Got my tin helmet ready and ducking into the trenches for this one!
From what i've seen so far, 3 at the Turf and the rest on TV; and i know we've been overly blessed in recent seasons, but Muric has to rate as our worst Keeper since the clown Kiraly was between the sticks.
No command of his area at all, takes a step forward to come for the cross and then hurriedly retreats back onto his line. For some reason cant seem to out tussle the diminutive forward placed in front of him from corners even though he invariably stands at least a foot taller, and seems to have a studless pair of boots as he looks to stumble in the box at least once a game for no apparent reason.
I'm not laying all the blame for the lost points (Think VK gave Cardiff the impetus they needed by replacing the front three and making us less dangerous going forward allowing them to come more and more into the game) but Muric's attempt to try to make a stop for Cardiff's equaliser was shambolic (stood on his line on his right hand side towards the post it went in at and yet other than waving an arm at it did nothing and clearly not an attempt you would expect from a visiting keeper whose side were within seconds of winning the game)Jenson, Heaton, Pope, Hennessey and i would expect P-Farrell would all have clattered into the post if need be, fair enough they might not have saved it but would have at least tried!
I fully understand our new style of play means gaining mobility sometimes at the cost of "robustness" within our back four, and yes, he is usually fantastic as a second sweeper to start the next move, but with our now more fragile defence you want your keeper to do the job he's paid for, to make saves, not just bog standard saves that they should be making, but every now and again pull an absolute corker out of the bag.
Every time the opposition get anywhere near knocking a ball into our box then its hearts in mouths time, as anything could happen. Sometimes (from what i've seen so far) because this keeper isn't capable of "sorting it out" before it drops in the danger zone.
Fair enough if your 6 goals in front then it's of no real consequence if your keeper lets a couple in late on,(eg City yesterday) but until our forwards are regularly getting us into such a commanding position then i think its time to give this lad a rest and give one of the other guys a run.

"INCOMING !!!"

How many have we had since Kiraly?

Grant, Jensen, Heaton and Pope as regulars?

Kiraly isn't even the worst keeper since Kiraly.

Since Kiraly there has been at times, Penny, Grant and Jensen.

Is he as good as Hart, Pope or Heaton - no, at 23 yr old and probably the same number of appearances as 1.5 seasons of football you would like to think most rational people will give him time. Moaning about him slipping is a bit daft too.

I don’t see much if anything at all wrong with the keeper and I’m not sure any keeper in the world would have saved the equaliser on Saturday.

If a token dive would have made you feel better then fair enough.

Also worth noting that our shambolic defence has only 5 teams in the division conceding fewer

Hes a top keeper for this league and we should be grateful to have him

Can we really afford to "blood" inexperienced players at the expense of valuable league points.
I'm thinking the reason he didn't figure much for Man City is that he's not particularly good at doing the bog standard goal keeping tasks.
Needs to get his game sorted in the U23's then come back in when he's ready.

I had concerns (and still have them on corners) but he has won me over with his distribution which is exemplary.

Loved Nick Pope, and yes, he’s the superior goalkeeper on every level - except for the one that is most crucial to how this team plays. The lad just needs backing and a bit of restraint around errors - he’s 23 and I think VK knows and accepts he will make mistakes due to what is being asked of him.

He could improve on corners though - but so could our entire defensive structure.

claretonthecoast1882 wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 03, 2022 2:28 pm

Also worth noting that our shambolic defence has only 5 teams in the division conceding fewer

And only once have we conceded more than one goal this season.

colnbev wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 03, 2022 2:31 pm

Can we really afford to "blood" inexperienced players at the expense of valuable league points.
I'm thinking the reason he didn't figure much for Man City is that he's not particularly good at doing the bog standard goal keeping tasks.
Needs to get his game sorted in the U23's then come back in when he's ready.

You're making it obvious that you're on a wind up now with this one

colnbev wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 03, 2022 2:31 pm

Can we really afford to "blood" inexperienced players at the expense of valuable league points.
I'm thinking the reason he didn't figure much for Man City is that he's not particularly good at doing the bog standard goal keeping tasks.
Needs to get his game sorted in the U23's then come back in when he's ready.

Yup, nothing to do with Ederson

Heads in the sand time guys, who have we played so far? 7 of the bottom 9 in the league, wait until we play any of the top 6 or 7. I hope I have to eat humble pie but i'm worried that unless we have built a comfortable lead (which we are more than capable of doing)we'll come well and truly unstuck especially with this lad in goal.

I don’t think Muric is a good goalkeeper. Just an average one. Though we have been spoilt with some good ones recently

I don't think anyone can say he commands his area enough with a straight face given his height, however, the rest is pretty good. At 23 he's doing ok imho

colnbev wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 03, 2022 2:31 pm

Can we really afford to "blood" inexperienced players at the expense of valuable league points.
I'm thinking the reason he didn't figure much for Man City is that he's not particularly good at doing the bog standard goal keeping tasks.
Needs to get his game sorted in the U23's then come back in when he's ready.

Probably also to do with the fact City have one of the best keepers in world football playing for them.

Honest to god, some of our fans... I imagine you were at the bar when he made a crucial save just before half time against Bristol City. And as already alluded to, we are top 6 in terms of defensive record. He's not Nick Pope but not many are. He's crucial to our play, he's talented, he will make an error now and again (as most keepers do at this level) - but he's our number one and he needs supporting. Personally, I don't think he's done a whole lot wrong. But there's a decent minority of our fanbase who cannot, or will not, move on from the Dyche era.

The goalkeeping coaching team need to work on his catching crosses in and around the six yard box. Overall he is a decent keeper but does need to dominate on crosses much more.

14 teams in the league have conceded more goals than us and a further 4 have let in the same number 11 in eleven games.Norwich 2nd in the league have let in 9.He is doing as well and better than most in the league.Perhaps all the other keepers need a bit of time in their U21 side.

Not a fan. I’m not bothered how good he is with his feet, I want him to keep it out of our net. I’ve seen very few brilliant saves from him and I’ve seen him pick it out of the net when it shouldn’t have been in there too often.

Should have stopped the goal on Saturday, he made no attempt to make a save

We have been spoilt in recent seasons with England internationals behind the best central defensive pairings.

Amazing that we're 4th considering we have a dodgy defence and keeper according to many of this forum.

Firstly it's important not to compare Muric to Pope, one is an experienced PL keeper who's played for England during the recent international break, where incidentally he dropped a real clanger for Germany's 3rd goal, so even he is prone to making mistakes.

Secondly Muric is key to how Vincent Kpmpany wants us to play out from the back, and he's played a notable role in several of our goals and chances created already this season,

Just give him a bleeding chance he's joining a new side and still getting to know his teammates, and his only real howler was the 1st goal against Blackpool, apart from that he's been fine.

Worth noting of our current keepers, 2 are full internationals, BPF and Muric, and 1 is a French U19 regular in Franchi, so compared to most Championship clubs I'd say we're in pretty good shape between the sticks.

for me it's the back 4 in front of him that's the worst for a long time, but that and the whole team was expected given that we were relegated from the EPL, you'd expect they'd not be as good as the last decade, however I think the whole team is doing well as good as could be expected. Hopefully they get better and the defense cut out or at least reduce the number of silly errors, to be honest I thought the original post might be DA incognito.

As others have said would be great to see him dominate the box much more, a la Nick Pope, Murics a big lad!!
Would also help out the central defenders, give them confidence in him

Bring back Billy Mercer he will soon create another great keeper for us.

Pathetic to slag him off like the OP has, I put just 1goal down to an error, the slip was just unfortunate.

I’ve been pretty happy with Muric - until Saturday - when he could have done far more to stop that goal. We have to use Roberts to protect him at corners now which means we’re not utilising him in the best way. Still there’s loads of potential in him and we have a good back-up until BPF leaves in the next window ( as he’s been told to do by the N Ireland manager)

bfcjg wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 03, 2022 4:11 pm

Pathetic to slag him off like the OP has, I put just 1goal down to an error, the slip was just unfortunate.

The OP is just trolling, the account has been on here for 6yrs and made less than 10 posts, including the garbage of an op

At corners Muric is targeted by the opponents. Yesterday Cardiff put three players on him.

Didn’t seem to work as they had no joy from 9 corners.

I agree with most of what the OP said.
I think he has cost us up to 8 points so far this season including Sat, 4 previous keepers would have saved it, he didn’t even try.

What I will say is he has improved his distribution choices, after his FU against Blackpool letting them get back in the game. He now sees if players close are under pressure and chips to the midfield or kick longer instead of just playing short. So he has learnt, but he is not a great keeper. Just a below average one.

Lowbankclaret wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 03, 2022 5:58 pm

I agree with most of what the OP said.
I think he has cost us up to 8 points so far this season including Sat, 4 previous keepers would have saved it, he didn’t even try.

What I will say is he has improved his distribution choices, after his FU against Blackpool letting them get back in the game. He now sees if players close are under pressure and chips to the midfield or kick longer instead of just playing short. So he has learnt, but he is not a great keeper. Just a below average one.

I cannot agree that he’s lost us 8pts Lowbank.

Or that he was at fault for the goal on Saturday. Maatsen should’ve cleared more convincingly or let run through for a GK, but having failed to do either, then blocked the cross and we shouldn’t have allowed a free (bullet) header at the far post. All before you look at the keeper.

I do agree that some of our ex keepers are better shot stoppers, but we’ve been incredibly lucky in that regard. And that his distribution choices (which is literally unbelievably good - bending outside of the foot passes on Sat ) have got better.

He’s not as commanding as he should be for his size. That’s his main area for improvement. Needs to watch some Pope videos.

NewClaret wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 03, 2022 6:07 pm

. Needs to watch some Pope videos.

Pretty sure I remember an interview with Pope where he said he watches videos of all the top keepers, so he could learn and improve.

If Oenny came after, then he must win the prize. Nit sure memories of Gaborrrrr are welcome! How to make a simple save look like a world and how to miss the rest!

Kiraly was the definition of a goalkeeping clown. I’m still undecided on the gk but he is still young, is a big presence in goal, and is still learning. Plus we are playing in a new system. I think we have had a good start. A sign of a good team is to play bad and still not lose.

NewClaret wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 03, 2022 6:07 pm

I cannot agree that he’s lost us 8pts Lowbank.

Or that he was at fault for the goal on Saturday. Maatsen should’ve cleared more convincingly or let run through for a GK, but having failed to do either, then blocked the cross and we shouldn’t have allowed a free (bullet) header at the far post. All before you look at the keeper.

I do agree that some of our ex keepers are better shot stoppers, but we’ve been incredibly lucky in that regard. And that his distribution choices (which is literally unbelievably good - bending outside of the foot passes on Sat ) have got better.

He’s not as commanding as he should be for his size. That’s his main area for improvement. Needs to watch some Pope videos.

Happy for you to disagree, it’s just my opinion.

There are normally mistakes leading to a goal which if they had not happened, the goal would not have happened.
I just think it could have been saved. But that’s an opinion we can never prove one way or another.

It’s difficult to judge him to be honest because the only comparables in recent memory are England internationals, so he was always going to be a step down.

I’m pretty relaxed when he has the ball at his feet, he’s definitely learned from the Blackpool error and is safer as a result.

His presence from crosses is a worry. I don’t think he’s ever going to be a keeper who comes and claims everything, it’s obviously not a strength of his. But I find that he doesn’t read the flight of the ball well at all. This leaves him caught in no man’s land or off balance. A recent example being him tipping a harmless cross behind for a corner on Saturday. I also think his slip against Preston was partly a result of him being indecisive with his footwork as the original cross came in.

Shot stopping has been hit and miss. He hasn’t made many saves that you would expect him not to, although he made some good stops against Bristol (i think). I also wondered whether he should have stopped the equaliser on Saturday, although I’ve not seen it back. He certainly should have made a better effort to get there.

So overall, it’s difficult to judge because he’s not as good as we’ve had before, but he’s probably ranks fairly well against the rest of the Championship.

Muric is one of the best we have ever had in relation to his distribution, he is weaker at the traditional elements than Pope and Heaton. He’s still young so we can afford him time to get to there level.

However, the point stands that he is part of a leaky defence that can’t keep a clean sheet.

If we are to have a decent season then clean sheets need to be the priority

Diego Penny.

No denying it.

For their goal on Saturday, he looked to me to react as if he thought it was going wide. Any goalkeeper worth their salt should, and could, have saved that header.

One thing’s for certain, he’s not getting half the practice Pope did. Less than Heaton too I would imagine.

I see Pope is top of the 'saves made' stats in the prem. I don't see that as a good thing, more like you need a better defence..

Cheshireclaret wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 03, 2022 7:24 pm

For their goal on Saturday, he looked to me to react as if he thought it was going wide. Any goalkeeper worth their salt should, and could, have saved that header.

I thought he should have got that one, but I'm not up for this constant criticism of our goalkeeper.

boatshed bill wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 03, 2022 7:40 pm

I thought he should have got that one, but I'm not up for this constant criticism of our goalkeeper.

Agreed - especially one as young and inexperienced as Muric, and one who joins us after we've been spoilt with Pope and Heaton before him.

Or is he the best keeper we've had since Pope?

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 03, 2022 6:12 pm

Pretty sure I remember an interview with Pope where he said he watches videos of all the top keepers, so he could learn and improve.

I remember that.

You’d hope he would. If I were VK I’d be on the phone to Billy Mercer to get him to work his magic on dominating the box! Short term contract before he gets a job at NFFC!

NewClaret wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 03, 2022 10:13 pm

I remember that.

You’d hope he would. If I were VK I’d be on the phone to Billy Mercer to get him to work his magic on dominating the box! Short term contract before he gets a job at NFFC!

You might, but i wouldn't.

Cheshireclaret wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 03, 2022 7:24 pm

For their goal on Saturday, he looked to me to react as if he thought it was going wide. Any goalkeeper worth their salt should, and could, have saved that header.

Poor defending was the issue, not poor goalkeeping!

Leisure wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 03, 2022 10:18 pm

Poor defending was the issue, not poor goalkeeping!

Exactly this. Slow it down frame by frame there’s a lot of issues before it gets anywhere near Muric.

colnbev wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 03, 2022 2:39 pm

Heads in the sand time guys, who have we played so far? 7 of the bottom 9 in the league, wait until we play any of the top 6 or 7. I hope I have to eat humble pie but i'm worried that unless we have built a comfortable lead (which we are more than capable of doing)we'll come well and truly unstuck especially with this lad in goal.

Pointed out recently in another thread that it is irrelevant at this time. Watford were top when we played them. Hull were up there. Table is too fluid at this point to make anything of who is where. You’re just looking for reasons to criticise that don’t exist.