January transfer window rumours.

[warksclaret]

We need a dam good clear-out. If we get £2.5m for Twine so be it. When we are in the Championship next season we need to prepare for the PL better-we have been through the "learning curve". Athleticism, physicality,goal scoring and experience is what we need to build on. Twine will never be a PL player despite certain skills he possesses. To go-Cork, Rodriguez, Bastian, JBG,Obefemi,Muric and possibly a few more, probably in the Summer

[warksclaret]

We need a dam good clear-out. If we get £2.5m for Twine so be it. When we are in the Championship next season we need to prepare for the PL better-we have been through the "learning curve". Athleticism, physicality,goal scoring and experience is what we need to build on. Twine will never be a PL player despite certain skills he possesses. To go-Cork, Rodriguez, Bastian, JBG,Obefemi,Muric and possibly a few more, probably in the Summer

Please add Egan Riley, Churlinov and McNally, Weghorse to the list of departures

[gandhisflipflop]

I’m praying we get some full backs in soon

[clarethomer]

We’ve wasted some money in the last 18 months. Like VKs team selection, his transfers are a lucky dip too.

Just wanted to share a slightly different view from my perspective.

When we bought Foster last year - how many fans thought we had wasted our money then? I was leaning to that way of thinking if I am being honest when I got to the end of the season. Put it down to he wasn't getting a chance as a bit of rationale but if he couldn't get into last years team - he was never going to prove himself in the PL.

Then Mission To Burnley came on and VK talked about buying for the PL and that he would be the cheapest successful PL striker bought.

How many fans do you think saw PL Lyle Foster before he actually proved he could find the net in this league?

Cost what £8m. Value today, next season etc if progress continues?

My reflections are that it's easy to take the short term view based on emotions of current performance of individual/team but buying players with growth and development still likely - the risk v reward over the medium to long term is far lower when you take a slightly longer term view.

Would be quite interesting in the coming years, to keep a simple profit/loss track on the ALK/VK investment into players.

If I was to be a betting man, I would put my money on a positive return within next 2 -3 years.

[CoolClaret]

So let me get this right -

The first signing of this new revolutionary 'model' is gonna go for a loss?

I thought every single player we were gonna sign was magically gonna get flipped for profit?! Almost like it's not that easy eh - who'd have thought it

[northeastclaret]

So let me get this right -

The first signing of this new revolutionary 'model' is gonna go for a loss?

I thought every single player we were gonna sign was magically gonna get flipped for profit?! Almost like it's not that easy eh - who'd have thought it

He was injured most of last season and we won promotion ahead of schedule if you hadn’t noticed, but don’t let the facts get in the way of you having another moan and dig at the club.

[Newcastleclaret93]

He was injured most of last season and we won promotion ahead of schedule if you hadn’t noticed, but don’t let the facts get in the way of you having another moan and dig at the club.

The documentary pretty much proved that point to be inaccurate

[KRBFC]

So let me get this right -

The first signing of this new revolutionary 'model' is gonna go for a loss?

I thought every single player we were gonna sign was magically gonna get flipped for profit?! Almost like it's not that easy eh - who'd have thought it

Of course not every player was gonna move for profit, is that not obvious?

I doubt he’s moving for a loss either. If it is a small loss who cares? We can sell Zaroury to off set that potential 500k loss if you want? The profit on one player covers that 10x over.

[CoolClaret]

He was injured most of last season and we won promotion ahead of schedule if you hadn’t noticed, but don’t let the facts get in the way of you having another moan and dig at the club.

I did notice thanks - not sure what any of that has to do with what I posted?

[CoolClaret]

Of course not every player was gonna move for profit, is that not obvious?

I doubt he’s moving for a loss either. If it is a small loss who cares? We can sell Zaroury to off set that potential 500k loss if you want? The profit on one player covers that 10x over.

Who's buying Zaroury for more than we paid for him? Bloke has barely kicked a ball.

I'm well aware of what you're saying, my point was it isn't as simple as some like to make out and every signing has an element of risk

[KRBFC]

Who's buying Zaroury for more than we paid for him? Bloke has barely kicked a ball.

I'm well aware of what you're saying, my point was it isn't as simple as some like to make out and every signing has an element of risk

Who’s buying Zaroury for more than £2m? Nobody, you’re right he’s s***e, the model is terrible, nobody is worth more than we paid, VK out!

[CoolClaret]

Who’s buying Zaroury for more than £2m? Nobody, you’re right he’s s***e, the model is terrible, nobody is worth more than we paid, VK out!

I'll go with that - well, if he takes the owners with him...

[bumba]

Who’s buying Zaroury for more than £2m? Nobody, you’re right he’s s***e, the model is terrible, nobody is worth more than we paid, VK out!

We paid £3.5 million for Zaroury with a 20% sell on too

[Newcastleclaret93]

If we are being honest Zaroury is a strange one, 12 months ago I think we could have got 15m for him. After a poor second half of the season and barely kicking a ball this season his value has likely plummeted.

I still suspect profit could be made but not even remotely close to his value last January or in the summer

[Goody1975]

We were a mess when relegated from the Premier League, others may disagree but I feel we'll be in a far better position in August 2024 than in August 2022 no matter what division we are in.

I'm as frustrated as anybody with how this season has panned out but some of the reactions to it are hysterical.

The big issue will be the reduction in parachute payments from three years to two due to immediate relegation, but feel we are more than capable of bouncing straight back if required.

[agreenwood]

Jesus lads.

Dig away at the recruitment of the summer of 2023 by all means. It’s warranted.

However, it’s a stretch and slightly disingenuous taking the **** about the summer 2022 recruitment, when the success rate considering the volume was pretty phenomenal. Twine and Churlinov were probably the two exceptions, but the latter was injured early and dropped behind various other signings who ended up excelling.

We brought in over a dozen players and won the league at a canter. If we lose a million or two on a small proportion of those signings from that summer, it really is a drop in the ocean when weighed against what our 2022 business brought in with a fresh trip to the land of milk and honey.

[boyyanno]

Of course not every player was gonna move for profit, is that not obvious?

I doubt he’s moving for a loss either. If it is a small loss who cares? We can sell Zaroury to off set that potential 500k loss if you want? The profit on one player covers that 10x over.

Some people did actually think that to be fair.

[RVclaret]

Looks like Twine is a straight loan with no buy option.

[gandhisflipflop]

Some people did actually think that to be fair.

Well they’re numbskulls then aren’t they.

[KRBFC]

We paid £3.5 million for Zaroury with a 20% sell on too

VK publicly said the reported total figure was closer to half. I doubt we paid £3.5m total for him. Just like I doubt we paid £4m upfront for Twine.

[KRBFC]

Some people did actually think that to be fair.

I don’t think anybody thought every signing would be a success, that’s impossible.

[123EasyasBFC]

Don’t know why people are losing their head over the fact at potentially making loss on a player, I’d rather make a 1m loss on a player like twine than make a 12m loss on hendrick, 12m loss on Brady, 12m loss on Vydra, when you have to rebuild practically a full squad there were always going to be signings that didn’t work out, not possible to get everything right, even the best run clubs in the world make signings that don’t work out

[boyyanno]

Well they’re numbskulls then aren’t they.

Yep.

In all seriousness Twine is actually one I'm more happy to give the club a "pass" on. I thought he was the right kind of signing, good profile, not mega money- it just hasn't worked out.

But there were some on here who were acting like every bit of business was going to make us profit and this kind of looks like it puts that notion to bed which I'm happy about.

[123EasyasBFC]

So let me get this right -

The first signing of this new revolutionary 'model' is gonna go for a loss?

I thought every single player we were gonna sign was magically gonna get flipped for profit?! Almost like it's not that easy eh - who'd have thought it

Understand you don’t like the ownership and business model but every decision that happens isn’t always a ownership problem, out of best part of 30 new players there are always going to be ones that don’t work out

[NewClaret]

Looks like Twine is a straight loan with no buy option.

Much happier with that if true.

[Darthlaw]

Don’t know why people are losing their head over the fact at potentially making loss on a player, I’d rather make a 1m loss on a player like twine than make a 12m loss on hendrick, 12m loss on Brady, 12m loss on Vydra, when you have to rebuild practically a full squad there were always going to be signings that didn’t work out, not possible to get everything right, even the best run clubs in the world make signings that don’t work out

I think Ben Gibson retains the award for biggest spaff of cash to date.

At least we got double figures (treble figures in Hendrick's case) in appearances from the rest.

[AfloatinClaret]

...I’ll think we are mad if we loan with an option though. In order of preference - no option or obligation.

Loans like any other deal are 'negotiated' and my preference follows you're own... When we're the one loaning. Going the other way, I of course strongly favour buying as an option and at a pre-agreed (low) fee. Why can't we have it both ways? it's not fair!

[gandhisflipflop]

Looks like Twine is a straight loan with no buy option.

So we are getting 2.5m as a loan fee?

[bumba]

VK publicly said the reported total figure was closer to half. I doubt we paid £3.5m total for him. Just like I doubt we paid £4m upfront for Twine.

Up front was probably half, I'd imagine it rose closer to the reported figure upon promotion

[RVclaret]

So we are getting 2.5m as a loan fee?

There is no 2.5m at all (according to Nixon who tbf was the first to report on this weeks ago).

[Vegas Claret]

yeah Nixon deffo says it's a loan

[Clovius Boofus]

Don’t know why people are losing their head over the fact at potentially making loss on a player, I’d rather make a 1m loss on a player like twine than make a 12m loss on hendrick, 12m loss on Brady, 12m loss on Vydra.

Those don't count though because they don't fit with the current agenda.

[123EasyasBFC]

I think Ben Gibson retains the award for biggest spaff of cash to date.

At least we got double figures (treble figures in Hendrick's case) in appearances from the rest.

We actually got half our transfer fee back on Gibson

[123EasyasBFC]

Those don't count though because they don't fit with the current agenda.

If you wanted to look when deeper we actually doubled our money on Chris wood , made profit on pope, Collins, cornet and McNeil

[Somethingfishy]

I'll go with that - well, if he takes the owners with him...

Ahhhh there it is...
The agenda behind all the negativity....zzzzzzzzz

[Darthlaw]

We actually got half our transfer fee back on Gibson

So thats £6m per league appearance?

[123EasyasBFC]

So thats £6m per league appearance?

I wasn’t arguing that we didn’t lose at all on him but compared to hendrick, Brady and Vydra getting money back for Gibson wasn’t the worst business

[Darthlaw]

I wasn’t arguing that we didn’t lose at all on him but compared to hendrick, Brady and Vydra getting money back for Gibson wasn’t the worst business

The point I made was Hendrick cost us 11m for 122 premier league appearances, Robbie Brady 81 PL appearances for £13m and Vydra £8m for 82 appearances.

Gibson's 1 appearance for £6m is easily the worst business, in my eyes at least.

Back on the subject of Twine, I can stand making a slight loss on him as really his goal vs WBA kept our momentum toward PL promotion so really I think he played his part in earning us the prize money.

[Holtyclaret]

So let me get this right -

The first signing of this new revolutionary 'model' is gonna go for a loss?

I thought every single player we were gonna sign was magically gonna get flipped for profit?! Almost like it's not that easy eh - who'd have thought it

Don’t confuse the two summer windows.

The first summer vk arrived late to pretty much zero first team squad. The flurry of signings late that window was to provide us with some sort of squad that could be competitive in the championship, a miracle happened as we know. Some of these relatively low cost players haven’t made the grade or have subsequently been upgraded and will move on.

Last summer and going forward will be more the new model.

[CoolClaret]

Don’t know why people are losing their head over the fact at potentially making loss on a player, I’d rather make a 1m loss on a player like twine than make a 12m loss on hendrick, 12m loss on Brady, 12m loss on Vydra, when you have to rebuild practically a full squad there were always going to be signings that didn’t work out, not possible to get everything right, even the best run clubs in the world make signings that don’t work out

Fag packet maths that, 6 years of PL football revenue streams

[CoolClaret]

Don’t confuse the two summer windows.

The first summer vk arrived late to pretty much zero first team squad. The flurry of signings late that window was to provide us with some sort of squad that could be competitive in the championship, a miracle happened as we know. Some of these relatively low cost players haven’t made the grade or have subsequently been upgraded and will move on.

Last summer and going forward will be more the new model.

I made the point (a bit tongue in cheek) because I believe Twine was the first player we officially signed in Summer 2022, no?

[Chester Perry]

Don’t confuse the two summer windows.

The first summer vk arrived late to pretty much zero first team squad. The flurry of signings late that window was to provide us with some sort of squad that could be competitive in the championship, a miracle happened as we know. Some of these relatively low cost players haven’t made the grade or have subsequently been upgraded and will move on.

Last summer and going forward will be more the new model.

The announcement wasn't early or even late, but work on the season and recruitment with the manager's team started weeks in advance of it

[Vegas Claret]

Good move for Twine, isn't the Bristol City manager the same guy who was his manager at MK Dons ?

[Somethingfishy]

Good move for Twine, isn't the Bristol City manager the same guy who was his manager at MK Dons ?

It's about as good a move as he could get. Isn't he from Wooton Bassett? He started at Swindon his local club and Bristol City only down the road and obviously a better level. Being closer to home may be what he needs?
Disappointed if it happens as I think there is a player in there. He is just too lightweight (many Hull fans have also said this) and his favoured position is only suitable to certain systems...imo

[Vegas Claret]

It's about as good a move as he could get. Isn't he from Wooton Bassett? He started at Swindon his local club and Bristol City only down the road and obviously a better level. Being closer to home may be what he needs?
Disappointed if it happens as I think there is a player in there. He is just too lightweight (many Hull fans have also said this) and his favoured position is only suitable to certain systems...imo

it's a loan deal apparently

[123EasyasBFC]

The point I made was Hendrick cost us 11m for 122 premier league appearances, Robbie Brady 81 PL appearances for £13m and Vydra £8m for 82 appearances.

Gibson's 1 appearance for £6m is easily the worst business, in my eyes at least.

Back on the subject of Twine, I can stand making a slight loss on him as really his goal vs WBA kept our momentum toward PL promotion so really I think he played his part in earning us the prize money.

The point was was still lost a hell of a lot of money on 3 players under 30

[123EasyasBFC]

Fag packet maths that, 6 years of PL football revenue streams

Well the new ownerships first signings Collins Roberts cornet, 2 out of those 3 we sold for profit, but your just looking at twine and the fact we are potentially selling him for a loss after we have said 27 players as a negative, what club gets every decision right?

[123EasyasBFC]

Fag packet maths that, 6 years of PL football revenue streams

By this argument to twine isn’t a loss because he played a part in us getting back to the prem leading to higher revenue streams

[CoolClaret]

By this argument to twine isn’t a loss because he played a part in us getting back to the prem leading to higher revenue streams

You're missing the point -

For a start, most of them apps when the title was already won, hardly a massive contributor.

6 seasons and a lot of apps between them.

I know the club isn't going to make money on every player, I was highlighting (with evidence) that it isn't as simple as some tried to make out as though buy young, develop, sell for profit is a sure fire way to success.

[123EasyasBFC]

You're missing the point -

For a start, most of them apps when the title was already won, hardly a massive contributor.

6 seasons and a lot of apps between them.

I know the club isn't going to make money on every player, I was highlighting (with evidence) that it isn't as simple as some tried to make out as though buy young, develop, sell for profit is a sure fire way to success.

You wasn’t highlighting anything ‘So let me get this right -

The first signing of this new revolutionary 'model' is gonna go for a loss?

I thought every single player we were gonna sign was magically gonna get flipped for profit?! Almost like it's not that easy eh - who'd have thought it’

Is you clearly trying to sarcastic, you said you know the club isn’t going to make money in every playing but your statement says you thought every player was.

You don’t like the ownership and model and we all know you don’t but if we lose 1.5m or whatever on twine that isn’t an example on the model not working when we already made around 3m on cornet and 4m on Collins. McNeil wasn’t a new ownership singing but still made 20m profit on him, 8m profit on pope