. What they absolutely don't want in any party is a grassroots movement calling for more democracy, more open government, more social justice, and less inequality. Especially not a movement that is politically active against them. If Momentum were so bad, then why did the Tories attempt to begin their own version?

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/ ... 1mC4JO0IgX

I'd imagine Starmer will be looking forward to working with Momentum to bring about a Labour government.

Hope he does a good job and get labour electable. Strong opposition keep governments on their toes and prevents extremism.

AndrewJB wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 6:56 pm

One of the things I most dislike about the influence of our right wing media, is their propensity for the language of hatred, which is then taken up by people to pretend they speak with political gravitas.

May I congratulate you AndrewJB on your fantastic ability to insult, without it actually sounding like that. Well done comrade.

AndrewJB wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 7:22 pm

Momentum is just one of many sub groups within Labour. They hold an advantage over others because unlike groups such as Progress set up by rich donors, Momentum has real people in it, willing to campaign and knock on doors.

This is where you've been influenced by Tory propaganda. "Far left" is not an applicable term to describe Momentum. If you took the time to look at their aims, the abolition of private property isn't one of them, and nor is anything you could reasonably describe as "hard left". The Tory papers and party want you to think they're far left to discredit them. You're free to have your own opinions based on facts, and these might be negative toward Momentum and their aims, but if you claim they're "far left" you have been duped.

The reason the Tory Party are so keen to discredit Momentum is they're terrified of them. What they absolutely don't want in any party is a grassroots movement calling for more democracy, more open government, more social justice, and less inequality. Especially not a movement that is politically active against them. If Momentum were so bad, then why did the Tories attempt to begin their own version?

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/ ... 1mC4JO0IgX

I'd imagine Starmer will be looking forward to working with Momentum to bring about a Labour government.

When very respectable Labour people like Alan Johnson despise Momentum it's certainly worth listening to. Hopefully we will hear much less about them going forward.

[urlhttps://www.itv.com/news/2019-12-13/alan-johnso ... -itv-news/][/url]

taio wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 7:14 pm

I think Starmer will do a decent job. And I hope he appoints Nandy as a key member of his shadow cabinet. Long Bailey will unfortunately be part of it - she's big buddies with the deputy leader. There should now be a credible opposition which can only be a good thing.

There's a brief guide to the runners and riders from Labour List

Rachel Reeves
Anneliese Dodds
Preet Gill
Sarah Jones
Jim McMahon
Brdiget Phillipson
Jonathan Reynolds
Yvette Cooper
Hilary Benn
David Lammy
Nick Thomas-Symonds
Ian Murray
Chris Matheson
Luke Pollard
Tracy Brabin
Jon Ashworth
Rebecca Long Bailey
Lisa Nandy

That's the rumour mill,now some of those names mean nothing to me,but that might not be a bad thing from Starmer's POV,he needs to stamp his own authority on the party ASAP,and a host of fresh faces could go a long way to erasing the scars of Corbyn's tenure pretty quickly.

As long as Richard Burgon,Dawn Butler,Barry Gardiner,Jess Phillips and Emily Thornberry aren't in the Shadow cabinet,that'll be a decent start in my book.In an ideal world Chakrabarti would get the heave-ho as well,but that's wishful thinking.

tiger76 wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 7:42 pm

There's a brief guide to the runners and riders from Labour List

Rachel Reeves
Anneliese Dodds
Preet Gill
Sarah Jones
Jim McMahon
Brdiget Phillipson
Jonathan Reynolds
Yvette Cooper
Hilary Benn
David Lammy
Nick Thomas-Symonds
Ian Murray
Chris Matheson
Luke Pollard
Tracy Brabin
Jon Ashworth
Rebecca Long Bailey
Lisa Nandy

That's the rumour mill,now some of those names mean nothing to me,but that might not be a bad thing from Starmer's POV,he needs to stamp his own authority on the party ASAP,and a host of fresh faces could go a long way to erasing the scars of Corbyn's tenure pretty quickly.

As long as Richard Burgon,Dawn Butler,Barry Gardiner,Jess Phillips and Emily Thornberry aren't in the Shadow cabinet,that'll be a decent start in my book.In an ideal world Chakrabarti would get the heave-ho as well,but that's wishful thinking.

Like you, I don't know some of those but some decent options. But Burgon, Chakrabarti and Thornberry in particular would be a horrible choices for the shadow cabinet. It would be funny if Lammy got a senior role.

tiger76 wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 7:42 pm

As long as Richard Burgon,Dawn Butler,Barry Gardiner,Jess Phillips and Emily Thornberry aren't in the Shadow cabinet,that'll be a decent start in my book.In an ideal world Chakrabarti would get the heave-ho as well,but that's wishful thinking.

Why would you put Jess Phillips in that list / category?

nil_desperandum wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 8:26 pm

Why would you put Jess Phillips in that list / category?

She's just not up to the task in my view,and she's too hot-headed for a shadow cabinet role,she has done plenty of good work as a backbench MP,notably on domestic violence,but being a minister or indeed a shadow minister is a whole different challenge.

bobinho wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 7:25 pm

May I congratulate you AndrewJB on your fantastic ability to insult, without it actually sounding like that. Well done comrade.

Thanks (I think), but I think everyone should deplore the kind of hothead political commentary in which whole swathes of the population are called "filth" or "****" or "traitors" or (and perhaps you'll find agreement on this?) "racists" "fascists" or "marxists". It's the opposite of debate. It's the "I will not even consider your point" argument. Whether it's done on the left or the right, it's the authoritarian point of view, and it's the kind of view very much pushed by a lot of newspapers in the UK, by the way they cover politics, and the editorial stances they take. Just consider how uncompromising The Sun was over the junior doctor strike of a few years ago: https://www.google.co.uk/search?source= ... CAk&uact=5

AndrewJB wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 7:22 pm

Momentum is just one of many sub groups within Labour. They hold an advantage over others because unlike groups such as Progress set up by rich donors, Momentum has real people in it, willing to campaign and knock on doors.

This is where you've been influenced by Tory propaganda. "Far left" is not an applicable term to describe Momentum. If you took the time to look at their aims, the abolition of private property isn't one of them, and nor is anything you could reasonably describe as "hard left". The Tory papers and party want you to think they're far left to discredit them. You're free to have your own opinions based on facts, and these might be negative toward Momentum and their aims, but if you claim they're "far left" you have been duped.

The reason the Tory Party are so keen to discredit Momentum is they're terrified of them. What they absolutely don't want in any party is a grassroots movement calling for more democracy, more open government, more social justice, and less inequality. Especially not a movement that is politically active against them. If Momentum were so bad, then why did the Tories attempt to begin their own version?

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/ ... 1mC4JO0IgX

I'd imagine Starmer will be looking forward to working with Momentum to bring about a Labour government.

Momentum were formed out the campaign group that were established to win Jeremy Corbyn the Labour leadership. During this leadership election, the 12 member " Steering Group ", sent the Momentum activists a ballot paper with only Rebecca Long-Bailey's name on, asking them to say yes or no to supporting that Candidate.

It was Alan Johnson who told Jon Lansman, that he wished his " little cult " would leave the Labour party, and " go back to playing Student politics ", on ITV during the Election night coverage. Clearly, Alan's been reading the " Daily Mail " as well .....

taio wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 7:29 pm

When very respectable Labour people like Alan Johnson despise Momentum it's certainly worth listening to. Hopefully we will hear much less about them going forward.

[urlhttps://www.itv.com/news/2019-12-13/alan-johnso ... -itv-news/][/url]

A lot of senior Labour people were unhappy with Corbyn's election as leader, and made no secret of this, and as Momentum were set up to back Corbyn, they also didn't like Momentum. As Corbyn won two leadership contests in a row, it shows that these senior Labour people were not in line with the membership. In fact after the 2017 election, all of them went very quiet. It's actually no different to B.Johnson being backed by the Tory rank and file, yet denounced by many senior Tories. Ken Clarke hasn't been in the media recently, but as soon as B.Johnson looks more doddery as leader, then I'm sure he, and Grieve, and the rest will begin to pipe up again.

What you won't be able to show me - because the accusation is simply a Tory smear - is how Momentum could be described as "hard left". They're not. If not members themselves, then the ideas that come out of Momentum will continue to inform the direction Starmer moves the Labour Party in. And Momentum will continue to campaign for a Labour government.

As a short post script; I think the hypocrisy coming from some people who insisted that Corbyn would have no legitimacy to kick out of Labour those who opposed him, and yet are now talking about "cleansing the party of "Corbynites"" is disgraceful. The Labour Party is a big tent party, and I'm glad there are people from across the spectrum putting forward ideas.

Clarets4me wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 9:28 pm

Momentum were formed out the campaign group that were established to win Jeremy Corbyn the Labour leadership. During this leadership election, the 12 member " Steering Group ", sent the Momentum activists a ballot paper with only Rebecca Long-Bailey's name on, asking them to say yes or no to supporting that Candidate.

It was Alan Johnson who told Jon Lansman, that he wished his " little cult " would leave the Labour party, and " go back to playing Student politics ", on ITV during the Election night coverage. Clearly, Alan's been reading the " Daily Mail " as well .....

He didn't say that after the 2017 election, and nor did a lot of Labour MP's who had attacked Momentum, but found their majorities significantly increased when members had campaigned in their ridings. So Alan Johnson's opposition to Momentum simply followed his opposition to Corbyn, rather than following the Mail. It still remains the case that the Tory Party were terrified of Momentum, and set their press attack dogs on them. You won't find me an article in any of those papers that is positive about Momentum (or Corbyn), and the people who read these papers were fed the smears and nonsense on a nearly daily basis.

MT03ALG wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 1:20 pm

With Diane Abbott as Shadow Chancellor !!

Her career path follows that of Mr C.

Devils_Advocate wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:47 pm

I see the Sun is already attacking Starmer and looking at ways to smear him before he started.

The right wing press will be doing a real hatchet job on him to make sure the Tory's don't have any opposition and the idiots who lack any critical thinking skills will just lap it up and let it become their new truth

are you doing Andrew's press releases for him now, it's a shame I admit that the Tory's don't have any credible opposition, won't hold my breath that they might in a few years. Yet that again will all be press/news outlets and you have the audacity to write about idiots who lack of any critical skills, you just demonstrated yours clearly for all to see.

Normally you are a lot better than this.

AndrewJB wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 9:48 pm

As Corbyn won two leadership contests in a row, it shows that these senior Labour people were not in line with the membership.

It also shows that the membership were not in line with a lot of its core supporters.
When momentum took over by an organised infiltration of constituency parties, through the mobilisation of young radicals, they left behind the people they were supposed to represent.
If Keir Starmer hopes to make Labour electable again, one of his first targets has to be reversing that.

KateR wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:44 pm

are you doing Andrew's press releases for him now, it's a shame I admit that the Tory's don't have any credible opposition, won't hold my breath that they might in a few years. Yet that again will all be press/news outlets and you have the audacity to write about idiots who lack of any critical skills, you just demonstrated yours clearly for all to see.

Normally you are a lot better than this.

Why do you think the Sun have decided to run a big story today on Starmer being rich and do you think this matters?

And on the back of this what do you think of a couple of people on this thread parroting on about Starmer being middle class, wealthy, from greater London and being knighted?

Devils_Advocate wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:47 pm

I see the Sun is already attacking Starmer and looking at ways to smear him before he started.

The right wing press will be doing a real hatchet job on him to make sure the Tory's don't have any opposition and the idiots who lack any critical thinking skills will just lap it up and let it become their new truth

And when a tory leader is elected, the mirror and guardian stay silent?

Alanstevensonsgloves wrote: ↑

Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:00 am

And when a tory leader is elected, the mirror and guardian stay silent?

I was trying to have a normal discussion with KateR but the difference between the papers you mention and the Murdoch press is like another dimensions.

If you cant see this difference you are way to far gone foe me to try and have a genuine discussion with you

Alanstevensonsgloves wrote: ↑

Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:00 am

And when a tory leader is elected, the mirror and guardian stay silent?

Dont forget The Observer, The People, The Sunday Mirror, The Independent, The Morning Star, Scottish newspapers, the millions of newsletters sent out by trades unions....

however plausible he is, we live in a country of docile idiots, Ant and Dec clowns and the SUN and its docile herd of thicknecks will be able to disregard any value there might have been in a new leader.
a nation that drools over soaps and reality tv shows is not the stuff of considered debate and honest values.
The "our boys " mob will always win.