I see Anne Sacoolas is “in court”. Video link obviously, no way she’s coming back here.

She should be being ‘tried’ but we all know that won’t happen. Be dealt with in the magistrates court. After the Americans allowed her to claim diplomatic immunity, it’s hardly likely they’d allow any proper trial to be completed that resulted in her seeing jail time. It’s as big a sham as the referendums in Ukraine.

That boys family will get zero justice I’m afraid.

Video link what a cop out....she should be in this country facing the music,like you say the family will never get closure on this sad story.

All down to politics yet again, I'm afraid.

Yes scandalous how she skipped the country, appalling behaviour by “our special friend” the USA.

As sad as it is, there’s nothing you can do when they have a diplomatic passport.

To be fair, our cowardly politicians don't come out of this sordid exercise particularly well.

Most disgraceful thing America has done for a good generation in terms of our relationship with them.

You'd have to go back to them remaining neutral in the Falklands War. It's a stain on Trump and Biden that they've allowed this woman to escape trail and have denied the family justice.

evensteadiereddie wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 29, 2022 8:41 pm

To be fair, our cowardly politicians don't come out of this sordid exercise particularly well.

I don't know of a British politician of any party who hasn't condemned the American position on this and/or worked to bring the suspect to trial.

Paid lip-service perhaps but no downright condemnation of the Americans or any meaningful threat to withdraw cooperation in future.
It's as though it never happened.

It’s a disgrace.

evensteadiereddie wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 29, 2022 8:49 pm

Paid lip-service perhaps but no downright condemnation of the Americans or any meaningful threat to withdraw cooperation in future.
It's as though it never happened.

I think they've applied as much pressure as is possible on an ally behind the scenes but admitedly not many have spoken on it publicly.

FWIW I think the woman will eventually face some form of justice but it's been a poor show all round and a disgraceful incident.

It Is What It Is wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 29, 2022 8:32 pm

I can't think of one single bloody yank who hasn't been a total ass wipe in this country. This spy wife is another example of cowardly Americans.

How about the 2 million US servicemen that passed through Britain in WW2? Tens of thousands who lost their lives for freedom. Not a single one of them?

box_of_frogs wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 29, 2022 4:35 pm

As sad as it is, there’s nothing you can do when they have a diplomatic passport.

She was given it after the accident, the Yanks didn't want her in a UK court if possible

evensteadiereddie wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 29, 2022 8:49 pm

Paid lip-service perhaps but no downright condemnation of the Americans or any meaningful threat to withdraw cooperation in future.
It's as though it never happened.

Has she shown any remorse, or did she even care once she got back to America?

Rowls wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 29, 2022 8:44 pm

Most disgraceful thing America has done for a good generation in terms of our relationship with them.

You'd have to go back to them remaining neutral in the Falklands War. It's a stain on Trump and Biden that they've allowed this woman to escape trail and have denied the family justice.

Erm... have a re-think regards the Falklands.
US provided the latest Sidewinder missiles at 48 hours' notice after the British task force came under fire. A deal was made in advance of this to "diplomatically keep US clean" yet provide UK with all the latest tech.
Sidewinders, mobile Sat GPS and US intel direct to UK.
The UK would have failed without the "impartial" US.

HunterST_BFC wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 29, 2022 9:01 pm

Erm... have a re-think regards the Falklands.
US provided the latest Sidewinder missiles at 48 hours' notice after the British task force came under fire. A deal was made in advance of this to "diplomatically keep US clean" yet provide UK with all the latest tech.
Sidewinders, mobile Sat GPS and US intel direct to UK.
The UK would have failed without the "impartial" US.

Thatcher won a modicum of support after blowing her top at Reagan.

They planned to remain neutral and gave no public support.

Edit - Anyway, the point of this thread is the Harry Dunn case.

Rowls wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 29, 2022 9:09 pm

Thatcher won a modicum of support after blowing her top at Reagan.

They planned to remain neutral and gave no public support.

Edit - Anyway, the point of this thread is the Harry Dunn case.

Lord Renwick, a Labour Peer and senior diplomat in the British embassy in Washington sorted out the US help.

... and yes the whole Harry Dunn situation is a scandle from the start. Raab / Hunt and ultimately Johmson allowed the sweeping of this away...

HunterST_BFC wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 29, 2022 9:24 pm

Lord Renwick, a Labour Peer and senior diplomat in the British embassy in Washington sorted out the US help.

... and yes the whole Harry Dunn situation is a scandle from the start. Raab / Hunt and ultimately Johmson allowed the sweeping of this away...

Nothing was swept away and it's been constantly kept on the agedna. The real villains are Trump who allowed it to happen and Biden who broke his word to extradite the suspect.

Let's not try and turn it into a UK party political thing.

Rowls wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 29, 2022 9:31 pm

Nothing was swept away and it's been constantly kept on the agedna. The real villains are Trump who allowed it to happen and Biden who broke his word to extradite the suspect.

Let's not try and turn it into a UK party political thing.

Biden doesn’t even know what day of the week it is. There’s no way he’ll remember saying it.

box_of_frogs wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 29, 2022 4:35 pm

As sad as it is, there’s nothing you can do when they have a diplomatic passport.

As far as I’m aware, only her husband was entitled to diplomatic immunity. She was granted it only after the death of Harry Dunn.

The whole thing stinks like a pole cat.

Rowls wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 29, 2022 9:31 pm

Nothing was swept away and it's been constantly kept on the agedna. The real villains are Trump who allowed it to happen and Biden who broke his word to extradite the suspect.

Let's not try and turn it into a UK party political thing.

Raab / Hunt and ultimately Johnson allowed her to leave and effectivly travel away imune !!! Despite not being imune under Law.
You can't deny this.
Just another law broken or bent out of shape.
You can't blame the US for our own complicit corruption (mostly).

Bottom Line Justice Can Be Swerved with the "Right" Connections. Now way is any of this Just & Correct, Honest or Clean.

HunterST_BFC wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 29, 2022 10:06 pm

Raab / Hunt and ultimately Johnson allowed her to leave and effectivly travel away imune !!!

That simply is not true.

Goodnight.

Guilty.

8 months suspended and a 12 month driving ban. Neither of which are, nor will be enforceable. Absolutely obscene is this. Reeks to high heaven.

Our “special relationship” with the Americans is in the dirt where it belongs.

The Yanks NEVER extradite. We should reciprocate but won’t.

A disgrace.
The Yanks want Assange? Jog on.

Sends out the message that Diplomats can just drive around and kill people and get away with it. You just knew the sentence would be suspended before it was announced. It’s a disgrace. This isn’t justice for that poor boy’s family.

Boss Hogg wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 08, 2022 6:06 pm

Sends out the message that Diplomats can just drive around and kill people and get away with it. You just knew the sentence would be suspended before it was announced. It’s a disgrace. This isn’t justice for that poor boy’s family.

Diplomats can get away with a lot though, including incidents like this I think, but she isn't a diplomat.

The contentious issue was if she had immunity prior to the accident or not and if the USA gave it too her to get her out of the UK quickly.

Disgusting BITCH

A sad business.

As sad and wrong as it is it's how international politics works. Always a balance between personal interest and looking after your own. I get that the lady broke the law and the family's search for justice but at the end of the day it was a terrible accident. I'm not sure locking someone up is the answer. The whole thing could be dealt with in a better way. I'm sure the lady is remorseful and maybe the opportunity for some one to one discussions with the family might heal some wounds without the need for vengence.

AGENT_CLARET wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 08, 2022 6:30 pm

Disgusting BITCH

I suspect she doesn't really care about what happened either as she knows she's got away with it.

welsbyswife wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 08, 2022 6:58 pm

As sad and wrong as it is it's how international politics works. Always a balance between personal interest and looking after your own. I get that the lady broke the law and the family's search for justice but at the end of the day it was a terrible accident. I'm not sure locking someone up is the answer. The whole thing could be dealt with in a better way. I'm sure the lady is remorseful and maybe the opportunity for some one to one discussions with the family might heal some wounds without the need for vengence.

She deserves no sympathy what so ever!

Spijed wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:00 pm

I suspect she doesn't really care about what happened either as she knows she's got away with it.

Why do you suspect that? Do you know anything about the woman? Tabloid reaction.

Sordid affair all round but where does this eye for an eye mentality get anyone? It's not like she deliberately set out to kill the lad.

welsbyswife wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:03 pm

Why do you suspect that? Do you know anything about the woman? Tabloid reaction.

She scarpered pretty quickly after the accident didn't she?

Why are you defending her, btw?

I'm not defending her as such but just asking who gains out of locking her up? Would you have her hung drawn and quartered if you could?

There seems to be a lot of people who don’t understand that as the wife of someone with diplomatic immunity she is also covered (that’s the law). The caveat that DI doesn’t cover travel to and from the place to which their DI is applicable, which was an amendment to the original agreement, didn’t include the spouses so she was covered by DI.

Plus, the fact that she scarpered doesn't automatically mean she doesn't regret what happened. Maybe she panicked and then got back to base and the politics took over.

Not the punishment that the crime deserves, in my eyes. Perhaps it would be just if she hadn’t fled and had just come clean at the outset.

Huge credit to Harry Dunne’s family for pursuing this and at least achieving some form of justice for their son. They’ve fought and fought and hopefully they can now rest in the comfort that they sought and achieved justice for their son.

I wonder if we were slow to react to what was an obvious scenario. Could we have prevented her leaving? . I seem to recall there was a few days between the accident and her getting on a plane to leave. Is this a case of turning a 'blind eye?

welsbyswife wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:05 pm

Sordid affair all round but where does this eye for an eye mentality get anyone? It's not like she deliberately set out to kill the lad.

Absolutely, but driving on the wrong side of the f4cking road like an utter simpleton is reckless and she’s killed somebody.

Serving somebody a deserved custodial sentence against the loss of a young man’s life is not exactly ‘eye to eye’ is it.

DCWat wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:21 pm

Not the punishment that the crime deserves, in my eyes. Perhaps it would be just if she hadn’t fled and had just come clean at the outset.

Huge credit to Harry Dunne’s family for pursuing this and at least achieving some form of justice for their son. They’ve fought and fought and hopefully they can now rest in the comfort that they sought and achieved justice for their son.

This is what I struggle to grapple with. I just can't see how what happened today would make any difference to me if it was my child. I wouldn't sleep any easier, I wouldn't miss them less. I accept that everyone is different but this idea of "justice" making things better just doesn't really wash with me in cases like this.

welsbyswife wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:05 pm

Sordid affair all round but where does this eye for an eye mentality get anyone? It's not like she deliberately set out to kill the lad.

It will come her way

They got the verdict, but not justice.

I disagree with welsbyswife in trying to find mitigation, but neither do I think she should be hung drawn and quartered.

She fled home to escape justice. She’s been helped to do that by the American government. Rules have been bent and manipulated to keep her from having to answer for her crime properly.

She’s absolutely got away with it. I won’t use the word “murder”, because it’s clearly not, but anyone suggesting the “sentence” fits the crime needs to give their head a wobble. Her efforts in trying to avoid answering for causing the death of that young man tell us all we need to know about her character. That should be taken into account at sentencing.

bobinho wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:37 pm

They got the verdict, but not justice.

I disagree with welsbyswife in trying to find mitigation, but neither do I think she should be hung drawn and quartered.

She fled home to escape justice. She’s been helped to do that by the American government. Rules have been bent and manipulated to keep her from having to answer for her crime properly.

She’s absolutely got away with it. I won’t use the word “murder”, because it’s clearly not, but anyone suggesting the “sentence” fits the crime needs to give their head a wobble. Her efforts in trying to avoid answering for causing the death of that young man tell us all we need to know about her character. That should be taken into account at sentencing.

Fair dos Bobinho but what in your view would amount to "justice"? That's my point really. No doubt she's done wrong, no doubt she's got away with it but what justice would be appropriate? All I'm saying is that for me banging her up for a few years doesn't do it for me. I think if I was the parent I'd want to meet her, look her in the eye and gauge if she is actually remorseful for what she's done. I wouldn't necessarily want a custodial sentence. So for me, the traditional court system would maybe prevent that.

It seems to be either she comes back and gets banged up or nothing. Not much middle ground and no winners.

HunterST_BFC wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 29, 2022 9:01 pm

Erm... have a re-think regards the Falklands.
US provided the latest Sidewinder missiles at 48 hours' notice after the British task force came under fire. A deal was made in advance of this to "diplomatically keep US clean" yet provide UK with all the latest tech.
Sidewinders, mobile Sat GPS and US intel direct to UK.
The UK would have failed without the "impartial" US.

Yep. Allowed UK to grab masses of stores and fuel from ascension island on way down, but more importantly traced every Exocet missile in existence and made sure Argentina couldn't access any more. Neutral my arse.

welsbyswife wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:57 pm

Fair dos Bobinho but what in your view would amount to "justice"? That's my point really. No doubt she's done wrong, no doubt she's got away with it but what justice would be appropriate? All I'm saying is that for me banging her up for a few years doesn't do it for me. I think if I was the parent I'd want to meet her, look her in the eye and gauge if she is actually remorseful for what she's done. I wouldn't necessarily want a custodial sentence. So for me, the traditional court system would maybe prevent that.

It seems to be either she comes back and gets banged up or nothing. Not much middle ground and no winners.

Not about it helping me sleep better at night, not about it making me miss anyone less, for me it’s about people being punished adequately. It may well have been a terrible accident, but her actions cut short the life of a young man. He lost his life, his family have a life sentence. They have to live with that forever. The judge stated that sending her to prison would have considerable consequences for her children, them being without their mother for 8 months. No mention whatsoever about the considerable consequences for the family of Harry Dunn who have a lifetime to be without him.

Same sentence, maybe a little more, just not suspended. Far from being “an eye for an eye” I’m sure you’ll agree.
A suspended sentence doesn’t mean anything in this case. It’s just a let off. Taking someone’s life, accident or not, should have consequences more than being banned from driving for 12 months, which won’t even be enforceable over there. She’s got away with this absolutely Scott free and that just isn’t right.