Won 4 in 29 (I think)
Not won at home since Jan 26th
Tactically poor
Unbinding loyalty
Falling attendances
This must be a cause of concern for Pace, if we lose on Saturday it will surely start to ramp up.

Dyche is pretty much untouchable after his new contract.

I said it a while back if we are cut adrift by January he will be gone.

Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 1:59 pm

I said it a while back if we are cut adrift by January he will be gone.

There's 12m reasons why he won't be.

He won't be gone. He'll be given the chance to take us back, and I think he will have earned it too if we drop. We are suffering from the years of underinvestment. Did anyone expect it to be fixed in one window?

He deserves time, having given us so many memories, and delivered what many thought was impossible.

I dont think im even near the stage to kick up a stink calling for his head, I'll just vote with my feet first, and return after when there's a fresh start, as I think he deserves that much.

And I think that goes for a few I have spoken with, some feel he is a 1 trick pony and just a dinosaur in the Allerdyce/Pulis mould.
They've voted with their feet, rather than on the terraces, which I think is fair enough.

How long Pace will stand by and watch the investment diminish before his eyes who actually knows, but with handing out the excellent 4 year contract, he has probably shown his hand and given Mr Dyche all the cards.

The business side of things needs to flourish for the investors to remain happy and on side, and that means firstly staying in the league, and secondly growing the brand.
At this moment in time the first looks unlikely, and the 2nd isn't happening due to falling crowds and people not liking or wanting to pay for what's on offer.

Is this a concerted campaign? Everyone who doesn't like Sean Dyche, start a new thread to say so?

Don't think he should be under real pressure, but he certainly looks devoid of ideas at the moment. He just keeps doing the same thing over and over. Even when it's clearly not working he is incredibly reluctant to change. It feels like he has no faith in his own team.

dsr wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 2:07 pm

Is this a concerted campaign? Everyone who doesn't like Sean Dyche, start a new thread to say so?

No, it was just a question because ANY other manager in the Prem with those stats would be gone new contract or not, I am sure there will be clauses in the contract to mitigate any payoffs.

dsr wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 2:07 pm

Is this a concerted campaign? Everyone who doesn't like Sean Dyche, start a new thread to say so?

I don’t think many people are actively Dyche out. However I don’t think Pace will hang around, his investment depends on Burnley staying up. If we go down I’m sure he will be running back to America quick enough

I have said it before but the ones who do want him gone why not all join up and voice your view at the game or outside the ground.

Bit empty making noise on a forum but not in public, that way least the club will know how you feel.

For me the results are to be expected. Where I think SD has failed is not realising that everyone outside of our defence (exclude McNeil & Cornet in this) is just not up to the job of maintaining us in the PL. He should have been barking at Pace to sort it out. For a club in our position failure to exploit the loan market is a major failure. WE cannot afford the luxury of ruling out key options. If SD still feels we can still survive I must me missing some form of miracle

Just a question for everyone here. We all know he keeps trying the same thing-but what about the two coaches-do they believe in the formation and players we are using. They strike me as YES MEN. Can you see Woan or Stone saying to him-look we need to change it round Saturday. Lets start with Vydra but lets give Wood a rest on the bench

Given the failure of our previous board in the past transfer windows no chance they’ll sack him after giving him a 4 year deal.

warksclaret wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 2:24 pm

Can you see Woan or Stone saying to him-look we need to change it round Saturday. Lets start with Vydra but lets give Wood a rest on the bench

This is my issue. We can all see Wood is not on it at the moment and a couple of the midfield are really struggling, but you can almost guess the line-up and the tactics right now. It's predictable and must be uninspiring as a player to know that no matter how well you do, your only chance is if there is an injury because Dyche just doesn't seem to drop out of form players.

Dyche would have had a say in Cornet, Collins and Roberts. All three look great, so lets be optimistic that Dyche and ALK are a good fit.

I’ve said for some years that Dyche needs a firm word at times - the board are in charge, they have to choose when to “have a word”, they can’t pick the team for him (though some owners try to) but they can lay a few principles down and Dyche would then have to decide if he is happy to go along with them.

Things like how to behave in interviews, approach to shortlisting players, discipline - all things the board may have strong views on and which can at times trickle into on-pitch performance (e.g. Ole handling Pogba at Man U etc).

EDIT - not saying the above examples are Dyche weaknesses, just examples. He does have weaknesses but I’m not going into my views on that.

snapcrackleandpop wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 2:14 pm

No, it was just a question because ANY other manager in the Prem with those stats would be gone new contract or not, I am sure there will be clauses in the contract to mitigate any payoffs.

Norwich haven't sacked Farke and he's got far worse stats.
Apart from that though, you're right

The failure of our previous owners to invest in players despite vast profits is our problem
Sean told Garlick he needed better players yet was given derisory sums to attempt to recruit
Sean will get us moving again UTC

Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 2:16 pm

I don’t think many people are actively Dyche out. However I don’t think Pace will hang around, his investment depends on Burnley staying up. If we go down I’m sure he will be running back to America quick enough

Impressive.

Pace won't flee at the first relegation, he'd need to sell the club first and that takes time.

We were discussing the Dyche situation last night. I see it as we are coming to a point soon (very soon on current results) where a decision has to be made. It’s either change and do it quickly or sit tight and back Dyche and his record to bring us straight back up. Once we get past the point of realistic (not mathematical) saviour from relegation there’s no point sacking him.

I must add I’m not in any Dyche out camp, but I fully understand some people’s growing disinterest. It’s hard going at the moment in terms of attacking intent, match day experience and feeling.

I should imagine he's under pressure every time he walks across the Turf to the dugouts and he's been doing it for over 9 years...so people need to get of his back...get behind him not on his back....can't believe the best manager we have ever had is being questioned about the job he's doing for our club.

Quickenthetempo wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 2:04 pm

There's 12m reasons why he won't be.

If Pace has been smart, there will be clauses in the contract related to performance. One I would expect would be a reduction in salary in the event of relegation.

snapcrackleandpop wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 2:14 pm

No, it was just a question because ANY other manager in the Prem with those stats would be gone new contract or not

Daniel Farke?

Billy Balfour wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 2:05 pm

He won't be gone. He'll be given the chance to take us back, and I think he will have earned it too if we drop. We are suffering from the years of underinvestment. Did anyone expect it to be fixed in one window?

I see this kind of quote quite often and it’s a fair point, however people are basing this on the fact that should we go down, Dyche will want to stay to try and get us back up, which with the team we have at the moment won’t be an easy thing. Dyche clearly fancies himself as a top manager so who’s to say we get relegated and he walks to another, ‘bigger’ Championship club? I sometimes feel that people believe the bloke will stay here forever.

Quite frankly he should be under real pressure given the performance over the last 2 seasons.
I bet he isn't feeling it though.

Second half of next season if we're struggling in the Championship.
Otherwise, no real pressure on him.

Major rebuilding job needed whatever happens.

The back bone of this team taking out those that will likely leave won’t imho have a championship promotion season in them. The likes if Lowton, Mee, Barnes, J Rod, JBG, Westwood, Cork etc etc.

It’s completely different to last time. These players have 5/6 years of PL football behind them, could they really be arsed or even hack a 46 game promotion push?

gawthorpe_view wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 3:24 pm

Second half of next season if we're struggling in the Championship.
Otherwise, no real pressure on him.

Totally agree. I also very much doubt we’d find a better/more experienced manager so very little pointeven considering a change.

2 promotions out of the Championship, zero pressure at this stage

Dyched wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 3:32 pm

It’s completely different to last time. These players have 5/6 years of PL football behind them, could they really be arsed or even hack a 46 game promotion push?

They probably shouldn't be playing football at all if they can't be arsed.

If we did go down are you seriously saying a player like Ben Mee would be lacking in effort to get back to the PL?

snapcrackleandpop wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 1:55 pm

Not won at home since Jan 26th

As this is the overreaction to a League Cup defeat, you are incorrect, we beat Rochdale in the very same competition.

And we've also won five away games since 22nd January which is a good return for us.

No balance to your argument.

BLH_Claret wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 3:21 pm

I see this kind of quote quite often and it’s a fair point, however people are basing this on the fact that should we go down, Dyche will want to stay to try and get us back up, which with the team we have at the moment won’t be an easy thing. Dyche clearly fancies himself as a top manager so who’s to say we get relegated and he walks to another, ‘bigger’ Championship club? I sometimes feel that people believe the bloke will stay here forever.

You may be right but if he did leave he’d have to be willing to take a substantial pay cut. If I were him, I’d just wait to be sacked and get paid out. He’d still walk into any Championship club job IMO.

Couple of things need mentioning

He's earnt the right to be under no pressure at the moment

He's as responsible for the situation with recruitment pre-Pace as everyone else is

However, Him and Pace seem a good fit, but its a results business, and he needs results

So are you saying 1 pl win at home since January is a good or bad return for us?

I do feel like he should be under some pressure but that midfield is so genuinely terrible I don't think any manager could win with it.

KlyBfc wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 2:45 pm

We were discussing the Dyche situation last night. I see it as we are coming to a point soon (very soon on current results) where a decision has to be made. It’s either change and do it quickly or sit tight and back Dyche and his record to bring us straight back up. Once we get past the point of realistic (not mathematical) saviour from relegation there’s no point sacking him.

I must add I’m not in any Dyche out camp, but I fully understand some people’s growing disinterest. It’s hard going at the moment in terms of attacking intent, match day experience and feeling.

He signed a new contract last month. So obviously "a decision was made" then. Why do you think they need to make it again - and should this decision be made every month?

The stats are very poor and a manager wouldn’t survive these at another club. Having said that whilst Dyche seems stubborn and reluctant to change things tactically the lack of investment in the squad is not his fault or the new board’s. It looks as though the former chairman was looking to line his own pockets for some time to the detriment of the club on the pitch. Some of the players are no longer fit for purpose despite what Dyche says publicly. Central midfield and two of the strikers would struggle in the Championship and our main goal threat is woefully off form. Pressure will build when enough people don’t turn up and if PL status is really at risk. The product then starts to lose value for the owners. It’s hard to win fans back and we aren’t going to be anybody’s ‘favourite underdog’ with the dire football on show.

CrosspoolClarets wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 2:36 pm

Dyche would have had a say in Cornet, Collins and Roberts. All three look great, so lets be optimistic that Dyche and ALK are a good fit.

Things like how to behave in interviews, approach to shortlisting players, discipline - all things the board may have strong views on and which can at times trickle into on-pitch performance (e.g. Ole handling Pogba at Man U etc).

Just thinking about the ManU situation. Do you think Solskjaer regrets being "bounced" into re-signing CR7 by Fergie - just so Man City couldn't sign him?

ClaretTony wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 3:44 pm

As this is the overreaction to a League Cup defeat, you are incorrect, we beat Rochdale in the very same competition.

And we've also won five away games since 22nd January which is a good return for us.

No balance to your argument.

Tony it really isn’t because of last night it’s the last 30 games or so, and not Dyche out YET.

fidelcastro wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 3:39 pm

They probably shouldn't be playing football at all if they can't be arsed.

If we did go down are you seriously saying a player like Ben Mee would be lacking in effort to get back to the PL?

If we kept too many of the over 30s around there probably wouldn't be the same hunger to get promoted, no.

snapcrackleandpop wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 4:08 pm

Tony it really isn’t because of last night it’s the last 30 games or so, and not Dyche out YET.

It was posted after last night which I think is our only disappointing performance this season. We've played some good stuff at times but we can't keep the goals out away and we can't score them at home and that's the problem right now. We are playing far better than we were at this stage last season.

Billy Balfour wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 2:05 pm

He won't be gone. He'll be given the chance to take us back, and I think he will have earned it too if we drop. We are suffering from the years of underinvestment. Did anyone expect it to be fixed in one window?

Take a f**king bow. SENSE SPOKEN AT LAST.

He's got what he's got and what was bought for him. What was bought for him can't play football effectively any other way.

Do you really think Dyche would have bought Stephens if the calibre of Cornett was available? NO! Garlick wouldn't have spent the money on Collins & Cornett whilst he was actively selling the club. Why can't people see this? The lack of investment from the Garlick run board has now started to come to roost.

Woodleyclaret wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 2:36 pm

The failure of our previous owners to invest in players despite vast profits is our problem
Sean told Garlick he needed better players yet was given derisory sums to attempt to recruit
Sean will get us moving again UTC

How do you know this is true? Perhaps Dyche was so insistent on certain Rivera it made it very difficult to get players in?

Burnley Ace wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 4:49 pm

How do you know this is true? Perhaps Dyche was so insistent on certain Rivera it made it very difficult to get players in?

What's the point in signing a player for the sake of it? If the player doesn't fit or improve the team why sign them?

However, it has been said in the past that Dyche, although had final say on a signing, didn't identify nor chase the targets. That was Rigg's department.

He's already under pressure but there's plenty of the season to go yet. That said it will only increase if Barnes and Wood are on the pitch together again, it really was game over when they came on last night.

snapcrackleandpop wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 1:55 pm

Won 4 in 29 (I think)
Not won at home since Jan 26th
Tactically poor
Unbinding loyalty
Falling attendances
This must be a cause of concern for Pace, if we lose on Saturday it will surely start to ramp up.

On this form alone his tenure should now be in question he has done a fabulous job in previous seasons but the PL standard has moved on and he hasnt he has reached his limit as a coach at this level, the problem is who would replace him that would make/allowed to make/ funded to make the changes that are needed?

bf2k wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 4:45 pm

Take a f**king bow. SENSE SPOKEN AT LAST.

He's got what he's got and what was bought for him. What was bought for him can't play football effectively any other way.

Do you really think Dyche would have bought Stephens if the calibre of Cornett was available? NO! Garlick wouldn't have spent the money on Collins & Cornett whilst he was actively selling the club. Why can't people see this? The lack of investment from the Garlick run board has now started to come to roost.

I just don’t see how this can possibly be true?

Dyche and Garlick had a very public dispute about not wanting to offer contracts to the very players that we are all now saying arnt good enough. Garlick was right two seasons ago and Dyche.should have listened.

Instead we are stuck with a squad of deadwood on a wage bill of 100m.

jrgbfc wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 4:08 pm

If we kept too many of the over 30s around there probably wouldn't be the same hunger to get promoted, no.

Looking at the players out of contract at the end of this season, I think several of the over thirties you mention will be gone regardless of which division we're in.

Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 5:32 pm

I just don’t see how this can possibly be true?

Dyche and Garlick had a very public dispute about not wanting to offer contracts to the very players that we are all now saying arnt good enough. Garlick was right two seasons ago and Dyche.should have listened.

Instead we are stuck with a squad of deadwood on a wage bill of 100m.

Who were Hendrick and Lennon replaced with 2 years ago?

bf2k wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 28, 2021 6:34 pm

Who were Hendrick and Lennon replaced with 2 years ago?

I don’t understand what relevance that has? That season Dyche spent 20m on Jay Rod (who can play wide) and Brownhill. Plus a further 3m on a goal keeper that is now in league 1. Letting both of them go made sense from an ownership point of view. It would have also made sense to get rid of the likes of Bardsley, Brady etc… and re build that summer. However Dyche wanted there contracts extending