Equal pay: Football Association of Wales agree landmark deal - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/64299007

The men have taken a 25% pay cut to enable the women's team to get a pay rise of 25% so they have matching pay.

Madness.
I'm no misogynist, but there is no justification for this, other than pandering to the few.
I can only believe that the men are happy for this to happen, and it's their money, so their shout, but there can never be equality in Sport.
If you do want equality, then scrap mens and womens football, and just have football...........

Nice gesture, but no male footballer ever became a millionaire by playing for wales - he did it by playing in the Premier League or Championship.
A welsh woman footballer that was good enough to play in the Premier League or Championship would likely find herself a millionaire before the season was out, but one might try to find a unicorn horn with more success.

Can't see this ever happening in club football so no worries there.

Colburn_Claret wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 8:12 pm

Madness.
I'm no misogynist, but there is no justification for this, other than pandering to the few.
I can only believe that the men are happy for this to happen, and it's their money, so their shout, but there can never be equality in Sport.
If you do want equality, then scrap mens and womens football, and just have football...........

Well, the simple justification for this is that they’re doing the same job, so deserve the same pay. And I wouldn’t call half of Welsh international footballers ‘the few’.

If they were doing the same job which requires the same amount of skill then fair enough. Clearly that isn’t the case

Firthy wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 8:21 pm

Can't see this ever happening in club football so no worries there.

I wouldn't be too sure about that. The ball is rolling.

Dazzler wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 8:38 pm

I wouldn't be too sure about that. The ball is rolling.

Haha good pun. I know what you mean but until women get the same support showing up for games then clubs will never be able to afford it. But never say never, women tennis players only have to play 3 sets while the men have to play 5 and they get the same prize money. It seems rthey only want equality when it comes to the money.

Firthy wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 8:44 pm

It seems rthey only want equality when it comes to the money.

I would add 'Fame' to that

Pretty sure there was 45k at Arsenal v Chelsea at the weekend.

This is a great move by the Welsh FA.

Fortunately there is more in sport than money.
i would think the more important thing to these Welsh men and women is to represent their country.
The money is small change to a top professional footballer.

SalisburyClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 8:36 pm

If they were doing the same job which requires the same amount of skill then fair enough. Clearly that isn’t the case

They are doing the same job. Bearing in mind the physical differences between men and women, you’re essentially saying that in any job that requires physicality and therefore that men can perform to a better standard, women deserve to be paid less.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bECt3Tv314Y

Summed up perfectly.

Could only happen in Wales where the men’s and women’s National teams are on par in terms of quality.

Will be Scotland next.

Getting gates of 45k fella?

helmclaret wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 9:03 pm

Getting gates of 45k fella?

How much were the tickets?

No idea.

Chelsea v Liverpool women in next few days £10 or less!

Charge normal Chelsea men’s prices attendance the might be????

The women’s game is growing - not sure why you guys can’t get your head around this

helmclaret wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 9:10 pm

No idea.

They were £12.

helmclaret wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 9:29 pm

The women’s game is growing - not sure why you guys can’t get your head around this

Nobody is denying it’s growing - that’s got nothing to do with this thread.

Haha ok

CardyTheClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 9:34 pm

Nobody is denying it’s growing - that’s got nothing to do with this thread.

Erm, neither do ticket prices.

Funny argument, this.
Surely it's entirely up to the welsh FA who are obviously keen on parity.
I fail to see what harm it does.

boatshed bill wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 9:45 pm

Funny argument, this.
Surely it's entirely up to the welsh FA who are obviously keen on parity.
I fail to see what harm it does.

It scares small-minded people. I pity them.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 9:35 pm

Erm, neither do ticket prices.

But of course they do. We are talking about finances, aren’t we?

CardyTheClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 9:47 pm

But of course they do. We are talking about finances, aren’t we?

We’re talking about how the Welsh FA have decided to grant equal pay to their male and female international counterparts. The price of a twix at the Millennium Stadium is financially related but equally irrelevant.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 9:49 pm

We’re talking about how the Welsh FA have decided to grant equal pay to their male and female international counterparts. The price of a twix at the Millennium Stadium is financially related but equally irrelevant.

So helms 45k attendance comment (the one I was replying to) is equally irrelevant too, yes?

CardyTheClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 9:54 pm

So helms 45k attendance comment (the one I was replying to) is equally irrelevant too, yes?

Yes.

The WSL is averaging 6k a game this season.

In comparison league 2 is averaging about 4.5k a game this season.

The lionesses winning the Euros has obviously helped create a surge of interest and it's a good thing.

The pay parity for Welsh International footballers is a good thing, I'd expect the English FA to follow suit, especially as the lionesses have actually won something recently....

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 9:58 pm

The WSL is averaging 6k a game this season.

In comparison league 2 is averaging about 4.5k a game this season.

The lionesses winning the Euros has obviously helped create a surge of interest and it's a good thing.

The pay parity for Welsh International footballers is a good thing, I'd expect the English FA to follow suit, especially as the lionesses have actually won something recently....

Do you think it should come in at club level too?

The Average Women’s Super League attendance is less than 1,000 , I expect that’s irrelevant though.

Casper2 wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:11 pm

The Average Women’s Super League attendance is less than 1,000 , I expect that’s irrelevant though.

Yes, it’s completely irrelevant.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:14 pm

Yes, it’s completely irrelevant.

To this thread or to the subject of equal pay?

CardyTheClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:23 pm

To this thread or to the subject of equal pay?

To the subject of equal pay in the context of this thread ie. the Welsh Fa’s decision to grant equal pay to their male and female internationals.

This is just pandering for the sake of it. Will the women’s coach be on the same wage as the men’s?

I highly doubt it.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:25 pm

To the subject of equal pay in the context of this thread ie. the Welsh Fa’s decision to grant equal pay to their male and female internationals.

You said earlier ‘Well, the simple justification for this is that they’re doing the same job, so deserve the same’ ….Would this apply at club level too? Or is the question not allowed with it being irrelevant to the title of this topic?

CardyTheClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:30 pm

You said earlier ‘Well, the simple justification for this is that they’re doing the same job, so deserve the same’ ….Would this apply at club level too? Or is the question not allowed with it being irrelevant to the title of this topic?

I think any question is allowed. My comment which you’ve quoted was in relation to this particular story which is summarised in the title of the thread, the poster I was replying to claimed that the Welsh FA’s decision was ‘MADNESS’.

As for would equal pay apply at club level too, that would be a decision for the individual club to make. In most cases, but probably not all, I would suggest that it shouldn’t apply as football clubs are commercially driven entities and the men’s team generates more revenue. Football clubs also pay their players differently according to a number of factors such as ability and commercial worth.

But the Welsh FA aren’t a football club, and this thread is about the Welsh FA. So I don’t see how your question about whether clubs should have equal pay for players is relevant to whether the Welsh FA should pay their male and female players equally.

BurnleyFC wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:28 pm

This is just pandering for the sake of it. Will the women’s coach be on the same wage as the men’s?

I highly doubt it.

Most men’s teams in the Welsh leagues are semi pro so probably yeah.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:39 pm

I think any question is allowed. My comment which you’ve quoted was in relation to this particular story which is summarised in the title of the thread, the poster I was replying to claimed that the Welsh FA’s decision was ‘MADNESS’.

As for would equal pay apply at club level too, that would be a decision for the individual club to make. In most cases, but probably not all, I would suggest that it shouldn’t apply as football clubs are commercially driven entities and the men’s team generates more revenue. Football clubs also pay their players differently according to a number of factors such as ability and commercial worth.

But the Welsh FA aren’t a football club, and this thread is about the Welsh FA. So I don’t see how your question about whether clubs should have equal pay for players is relevant to whether the Welsh FA should pay their male and female players equally.

You really are dim , aren’t you .

Having played in the Welsh league and seen the wages players are on there won’t be a massive gap to fill to match it up. As others have said players make their money moving to other leagues.

It’s an entertainment business not a politically correct business - the income for the Welsh FA is mainly generated by male players. If they all agree to split it evenly then fair enough. But let’s not pretend it’s deserved, they are not doing the same job -the skill level/entertainment level is hugely different.

Casper2 wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:43 pm

You really are dim , aren’t you .

Maybe, but my dim, little brain learned how to punctuate.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:48 pm

Maybe, but my dim, little brain learned how to punctuate.

Oh dear , he’s gone down the punctuation route .

Casper2 wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:49 pm

Oh dear , he’s gone down the punctuation route .

One of us had to .

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:51 pm

One of us had to .

https://www.sciencealert.com/people-who ... s-find/amp

Just for you Riley. enjoy

Casper2 wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:52 pm

https://www.sciencealert.com/people-who ... s-find/amp

Just for you Riley. enjoy

How did you find that picture of me?

I don’t tend to pick up on spelling and grammar mistakes, I just find that when attempting to insult someone else’s intelligence on a messageboard, it helps your cause if you have a basic grasp of written English.

Unfortunately, you have resorted to personal abuse rather than attempt to discuss the points I’ve raised - but that’s your decision.

Rileybobs wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:57 pm

How did you find that picture of me?

I don’t tend to pick up on spelling and grammar mistakes, I just find that when attempting to insult someone else’s intelligence on a messageboard, it helps your cause if you have a basic grasp of written English.

Unfortunately, you have resorted to personal abuse rather than attempt to discuss the points I’ve raised - but that’s your decision.

Personal abuse
You definitely need to get out more

It'll never happen at club level because the clubs won't do it. What are the odds of Burnley FC using half the gate and TV income to ensure that the women playing in front of a few hundred in (for some reason) Leyland should get paid half a million a year?

When the clubs raise as much money from women's football as they do from men's, then the pay will equalise. Until then, it won't. And if the FA insisted that it does, clubs would just stop having women's teams.

The Welsh FA has decided that the gate receipts and TV income from the men's game should be used to subsidise the women's game; their choice. But the argument that they are doing the same job or are working just as hard to get there is specious, because it could apply to all sportspeople - why should Roger Federer get more money than the world croquet champion? Because he and his sport generate the money, and croquet doesn't.

Incidentally, the tennis "equal pay" principle doesn't apply to non-major tournaments, because in non-major tournaments the men aren't there to (in effect) subsidise the women. Which is why Queens (ATP500 tournament) has total prize money of £2m and Eastbourne (WTA500) has prize money of £600k. The women, equal work or otherwise, don't generate the same income.

There is a difference between being "seen" to do the right thing and actually doing the rational common sense thing.

Just an example. Male solicitor/Female solicitor - equally capable of representing their clients/dealing with workloads yet male solicitors are likely to be paid more than their female counterparts. This is clearly wrong and it is the same across many professions. The gender inequality in pay where a female is equally capable as a male. It needs sorting and strides are being made..albeit slowly to change this.

However when it comes to a physical sport such as football. This really can't be applied. Men and women do not compete in the same sphere at the same level. Men generate a vastly bigger amount financially into the game. In a situation like this they need to be treated as separate entities and be rewarded depending on how much they generate.
Womens football is growing at a rapid rate (and about time)but it is light years behind the mens game in a financial sense. It stands to reason that at a club level equal pay just can't happen. Not for the forseeable anyway.Now surely the Welsh FA generates most of its money from the mens team. I'm not 100% but I don't think the womens team fill the Cardiff stadium.
The Lionesses have recently filled Wembley..and if they continue to do so then there would be a good case for equal pay based on the money they generate.
Lets not pretend that the Welsh FA and the mens team are doing this out of equality. It is not wrong to say they just aren't equal in standard or more importantly in revenue. They are doing it to be "seen" to be doing the right thing and this is why they are being called out on it.
As in a lot of what is happening in this "Culture War". The PC side of it are that desperate for equality they are creating more inequality....and the really sad thing is they are completely blind to it.