Claretitus wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 04, 2022 8:05 pm

And ticks a box too.

Claretitus wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 04, 2022 8:05 pm

And ticks a box too.

JohnMac wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 04, 2022 8:34 pm

Efan Ekoku is another pundit that deserves more prime time.

SouthLondonexile wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 04, 2022 8:19 pm

Very good pundit indeed.
I was only thinking the other day how I miss Garth Crooks though.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 04, 2022 8:42 pm

I don’t understand why the racists are allowed to continue posting on here. Surely it warrants a permanent ban?!

Claretitus wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 04, 2022 8:05 pm

And ticks a box too.

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 04, 2022 8:48 pm

It hardly constitutes racism it’s a fact some people are overlooked by others & discriminated, the 4 perceptive, associative, direct & indirect aren’t always straightforward, candidates should get the job based on merit irrespective of any discrimination.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 04, 2022 8:54 pm

Stating that a black person, who is qualified for and competent at a job, has got that job because they ‘tick a box’ very much constitutes racism.

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 04, 2022 8:59 pm

I can’t comment on the gentleman’s qualifications, but I do realise quotas need fulfilling & sometimes other people can get overlooked who perhaps could be more suitable. It’s the world we are living in I’m not bothered who gets the job but I think it should be based on merit & not meeting quotas or box ticking. If you are good enough no colour, gender, sex or disability should harm your chances of success.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 04, 2022 9:02 pm

Why are you waffling on then?

Marty Dobson wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 04, 2022 9:08 pm

That didn't take long then. I dread to think how tetchy things will get on here before end of season.

colne-claret wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 04, 2022 10:44 pm

People deserve to be called out when they put on comments that could be deemed as racist. What world are we living in where people think a footballer on a sports program is there to 'tick a box'. It's out of order.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 04, 2022 8:42 pm

I don’t understand why the racists are allowed to continue posting on here. Surely it warrants a permanent ban?!

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 04, 2022 9:04 pm

I always enjoy listening to him on 5live, he tends to come across quite well, good analysis and opinions etc and has a good rapport with his fellow presenters.
I prefer him over someone like O'Hara

Appears to be over in the USA quite regularly, not sure if that's to watch the NFL or for MLS stuff.
I can't remember which NFL team he supports, I know he's mentioned it.

gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 05, 2022 12:15 am

Because people are posting opinions. The fact you deem them racist, says more about you. Nobody has said anything remotely racist on this thread and I’m glad we have mods that allow differing points of view.

gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 05, 2022 12:15 am

Because people are posting opinions.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 05, 2022 8:18 am

If you can't see how someone claiming that Nedum Onuoha has got a job with the BBC because it 'ticks a box' is racist then it very much says more about you than me. Everyone is allowed an opinion, everyone is allowed to have racist views - what they shouldn't be allowed to do is freely post such views on a BFC messageboard.

The mods have deemed fit to delete the racist post and in my opinion should deal with people who post such views a lot more harshly.

JohnMcGreal wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 05, 2022 8:40 am

Racist and ignorant opinions.

Wile E Coyote wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 05, 2022 12:04 am

not long ago there were barely any black or female sports pundits on radio and tv, now there are lots and lots.
tick in a box might be a crass expression, but to say there hasnt been a concerted effort to very swiftly employ them is stupid. that's not racist by any stretch of the imagination. To suggest it is is plainly ignorant and wholly incorrect.

gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 05, 2022 8:42 am

It isn’t racist. If you can’t see how corporations such as the BBC SKY etc are going out of their way to place greater emphasis on BAME status and filling quotas then you are incredibly naive. The problem with this is that Nedum Onuaha may well be incredibly good at his job and very well qualified and may have got the job in sensible times however because of what that major corporations are doing, it gets lost in all the box ticking nonsense. For the record I am NOT saying that this is definitely the case here. It is not racist to say that and by crying racism you are stifiling any sort of sensible debate, which is sadly common in today’s society.

Swizzlestick wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 04, 2022 9:58 pm

Yes, he was excellent - confident and actually provided proper tactical analysis.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 05, 2022 9:13 am

I'm stifling debate, whereas the person who's only contribution to the thread was to say that the BBC had ticked a box by employing Onuoha is just posting his opinion? Hilarious.

If you can't see how someone bringing up his race, a totally irrelevant characteristic in the context of this particular discussion, is racist, then there's no point discussing this with you. Using terms like 'crying racism' to undermine anyone calling out prejudice and bigotry does you absolutely no favours.

gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 05, 2022 9:32 am

You are asking for removal of content which doesn’t conform with your own opinions. That is stifling debate. Keep the content on there, people are then free to agree or disagree. You say I’m undermining people by using terms like ‘crying racism’ yet in the same sentence you use the terms ‘bigotry’ you hypocrite. I’ve already seen the term ‘ignorant’ thrown about. I’m waiting on ‘uneducated’ for a holier than thou full house.

Unconscious biases, or implicit biases, are attitudes that are held subconsciously and affect the way individuals feel and think about others around them. Subconscious attitudes aren’t necessarily as well-formed as coherent thoughts, but they can be very ingrained. Many people have unconscious biases that have been with them since childhood, which they absorb by observing their social, familial and institutional environments. Unconscious biases can color the emotional and rational responses of individuals in everyday situations and affect their behavior.

There are many types of unconscious biases. Some of the most common are biases in how individuals regard their own thought processes and reasoning abilities, such as focusing on negative qualities of individuals that align with one’s existing attitudes — like in confirmation bias and affirmation bias.

Other unconscious biases are directly related to how other people may look. These types of biases tend to rely on stereotypes and can result in discriminatory practices when people are not treated like individuals, such as racism, ageism and beauty bias.

There are also unconscious biases that stereotype people based on how they behave — even though these types of biases aren’t commonly talked about, holding these biases can result in discriminating against people based on their personalities.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 05, 2022 9:42 am

Show me where I've asked for removal of any content. I haven't even complained about the post, because what seems to happen is the post is deleted and the poster is then free to continue to spread their bigoted views after presumably a very nominal ban. I'd rather the posts remain and the posters with such views are highlighted and taken to task.

Yes, I used the term bigotry to refer to the posting of racist views - not sure what's hypocritical about that.

Zlatan wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 05, 2022 9:58 am

to anyone suggesting that the comment "box ticking" isn't racist can I draw your attention to the term Unconscious Bias.

Taken from a google search and the top link this is a better description of it that I could write.



The problem here is that those who see no wrong in using the term "box ticking" will also think that they are also not racist, after all it is a nasty label to have applied to yourself isn't it. So you'll go all out to defend the "box ticking" argument because you too dont want to be seen as racist - it's a normal response because you have someone saying you're a nasty person, it happens a lot on this forum.

Now the reason that the "box ticking" is perceived as racist is because its a subconscious thought process that the person who raised it went through. They thought "well, they certainly ticked a box there" because the presenter is black when the reality is that the recruitment process will certainly not have a box indicating race as part of the selection process. So subconsciously that person has expressed a racist thought without considering it to be a racist thought because why would they. The problem arises (especially on this forum) when it is identified for what it is (a mistake in reality) and then all Hell breaks loose discussing that instead of the actual topic of conversation which is "MOTD2" has a very good new presenter, which he is.

I'll urge anyone who thinks box ticking isn't racist to go away and read up on the subject of Unconscious Bias and take it on board. To those who identified the term as racist also need to go and read it because I am sure you don't really want to have tit for tat arguments every time someone makes a mistake by falling into the subconscious racism issue, it would be much better served to be polite and try to redirect the other forum user's train of thought instead.

have a good day all

gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 05, 2022 10:36 am

Subconscious bias I’m well aware of ‘subconscious bias’ and what it is (there is training provided in the workplace). This has nothing to do with it.

gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 05, 2022 10:36 am

Subconscious bias I’m well aware of ‘subconscious bias’ and what it is (there is training provided in the workplace). This has nothing to do with it.

gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 05, 2022 10:35 am

You are shifting the goalposts. You wrote:

“ I don’t understand why the racists are allowed to continue posting on here. Surely it warrants a permanent ban?!”

How are they going to carry on offering an opinion if you want a permanent ban. I’m referring to you calling people bigots and at the same time accusing me of ‘undermining’ by using the terms I’ve used. You can’t have it both ways.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 05, 2022 12:49 pm

Well of course, if someone keeps posting racist views then they should be permanently banned, would you not agree? I haven't shifted any goalposts as I haven't asked for removal of content which is what you claimed.

What do you mean I can't have it both ways?
1.)People who hold racist views are bigots.
2.)People who use the term 'crying racism' at someone for pointing out actual racism is an attempt to undermine the issue.
How is that even slightly hypocritical?

I think you're getting yourself into a bit of a muddle.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 05, 2022 12:04 pm

Doesn't it?
If the first thing someone says is "box ticking" then yes there is a bias, subconscious or otherwise

gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 05, 2022 1:09 pm

But you are setting the boundaries of what you perceive to be racism. I’m not in any muddle at all, you are calling for bans for people who hold an alternate point of view that is, in your opinion, racist. Saying you are ‘crying racism’ isn’t undermining you, it is pointing out your overreaction (in my opinion) to a statement made earlier in the thread. You then go on to call these people bigots, which is the usual go to insult.


Anyway. I can’t really be arsed wasting any more time with this. Nobody’s opinions are going to be changed by it anyway.