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What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 11:28 am
by It Is What It Is
I'd like to think that The Board has never even thought about anything but giving VK their full unwavering support during this disappointing start and continuing to do so.
Just a few months ago in May, everybody on this forum thought VK was the Messiah and could do no wrong
I cannot understand now the numbers ( who have probably never played footy for decades ) on this forum who are screaming for him to go.
Fairweather fans.
We are a very young inexperienced squad who have had a EPL baptism of fire and dealt with it admirably and courageously.
I have never seen any heads dropping or any lack of commitment, enthusiasm or energy even when losing at home or away.
We will turn it all around starting Saturday v Blades.
The commitment of VK, his staff and squad will get us back up the league to safety.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 11:33 am
by Longsidelenny1882
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 11:35 am
by Jjjack
We massively miss Foster at the moment, I think there's still a naivety there to tactics and approach but I'm happy to continue with Kompany and the project. We definitely lack confidence, I'd have liked to have seen Ekdal and Roberts coming on on Saturday to make it a back 5 towards the end, they desperately need a result. Still a long way to go but we haven't exactly made it easy for ourselves.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 11:55 am
by MeeActon1
It Is What It Is wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 11:28 am
I have never seen any heads dropping or any lack of commitment, enthusiasm or energy even when losing at home or away.
Agree with much of your post, however heads pretty obviously dropped after the equaliser on Saturday and the whole atmosphere in the ground and on the pitch changed, panic set in, it was obvious what was going to happen as it has been for much of the season when we concede.
Season wise, I can’t see us staying up from this start, would love it to happen but it’s just not realistic I fear.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:14 pm
by Bowclaret
What a refreshing post compared to all the blockheads currently sprouting utter rubbish.
I saw fight and commitment from every single player on Saturday and we WILL get better and get results.
The gaffer made a clear mistake on Saturday with not bringing on Ekdal to shore it up - He knows that and will learn and we will be better for it.
For the board ? Nothing to see here and the gaffer will have total full support.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:25 pm
by alwaysaclaret
Bowclaret wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:14 pm
What a refreshing post compared to all the blockheads currently sprouting utter rubbish.
I saw fight and commitment from every single player on Saturday and we WILL get better and get results.
The gaffer made a clear mistake on Saturday with not bringing on Ekdal to shore it up - He knows that and will learn and we will be better for it.
For the board ? Nothing to see here and the gaffer will have total full support.
Really !!!! You think he knows HE made a mistake.
Not just one, but 3, should have left well alone, the player's on the pitch were running on adrenaline at the thought they would get the win we're all craving, and I believe we'd have got it had he not intervened.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:38 pm
by Woodleyclaret
Spot on re subs but more concerning is why Benny isn't playing and why Ramsay was considered a good idea instead of Obafemi?
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:49 pm
by SalisburyClaret
VK is learning on the job and is still making mistakes - but he puts them right pretty quick, for example, the way we dealt with corners at the weekend was a massive improvement. The board will be considering his position, it’s their job too but there’s no reason to think they’ll change manager. We got promoted a couple of years earlier than planned, so this is valuable extra experience
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:54 pm
by Jamesy
They are probably thinking two things.
Firstly, can we survive in the Premier League? Answer: doubtful.
Secondly, can we service the level of debt and borrowing if we are relegated? Answer: with difficulty.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:57 pm
by alwaysaclaret
SalisburyClaret wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:49 pm
VK is learning on the job and is still making mistakes - but he puts them right pretty quick, for example, the way we dealt with corners at the weekend was a massive improvement. The board will be considering his position, it’s their job too but there’s no reason to think they’ll change manager. We got promoted a couple of years earlier than planned, so this is valuable extra experience
We were still marking zonal area's rather than giving the keeper some protection on Saturday, and the problem in terms of being promoted a couple of year's early is we've consequently spent around £110m and half of the signings are simply not ready for this league, if we do get relegated those players will be off, so potentially we will never actually realise their true value,which is apparently part of the reason they were bought in the first place.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:57 pm
by GodIsADeeJay81
Woodleyclaret wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:38 pm
Spot on re subs but more concerning is why Benny isn't playing and why Ramsay was considered a good idea instead of Obafemi?
Benny has had a hamstring injury
He’s only just come back into the squad
Ramsey and benny play in different positions
Ramsey is most likely fitter than Benny, so less of a risk to being on as a sub
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:58 pm
by GodIsADeeJay81
Jamesy wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:54 pm
They are probably thinking two things.
Firstly, can we survive in the Premier League? Answer: doubtful.
Secondly, can we service the level of debt and borrowing if we are relegated? Answer: with difficulty.
When we got relegated last time they made it clear that the debts weren’t an issue
If we go down again, they probably won’t be much of an issue, mainly because we have a squad full of saleable assets
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:00 pm
by alwaysaclaret
GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:57 pm
Benny has had a hamstring injury
He’s only just come back into the squad
Ramsey and benny play in different positions
Ramsey is most likely fitter than Benny, so less of a risk to being on as a sub
Ramsey hasn't been fit since day 1, has had strapping on some part of he's leg every appeance.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:01 pm
by Big Vinny K
Jamesy wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:54 pm
Secondly, can we service the level of debt and borrowing if we are relegated? Answer: with difficulty.
Do you not think that the distinct possibility of relegation was not something they had already considered and planned for in the summer ?
The servicing of our debt in my view will be based on a number of different scenarios playing out - relegation being one of them. That’s my experience anyway based on looking at it from the lenders point of view which I have had to do many times.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:02 pm
by Dark Cloud
I personally really wouldn't be looking at replacing VK anytime soon and that includes when (not if!) this season ends in relegation. He's already proven he can put a team together to walk the Championship and I don't doubt he could do it again. What he's had to learn the hard way is that it takes far more than pace, youth, belief, enthusiasm and potential to survive in the PL. I'm guessing he knows that better than anyone now, but obviously it's too late to correct the mistakes made in the summer window and a couple of appropriate signings in January isn't going to turn a whole season round. VK will be a far, far better manager once he's back in the PL and I for one hope it's with us.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:03 pm
by GodIsADeeJay81
alwaysaclaret wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:00 pm
Ramsey hasn't been fit since day 1, has had strapping on some part of he's leg every appeance.
He’s still fitter than benny and has made more appearances etc
That was my point
Why risk benny when he’s barely been back a week or so?
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:03 pm
by elwaclaret
I still believe, but it gets a little harder with each defeat. West Ham was a blow, and that showed not least in the chairman’s face.
I’m hoping for a City like pick up as Christmas approaches (when they invariably find the extra gear) and we kick on to the end of the season.
For me VK stays, but I still expect this team to make much of the talk early this season to come back and haunt the short sighted… I just wish they’d get a wriggle on and hurry up turning the corner.
I really think VK needs to concentrate on man for man on dead balls though… neither came directly from dead balls on Saturday but both came from second balls… while players were still up in and around our box… teams know only too well that they are the best bets against Burnley this season.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:09 pm
by alwaysaclaret
GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:03 pm
He’s still fitter than benny and has made more appearances etc
That was my point
Why risk benny when he’s barely been back a week or so?
Still not fit though so why risk Ramsey, the change if any should have been larsen for gudmundson, obafemi for JRod. Amdouni and Koleosho were our 2 biggest threats knackered or not the mere fact they were on the pitch kept West ham guessing, soon as they went off they pushed up 10-15 yards and went for it, and got their rewards.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:12 pm
by CoolClaret
GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:58 pm
When we got relegated last time they made it clear that the debts weren’t an issue
If we go down again, they probably won’t be much of an issue, mainly because we have a squad full of saleable assets
When we went down last we probably owed on Weghorst and Cornet and sold players for a decent return.
To go down now we’d still owe on pretty much everyone that came in, now you’re saying we can simply sell them - we’re still going to have to replace any that we sell. It’s kicking the can down the road at best.
McNeil was pure profit, Pope more or less after being here for so long, Wood etc….
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:14 pm
by GodIsADeeJay81
CoolClaret wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:12 pm
When we went down last we probably owed on Weghorst and Cornet and sold players for a decent return.
To go down now we’d still owe on pretty much everyone that came in, now you’re saying we can simply sell them - we’re still going to have to replace any that we sell. It’s kicking the can down the road at best.
McNeil was pure profit, Pope more or less after being here for so long, Wood etc….
We’ll sell for more than we paid for them, despite what the naysayers claim on here
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:17 pm
by CoolClaret
GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:14 pm
We’ll sell for more than we paid for them, despite what the naysayers claim on here
Luca yes. Not as much as some are claiming but undoubtedly.
The rest? Would have to show more.
Point is it’s spinning our wheels at best, more likely going backwards.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:19 pm
by BabylonClaret
MeeActon1 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 11:55 am
Agree with much of your post, however heads pretty obviously dropped after the equaliser on Saturday and the whole atmosphere in the ground and on the pitch changed, panic set in, it was obvious what was going to happen as it has been for much of the season when we concede.
Season wise, I can’t see us staying up from this start, would love it to happen but it’s just not realistic I fear.
Heads drop every time we lose the lead. Its been a common thread all season
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:21 pm
by Jakubclaret
GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:14 pm
We’ll sell for more than we paid for them, despite what the naysayers claim on here
Not a hope in hell getting more than £7mil for O'Shea & Trafford will have to seriously buck his ideas up to even dream of getting anywhere near £15 mil for him, the rest might break even or raise a profit. Let's be honest collectively they are hardly setting the world alight.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:23 pm
by Jamesy
GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:58 pm
When we got relegated last time they made it clear that the debts weren’t an issue
If we go down again, they probably won’t be much of an issue, mainly because we have a squad full of saleable assets
I get where you are coming from but saleable assets decrease in value once relegated. Nick Pope is a classic example of this and James Maddison to Spurs from relegated Leicester.
We have now spent circa 120 million and in the event of relegation we would be lucky to recoup half of that if we sold all of the players we have signed.
Vincent has taken a punt on lots of unproven players and splashed several million here and there in doing so. Apart from two or three players in the squad I cannot see Premier League clubs beating our door down to try and sign any others.
Just my opinion of course and I will be elated if I am proved wrong. UTC.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:24 pm
by alboclaret
Bowclaret wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:14 pm
What a refreshing post compared to all the blockheads currently sprouting utter rubbish.
I saw fight and commitment from every single player on Saturday and we WILL get better and get results.
The gaffer made a clear mistake on Saturday with not bringing on Ekdal to shore it up - He knows that and will learn and we will be better for it.
For the board ? Nothing to see here and the gaffer will have total full support.
I agree with what tour saying but not sure about the, he will learn bit. I hope he does but its a very simple thought process of what was needed and chose not to do it.
It's just not what he does. He wants us to pass our way to a result, keeping the ball away from the opposition but our players are not good enough for that.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:24 pm
by BabylonClaret
GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:14 pm
We’ll sell for more than we paid for them, despite what the naysayers claim on here
I would be surprised if most if them made what we paid. Only Koleosho looks good enough to make a profit
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:26 pm
by Quickenthetempo
Starts the thread with a question about the chairman and board, but uses the post to have a dog at the fans.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:27 pm
by alwaysaclaret
BabylonClaret wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:24 pm
I would be surprised if most if them made what we paid. Only Koleosho looks good enough to make a profit
Agree, can't imagine getting anywhere near £18m for Tresor
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:27 pm
by NewClaret
I HOPE he and the board are not reading social media and reaching knee-jerk, emotional conclusions. And are 1000% focussed on supporting Kompany in every way that he needs.
It’s hard times like these that show peoples true characters and so I’m hoping it’s a time that Pace shows his. I’ll be very, very worried if he doesn’t… and would ask the simple question: show me a single club that has achieved success chopping and changing managers? The answer is none.
It’d be complete lunacy to make us a new Watford and it’d end very badly.
He’d also look really stupid having talked about him in the way he has and you’d have to question his judgement if he signed a young manager knowing he had no PL experience and expected him to be brilliant in his first year in the PL. He is learning, like the team.
If he does sack him it’ll show poor judgement and panic (probably due to financial over-stretching), which for me will give rise to far, far more concerns than any run of poor results would do.
Kompany has got us out of the Championship and could do again with this team. No guarantees but better than someone with no experience of that league. He has a team in place, a full squad that he’s bought and who are playing for him/his style. He’s also proven he can identify good, cheap players and attract them to a pretty unfashionable club. And he’s also a great ambassador for the club in need of an image change. He’s the perfect fit, just not delivering the perfect results at the moment.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:28 pm
by NewClaret
alwaysaclaret wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:27 pm
Agree, can't imagine getting anywhere near £18m for Tresor
He cost £13.9m by the way.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:31 pm
by Big Vinny K
Jamesy wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:23 pm
I get where you are coming from but saleable assets decrease in value once relegated. Nick Pope is a classic example of this and James Maddison to Spurs from relegated Leicester.
We have now spent circa 120 million and in the event of relegation we would be lucky to recoup half of that if we sold all of the players we have signed.
Vincent has taken a punt on lots of unproven players and splashed several million here and there in doing so. Apart from two or three players in the squad I cannot see Premier League clubs beating our door down to try and sign any others.
Just my opinion of course and I will be elated if I am proved wrong. UTC.
£120m ?
Holy sh-it….it’s almost like for some posters the amount is increasing after every defeat.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:33 pm
by CoolClaret
NewClaret wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:27 pm
It’d be complete lunacy to make us a new Watford and it’d end very badly.
I mean - we already are a bit.
Wanting multi club ownership, massive packed out squad, happy to chop and change every season with large swathes of transfers.
Add a manager merry go round and we’re the new Watford!
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:34 pm
by northernpowerhouse
I imagine they're thinking can we attract a decent manager while bottom of the league, and if not how bad do things have to get before we give Bellamy or Jackson a go.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:34 pm
by Superjohnnyfrancis
alwaysaclaret wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 12:25 pm
Really !!!! You think he knows HE made a mistake.
Not just one, but 3, should have left well alone, the player's on the pitch were running on adrenaline at the thought they would get the win we're all craving, and I believe we'd have got it had he not intervened.
We have posters who can read minds now.
Thing is Ekdal hardly ever gets in the team another head scratcher from VK.
How does this poster know Ekdal should have come on or if Vinny was even thinking about this. Gigantic stretching going on.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:39 pm
by RVclaret
Big Vinny K wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:31 pm
£120m ?
Holy sh-it….it’s almost like for some posters the amount is increasing after every defeat.
I saw a £130m claim on Twitter!
Wonder what it will be after Sheffield?
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:39 pm
by GodIsADeeJay81
Sigh
People just don’t get it
Players are mostly young and will improve
Players are mostly on long contracts, this makes a big difference
Several players were held in high regard/ones to watch, across Europe before coming here - Tresor and Amdouni being examples
More often than not the transfer fees being thrown around will I include add-ons and we had this confusion with Gibson and we only paid just over half the claimed total of £15 million
Just because some of you don’t rate our players, it doesn’t mean scouts/coaches/managers have the same opinion as you
Ramsdale was relegated twice and went for more money after each one - this is being ignored in regards to Trafford
Pope had one year left on his deal, wanted to move and wasn’t a young player
How often do players get sold for a lot less than they were signed for?
We made money on Chris Wood after he’d had a torrid first half of the season and he’s never rediscovered his early form
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:40 pm
by GodIsADeeJay81
CoolClaret wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:33 pm
I mean - we already are a bit.
Wanting multi club ownership, massive packed out squad, happy to chop and change every season with large swathes of transfers.
Add a manager merry go round and we’re the new Watford!
Every season?
We needed a full rebuild of the squad last season
Then we needed to add more players, potentially of better quality, for this season
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:44 pm
by CoolClaret
GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:40 pm
Every season?
We needed a full rebuild of the squad last season
Then we needed to add more players, potentially of better quality, for this season
VK is the one that said he likes a high turnover of players.
Aye last year we did no doubt.
This season we certainly didn’t need some of the additions that we have made.
On your point about Wood - Newcastle overpaid becuase they were desperate for a striker and it also massively weakened what was a relegation rival to them.
He was under firing but he had 49? goals in 150 ish PL for us, understandably older like.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:48 pm
by Jamesy
Big Vinny K wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:31 pm
£120m ?
Holy sh-it….it’s almost like for some posters the amount is increasing after every defeat.
[/quote
Why, do you think I am telling porkies?
Work it out for yourself then. It was 100 million before we paid for Tresor.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:48 pm
by Lambo
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:51 pm
by Jamesy
Furthermore, if we get back what we paid for Tresor I will run naked up Pendle Hill.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:52 pm
by NewClaret
RVclaret wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:39 pm
I saw a £130m claim on Twitter!
Wonder what it will be after Sheffield?
It’s crazy how much complete rubbish is written.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:53 pm
by Boss Hogg
Are the players going up in value ?
Not really. Only Koleosho would make a profit in the Summer purchases.
Is the brand being damaged by breaking defeat records ?
Are the investors happy ?
Can they attract new investment when we lose every week ?
Are they getting value for money ( and compared to other clubs such as Luton) ?
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:54 pm
by alwaysaclaret
Superjohnnyfrancis wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:34 pm
We have posters who can read minds now.
Thing is Ekdal hardly ever gets in the team another head scratcher from VK.
How does this poster know Ekdal should have come on or if Vinny was even thinking about this. Gigantic stretching going on.
Not sure who your referring to that can read minds, I certainly don't pretend to. But I'd also say ekdal although it would have been he's first game back from injury may have been a better option than Cullen given West ham were likely to lay siege to our goal at that point, given that we'd fired them up by taking our 2 biggest threats of the pitch, who'd both had excellent game's.
However let's hope our manager is learning something, and quick.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:55 pm
by Boss Hogg
Jamesy wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:51 pm
Furthermore, if we get back what we paid for Tresor I will run naked up Pendle Hill.
‘…we get back what we paid for Tresor…’
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:57 pm
by Superjohnnyfrancis
alwaysaclaret wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:54 pm
Not sure who your referring to that can read minds, I certainly don't pretend to. But I'd also say ekdal although it would have been he's first game back from injury may have been a better option than Cullen given West ham were likely to lay siege to our goal at that point, given that we'd fired them up by taking our 2 biggest threats of the pitch, who'd both had excellent game's.
However let's hope our manager is learning something, and quick.
I was posting about the guy you replied to saying VK will know he made a mistake and would have brought Ekdal on , daftest thing I’ve read on here recently including the troll stuff.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:58 pm
by RicardoMontalban
RVclaret wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:39 pm
I saw a £130m claim on Twitter!
Wonder what it will be after Sheffield?
Chris Boden quoted that on the last FTBHE podcast. It goes up every time he cites it.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:58 pm
by Superjohnnyfrancis
In answer to the question
Probably looking into if Wonga still exists and asking Genk if we really do have to buy Tresor or can we return him.
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:59 pm
by Big Vinny K
Jamesy wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:48 pm
No I don’t think you are “telling porkies”
But I do think that you are wrong.
And I’d be happy to place a charity bet for a decent amount that we did not spend £120m (we’ll find out when we see the relevant accounts published)
In the meantime feel free to show your workings - and then I’ll let everyone else pick it apart
Re: What are Pace & The Board thinking now?
Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2023 2:00 pm
by RVclaret
RicardoMontalban wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 1:58 pm
Chris Boden quoted that on the last FTBHE podcast. It goes up every time he cites it.
Embarrassing from someone who should know better.
