I’ve long wanted Muric in nets but have held off the inane criticism because, like Muric, I knew he’d improve as the season progressed. That will continue.

I think it’s fair to say that James Trafford was outstanding today.

Saves us multiple times, pulled off some worldies and commanded his box much better. Made sensible decisions with his kicking. Areas to improve of course, but much, much better.

Only a few games ago posters were saying we’d lost money on Trafford They don’t know what they’re talking about because any 21yo English Keeper who can make saves like that at his age is not selling for £14 or even £19m. Another one we’re lucky to have.

I love the Kosovan Mad Man. Think he’s pure genius and worth the admission fee alone.

Still don’t think he deserved to get dropped but Traff was very, very good tonight - no question.

Wish we wouldn’t have him playing out as much but that’s on VK.

TOP keeper

I’ve said all year, he’s miles better than Muric in almost all departments, but I respect some of the reasons some folks disagree.
The stick he’s had on here by the usuals has been daft, again today he played a few ropey passes but on the whole he was brilliant

He’s clearly more settled now and showing his keeping skills. I think he has the tools to work on his passing and no doubt it’ll improve with age. It’s not like it’s bad, just can be better.. but some keepers s*** themselves when under pressure, he stays calm, has a good touch and tries to play. I think he’s a better keeper than Bazunu at Saints who some compared Traff too earlier on.

Burnley1989 wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 8:44 pm

I’ve said all year, he’s miles better than Muric in almost all departments, but I respect some of the reasons some folks disagree.
The stick he’s had on here by the usuals has been daft, again today he played a few ropey passes but on the whole he was brilliant

VERY lucky to have him in this form.

Super James Trafford in goal.

Burnley1989 wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 8:44 pm

I’ve said all year, he’s miles better than Muric in almost all departments, but I respect some of the reasons some folks disagree.
The stick he’s had on here by the usuals has been daft, again today he played a few ropey passes but on the whole he was brilliant

‘Almost all areas’

- I’ll Give you shot stopping.

Not having it on crosses or with the ball either touch, vision or passing range.

Would be even better if VK stopped asking him to do things he isn’t great at.

Now down to just 2 goals conceded per game!

Out of position for first goal and nutmegged for the second. Otherwise very good

RVclaret wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 8:48 pm

He’s clearly more settled now and showing his keeping skills. I think he has the tools to work on his passing and no doubt it’ll improve with age. It’s not like it’s bad, just can be better.. but some keepers s*** themselves when under pressure, he stays calm, has a good touch and tries to play. I think he’s a better keeper than Bazunu at Saints who some compared Traff too earlier on.

I think he’s better than Bazunu - the comparison was more about chucking someone young straight in from L1 was doing repeating the Southampton/Bazunu mistake.

He’s started to grow and show his quality but it has taken us a long time.

FCBurnley wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 8:51 pm

Out of position for first goal and nutmegged for the second. Otherwise very good

Yeah looked to me to have misread the flight of the ball for the first and jumped over it

CoolClaret wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 8:49 pm

‘Almost all areas’

- I’ll Give you shot stopping.

Not having it on crosses or with the ball either touch, vision or passing range.

Would be even better if VK stopped asking him to do things he isn’t great at.

Let’s see, I’ll bet you he goes on to have a much more successful career, he’s a kid but improving massively every week

Superjohnnyfrancis wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 8:50 pm

Now down to just 2 goals conceded per game!

And that's all Traffords fault? Are you 10 years old?

Put it on ratings thread he stops shots like most keepers but his distribution and lack of command of his area is a continual problem. How much did we pay for him?

GetIntoEm wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 8:56 pm

And that's all Traffords fault? Are you 10 years old?

Why are the dumb ones so triggered by factual posts?

Burnley1989 wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 8:56 pm

Let’s see, I’ll bet you he goes on to have a much more successful career, he’s a kid but improving massively every week

He may, he may not, we will see.

Put it this way - a club in the pl will be more inclined to want Trafford with the homegrown quarter etc

Can easily see Muric playing for some big clubs in Europe as well.

Still believe we’d have been on a higher points total rn with slowly integrating the new lads but it is what it is.

Of course hes improving, hes been given 6 months to build on his experience at the top level without any worries about losing his place.
The debate really is whether we could afford to put his individual development ahead of the teams results. Id argue that the league table answers that and we are now so far down the Trafford road that we may as well leave him in and hope to reap the rewards from our very generous treatment of him in the first half of the season

Homegrown quota *

Goliath wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 9:06 pm

Of course hes improving, hes been given 6 months to build on his experience at the top level without any worries about losing his place.
The debate really is whether we could afford to put his individual development ahead of the teams results. Id argue that the league table answers that and we are now so far down the Trafford road that we may as well leave him in and hope to reap the rewards from our very generous treatment of him in the first half of the season

He’s had a decent game today but we have sacrificed the season to hope he reaches the level we need him for. Bad management that.

Manager too comfortable feels no pressure from above. That’s on Pace.

Question: is a keeper that’s nutmegged always at fault?

In 2 years time, barring injury, he'll be the best British keeper around and established in a top 6 side.

No doubt about it.

Trafford was perfectly good from when he started playing for us, he’s simply been busy recently with a few shots that have been stoppable . His feet are good and today a good but better than arguably one of the worlds best keepers Allison .He’s a child prodigy and starting to get the experience hd needs .

Improving fast and already worth £20m (and we paid mich less than £18m, especially if we go down because there is a likely survival payment in there).

Can see him exceeding Pope’s shot stopping within 12 months, also being in the full England squad, and that is some accolade at his age. Many top keepers are rooted to their line, so that doesn’t affect his value. His distribution is improving though still iffy at times. Can see a top team buying him as a number 2 because he is English. Personally though I think if we drop the worst thing he could do is leave unless we choose to sell. 2 more years with us and he could then be ready for a Champions League move.

Goliath wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 9:06 pm

Of course hes improving, hes been given 6 months to build on his experience at the top level without any worries about losing his place.
The debate really is whether we could afford to put his individual development ahead of the teams results. Id argue that the league table answers that and we are now so far down the Trafford road that we may as well leave him in and hope to reap the rewards from our very generous treatment of him in the first half of the season

Agreed here.

‘Child prodigy’ comment is a little embarrassing - I mean, he’s 21 and has over 100 games of Professional Men’s Footy under his belt.

Dean Henderson had less hype and arguably had a better debut season (so far) in the Premier League at pretty much the same age.

Let’s just calm down a bit on the hyperbole.

Aside from a few dodgy bits of distribution in the first half, he had a very good game tonight.

Well done, Traff.

He's a very very good shot stopper, he also has shown signs the last 2 games of growing more confident and physical at high balls- not fantastic but he's claimed some which, although expected claims, he was spilling earlier in the season.

I've said from the start he WILL be a top keeper. After a very ropey first 14-15 games he's starting to develop.
I think he probably is a better shot stopper than Muric- hard to compare as we've not seen Muric at this level, but I lean probably 70/30 towards it being yes.
I think he's a very good keeper for the cameras, and looks better on TV than he often actually is, can make saves look very dramatic. Not a criticism, not a positive, just think he can be a bit deceptive at times and look like he's had to do more than he actually did.
I think he's still got a long way to grow at commanding his area, but is improving- it's where Muric improved massively last season, Traffords' still not as good right now but headed in the right direction.
I think he's way way behind as a ball player, but my frustration there is with Kompany sticking to a system needing him to be one, rather than adapting to help Trafford out- he's the most utilised keeper in the league for passing and it's not his strong suit, it exposes him but that's a managerial fault as much as a Trafford weakness.
I still think we'd have a lot more points had Muric played the first 12-15 games.
I don't think Muric will ever play a league game for us again, so I'm backing Trafford.
I do still feel a slight sense of disconnect from the team because of the persistent stubbornness of Kompany's behaviour this season very much selecting against form and pedigree in favour of intangibles known only to him.
I do think Trafford won us a point against West Ham and kept us in the game today.

I hope Trafford keeps developing and doing well, but don't think it's going to be enough to save us unless we adapt & improve elsewhere.

NewClaret wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 8:39 pm

I’ve long wanted Muric in nets but have held off the inane criticism because, like Muric, I knew he’d improve as the season progressed. That will continue.

I think it’s fair to say that James Trafford was outstanding today.

Saves us multiple times, pulled off some worldies and commanded his box much better. Made sensible decisions with his kicking. Areas to improve of course, but much, much better.

Only a few games ago posters were saying we’d lost money on Trafford They don’t know what they’re talking about because any 21yo English Keeper who can make saves like that at his age is not selling for £14 or even £19m. Another one we’re lucky to have.

That’s good to here about Trafford’s performances.

CoolClaret wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 9:18 pm

Agreed here.

‘Child prodigy’ comment is a little embarrassing - I mean, he’s 21 and has over 100 games of Professional Men’s Footy under his belt.

Dean Henderson had less hype and arguably had a better debut season (so far) in the Premier League at pretty much the same age.

Let’s just calm down a bit on the hyperbole.

Well at 9 with Blackburn’s GK coach ( Ben Benson) guiding him when at Carlisle he had Newc/Sunderland/ city/utd / Everton all keeping very close tabs on him . He was unable to sign as parents couldn’t move . When I watched him play his last game (Carl vs Man Utd) he was 12 and was going to City and St Bedes where their academy lot get educated . “He’d “turned down quite lucrative moves to other clubs and had been in the Eng junior set up “ underage “ So trust me JT was a child prodigy . Thats no guarantee of anything of course and I personally prefer Muric, though facts are facts .

‘Child prodigy’ christ there is some utter guff posted on here at times!!!!!

AlargeClaret wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 9:33 pm

Well at 9 with Blackburn’s GK coach ( Ben Benson) guiding him when at Carlisle he had Newc/Sunderland/ city/utd / Everton all keeping very close tabs on him . He was unable to sign as parents couldn’t move . When I watched him play his last game (Carl vs Man Utd) he was 12 and was going to City and St Bedes where their academy lot get educated . “He’d “turned down quite lucrative moves to other clubs and had been in the Eng junior set up “ underage “ So trust me JT was a child prodigy . Thats no guarantee of anything of course and I personally prefer Muric, though facts are facts .

I took your post as meaning ‘he is (right now) a child prodigy’

That’s interesting to know and I’ll give you that - though I’d have expected that ‘most’ English players playing right now in the PL were being monitored as youngsters.

Interestingly, our now 2nd choice backup did enough as a child to get a move to City from Switzerland as a 16 yr old - could argue he was a child prodigy as well!

Steve-Harpers-perm wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 9:36 pm

‘Child prodigy’ christ there is some utter guff posted on here at times!!!!!

It's hardly utter guff. He was very highly rated as a youngster which is why he pretty much represented England at every youth level.

Superjohnnyfrancis wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 8:59 pm

Why are the dumb ones so triggered by factual posts?

Can spot the ones who know nothing about football a mile off. Clearly no idea

Probably complain that he doesn't hoof it down the pitch every time too

An oustanding display tonight for this promising young keeper. What I like about him is the mental strength he has at such a young age. He is definitely getting noticed and talked about, and it would not surprise me if Southgate gets him involved with the England squad in the near future

Legs wider than the Mersey tunnel for their 2nd goal.

Quickenthetempo wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 10:35 pm

Legs wider than the Mersey tunnel for their 2nd goal.

He’ll be up for the Balon Dor next season mark my words!

I've been critical of him this season, but he played well tonight. The save to tip the Salah effort over the bar was superb.

He still has a way to go, with dominating the area, but he will get there.

No goalkeeper 'sets himself' with his feet together.

chekhov wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 9:10 pm

Question: is a keeper that’s nutmegged always at fault?

No. He's just trying to spread himself.

Darnhill Claret wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 10:51 pm

No goalkeeper 'sets himself' with his feet together.

No, but not as wide as Trafford tonight either.

Quickenthetempo wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 11:06 pm

No, but not as wide as Trafford tonight either.

Agreed. Didnt mention it in the player ratings as i didmt think it had much influence in the game in the end but he gave Jota a target which he shouldnt have had from that angle

spt_claret wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 9:29 pm

I do think Trafford won us a point against West Ham and kept us in the game today.

We lost to West Ham !

Stalbansclaret wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 11:38 pm

We lost to West Ham !

Brighton, even. I'm under the weather currently with a nasty head cold, must have got in my brain.

CoolClaret wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 9:39 pm

I took your post as meaning ‘he is (right now) a child prodigy’

That’s interesting to know and I’ll give you that - though I’d have expected that ‘most’ English players playing right now in the PL were being monitored as youngsters.

Interestingly, our now 2nd choice backup did enough as a child to get a move to City from Switzerland as a 16 yr old - could argue he was a child prodigy as well!

Yes cross wires , and likewise I think JT’s box command is quite poor and he’s flap/punch a concern , though it’s being coached into his game I’d imagine . I can only imagine Muric is off which is very disappointing.

CoolClaret wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 8:49 pm

‘Almost all areas’

- I’ll Give you shot stopping.

Not having it on crosses or with the ball either touch, vision or passing range.

Would be even better if VK stopped asking him to do things he isn’t great at.

The best thing about Muric is the utterly ironic nickname you have given him. Kosovan mad man? Wow… he’s kosovan allright, but as for being a mad man? commands the area considerably LESS than Trafford, and for such a big fella has less heart than Brian Jensen.
Great distribution, I’ll give you that, but a keeper?

Steve-Harpers-perm wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 9:36 pm

‘Child prodigy’ christ there is some utter guff posted on here at times!!!!!

He had similar profile and club trajectory as Pickford who was earmarked about 8. Few grow tall enough , have 2 good feet , outstanding plyometric stats and the dedication though .

bobinho wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 26, 2023 11:54 pm

The best thing about Muric is the utterly ironic nickname you have given him. Kosovan mad man? Wow… he’s kosovan allright, but as for being a mad man? commands the area considerably LESS than Trafford, and for such a big fella has less heart than Brian Jensen.
Great distribution, I’ll give you that, but a keeper?

Bit weird this mate -

PFA champ keeper of the year, part of a defence that conceded less than 30 goals in the Championship.

You’re mental if you think he doesn’t command his area? He got really good at it - imperious towards the end of the season! Did it in pre season and the stats back it up as well!

Kosovan Mad Man is just a bit of fun - coined the term because of things like Cruyff turns in the area, megging that Cardiff player in the area in the last game of the season, running 40 yards out and sticking his nut on it when sweeping up - oh and posting a picture of an exotic cat baby in his passenger seat of his lambo .

So yeah - Kosovan Mad Man

We have 2 excellent keepers, don't know why so many supporters have to insult either of them.

How some people can’t bring themselves to give him credit for that performance is beyond me. He was outstanding and kept us in the game. The save from Salah was world class.

Sadly we have a gem but he will probably be at Newcastle next year.

Longsider wrote: ↑

Wed Dec 27, 2023 7:11 am

Sadly we have a gem but he will probably be at Newcastle next year.

Hope so