Apologies if this thread is not allowed but it is to do with football.

The Premier League have announced, despite the government withdrawing the need for COVID passports, that spot checks at stadiums across the country will continue after October 1st with fans needing to show a negative test or prove they have been double vaccinated.

This has been in place since the first game of the season and for the Brighton and Leeds games, I didn't see one person being spot checked at Turf Moor, has anyone else seen this happen yet or been spot checked themselves?

https://www.skysports.com/football/news ... ative-test

claretburns wrote: ↑

Wed Sep 15, 2021 8:53 am

Apologies if this thread is not allowed but it is to do with football.

The Premier League have announced, despite the government withdrawing the need for COVID passports, that spot checks at stadiums across the country will continue after October 1st with fans needing to show a negative test or prove they have been double vaccinated.

This has been in place since the first game of the season and for the Brighton and Leeds games, I didn't see one person being spot checked at Turf Moor, has anyone else seen this happen yet or been spot checked themselves?

https://www.skysports.com/football/news ... ative-test

Nope. Not at Turf Moor, Anfield or Goodison.

To be honest, I think they would struggle to refuse entry to someone who didn’t have it given the Governments most recent stance and the general confusion around protocols. I wouldn’t like to be the spot check steward trying to turn folk away, put it that way…

I struggled to see how this could be implemented at the start of the season and I'm struggling to see how this can be enforced now. The rule is not backed up by any law.

NewClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:01 am

Nope. Not at Turf Moor, Anfield or Goodison.

To be honest, I think they would struggle to refuse entry to someone who didn’t have it given the Governments most recent stance and the general confusion around protocols. I wouldn’t like to be the spot check steward trying to turn folk away, put it that way…

It's a private building, they can impose any restrictions they wish, just like any landlord of a pub can refuse to serve anyone, or enforce a dress code etc etc

I'll be surprised if clubs refuse admission if someone is checked who can't show proof of double vaccination or negative test. If they do surely they'll have to have a process in place to part refund the season ticket holder.

I’ve posted on another thread that I was checked at Goodison. I had no problem with it.

Imagine thousands of attendees who have been on the pop all day before the game being asked

Would cause mayhem. A lot of younger especially arent double jabbed

taio wrote: ↑

Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:20 am

I'll be surprised if clubs refuse admission if someone is checked who can't show proof of double vaccination or negative test. If they do surely they'll have to have a process in place to part refund the season ticket holder.

A lot of Premier League clubs have a process in place to refund season ticket holders who have to isolate.

ClaretTony wrote: ↑

Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:54 am

I’ve posted on another thread that I was checked at Goodison. I had no problem with it.

I'd be happy to be spot checked and show proof of my double vaccination too. It's the ones who haven't been double vaccinated that won't be happy.

Same as above, I am double jabbed and would be happy to show this if asked to do so, but I can just imagine the problems at turnstiles if some individuals are turned away.

Wouldnt it also cause.massive queues and potential missing of the start of the game

Froobs wrote: ↑

Wed Sep 15, 2021 10:29 am

Wouldnt it also cause.massive queues and potential missing of the start of the game

This would also be one of my major concerns, and how the stewards would decide who they checked and who they didn't given it's supposedly random.

I've nothing against the policy per se, but if thousands descend on TM en masse 15-20 minutes prior to KO there's the potential for chaos and folks being delayed in entering, which may cause problems in itself if the punters start getting restless.

If the want to do it, it has to be done properly. Clubs should employ people specifically to do it. Not pass it on to the stewards who are there for other reasons.

I've no problems with the passport scheme, but, it should be all or none. Very unfair if one person gets turned away, but a thousand with the same status are allowed in.

If it is a policy, then surely everyone should be clearly informed if they are an ST holder, or purchase a ticket?
I've just read it on here by chance.
I have been double jabbed since April, but wouldn't be taking evidence of this to a football match unless it was made clear to me that I had to.

This will hardly be enforced and is a waste of time. Either do it properly and provide evidence on entry or don’t bother. This is a token gesture that won’t actually help deal with the problem. I reckon about 1% of fans wear masks to and from seats and in communal areas and I know plenty of double jabbed people who have caught COVID. When the numbers go crazy I won’t be attending but people can make their own judgements. Some don’t give one and some do.

"show us your private medical history or you can't go in".


Is this the gist?

tarkys_ears wrote: ↑

Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:52 pm

"show us your private medical history or you can't go in".


Is this the gist?

Yep, similar to if you want to travel... Your choice

Don't see the problem

tarkys_ears wrote: ↑

Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:52 pm

"show us your private medical history or you can't go in".


Is this the gist?

Roughly so it seems. Well done on the Premier League for bringing in this initiative for all clubs

Really don't see how random checks would work, whether people object or not. Where would they do them? Surely not at the turnstiles, which would cause chaos as some people argued about having to be checked. Away from the turnstiles means you can just return later and probably NOT get checked. Then there is the government guidlines to consider. Nothing there about being checked anywhere socially, so why football grounds?

Plus of course, medical records are supposed to be private. Why should any football club be privy to them, and who might they pass those details on to?

Froobs wrote: ↑

Wed Sep 15, 2021 10:29 am

Wouldnt it also cause.massive queues and potential missing of the start of the game

Am I too naive in thinking the double jab proof could be added to your season ticket card and save you having to prove vaccination status at (potentially) every game??

I wonder if the anti passport posters have a reason for not wanting the checks? 90% of people over 16 in the UK have had at least one jab. In Burnley that figure is only 76%.
So a quarter of Burnley fans could be turned away on a probability basis.

Grumps wrote: ↑

Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:15 am

It's a private building, they can impose any restrictions they wish, just like any landlord of a pub can refuse to serve anyone, or enforce a dress code etc etc

I wasn’t saying they couldn’t legally, just that I think some fans would take a dim view to being turned away given the most recent government position on the need for vaccine passports.

We may know that they are needed because we read this board, where the PL position is debated and Tony kindly shares the rules for away games, but I’d say we don’t represent the vast majority of match-going fans who don’t read this board or seek the information out themselves.

Given the backdrop of the government narrative being that they are not necessary at the moment, I wouldn’t like to be a turnstile operator/spot checker trying to turn away a family of four who’ve travelled down from Scotland to watch the match!

NewClaret wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 6:27 pm

I wasn’t saying they couldn’t legally, just that I think some fans would take a dim view to being turned away given the most recent government position on the need for vaccine passports.

We may know that they are needed because we read this board, where the PL position is debated and Tony kindly shares the rules for away games, but I’d say we don’t represent the vast majority of match-going fans who don’t read this board or seek the information out themselves.

Given the backdrop of the government narrative being that they are not necessary at the moment, I wouldn’t like to be a turnstile operator/spot checker trying to turn away a family of four who’ve travelled down from Scotland to watch the match!

Any family travelling from Scotland (or anywhere or anyone else for that matter ) to a Footy Match and not carrying proof of vaccination or pcr test is a bit silly really as its sort of out in the open there "might be checks" at Premier League grounds...

Bosscat wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 6:36 pm

Any family travelling from Scotland (or anywhere or anyone else for that matter ) to a Footy Match and not carrying proof of vaccination or pcr test is a bit silly really as its sort of out in the open there "might be checks" at Premier League grounds...

I suppose my point is twofold:

1. I don’t think it’s correct to assume that everyone is aware of the PL Covid policies. You’re right to say the majority will be sensible enough to check, but with the Government recently deciding not to mandate them, I could understand some fans being unaware/confused about the position (genuine folk who have busy lives and are not glued to UTC/SSN). Even if I felt they were a bit stupid in not checking, I’m not sure I’d want to turn away a family with excited kids looking forward to a match who may have travelled a long distance to support their team. Would you?

2. Then there will be some obstinate people just unwilling to comply. That group are probably the most likely to react angrily if refused entry. Football crowds, often half cut, aren’t the type of group I’d be wanting to stop and refuse entry to. We’re not talking nightclubs here with doorman experienced in dealing with these situations, with the relevant training and stature. We’re talking turnstile operators/stewards likely on minimum wage.

I’m not saying I disagree with the policy, just that I think it’s a tough one to enforce.

NewClaret wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 7:28 pm

I suppose my point is twofold:

1. I don’t think it’s correct to assume that everyone is aware of the PL Covid policies. You’re right to say the majority will be sensible enough to check, but with the Government recently deciding not to mandate them, I could understand some fans being unaware/confused about the position (genuine folk who have busy lives and are not glued to UTC/SSN). Even if I felt they were a bit stupid in not checking, I’m not sure I’d want to turn away a family with excited kids looking forward to a match who may have travelled a long distance to support their team. Would you?

2. Then there will be some obstinate people just unwilling to comply. That group are probably the most likely to react angrily if refused entry. Football crowds, often half cut, aren’t the type of group I’d be wanting to stop and refuse entry to. We’re not talking nightclubs here with doorman experienced in dealing with these situations, with the relevant training and stature. We’re talking turnstile operators/stewards likely on minimum wage.

I’m not saying I disagree with the policy, just that I think it’s a tough one to enforce.

1- I'd assume they're either dense or living under a rock, but if they aren't able to provide proof it isn't worth the person's job to let them in regardless.

2 - they can also get lost quite simply, regardless of how arsey they want to get

Also, Police will be present so there's only going to be one outcome.

I remember seeing a video clip of some self entitled American woman having a massive argument with someone at an airline desk because they wouldn't let her fly, because she refused to follow the rules.
One issue was she hadn't checked the rules before buying the ticket and heading to the airport.
This sort of entitlement/stupidity can't be allowed to take precedence over other people's safety.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 7:33 pm

1- I'd assume they're either dense or living under a rock, but if they aren't able to provide proof it isn't worth the person's job to let them in regardless.

I don't think I'm particularly dense or living under a rock, but this thread is the first I've heard of it.
Have the club informed ST holders about it?
Have the PL advertised it anywhere?
(I don't think for example that anything was flagged up at the 2 games so far. It could have been both announced and displayed on the screen if they were serious about supporters knowing about it).

nil_desperandum wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 7:49 pm

I don't think I'm particularly dense or living under a rock, but this thread is the first I've heard of it.
Have the club informed ST holders about it?
Have the PL advertised it anywhere?
(I don't think for example that anything was flagged up at the 2 games so far. It could have been both announced and displayed on the screen if they were serious about supporters knowing about it).

It was mentioned before the Brighton game, so it's hardly old news, because people on here were annoyed with it then.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 7:51 pm

It was mentioned before the Brighton game, so it's hardly old news, because people on here were annoyed with it then.

Mentioned how? On the big screen, announced or emailed to ST holders?

nil_desperandum wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 7:57 pm

Mentioned how? On the big screen, announced or emailed to ST holders?

We are in a Pandemic.
It's been mentioned in various places for large mass events that Covid spot checks could be happening

Please see my rock answer.

It was widely reported in the media. And I'm pretty sure the club put something on the official website.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 7:33 pm

1- I'd assume they're either dense or living under a rock, but if they aren't able to provide proof it isn't worth the person's job to let them in regardless.

2 - they can also get lost quite simply, regardless of how arsey they want to get

Also, Police will be present so there's only going to be one outcome.

Do you get to many games Sid? I can't ever remember the Police being outside the turnstiles.

The Police normally stand where any flash points could occur with away fans or in the ground at the clubs expense.
You're describing an area where either side won't want to pick the bill up.

I remember a Police Sargent mate of mine who was working the CF with only one other copper. A steward radioed through saying he needed Police help, as someone was smoking in the toilets. He went mad how he thought that was a Police priority with only 2 of them in a flash point stand.
I think you would get the same response outside the ground. A stewards job for the club. Not breaking any laws.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:02 pm

We are in a Pandemic.
It's been mentioned in various places for large mass events that Covid spot checks could be happening

Please see my rock answer.

I think the key word there is "could". This is also contradicted by official govt. guidelines / laws, so I think it would be reasonable for people to assume that there are no "passports" required.
Definitely the first I've heard of it is on this forum in past 24 hours.
Not that I particularly disagree with it, it's the poor communication from BFC / PL that I have an issue with.
As I've implied: an email to all ST holders for something so important might have been expected.

nil_desperandum wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:08 pm

I think the key word there is "could". This is also contradicted by official govt. guidelines / laws, so I think it would be reasonable for people to assume that there are no "passports" required.
Definitely the first I've heard of it is on this forum in past 24 hours.
Not that I particularly disagree with it, it's the poor communication from BFC / PL that I have an issue with.
As I've implied: an email to all ST holders for something so important might have been expected.

Here, have a read.

https://www.burnleyexpress.net/sport/fo ... ry-3373846

Quickenthetempo wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:05 pm

Do you get to many games Sid? I can't ever remember the Police being outside the turnstiles.

The Police normally stand where any flash points could occur with away fans or in the ground at the clubs expense.
You're describing an area where either side won't want to pick the bill up.

I remember a Police Sargent mate of mine who was working the CF with only one other copper. A steward radioed through saying he needed Police help, as someone was smoking in the toilets. He went mad how he thought that was a Police priority with only 2 of them in a flash point stand.
I think you would get the same response outside the ground. A stewards job for the club. Not breaking any laws.

I was at the Brighton game.
If checks are to become mandatory I'd expect to see more police near the turnstiles incase of any issues.
Smoking in the bog is just accepted now from the smell of it, Covid issues will be deemed more serious.

This stuff has been circulating since the summer and checks could be mandatory from October so PL clubs are just getting ahead of that.

BBC Sport information regarding Covid protocols, Inc spot checks.

Premier League: What are the protocols for fans returning this weekend? - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/58179662

Premier League: Covid-19 status spot-checks introduced for first games of season - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/58153110

All this information has been reported on and is easily accessible, it isn't just going on at Burnley

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:31 pm

I was at the Brighton game.
If checks are to become mandatory I'd expect to see more police near the turnstiles incase of any issues.
Smoking in the bog is just accepted now from the smell of it, Covid issues will be deemed more serious.

This stuff has been circulating since the summer and checks could be mandatory from October so PL clubs are just getting ahead of that.

But at the minute, seeing as it's the club/premier league wanting these checks and not the law, then the club will have to pay extra for any officers they want there.

In October if the law states it then the Police could use their budget?

Quickenthetempo wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:48 pm

But at the minute, seeing as it's the club/premier league wanting these checks and not the law, then the club will have to pay extra for any officers they want there.

In October if the law states it then the Police could use their budget?

I don't know how the officers are located around the ground, do you?
It may not cost any extra

There is absolute no chance the police will engage

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:50 pm

I don't know how the officers are located around the ground, do you?
It may not cost any extra

The general rule is the club pay for any officers they have within the stadium. It will be agreed how many and what rates.
Then the police put officers outside where needed for public safety reasons. These officers come out of the police budget and are mainly doing overtime. So it's not cheap.

Quickenthetempo wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 9:04 pm

The general rule is the club pay for any officers they have within the stadium. It will be agreed how many and what rates.
Then the police put officers outside where needed for public safety reasons. These officers come out of the police budget and are mainly doing overtime. So it's not cheap.

The spot checks would be done prior to entry I assume, as it's easier to prevent access than it is to remove someone who's already in.
Thus the police could be present at no extra cost, that's how I'd do it.

Does anyone know what level of spot checks they are targeting? 1%, 5%, 10%?

Also, are the EFL doing this?

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:28 pm

Here, have a read.

https://www.burnleyexpress.net/sport/fo ... ry-3373846

Haven't read the Burnley Express for years, nor seen it elsewhere. I didn't say that it hadn't been reported elsewhere, just that I hadn't noticed it, so I don't think it was a "big news" story. (Far more about Ronaldo (e.g.) which interests me, and affects me not one bit.)
My point really, is that as it potentially changes the T & Cs for entry to the ground - having already paid for my ST, one might expect the club to notify me, and it's really not difficult. They do contact me about other stuff. In fact I got one today about purchasing tickets for Rochdale game, even though I booked about 10 days ago.

nil_desperandum wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 9:21 pm

Haven't read the Burnley Express for years, nor seen it elsewhere. I didn't say that it hadn't been reported elsewhere, just that I hadn't noticed it, so I don't think it was a "big news" story. (Far more about Ronaldo (e.g.) which interests me, and affects me not one bit.)
My point really, is that as it potentially changes the T & Cs for entry to the ground - having already paid for my ST, one might expect the club to notify me, and it's really not difficult. They do contact me about other stuff. In fact I got one today about purchasing tickets for Rochdale game, even though I booked about 10 days ago.

I don't recall getting an email from either City, nor Utd about covid spot checks, I get emails from both about lots of other stuff after buying tickets for their games in the past.

This is just one of those where there's been plenty in the news and you've not seen it and not thought to check for any Covid related updates for PL football.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 7:33 pm

1- I'd assume they're either dense or living under a rock, but if they aren't able to provide proof it isn't worth the person's job to let them in regardless.

2 - they can also get lost quite simply, regardless of how arsey they want to get

Also, Police will be present so there's only going to be one outcome.

1. I’d not classify myself as either, but as nd said, I wouldn’t know without reading this board/Tony’s info. I’ve certainly not received anything from the club to my knowledge. Also, the key point is that the government has recently announced it won’t be introducing passports/it is not necessary to at the moment. Do you not agree that contradictory messaging might confuse people?

2. You sound the perfect man for the job £8 an hour. Give BFC a call, bet you get a free ticket too

I earn double that delivering food for a living, the club couldn't afford me

This is an article in The Athletic from just the other day, AFTER Javid said there wouldn't be Covid passports etc.

https://theathletic.com/news/vaccine-pa ... GV9k2pKqW9

NewClaret wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 9:27 pm

1. I’d not classify myself as either, but as nd said, I wouldn’t know without reading this board/Tony’s info. I’ve certainly not received anything from the club to my knowledge. Also, the key point is that the government has recently announced it won’t be introducing passports/it is not necessary to at the moment. Do you not agree that contradictory messaging might confuse people?

2. You sound the perfect man for the job £8 an hour. Give BFC a call, bet you get a free ticket too

Your first point sums up exactly what I have been trying to say. Thank you.
I'm not being argumentative, just articulating what I consider to be a reasonable point about communication.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 9:15 pm

The spot checks would be done prior to entry I assume, as it's easier to prevent access than it is to remove someone who's already in.
Thus the police could be present at no extra cost, that's how I'd do it.

I'm sure the club would love that, but the Police won't want to pay for them.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 16, 2021 9:31 pm

I earn double that delivering food for a living, the club couldn't afford me

This is an article in The Athletic from just the other day, AFTER Javid said there wouldn't be Covid passports etc.

https://theathletic.com/news/vaccine-pa ... GV9k2pKqW9

There you go, see, the club can’t afford folk like you who would enforce it properly. They’ll pay peanuts so get monkeys

Not a member of the athletic but my point isn’t really about us lot - tech and media savvy, interested enough to talk about this on a message board - it’s the older folks without smartphones, or the single mum who works every hour god sends. They’ve read in the mail that passports are out & they’ve received nothing from the club telling them what to do in the first place, let alone since, but you want them to subscribe to the athletic to get the latest or set the police on them at the turnstiles. You heartless *******