U23's friendly v Man Utd today
U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Man Utd 1 - Clarets 5.Richardson x 2, Thompson x 2 and Unwin x 1.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Good result. Shame the lads are fighting for a career in league one or two as we could get excited about one or two coming into our first team.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Possibly but interested to know on what have you based that claim?superdimitri wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 3:18 pmShame the lads are fighting for a career in league one or two
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
The gap in quality is too large and the majority of our u23s end up playing in those leagues. It's not like it used to be where the lads have a good chance of making it.
As Mike Baldwin said a few years ago in the a London Clarets AGM the aim in our youth development is too give the lads the best chance of landing a professional contract, even if it's not at Burnley.
I've said it before on here. No one wants a youngster to come through more than me, but I'm also a realist and recognise it's still a step too far for us. Hopefully that will change soon if we're able to attract better talent.
As Mike Baldwin said a few years ago in the a London Clarets AGM the aim in our youth development is too give the lads the best chance of landing a professional contract, even if it's not at Burnley.
I've said it before on here. No one wants a youngster to come through more than me, but I'm also a realist and recognise it's still a step too far for us. Hopefully that will change soon if we're able to attract better talent.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
superdimitri wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 3:29 pmThe gap in quality is too large and the majority of our u23s end up playing in those leagues. It's not like it used to be where the lads have a good chance of making it.
As Mike Baldwin said a few years ago in the a London Clarets AGM the aim in our youth development is too give the lads the best chance of landing a professional contract, even if it's not at Burnley.
I've said it before on here. No one wants a youngster to come through more than me, but I'm also a realist and recognise it's still a step too far for us. Hopefully that will change soon if we're able to attract better talent.
How many games did you go to per season before lockdown ?
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Unfortunately he's set to be the next Gilchrist with injuries being the biggest hindrance.boatshed bill wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 3:27 pmRichardson could do a lot better than L1.... if handled/coached correctly.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
And you are basing that on what?superdimitri wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 3:40 pmUnfortunately he's set to be the next Gilchrist with injuries being the biggest hindrance.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Mike Baldwin died in 2006, had a heart attack in front of the knicker factory on Corriesuperdimitri wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 3:29 pm
As Mike Baldwin said a few years ago in the a London Clarets AGM
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
ClaretTony wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 3:45 pmMike Baldwin died in 2006, had a heart attack in front of the knicker factory on Corrie
He got his name wrong... he meant Ken Barlow
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Before this thread gets too derailed.. good to see Richardson back in the goals. I know it's hard to keep track of the kids at the moment, but how long has he been back from injury and how far off a place in the squad do you reckon he is? I'm not even sure how old he is, must still be very young.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
He's 18, just 11 days ago. I've not seen him play since late 2019.NottsClaret wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 3:46 pmBefore this thread gets too derailed.. good to see Richardson back in the goals. I know it's hard to keep track of the kids at the moment, but how long has he been back from injury and how far off a place in the squad do you reckon he is? I'm not even sure how old he is, must still be very young.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Still not clear on just what basis you're stating that most of them will only make L1 and 2? How often have you seen them play? Which of them do you consider have a chance of making a higher standard?superdimitri wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 3:29 pmThe gap in quality is too large and the majority of our u23s end up playing in those leagues. It's not like it used to be where the lads have a good chance of making it.
As Mike Baldwin said a few years ago in the a London Clarets AGM the aim in our youth development is too give the lads the best chance of landing a professional contract, even if it's not at Burnley.
I've said it before on here. No one wants a youngster to come through more than me, but I'm also a realist and recognise it's still a step too far for us. Hopefully that will change soon if we're able to attract better talent.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Captains the U23s and he's just about the youngest of them. Loads of potentual.ClaretTony wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 3:48 pmHe's 18, just 11 days ago. I've not seen him play since late 2019.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
I didn't know he was captain. To be honest, I'd no idea who was captain. It was Oliver Younger last season.boatshed bill wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 3:55 pmCaptains the U23s and he's just about the youngest of them. Loads of potentual.
Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
I noticed that for the last U23 game he wasn't captain. I always felt that he was a bit too much of a hot-head for the captain's role. He does seem to have a bit of a temper.ClaretTony wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 3:48 pmHe's 18, just 11 days ago. I've not seen him play since late 2019.
Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Certainly had the armband for a few recent games prior to the Palace game. Think it was Richter v Palace.ClaretTony wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 3:57 pmI didn't know he was captain. To be honest, I'd no idea who was captain. It was Oliver Younger last season.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Haven’t we just beaten them at under 17 and under 18’s?
Last edited by Marney&Mee on Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Not sure how I got the name wrong since I don't even watch Coronation Street, but yeah. Dave Baldwin.
I've watched a fair bit of u21 football and seen our present team where possible on YouTube et al. Nothing suggests any of them are going to be good enough to make the step up apart from maybe Richardson...but with him it will be all about the injuries. Not good when getting injured so early on.
People keep asking me the same question because they don't like my answer. I'll answer again. 1. The step up is too much for our players to the premier league 2. You can see from the past players where they end up playing.
Changes don't happen overnight, and I hope I'm wrong but its probably going to be a few years before we can start to watch the u23s and see results like today and get excited about players making it into our first team.
As I said I'm just a realist, I don't get carried away and as much as I'd like too, its easy to see that we're still some way off getting a steady stream of youngsters into our first 11.
I've watched a fair bit of u21 football and seen our present team where possible on YouTube et al. Nothing suggests any of them are going to be good enough to make the step up apart from maybe Richardson...but with him it will be all about the injuries. Not good when getting injured so early on.
People keep asking me the same question because they don't like my answer. I'll answer again. 1. The step up is too much for our players to the premier league 2. You can see from the past players where they end up playing.
Changes don't happen overnight, and I hope I'm wrong but its probably going to be a few years before we can start to watch the u23s and see results like today and get excited about players making it into our first team.
As I said I'm just a realist, I don't get carried away and as much as I'd like too, its easy to see that we're still some way off getting a steady stream of youngsters into our first 11.
Last edited by superdimitri on Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Haven’t we just beaten them at under 17 and under 18 as well?
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
I don't know much about the U17 game, other than it included some older kids, but we did beat them in the U18 Premier League which was a terrific result.Marney&Mee wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:03 pmHaven’t we just beaten them at under 17 and under 18 as well?
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Good result for he lads with respect to the opposition ofc
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
superdimitri wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:02 pmNot sure how I got the name wrong since I don't even watch Coronation Street, but yeah. Dave Baldwin.
I've watched a fair bit of u21 football and seen our present team where possible on YouTube et al. Nothing suggests any of them are going to be good enough to make the step up apart from maybe Richardson...but with him it will be all about the injuries. Not good when getting injured so early on.
People keep asking me the same question because they don't like my answer. I'll answer again. 1. The step up is too much for our players to the premier league 2. You can see from the past players where they end up playing.
Changes don't happen overnight, and I hope I'm wrong but its probably going to be a few years before we can start to watch the u23s and see results like today and get excited about players making it into our first team.
As I said I'm just a realist, I don't get carried away and as much as I'd like too, its easy to see that we're still some way off getting a steady stream of youngsters into our first 11.
Nobody is getting carried away, just asking someone who knows nothing about the players why you are writing them all off
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Supposedly one of the premier acadamies. With clubs like ours usually picking up youngsters they release. Times a changing ?
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Yes. I have to agree, he tends to over react to fouls and appears to answer back.
Is Nartey captain now? He would be my choice.
Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Taken from the Man Utd website
Manchester United Under-18s were involved in a Lancashire battle with Burnley on Saturday morning, before bowing to a very rare defeat.
Neil Ryan's side had remarkably won the previous eight games, in a sequence dating back to the FA Youth Cup defeat at the hands of Chelsea on 30 October.
So there was certainly no cause for alarm when the hosts at Leyland County Ground scored after just three minutes though Sam Unwin but that proved to be the only goal of the game, as Burnley became only the second club to beat the Reds in the Under-18 Premier League this season.
Unwin's early opener came after a shot from his team-mate Corey Brennan rebounded off the crossbar, and the latter went close to finding the net himself just a few minutes later, when he attempted a lob with United goalkeeper Radek Vitek caught outside his area.
After those two chances for Burnley, the Reds responded well with Dillon Hoogewerf sending a long-range shot over and Charlie Savage having a goal-bound effort blocked brilliantly on the line by Clarets centre-back Dan Sassi.
Vitek had to make a save to deny Brennan but the game remained firmly in the balance as the two sides went into half-time with the hosts still leading 1-0.
The first chance of the second half fell to Unwin and while his effort from inside the area flew wide, Charlie McNeill went much closer at the other end, almost equalising for United with a shot into the side netting.
The same Reds striker was subsequently thwarted by Burnley goalkeeper Sam Waller with a fine save, but the home side nearly had the final word in the 90th minute when Vitek was forced to make another stop, from Will Hugill, who then blasted the rebound over the frame. There was one other incident of note in injury time as Hoogewerf was sent off following a skirmish involving a few players.
Manchester United Under-18s were involved in a Lancashire battle with Burnley on Saturday morning, before bowing to a very rare defeat.
Neil Ryan's side had remarkably won the previous eight games, in a sequence dating back to the FA Youth Cup defeat at the hands of Chelsea on 30 October.
So there was certainly no cause for alarm when the hosts at Leyland County Ground scored after just three minutes though Sam Unwin but that proved to be the only goal of the game, as Burnley became only the second club to beat the Reds in the Under-18 Premier League this season.
Unwin's early opener came after a shot from his team-mate Corey Brennan rebounded off the crossbar, and the latter went close to finding the net himself just a few minutes later, when he attempted a lob with United goalkeeper Radek Vitek caught outside his area.
After those two chances for Burnley, the Reds responded well with Dillon Hoogewerf sending a long-range shot over and Charlie Savage having a goal-bound effort blocked brilliantly on the line by Clarets centre-back Dan Sassi.
Vitek had to make a save to deny Brennan but the game remained firmly in the balance as the two sides went into half-time with the hosts still leading 1-0.
The first chance of the second half fell to Unwin and while his effort from inside the area flew wide, Charlie McNeill went much closer at the other end, almost equalising for United with a shot into the side netting.
The same Reds striker was subsequently thwarted by Burnley goalkeeper Sam Waller with a fine save, but the home side nearly had the final word in the 90th minute when Vitek was forced to make another stop, from Will Hugill, who then blasted the rebound over the frame. There was one other incident of note in injury time as Hoogewerf was sent off following a skirmish involving a few players.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Glennon v Newcastleboatshed bill wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:08 pmYes. I have to agree, he tends to over react to fouls and appears to answer back.
Is Nartey captain now? He would be my choice.
Nartey v Stoke
V Palace the club website says Nartey but I'm sure that on the day the commentators said it was Richter.
Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Yes, I would agree with that. Not good to see him answering back/challenging the ref and reacting to opponents when fouled.boatshed bill wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:08 pmhe tends to over react to fouls and appears to answer back.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Bloody hell, he's a young kid. He's never been anything like as bad as a young lad we had in the u18s just a few years ago by the name of Dwight McNeil.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Nearly all of the home games are on Clarets player and a few of the away games have been on YouTube.claretonthecoast1882 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:07 pmNobody is getting carried away, just asking someone who knows nothing about the players why you are writing them all off
There has been plenty of time for fans to give there assessments of players.
From what I have seen, I think Gomez looks to have some technical ability but needs to toughen up a bit. He could have a decent career in football. Richardson has looked really good in flashes, the next 12-18 months are crucial for him. Will he make the step up or will he sink.
I can see why fans are saying LG1 Lg 2 quality there are very few I would class as having high quality technical ability. When we played Leeds recently they absolutely blew us away.
Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Maybe he does know a lot about them? That's why I was asking him for the basis of his assertion that most of them would only make L1 and 2. Relating back to what were the levels of the U23's a few years ago isn't really relevant to the present day. I'm not saying that any of them will make the PL grade but surely it's far too early and disrespectful to be just writing them off on the viewings of a few games on Youtube etc..claretonthecoast1882 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:07 pmNobody is getting carried away, just asking someone who knows nothing about the players why you are writing them all off
Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Not sure just how relevant it is that we were outclassed by Leeds as to whether or not any of our lads will make the grade? Leeds U23's are top of the league and the best team by far in PL2 Group 2.Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:24 pmNearly all of the home games are on Clarets player and a few of the away games have been on YouTube.
There has been plenty of time for fans to give there assessments of players.
From what I have seen, I think Gomez looks to have some technical ability but needs to toughen up a bit. He could have a decent career in football. Richardson has looked really good in flashes, the next 12-18 months are crucial for him. Will he make the step up or will he sink.
I can see why fans are saying LG1 Lg 2 quality there are very few I would class as having high quality technical ability. When we played Leeds recently they absolutely blew us away.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
I think it's more about the responsibility of captaincy. In one game I saw he really pushed his luck, could have been sent off. To be honest, he's better off just concentrating on his game, which is very good.ClaretTony wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:22 pmBloody hell, he's a young kid. He's never been anything like as bad as a young lad we had in the u18s just a few years ago by the name of Dwight McNeil.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Hi Leisure,
Many, many thanks for all the details.
I think however it would be far better only commenting when our lads lose. Maybe then we'll have comments like "one of two of these lads could make it with us".
Really nothing positive at all in beating Manchester United 5-1.
Many, many thanks for all the details.
I think however it would be far better only commenting when our lads lose. Maybe then we'll have comments like "one of two of these lads could make it with us".
Really nothing positive at all in beating Manchester United 5-1.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Some rather sweeping statements on this thread. I didn't know that Dwight was a 'bit mouthy'. Anyway, there's one lad in the U'18's that should go on and play in our first team eventually but I have to admit I'm quite biased in my assessment.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Dwight used to be very feisty. He's calmed down somewhat but we've seen a couple of incidents this season, the one at Arsenal that led to Xhaka being sent off and one more recently.Silkyskills1 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:51 pmSome rather sweeping statements on this thread. I didn't know that Dwight was a 'bit mouthy'. Anyway, there's one lad in the U'18's that should go on and play in our first team eventually but I have to admit I'm quite biased in my assessment.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
I didn't recall anyone asking you about players?claretonthecoast1882 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:07 pmNobody is getting carried away, just asking someone who knows nothing about the players why you are writing them all off
Sorry I've lost you.
Its always the same in these threads. People get over-excited about youth prospects. I'm just a realist.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
I used to stand watching the youth team back in the day with Eli and we used to think we had some good players coming through. He once said: "We believe they are better than they are because we want them to be," and that's absolutely spot on. It applied then and it applies now.superdimitri wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:55 pmIts always the same in these threads. People get over-excited about youth prospects. I'm just a realist.
But I have to say the quality has risen considerably in the last 2-3 years although this isn't youth prospects we are necessarily talking about, although Richardson is. Many of these players have joined the club beyond youth level.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
This can only be a reference to Dale StephensClaretTony wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:59 pmBut I have to say the quality has risen considerably in the last 2-3 years although this isn't youth prospects we are necessarily talking about, although Richardson is. Many of these players have joined the club beyond youth level.
But seriously, thanks for sharing the news of the youngster and what a great result for the young Clarets.
UTC
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Its interesting to read this thread in tandem with the thread about the 1986 friendly against United.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Good to know the quality is rising. Hopefully we can get the team promoted in to the Premier League 1 league and compete with the very best.ClaretTony wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:59 pmI used to stand watching the youth team back in the day with Eli and we used to think we had some good players coming through. He once said: "We believe they are better than they are because we want them to be," and that's absolutely spot on. It applied then and it applies now.
But I have to say the quality has risen considerably in the last 2-3 years although this isn't youth prospects we are necessarily talking about, although Richardson is. Many of these players have joined the club beyond youth level.
I know a lot of fans feel close to the identity Burnley made in the past with developing youngsters, if it wasn't for those youngsters there wouldn't have been a successful era in the 60s, and we wouldn't have had the 'Team of the 70's"
But youth football in England took a turn for the worse some time ago, and even some teams with great academies now struggle to make success of it.
There are teams with established youth academies competing in the top u23 league that can't seem to find consistent premier league talent like Middlesbrough, Derby, Blackburn, Sunderland and Stoke. So its never a recipe for success competing in the top division.
It still remains a big if though, in part because of our location and limited catchment compared to the likes of Liverpool, Everton and the Manchester Clubs. I guess the first thing would be to get the u23s promoted so they can finish higher than Blackburn making us a better choice than them more locally.
I know what you mean about thinking players are better than they are though. In my time watching the youth team and development squad I've seen players who I was convinced looked really good and will make it, and I've also been confused when other players get a chance. I guess what everyone looks for in a player is different. The problem is the massive step up players need to make. Glennon is a player I've liked the look of in the development squad but he looked like a fish out of water against Bournemouth, its no mean feat of course with Bournemouth being a top championship side but it just shows the kind of quality a player needs to make the step up nowadays.
I think if we can get players out loan in the championship then I'll start to get a bit more excited about youth football, realistically now its still looking like most promising youngsters may get loans in league 1 or 2 which is still an improvement compared to non-league football of the past I guess.
Hopefully we can do what other teams haven't been able to do and improve our youth recruitment and make a success of it. I think the new ownership should help with that. I think our fanbase still thinks a lot of youth football in general, and the new owners should capitalise on that by promoting the games and attendances (in the future of course). If Burnley can get a reputation for developing the best youngsters then things can really step up...but its still a very long way off.
Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
Good to see Richardson back among the goals.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
There is no doubt that we have improved it in the last few years but it would have been very difficult not to given the mess left by the Blake era when we were heading towards closing it down. I can't say whether there have been any improvements this year because I simply haven't had the opportunity to go and see these lads play.superdimitri wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 5:39 pmHopefully we can do what other teams haven't been able to do and improve our youth recruitment and make a success of it. I think the new ownership should help with that. I think our fanbase still thinks a lot of youth football in general, and the new owners should capitalise on that by promoting the games and attendances (in the future of course). If Burnley can get a reputation for developing the best youngsters then things can really step up...but its still a very long way off.
Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
I miss getting to see the games live, but am enjoying watching them online etc ... a definite upgrade on a few years ago now we are at a higher level.ClaretTony wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 5:42 pmThere is no doubt that we have improved it in the last few years but it would have been very difficult not to given the mess left by the Blake era when we were heading towards closing it down. I can't say whether there have been any improvements this year because I simply haven't had the opportunity to go and see these lads play.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
We need to be a better option for local youngsters than Blackburn. And anyone else who is having a good spell and bringing in PL money: the likes of Wigan, Bolton etc when they had their Premier League spells.
We must do our best to compete with the other teams around us. Notably the two Manchester and Liverpool teams.
Realistically that’s a tall order but one or two local lads might choose us over them.
We’ve got to be strong enough at youth level that when we do uncover a sought after talent we have the resources and facilities to keep hold of them. That wasn’t always the case but we’re just about at that level.
If we’re the best option outside of those four giants in the north west then we’ll do alright for ourselves.
On top of this we should heavily target those who are released prematurely from the bigger clubs - as we did bringing in McNeil from Manyoo and Benson from Arsenal.
There’s still a way to go before this comes to fruition but from the outside it looks as if we’re doing all the right things and doing them well.
We must do our best to compete with the other teams around us. Notably the two Manchester and Liverpool teams.
Realistically that’s a tall order but one or two local lads might choose us over them.
We’ve got to be strong enough at youth level that when we do uncover a sought after talent we have the resources and facilities to keep hold of them. That wasn’t always the case but we’re just about at that level.
If we’re the best option outside of those four giants in the north west then we’ll do alright for ourselves.
On top of this we should heavily target those who are released prematurely from the bigger clubs - as we did bringing in McNeil from Manyoo and Benson from Arsenal.
There’s still a way to go before this comes to fruition but from the outside it looks as if we’re doing all the right things and doing them well.
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
It's a funny league. i'm not sure that winning it proves any more than coming bottom would.Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:24 pmNearly all of the home games are on Clarets player and a few of the away games have been on YouTube.
There has been plenty of time for fans to give there assessments of players.
From what I have seen, I think Gomez looks to have some technical ability but needs to toughen up a bit. He could have a decent career in football. Richardson has looked really good in flashes, the next 12-18 months are crucial for him. Will he make the step up or will he sink.
I can see why fans are saying LG1 Lg 2 quality there are very few I would class as having high quality technical ability. When we played Leeds recently they absolutely blew us away.
We tend to play a young side with 18-19 year olds among the slightly older lads, and very rarely put on any over-age players (I think 3 are permitted) so I'd say our results aren't too bad generally.
As for who will make it to our 1st team? Wouldn't one per season be great?
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Re: U23's friendly v Man Utd today
We would be over the moon with one youth player per year being promoted to the first team. But I don't think any club in the premier league has such a record? Ajax might?boatshed bill wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 6:21 pmIt's a funny league. i'm not sure that winning it proves any more than coming bottom would.
We tend to play a young side with 18-19 year olds among the slightly older lads, and very rarely put on any over-age players (I think 3 are permitted) so I'd say our results aren't too bad generally.
As for who will make it to our 1st team? Wouldn't one per season be great?