gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 7:30 am

I think the ticketing system has been wrong for years. A person who buys a season ticket gets 350 points, yet a person who makes the effort to travel away gets 10 points. This has resulted in fans who just go to home games accumulating points far quicker and then when it comes to the very big games with limited availability (Blackpool away in 2014 and Aberdeen in 2018 spring to mind) they then cherry pick the games and the fans who have been all over the country lose out. That isn’t fair and leaves a bad taste. I’m not saying that those with season tickets shouldn’t get loyalty points but it needs levelling up a bit and the club need to recognise just how much time effort and money it actually takes to follow your team away.

Burnleybabe wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 8:00 am

Grumps wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 8:03 am

He says he has forgone points by getting tickets through the groups, which means his points total doesn't increase, leaving it unlikely he would have enough points to buy tickets through the official channels
Perhaps he can come back and explain.

Leisure wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 8:49 am

When he says that he has 'forgone' points it means that he knew that by the supporters club getting his ticket he would not be awarded the normal 10 points.

Leisure wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 8:49 am

When he says that he has 'forgone' points it means that he knew that by the supporters club getting his ticket he would not be awarded the normal 10 points.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 8:04 am

A couple of issues with that. Firstly, the club doesn’t profit from the sale of away tickets - so why would they weight a loyalty system in favour of those who may travel to more away games but don’t ‘support’ the club financially.

Secondly, lots of people travel a fair distance to home games. I’d class myself as relatively local, but i make a 100+ mile round trip to every home game. There will be a lot of people who travel much further.

I’m not saying there couldn’t be improvements to the system because there could. But it really isn’t a huge issue as people rarely miss out on tickets due to the relatively low demand.

gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 9:04 am

I understand your point Rileybobs, however it shouldn't always be about whether the club profits financially or not. Loyal fans should be rewarded. maybe a workaround would be in an earlier post i made.



"Post by gandhisflipflop » Wed Jul 14, 2021 11:11 am

Points should be allocated in distance travelled to get to away games for example - if you live in London, and you attend Chelsea away which is only 15 miles from your address - you accumulate 15 loyalty points. If you are travelling from Burnley which is what 350 miles? You get 350 points. And so on and so on."

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 9:02 am

Who is awarded the loyalty points in these instances? Not sure how supporters clubs work.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 9:02 am

Who is awarded the loyalty points in these instances? Not sure how supporters clubs work.

Burnleybabe wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 9:18 am

Who ever purchased the tickets gets 10 points.

Grumps wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 6:25 am

If these independent supporters groups get preferential treatment for tickets, is that not a slap in the face, to use your term, for the majority of fans who don't use them
Access to tickets shouldn't be governed by the mode of transport you use to get to a game.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 9:10 am

Why should you reward distance travelled to games though? That has little to do with ‘loyalty’. What about fans who travel to home games? Should I get more points than equally loyal fans who just so happen to live in Burnley? Seems like a daft idea to me, and that’s not to mention the environmental issue of encouraging long distance travel.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 9:10 am

Why should you reward distance travelled to games though? That has little to do with ‘loyalty’. What about fans who travel to home games? Should I get more points than equally loyal fans who just so happen to live in Burnley? Seems like a daft idea to me, and that’s not to mention the environmental issue of encouraging long distance travel.

gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 9:34 am

Because it takes a considerable amount of time and effort to follow your team hundreds of miles than it does lets say Preston away (basing off an average BFC fan from the area). It would balance itself out - if you don't live in the area, there would be clubs more local to you where it would be more convenient for you to go to over someone who lived in Burnley. Why should season ticket holders who accumulate the loyalty points faster and hardly ever go to away games have priority over those that travel regularly when it comes to the big games?

Grumps wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 9:41 am

How about an away season ticket?

Or a separate loyalty system just for away games?

Both are used successfully at other clubs.

gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 9:49 am

That is a very good idea. How do these work at other clubs? I should imagine it would be very easy to implement as all tickets are set at a maximum of £30

gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 9:49 am

That is a very good idea. How do these work at other clubs? I should imagine it would be very easy to implement as all tickets are set at a maximum of £30

randomclaret2 wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 9:38 am

Perhaps we should just play local teams, to avoid the " environmental issue "

Grumps wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 10:09 am

Rovers had an away season ticket which worked well, but think you had to travel by coach

The most simple way would be to pay up front, then be guaranteed a ticket for every game, independent of whether you attend home games. By the sound of it some on here attend away games, but don't get the huge points because they are not season ticket holders, this would allow those people first dibs at away tickets

gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 10:22 am

Also in previous seasons, you had to have a season ticket and have the loyalty points in order to purchase. Again which I think is wrong. I couldn't afford a season ticket one year and was penalised because I didn't have a season ticket despite having the required points.

ClaretTony wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 10:24 am

If you don't think being a season ticket holder should be a pre-requisite then you don't understand the concept of loyalty points.

claretonthecoast1882 wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 10:27 am

Every season we have comments about how things should be changed while those making the comments ignore the fact hardly any away game sells out.

Leisure wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 10:26 am

Right, let's try to clear up a few things around this issue. I'll try to explain the background of historically the supporters groups being allocated tickets and just how the new arrangement of clubs only being allowed to purchase a maximum of 6 tickets, for people with the required points, wiil adversely affect the clubs.

Prior to the points system even being in place the club facilitated an allocation of tickets for supporters clubs. This allowed the clubs to be fairly certain that they would have enough people booked on their coaches to cover the cost. This arrangement then continued even when the points system was introduced, so we got tickets but no points were allocated to them individually. This arrangement was fine with the supporters clubs and suited the Club, as it involved less admin/inputting of membership numbers etc.

When the Club got promoted into the PL they started arranging coach transport for fans but there was such a small take up that it was discontinued fairly quickly (as the Club was losing money every game). The Club then stated that they valued the supporters clubs organising coaches and to help facilitate this they were happy for the ticket allocation arrangement to continue.

Then a couple of years ago we were made to fill in a seasonal form showing name and membership number of everyone we had purchased a ticket for and this had to be done for every game. It was only at this point that the Club started allocating points.

Then in the 2019/20? season the Club changed the arrangement again. We had to order the number of tickets we required (maximum of 50) and pay upfront for them. Go to the Ticket Office and collect them (with the stubs still attached). Take them home and allocate a ticket/seat to a person. Tear off the appropriate stub and mark on the ticket which category it was (adult, child etc). Then we had to complete a form showing name, membership number and seat number. Then take the stubs and form back to the Ticket Office. So we were relieving the Club of a fair bit of admin.

HOW THE NEW ARRANGEMENT IMPACTS ON THE SUPPORTERS CLUBS AND PEOPLE WHO TRAVEL WITH THEM -
1) Many supporters who have traveled the length and breadth of the county with clubs for many years and who have not been allocated points, will/may not have enough points to purchase a ticket, at least in the first sale.
2) People who regularly travel with supporters clubs and sit together at games will now not be able to do that, as they will be buying their own tickets and therefore will be spread out.
3) Where previously some people would be able to book a coach seat knowing that their club would purchase their ticket for them, now they will be either booking a coach seat without knowing that they have a ticket or buying a ticket without knowing that they can then book a coach seat.
4) Whilst I haven't spoken to London Clarets, I can imagine that they now face the same issue with regards to making a group booking on the train for attending home and away games ie can't book train without having match tickets but don't want to risk buying match tickets without knowing they can book the train.
5) From an Accy Clarets point of view we will probably now not run coaches to all the away games, as we won't take the risk (especially for the long distance games) of booking a coach at costs around £1500 without knowing that there will be enough people getting their own tickets to make the trip viable.

I hope that I'm wrong but I can only see the new arrangement resulting in some supporters clubs running less coaches, so less fans following the team, and some clubs may even fold (as their main purpose is to get fans to away games). Also, people buying their own tickets and then finding that there are no coaches to book on. The Club being left with unsold tickets (with that resulting in them justifying taking small allocations for most, if not all games), resulting in sell-outs for the big, local games and some fans not being able to get tickets.
From my personal viewpoint and this may not be agreed on by all clubs and fans, I have no issue (for fairness and openness) with the Club insisting that for tickets purchased by supporters clubs people must have the required points but to limit it to 6 tickets shows no understanding of just how it works running coaches for fans to away games.

Leisure wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 10:26 am

Right, let's try to clear up a few things around this issue. I'll try to explain the background of historically the supporters groups being allocated tickets and just how the new arrangement of clubs only being allowed to purchase a maximum of 6 tickets, for people with the required points, wiil adversely affect the clubs.

Prior to the points system even being in place the club facilitated an allocation of tickets for supporters clubs. This allowed the clubs to be fairly certain that they would have enough people booked on their coaches to cover the cost. This arrangement then continued even when the points system was introduced, so we got tickets but no points were allocated to them individually. This arrangement was fine with the supporters clubs and suited the Club, as it involved less admin/inputting of membership numbers etc.

When the Club got promoted into the PL they started arranging coach transport for fans but there was such a small take up that it was discontinued fairly quickly (as the Club was losing money every game). The Club then stated that they valued the supporters clubs organising coaches and to help facilitate this they were happy for the ticket allocation arrangement to continue.

Then a couple of years ago we were made to fill in a seasonal form showing name and membership number of everyone we had purchased a ticket for and this had to be done for every game. It was only at this point that the Club started allocating points.

Then in the 2019/20? season the Club changed the arrangement again. We had to order the number of tickets we required (maximum of 50) and pay upfront for them. Go to the Ticket Office and collect them (with the stubs still attached). Take them home and allocate a ticket/seat to a person. Tear off the appropriate stub and mark on the ticket which category it was (adult, child etc). Then we had to complete a form showing name, membership number and seat number. Then take the stubs and form back to the Ticket Office. So we were relieving the Club of a fair bit of admin.

HOW THE NEW ARRANGEMENT IMPACTS ON THE SUPPORTERS CLUBS AND PEOPLE WHO TRAVEL WITH THEM -
1) Many supporters who have traveled the length and breadth of the county with clubs for many years and who have not been allocated points, will/may not have enough points to purchase a ticket, at least in the first sale.
2) People who regularly travel with supporters clubs and sit together at games will now not be able to do that, as they will be buying their own tickets and therefore will be spread out.
3) Where previously some people would be able to book a coach seat knowing that their club would purchase their ticket for them, now they will be either booking a coach seat without knowing that they have a ticket or buying a ticket without knowing that they can then book a coach seat.
4) Whilst I haven't spoken to London Clarets, I can imagine that they now face the same issue with regards to making a group booking on the train for attending home and away games ie can't book train without having match tickets but don't want to risk buying match tickets without knowing they can book the train.
5) From an Accy Clarets point of view we will probably now not run coaches to all the away games, as we won't take the risk (especially for the long distance games) of booking a coach at costs around £1500 without knowing that there will be enough people getting their own tickets to make the trip viable.

I hope that I'm wrong but I can only see the new arrangement resulting in some supporters clubs running less coaches, so less fans following the team, and some clubs may even fold (as their main purpose is to get fans to away games). Also, people buying their own tickets and then finding that there are no coaches to book on. The Club being left with unsold tickets (with that resulting in them justifying taking small allocations for most, if not all games), resulting in sell-outs for the big, local games and some fans not being able to get tickets.
From my personal viewpoint and this may not be agreed on by all clubs and fans, I have no issue (for fairness and openness) with the Club insisting that for tickets purchased by supporters clubs people must have the required points but to limit it to 6 tickets shows no understanding of just how it works running coaches for fans to away games.

gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 9:49 am

That is a very good idea. How do these work at other clubs? I should imagine it would be very easy to implement as all tickets are set at a maximum of £30

Leisure wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 10:39 am

But would people be prepared to pay £570 upfront, especially when they won't know at that time just how many of those 19 games they'll be able to attend?

Leisure wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 8:49 am

When he says that he has 'forgone' points it means that he knew that by the supporters club getting his ticket he would not be awarded the normal 10 points.

randomclaret2 wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 10:36 am

Do you mind me asking if these issues have been raised with the club, and if so, what was their response ?

Leisure wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 10:48 am

Certainly has been raised with them but whilst we were aware that some changes were likely, especially around the points requirements, we only got informed officially on Tuesday of last week. Since then I've asked for clarification on how many tickets we can purchase for people with the required number of points and the answer was 6. We can't be committing to running a coach (costing £1500+) to places like Southampton, Norwich, the London clubs etc knowing that only 6 people have tickets!

aggi wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 10:46 am

You can see why a lot of people are suspicious, and not that sympathetic, about supporters club ticketing arrangements.

If tickets were being bought using each travelling individuals' clarets number through Friends and Family, as has been claimed many times, then the individuals would get the points.

Leisure wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 10:39 am

But would people be prepared to pay £570 upfront, especially when they won't know at that time just how many of those 19 games they'll be able to attend?

randomclaret2 wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 10:36 am

Do you mind me asking if these issues have been raised with the club, and if so, what was their response ?

Leisure wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 10:52 am

We were allocated 50 tickets for each game (for these tickets only 10 points were allocated to the person purchasing them, until more recently when the system changed) , any more than that we either purchased through F and F or at the Ticket Office (when points were awarded).
PS - who are suspicious and not sympathetic?

onewillieirvine wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 11:17 am

Just wondering how this situation has arisen. Have the club received complaints regarding the supporters clubs allocations? Or has somebody at the club thought how can I make it more difficult for fans to travel to away games?

ClaretTony wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 21, 2021 11:27 am

We can't answer that because there was no consultation with us at all.