Available here

https://www.burnleyfootballclub.com/con ... ven-season

Break even due to Covid.

Good news and credit to the previous directors for a good and prudent financial strategy.

£80,000,000 cash in hand / bank?

I’m not an accountant, some on here are, but do I see £80m in the bank pre takeover?

Like SGr I will await a breakdown from those who understand accounts better than I do

£94m on wages... jesus wept

Sidney will be along in a minute to tell me we don't have anyone earning over £40k a week HAHAHAHAHAAHHAHA!

tarkys_ears wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 1:26 pm

£94m on wages... jesus wept

Sidney will be along in a minute to tell me we don't have anyone earning over £40k a week HAHAHAHAHAAHHAHA!

We sensibly have a generous bonus structure that doesn't commit those sums recurrently should the worst happen.

SGr wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 1:21 pm

I’m not an accountant, some on here are, but do I see £80m in the bank pre takeover?

And there were some people thinking that Burnley didn't complete any transfers in January

13 months of wages everyone so do not get excited about that - it essentially means that wages were flat (ie. no growth)

£80m in the bank is not far off what I was suggesting a few months back either - so again no surprise (same with revenue)

I have also said for some time, that last summer we were geared up for some spending in the transfer market before the pandemic hit - we had all but freed the space in the wage bill and then had some money to spend on fees

- I will now have a look through the actual report

£80m in cash or equivalent and once again we only have 2 fit wingers. Still it's better than several times we have only had 1.

We are probably safe this year, but what a ridiculous state of affairs.

You have got to admire though that we seem to have weathered Covid well.

summitclaret wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 1:52 pm

£80m in cash or equivalent and once again we only have 2 fit wingers. Still it's better than several times we have only had 1.

We are probably safe this year, but what a ridiculous state of affairs.

You have got to admire though that we seem to have weathered Covid well.

All wrapped up in the takeover deal.

taio wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 1:54 pm

All wrapped up in the takeover deal.

That was at one time looking iffy due to our exceptionally poor start to the season, that was completely avoidable.

Chester Perry wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 1:52 pm

13 months of wages everyone so do not get excited about that - it essentially means that wages were flat (ie. no growth)

£80m in the bank is not far off what I was suggesting a few months back either - so again no surprise (same with revenue)

I have also said for some time, that last summer we were geared up for some spending in the transfer market before the pandemic hit - we had all but freed the space in the wage bill and then had some money to spend on fees

- I will now have a look through the actual report

Not true, the 94m figure is adjusted to 12 months the 13 month figure is over 100m.

summitclaret wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 1:57 pm

That was at one time looking iffy due to our exceptionally poor start to the season, that was completely avoidable.

It wasn't avoidable if the new owners applied conditions, which they almost certainly will have, because without it seems they would have had a challenge obtaining the equivalent capital to proceed with the takeover.

summitclaret wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 1:52 pm

You have got to admire though that we seem to have weathered Covid well.

But we only lost 4 home games in these accounts. In the next one it'll be probably 19 games, so only then will we be able to fully assess how well we've weathered Covid.

claretandy wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 1:57 pm

Not true, the 94m figure is adjusted to 12 months the 13 month figure is over 100m.

I’d assumed the £94m covered 13 months. Thanks for pointing that out.

claretandy wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 1:57 pm

Not true, the 94m figure is adjusted to 12 months the 13 month figure is over 100m.

That depends on how you read the bonus situation - for the first time the club have confirmed that bonus pools are based on final league position - that position was 5 places higher (normally an extra £15m of revenue (last year about £10m)

Chester Perry wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 2:15 pm

That depends on how you read the bonus situation - for the first time the club have confirmed that bonus pools are based on final league position - that position was 5 places higher (normally an extra £15m of revenue (last year about £10m)

Unless we know exactly how much bonus is due for highrt finishing position, we will never know, what we do know is wages were 8m higher.

a few other things to note

- permanent employee numbers fractionally down (There is a league 2 club that has more than us)
- I think some transfer debt owed to us has been delayed - my understanding is it was all due in last summer
- Amortisation decreased - (it will have done so again this season)
- The notes confirm an inter company loan post takeover but not for how much
- it appears we spent £46m or so last season on Intangible assets (players this usually means)

Chester Perry wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 2:30 pm

a few other things to note

- permanent employee numbers fractionally down (There is a league 2 club that has more than us)
- I think some transfer debt owed to us has been delayed - my understanding is it was all due in last summer
- Amortisation decreased - (it will have done so again this season)
- The notes confirm an inter company loan post takeover but not for how much
- it appears we spent £46m or so last season on Intangible assets (players this usually means)

Who on earth are the League 2 clubs with more permanent staff? I can only guess at Salford.

claretandy wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 2:24 pm

Unless we know exactly how much bonus is due for highrt finishing position, we will never know, what we do know is wages were 8m higher.

I agree

if you take away the PAYE and pension costs the increase is about 50% of the expected place money which seems an incentivised approach (perhaps overly so) - There were some notable new deals that season for Wood and Dwight - was Pope done as well? - plus you would expect Jay to be on a decent wack

So have we got 80m in the bank now or did it get swallowed up in the takeover?

ClaretTony wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 2:33 pm

Who on earth are the League 2 clubs with more permanent staff? I can only guess at Salford.

not Salford - I spat my drink out when I saw it last week - from the MMT thread

Chester Perry wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 31, 2021 12:13 am

@KieranMaguire has been posting about Colchester United's financial results how on earth does a League Two club employ more permanent staff than Burnley in in the Premier League for 7 seasons in the last 11

https://twitter.com/KieranMaguire/statu ... 7642336256

Quickenthetempo wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 2:36 pm

So have we got 80m in the bank now or did it get swallowed up in the takeover?

Remember there has been little income, so it will have dripped out in wages and running costs - Mat Slaters £50 - £55m at the end of December before his suggested £30m loan feels right - as I said at the time

Chester Perry wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 2:39 pm

Remember there has been little income, so it will have dripped out in wages and running costs - Mat Slaters £50 - £55m at the end of December before his suggested £30m loan feels right - as I said at the time

Based on last seasons wages, league position and TV income alongside the research you do what do you estimate our wage costs and TV income will be for 20/21?

Devils_Advocate wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 2:47 pm

Based on last seasons wages, league position and TV income alongside the research you do what do you estimate our wage costs and TV income will be for 20/21?

Quite a few unknowns in that - we still owe about £7m in rebates for last season - There is the Chinese TV deal collapse to account for yet (around £340m with another years losses next season) which the premier League did not deduct from prize money last season. We are as yet unaware of rebates this season and as yet do not know where we will finish in the table.

Wages were looking to be down (just from a numbers perspective) - do we assume the many renewals are at the same, lower or higher rates as currently. We also do not know if our new board members are paying themselves wages (especially the ALK 3) or at what rate. I would expect us to be back down to the 2018/19 levels before the board members are added.

I do not expect that we will return to a 31 June month end so anticipate those figures for 12 months

Chester Perry wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 2:36 pm

not Salford - I spat my drink out when I saw it last week - from the MMT thread

Is that now or was it last season they had more staff than us? They did sack John McGreal last summer and promoted the academy manager up to head coach, although that's not worked out. It's staggering though from a club that is by no means one of the biggest in League Two.

Chester Perry wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 2:30 pm

a few other things to note

- permanent employee numbers fractionally down (There is a league 2 club that has more than us)
- I think some transfer debt owed to us has been delayed - my understanding is it was all due in last summer
- Amortisation decreased - (it will have done so again this season)
- The notes confirm an inter company loan post takeover but not for how much
- it appears we spent £46m or so last season on Intangible assets (players this usually means)

I would add we were on target for a £20m profit (pre-covid and a June 31 Accounting year end)

Chester Perry wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 2:57 pm

Quite a few unknowns in that - we still owe about £7m in rebates for last season - There is the Chinese TV deal collapse to account for yet (around £340m with another years losses next season) which the premier League did not deduct from prize money last season. We are as yet unaware of rebates this season and as yet do not know where we will finish in the table.

Wages were looking to be down (just from a numbers perspective) - do we assume the many renewals are at the same, lower or higher rates as currently. We also do not know if our new board members are paying themselves wages (especially the ALK 3) or at what rate. I would expect us to be back down to the 2018/19 levels before the board members are added.

I do not expect that we will return to a 31 June month end so anticipate those figures for 12 months

So what would an educated guess from you be on how much TV revenue we expect to get. When are the TV payments made and have there been any in this current accounting year?

summitclaret wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 1:57 pm

That was at one time looking iffy due to our exceptionally poor start to the season, that was completely avoidable.

How was the poor start avoidable?

We had an injury to Ben Mee and it showed when he came back how much he was missed. Indeed he seems to be the one player we cannot do without. We had Ben Gibson as a replacement but obviously not available. Short of buying a top quality centre back at short notice (and probably stupid money) and for a temporary problem I don't see what more could have been done. You might say 'Dawson' but I don't know how likely that would have been and there would of course have been the usual accusations of the age of the squad.

Devils_Advocate wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 3:02 pm

So what would an educated guess from you be on how much TV revenue we expect to get. When are the TV payments made and have there been any in this current accounting year?

Payments come in 3 instalments

July/August - Jan/Feb - Season End (merit payments and TV appearancesm

So we have had 2 payments for the season (though possibly only one in the Accounting period so far)

as for guessing TV revenue I would say the Premier League are more likely to, deduct the Chinese TV money in the next cycle (in an effort to even out the pain) so we could pull in £105m - £115m

Chester Perry wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 3:14 pm

Payments come in 3 instalments

July/August - Jan/Feb - Season End (merit payments and TV appearancesm

So we have had 2 payments for the season (though possibly only one in the Accounting period so far)

as for guessing TV revenue I would say the Premier League are more likely to, deduct the Chinese TV money in the next cycle (in an effort to even out the pain) so we could pull in £105m - £115m

Cheers CP so had we continued without the takeover and with our prudent Covid strategy then it sounds like our losses could have been kept to a minimum and retained the majority of our cash in the bank?

ClaretTony wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 2:59 pm

Is that now or was it last season they had more staff than us? They did sack John McGreal last summer and promoted the academy manager up to head coach, although that's not worked out. It's staggering though from a club that is by no means one of the biggest in League Two.

That is the 2019/20 accounts like ours - Colchester had even more than that in 2018/19

I can only assume that their matchday stadium staff staff are on permanent contract at the club

Devils_Advocate wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 3:18 pm

Cheers CP so had we continued without the takeover and with our prudent Covid strategy then it sounds like our losses could have been kept to a minimum and retained the majority of our cash in the bank?

yep as I have consistently said, we could have come out in the summer in a strong position with space in the budget for new additions, the contract extensions in January and the loans have substantially weakened that position

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/56625740

UTC

Hipper wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 3:03 pm

How was the poor start avoidable?

We had an injury to Ben Mee and it showed when he came back how much he was missed. Indeed he seems to be the one player we cannot do without. We had Ben Gibson as a replacement but obviously not available. Short of buying a top quality centre back at short notice (and probably stupid money) and for a temporary problem I don't see what more could have been done. You might say 'Dawson' but I don't know how likely that would have been and there would of course have been the usual accusations of the age of the squad.

We knew Ben was going to be out, we knew Tarky was looking to go/the Board wanted to sell him, we knew Brady was unreliable fitness wise (and to some extent JBG). They still are.

Furthermore, we knew that Tarky would go in the next 2 windows, if not then. We could have signed a young cb to eventually replace Tarky. Or as many have said and been proved right signed Dawson.

Yet we allowed around a fifth of the season to be gone, with Dunne and Long at cb.

summitclaret wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 3:29 pm

We knew Ben was going to be out, we knew Tarky was looking to go/the Board wanted to sell him, we knew Brady was unreliable fitness wise (and to some extent JBG). They still are.

Furthermore, we knew that Tarky would go in the next 2 windows, if not then. We could have signed a young cb to eventually replace Tarky. Or as many have said and been proved right signed Dawson.

Yet we allowed around a fifth of the season to be gone, with Dunne and Long at cb.

What this has to do with the accounts I don’t know, other than the obvious need not to overspend, but it’s maybe worth pointing out that Dunne has only ever played in two Premier League games for us.

summitclaret wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 3:29 pm

We knew Ben was going to be out, we knew Tarky was looking to go/the Board wanted to sell him, we knew Brady was unreliable fitness wise (and to some extent JBG). They still are.

Furthermore, we knew that Tarky would go in the next 2 windows, if not then. We could have signed a young cb to eventually replace Tarky. Or as many have said and been proved right signed Dawson.

Yet we allowed around a fifth of the season to be gone, with Dunne and Long at cb.

How much of that was Sean not budging on his target choices, and the board having an absolute ceiling on their target valuations (the latter is better than the former in my view for the club)

summitclaret wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 3:29 pm

We knew Ben was going to be out, we knew Tarky was looking to go/the Board wanted to sell him, we knew Brady was unreliable fitness wise (and to some extent JBG). They still are.

Furthermore, we knew that Tarky would go in the next 2 windows, if not then. We could have signed a young cb to eventually replace Tarky. Or as many have said and been proved right signed Dawson.

Yet we allowed around a fifth of the season to be gone, with Dunne and Long at cb.

And crucially the former owners and new owners knew the club was being sold.

https://twitter.com/KieranMaguire/statu ... 32960?s=19

Worth a look.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 4:52 pm

https://twitter.com/KieranMaguire/statu ... 32960?s=19

Worth a look.

The real concern in the accounts is the wage to revenue ratio - we will struggle to spend on new players, without significant exits while it is as high as it has been this last couple of years

Chester Perry wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 5:11 pm

The real concern in the accounts is the wage to revenue ratio - we will struggle to spend on new players, without significant exits while it is as high as it has been this last couple of years

I just don’t see how the club can do business this summer? Unless we shift on a few of our higher earners and by cheap I can’t see how we have the finances to buy anyone.

So would you say we were in a healthy position, up until those accounts are responsible for?

And to what extent do you think this season (including the takeover) will put us? Financially?

I literally have no idea where to start in beginning to understand the club's finances.

I would hope Hart, Lennon, Hendrick leaving would hopefully free up a decent amount of wages. Would some payment for Drinkwater be included in that too?

Even with Hart, Lennon and Hendrick I’d guess at £150k a week freed up at least.

Socrates wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 5:30 pm

I would hope Hart, Lennon, Hendrick leaving would hopefully free up a decent amount of wages. Would some payment for Drinkwater be included in that too?

Even with Hart, Lennon and Hendrick I’d guess at £150k a week freed up at least.

Drinkwater's stay would be included in those accounts - no idea how costly it was but that was what, from what I'm told, that started the arguments between Dyche and Garlick.

Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 5:23 pm

I just don’t see how the club can do business this summer? Unless we shift on a few of our higher earners and by cheap I can’t see how we have the finances to buy anyone.

Tarks is most likely going to leave.

That's his wages and whatever fee we get for him.
One year left, so circa £20-30 million, maybe.

One would hope our scouting team have targets lined up...

ClaretTony wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 5:39 pm

Drinkwater's stay would be included in those accounts - no idea how costly it was but that was what, from what I'm told, that started the arguments between Dyche and Garlick.

Interesting. Which one wanted Drinkwater and which one was proved right and didn't want him?

Leisure wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 5:58 pm

Interesting. Which one wanted Drinkwater and which one was proved right and didn't want him?

Surely the latter?

Leisure wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 5:58 pm

Interesting. Which one wanted Drinkwater and which one was proved right and didn't want him?

I was told that Dyche wasn’t keen

ClaretTony wrote: ↑

Sat Apr 03, 2021 6:18 pm

I was told that Dyche wasn’t keen

Hi CT, are you suggesting that Mike Garlick was making too many footballing decisions, who the club should sign and who the club should let go? Is that's what's behind Sean Dyche referencing, as reported by Sky Sports today, that Alan Pace will leave all the football decisions to SD? Where did Ben Gibson fit in their relationship? Similar question re Joe Hart?

UTC