Dara O’Shea

Vegas Claret · Post by **Vegas Claret** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 5:18 pm

SalisburyClaret wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 08, 2023 5:14 pm
O’Shea clearly isn’t up to the standard needed as yet. I thought McNally looked a far better prospect

yeah I was disappointed we let him go on loan, Much more physical than our current batch and we need a bit of that, must be a reason for it though, VK isn't stupid (although I think I did call him that yesterday when I saw the team sheet

)

Firthy · Post by **Firthy** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 5:20 pm

Dingo wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 08, 2023 2:20 pm
He's only played 4 games for us? I don't understand how a player can be written off so quickly, or why anyone would want to to do that, especially when making a step up to a higher level.

Obviously new to the forum

Nori1958 · Post by **Nori1958** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 6:00 pm

JimmyRobbo wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 08, 2023 3:06 pm
Are you being ignorant on purpose?

I'm not arguing that. It requires intangibles that are not easily measured.

Ben Mee is 2 inches shorter. He is slower. He was slower at that age, too. BM turned into a fantastic player for us. He's a bona fide Prem player who is a fantastic leader, etc.

Have you played much football? It takes more than just physical aspects to make a player. I regularly marked "bigger" players because it takes more than just height. The thing is, you CAN'T COACH height. You can coach other routines.

Give him chance instead of just piling on when he plays badly as one of an entire squad. I still see him as a utility defender from off the bench.

You are 100% correct on oshea, Mee and CoolClaret

GodIsADeeJay81 · Post by **GodIsADeeJay81** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 6:02 pm

Dingo wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 08, 2023 2:20 pm
He's only played 4 games for us? I don't understand how a player can be written off so quickly, or why anyone would want to to do that, especially when making a step up to a higher level.

We’ve had players written off after a single appearance

Nori1958 · Post by **Nori1958** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 6:19 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 08, 2023 6:02 pm
We’ve had players written off after a single appearance

And quite a few before they actually signed

BurnleyFC · Post by **BurnleyFC** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 6:30 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 08, 2023 6:02 pm
We’ve had players written off after a single appearance

Yep, it was absolutely criminal to write Nimani off so soon.

warksclaret · Post by **warksclaret** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 6:37 pm

I think O'Shea was liked by the WBA fans, and was seen as a first choice defender. Confidence right now in our back four must be at a low point as a result of results, particularly at home, goals conceded and the frequency the defence has changed in 10 or so games. I think VK was wrong to build him up when signing him, saying he will become good enough to play in the top 6 clubs. He did it when Ramsey signed, with VK saying he will be good enough to play for England one day

beddie · Post by **beddie** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 7:13 pm

We should have signed Johnny Evans. He would have been a good leader with the younger lads around him,

Vegas Claret · Post by **Vegas Claret** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 7:15 pm

I don't know his name, but the lad we sign in January is not good enough. I think that's how it goes ?

scouseclaret · Post by **scouseclaret** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 7:56 pm

Maybe VK thinks he can improve O’Shea. Not sure I’d single him out yesterday though - I thought all three centre halves were pretty poor. Delacroix was clearly uncomfortable repeatedly receiving the ball on the six yard line with Connor Gallagher bearing down on him, but we kept on doing it just the same.

Hopefully Beyer will be back soon, because the thought of both him and Ekdal missing for a sustained period fills me with dread.

CoolClaret · Post by **CoolClaret** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 8:12 pm

scouseclaret wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 08, 2023 7:56 pm
Maybe VK thinks he can improve O’Shea. Not sure I’d single him out yesterday though - I thought all three centre halves were pretty poor. Delacroix was clearly uncomfortable repeatedly receiving the ball on the six yard line with Connor Gallagher bearing down on him, but we kept on doing it just the same.

Hopefully Beyer will be back soon, because the thought of both him and Ekdal missing for a sustained period fills me with dread.

I wasn’t particularly singling him out for yesterday, more over every PL game he’s played for us has more or less been a car crash defensively, with him always being all over the place.

warksclaret · Post by **warksclaret** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 8:16 pm

I cannot see Ekdal returning any time soon. He featured very little before his injury, and once ready to train needs to get to full fitness. I think we could do with his calmness and reading of the game, however like Beyer seems very injury prone

123EasyasBFC · Post by **123EasyasBFC** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 8:21 pm

warksclaret wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 08, 2023 8:16 pm
I cannot see Ekdal returning any time soon. He featured very little before his injury, and once ready to train needs to get to full fitness. I think we could do with his calmness and reading of the game, however like Beyer seems very injury prone

Ekdal is close to being fit

warksclaret · Post by **warksclaret** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 8:29 pm

123EasyasBFC wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 08, 2023 8:21 pm
Ekdal is close to being fit

That would be good news

ervi34 · Post by **ervi34** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 8:35 pm

Dingo wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 08, 2023 2:20 pm
He's only played 4 games for us? I don't understand how a player can be written off so quickly, or why anyone would want to to do that, especially when making a step up to a higher level.

He's not completely written off but he was awful in all 4 games he played. Should not be anywhere near our starting lineup and I can't understand why Kompany decided to trust him ahead of Ekdal who was rock solid for us last season.

evensteadiereddie · Post by **evensteadiereddie** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 8:45 pm

Well, we're not short of scapegoats this week, are we?

Stevie Morgan · Post by **Stevie Morgan** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 8:55 pm

evensteadiereddie wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 08, 2023 8:45 pm
Well, we're not short of scapegoats this week, are we?

Dara O'Shea was not responsible for our defeat yesterday.

Dara O'Shea SO FAR has not looked PL standard.

Both these things can be true.

And Mee was definitely better in the air than what we've seen so far from O'Shea.

Darnhill Claret · Post by **Darnhill Claret** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 10:18 pm

O'Shea never gave up yesterday giving maximum effort on a bad day. He was the one chasing Sterling on the half-way line and never stopped, eventually being the defender in the penalty area trying to block Jackson's shot for their 4th goal.

Stevie Morgan · Post by **Stevie Morgan** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 10:29 pm

Darnhill Claret wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 08, 2023 10:18 pm
O'Shea never gave up yesterday giving maximum effort on a bad day. He was the one chasing Sterling on the half-way line and never stopped, eventually being the defender in the penalty area trying to block Jackson's shot for their 4th goal.

Unfortunately, these actions were not the look of a quality defender. No issues with his commitment.

Jakubclaret · Post by **Jakubclaret** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 10:45 pm

Just not the required standard & I personally doubt he'll improve that much although it's possible given his age to be wrong but if he does I can't see it being much, not quite sure why we signed him maybe as a cover defender, when we signed him I had a look at the baggies forum & nobody seemed overly upset he's just a mediocre championship defender & I suspect that's all he'll ever be.

Gp8419 · Post by **Gp8419** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 10:54 pm

I know it’s early days but these two centre half’s look far worse than what we had last season clearly not good enough.

GodIsADeeJay81 · Post by **GodIsADeeJay81** » Sun Oct 08, 2023 11:41 pm

BurnleyFC wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 08, 2023 6:30 pm
Yep, it was absolutely criminal to write Nimani off so soon.

: IMG_1081.png (269.96 KiB) Viewed 1957 times

To be fair, he did virtually naff all with his career, absolutely stole a living

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 12:50 am

Another reactionary knee jerk fickle hot take. Zzzzzzz

How many games has Dara started? 2?

Yep s***e useless waste of money will never succeed here, get rid.

IanMcL · Post by **IanMcL** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 1:53 am

Unnecessary witch-hunt from a player needing all the confidence and support he can muster.

superdimitri · Post by **superdimitri** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 6:53 am

I think it's a bit unfair to single him out.
The way we play is so open, it's a nightmare for defenders. We rely completely on individual brilliance in defence so we can be more affective in attack.

If you think about it, that's similar to how Kompany did so well for Manchester City.

..and its the opposite of the Dyche system, that relied on individual brilliance in attack.

BurnleyFC · Post by **BurnleyFC** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 4:56 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 08, 2023 11:41 pm
IMG_1081.png

To be fair, he did virtually naff all with his career, absolutely stole a living

I had an OFI Crete shirt!

BleedingClaret · Post by **BleedingClaret** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 5:02 pm

SalisburyClaret wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 08, 2023 5:14 pm
O’Shea clearly isn’t up to the standard needed as yet. I thought McNally looked a far better prospect

And how did you think McNally did in his Premier League appearances?

ecc · Post by **ecc** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 5:17 pm

JimmyRobbo wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 08, 2023 2:00 pm
Certainly not a poor athlete. A decent defender.

I see him as a 'tweener. A bit like a Ben Mee was when he first joined. I didn't see BM evolving into the player he did. I think DOS is more physical. We'll see what happens. Useful utility defender for me. I wouldn't start him ahead of JB, AAD, Lecroix or Ekdal.

No need for a pile on when we've just been defeated by an established Prem heavyweight constructed through £bn of investment.

Not seen the lad play for us. JimmyRobbo: your post is a thoughtful analysis of a player giving the positives and negatives. It's the sort of post the board needs rather than some of the crazy kneejerking on here.

JTClaret · Post by **JTClaret** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 5:29 pm

From what I've seen, he looks dreadful.
Sloppy play, weak defending and conceeding a lot of goals whilst he is playing.

With the signings we made, I do wish we hadn't bothered and just gone for THB.
At least if he'd been just as poor, we've seen him be very good to deserve the chance.

CoolClaret · Post by **CoolClaret** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 5:38 pm

JTClaret wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 09, 2023 5:29 pm
From what I've seen, he looks dreadful.
Sloppy play, weak defending and conceeding a lot of goals whilst he is playing.

With the signings we made, I do wish we hadn't bothered and just gone for THB.
At least if he'd been just as poor, we've seen him be very good to deserve the chance.

It’s a strange one.

We’re a team that finished 1st quite convincingly but a lot of the additions that played in the Championship (and league one for that matter) have had look ins over the lads that finished 1st?

Doesn’t make sense to me at all.

Jamesy · Post by **Jamesy** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 5:38 pm

We need to get off the lad’s back and give him time to settle. It hasn’t been easy for him when we have had to field a makeshift defence due to injuries. He would be ideal in a back five alongside Ekdal and Beyer when they are fit. That would give us a true ball playing centre half, a stopper like O’Shea and a combination of both in Ekdal.

GodIsADeeJay81 · Post by **GodIsADeeJay81** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 6:47 pm

BurnleyFC wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 09, 2023 4:56 pm
I had an OFI Crete shirt!

Bizarre, how come?

BurnleyFC · Post by **BurnleyFC** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 7:09 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 09, 2023 6:47 pm
Bizarre, how come?

Just from a holiday there. Should’ve got his name on the back.

How the hell did he manage to make over forty appearances for Monaco?

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 7:19 pm

Bring back McNally, I say!

Casper2 · Post by **Casper2** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:27 pm

Average in the championship says it all

Jakubclaret · Post by **Jakubclaret** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:48 pm

Casper2 wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:27 pm
Average in the championship says it all

That's what you get for £7 mil in today's market unless you fall lucky & spot something everybody else has missed, I think some people were hoping differently, it's nothing to do with writing somebody off it's more to do with the realisation what is there is there & accepting that, west brom would have drove the price up if they thought any differently as well & we would have probably faced competition.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:51 pm

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:48 pm
That's what you get for £7 mil in today's market unless you fall lucky & spot something everybody else has missed, I think some people were hoping differently, it's nothing to do with writing somebody off it's more to do with the realisation what is there is there & accepting that, west brom would have drove the price up if they thought any differently as well & we would have probably faced competition.

Probably about right.
I'm hoping that whatever potential the recruitment people saw in him can be worked on, and that he will improve.

Jakubclaret · Post by **Jakubclaret** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:53 pm

boatshed bill wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:51 pm
Probably about right.
I'm hoping that whatever potential the recruitment people saw in him can be worked on, and that he will improve.

Always a possibility at 24 I'm not sure when defenders are supposed to peak.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:55 pm

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:53 pm
Always a possibility at 24 I'm not sure when defenders are supposed to peak.

I guess it all depends on the "agenda"

Superjohnnyfrancis · Post by **Superjohnnyfrancis** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:59 pm

VK has been robbed blind this season after the bargains of last

Oshea £9m

Ramsey £12m OMFG

Trafford £19m

No wonder Alan looked angry at the end of chelsea on saturday.

Jakubclaret · Post by **Jakubclaret** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:00 pm

boatshed bill wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:55 pm
I guess it all depends on the "agenda"

West brom will have had some sort of rough idea on his likely development I guess with all the data & sports science available, it's usually a tell tale when percentage sell ons are included offering insurance with unsure low valuations.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:02 pm

I could see him playing right back, similar to Peps 4 central defenders in defence last season. A narrow defensive right back spot might fit him better.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:02 pm

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:00 pm
West brom will have had some sort of rough idea on his likely development I guess with all the data & sports science available, it's usually a tell tale when percentage sell ons are included offering insurance with unsure low valuations.

He could become a very good, reliable cover CB, you could almost say "the new Kevin Long".

CoolClaret · Post by **CoolClaret** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:04 pm

It’s strange when we have Luke McNally and had Bobby Thomas who is younger and more versatile and more importantly non of them cost 7mill.

It’s a bizarre signing.

The rumour that we’re back in looking at Ballard at Sunderland is an indictment on our centre half recruitment in the summer.

Superjohnnyfrancis · Post by **Superjohnnyfrancis** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:05 pm

I think we should be getting a crime number for Ramsey, Unai has conned us big time.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:07 pm

Superjohnnyfrancis wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:05 pm
I think we should be getting a crime number for Ramsey, Unai has conned us big time.

He has plenty of development ahead of him.

ksrclaret · Post by **ksrclaret** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:10 pm

Superjohnnyfrancis wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:05 pm
I think we should be getting a crime number for Ramsey, Unai has conned us big time.

Played very well against Man Utd, but as a 20 year old kid he needs to be given some help out there and a sensible structure to play within.

Much like O'Shea, if these players were slowly introduced to PL life alongside some experienced pros, they might not be being hung out to dry quite so much.

CoolClaret · Post by **CoolClaret** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:12 pm

ksrclaret wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:10 pm
Played very well against Man Utd, but as a 20 year old kid he needs to be given some help out there and a sensible structure to play within.

Much like O'Shea, if these players were slowly introduced to PL life alongside some experienced pros, they might not be being hung out to dry quite so much.

Little different to O’Shea - he has 5 years of playing experience.

Ramsey of course but again - did anyone watch Boro last year and think, ‘yep, Ramsey would get in over Zaroury’… no chance

Superjohnnyfrancis · Post by **Superjohnnyfrancis** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:13 pm

ksrclaret wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:10 pm
Played very well against Man Utd, but as a 20 year old kid he needs to be given some help out there and a sensible structure to play within.

Much like O'Shea, if these players were slowly introduced to PL life alongside some experienced pros, they might not be being hung out to dry quite so much.

Probably wont happen but would like to see Cork come into midfield to at least steady the ship next game.

ksrclaret · Post by **ksrclaret** » Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:22 pm

CoolClaret wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:12 pm
Little different to O’Shea - he has 5 years of playing experience.

Ramsey of course but again - did anyone watch Boro last year and think, ‘yep, Ramsey would get in over Zaroury’… no chance

Like I said before, put O'Shea in a system where he's well protected and he'd be perfectly adequate. Kevin Long looked fine for large parts in the PL and O'Shea is clearly better than him.

Ramsey had a great record for Boro last season, I think it was a goal every 2 games from out wide, and I wasn't all that taken with Zaroury after the WC break and I wasn't surprised we looked to upgrade him.

The things that did surprise me were awarding him a new 5 year deal, signing 6 of the same winger, and seeing the team attempt to play in the way it has done so far. If the goal is to make these kids learn fast, we need to be careful not to break them in the process. O'Shea is looking very low on confidence already.