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VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 11:25 am
by It Is What It Is
I'm done with VAR now after all the ridiculous contentious decisions after ages of re refereeing
incidents from offsides, fouls, handballs, goals, penalties etc etc. in a TV studio bloody miles from anywhere.
The VAR decisions this season against us has robbed us being out of the bottom three to date
.VAR has totally destroyed the game and ripped the heart and emotions out of it.
The game was great before VAR, lots of contentious decisions and goals in real time but the mistakes the refs and assistants made were human but honest.....but the game flowed, no waiting 10 mins to celebrate a goal, and created a lot of talking points after the match.
Much prefer watching the championship and lower league matches with all their controversies.
Just wish the EPL was free of it.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 11:46 am
by warksclaret
Fully agreed-and we are in a Catch 22. On Friday the referee waved goal as soon as Morris netted. Had we no VAR we would all be saying VAR would have resolved it. However the current VAR verdicts are intensely inconsistent . At the end of the day it comes down to opinions and maybe as part of the VAR analysis we need an ex and respected goalkeeper, defender and attacker on the panel of decision makers
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 11:53 am
by kentonclaret
warksclaret wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2024 11:46 am
Fully agreed-and we are in a Catch 22. On Friday the referee waved goal as soon as Morris netted. Had we no VAR we would all be saying VAR would have resolved it. However the current VAR verdicts are intensely inconsistent . At the end of the day it comes down to opinions and maybe as part of the VAR analysis we need an ex and respected goalkeeper, defender and attacker on the panel of decision makers
The goalkeeper would have said that the goal on Friday night should have been ruled out and the attacking player would have argued that the goal was legitimate and should be allowed. Opinions between pundits and ex players divided into two camps as to whether Trafford was fouled.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:00 pm
by Sproggy
warksclaret wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2024 11:46 am
Fully agreed-and we are in a Catch 22. On Friday the referee waved goal as soon as Morris netted. Had we no VAR we would all be saying VAR would have resolved it. However the current VAR verdicts are intensely inconsistent . At the end of the day it comes down to opinions and maybe as part of the VAR analysis we need an ex and respected goalkeeper, defender and attacker on the panel of decision makers
Or the ref would have given the foul without the safety net of VAR to fall back on.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:04 pm
by Sproggy
kentonclaret wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2024 11:53 am
The goalkeeper would have said that the goal on Friday night should have been ruled out and the attacking player would have argued that the goal was legitimate and should be allowed. Opinions between pundits and ex players divided into two camps as to whether Trafford was fouled.
There shouldn't be any inconsistencies with VAR though. Unless the decision they're making is the first of its kind.
Any slight touch on a player's boot should be a penalty given what we've seen with Duran and Jota.
An attacking player should be able to deliberately obstruct the goalkeeper on a cross given what happened on Friday.
Once a decision has been made with VAR, that's the bar by which they should be judging all similar decisions.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:12 pm
by kentonclaret
Sproggy wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:04 pm
There shouldn't be any inconsistencies with VAR though. Unless the decision they're making is the first of its kind.
Any slight touch on a player's boot should be a penalty given what we've seen with Duran and Jota.
An attacking player should be able to deliberately obstruct the goalkeeper on a cross given what happened on Friday.
Once a decision has been made with VAR, that's the bar by which they should be judging all similar decisions.
That would only work if VAR was being operated by robots and not by human beings. You will always get inconsistent decisions and rulings (as we have seen on numerous occasions) when individuals interpret what they are viewing on a screen.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:16 pm
by South West Claret.
Who was it who said football was a simple game?
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:18 pm
by kentonclaret
South West Claret. wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:16 pm
Who was it who said football was a simple game?
A simple man?
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:20 pm
by Clive 1960
I used to love coming of the Turf after a game and have a good argument in pub with decisions that had gone on now you have to sit there for at least 5 minutes before you can cheer a goal because of VAR unfortunately it's ruined my enjoyment of watching the game i played and now watch on TV..
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:27 pm
by FCBurnley
If the turd of a ref had just simply disallowed the goal in real time we would have won 1-0 and we would have had none of the discussions that have followed
Would he have disallowed the goal at say Arsenal City or Liverpool ? Of course he would
Harrington and Bankes should be fired just as most most people are who make massive mistakes at work
They could probably both get good jobs at the post office !!
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:29 pm
by Goliath
I was surprised at how small the reaction was from the crowd after the decision on Friday. It was just a grim acceptance.
Don't know whether we can blame VAR but the lack of any noise or noticeable passion from the stands for the whole game really was pretty noticeable in what was an absolutely huge game. I do think having fans in the cricket field stand has had a pretty damaging effect on the noise coming from the other stands as well.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:34 pm
by Devils_Advocate
VAR is very frustrating and although it gets most of the decisions right it still makes some big mistakes. That said I think we just need to be patient with it and give it time to bed in as I think given time it will come good and in the future people will look back in horror about how we used to manage without it.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:37 pm
by JimmyRobbo
It Is What It Is wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2024 11:25 am
I'm done with VAR now after all the ridiculous contentious decisions after ages of re refereeing
incidents from offsides, fouls, handballs, goals, penalties etc etc. in a TV studio bloody miles from anywhere.
The VAR decisions this season against us has robbed us being out of the bottom three to date
.VAR has totally destroyed the game and ripped the heart and emotions out of it.
The game was great before VAR, lots of contentious decisions and goals in real time but the mistakes the refs and assistants made were human but honest.....but the game flowed, no waiting 10 mins to celebrate a goal, and created a lot of talking points after the match.
Much prefer watching the championship and lower league matches with all their controversies.
Just wish the EPL was free of it.
I agree.
We've managed to invent a system which should improve decision making. It just hasn't, though, but it has taken a lot of fun from the game.
All it has provided is a double opportnity to ensure the powerful clubs get the decisions they demand.
It has increased the play-acting by players and deceitful nature of some managers without retrospectively punising them for it. Even offside decisions lack cetrainty.
We've then invented lots of rules to make VAR work, like the handball rules, and the overall result is that a beautiful and simple game which has grabbed all of us by the heartstrings is losing that passion. It's becoming stale, repetitive and predictable.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:38 pm
by dsr
Devils_Advocate wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:34 pm
VAR is very frustrating and although it gets most of the decisions right it still makes some big mistakes. That said I think we just need to be patient with it and give it time to bed in as I think given time it will come good and in the future people will look back in horror about how we used to manage without it.
It's had 5 years. How much patience do we have to give?
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:48 pm
by Elizabeth
Devils_Advocate wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:34 pm
VAR is very frustrating and although it gets most of the decisions right it still makes some big mistakes. That said I think we just need to be patient with it and give it time to bed in as I think given time it will come good and in the future people will look back in horror about how we used to manage without it.
I'm taking your post at face value which is always a risk especially with your bedding in comment.
I think the officials running it don't know whether to stick or twist because of the constant criticism of how it's being operated.
A good example is the going to the screen which they have turned into a farce because you know the on field ref will change his decision. If some on field refs backed up their original decision there would be a completely different attitude to this important VAR process.
There are other good examples of how they could make it more acceptable eg microphones , and they will eventually have to concede that the people who can change it will put an end to this old boys club that currently operates.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:50 pm
by Devils_Advocate
dsr wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:38 pm
It's had 5 years. How much patience do we have to give?
I see VAR as a bit like Brexit in that it divides people, is very contentious and that to paraphrase a certain Mr Rees-Mogg the overwhelming opportunity from this decision will be seen over the next 50 years.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:57 pm
by bumba
VAR hasn't done anything, it's the Muppets running football that have ruined the game
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:59 pm
by South West Claret.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 1:01 pm
by claretandy
I understand that they don't want to re-referee the game, but from the refs POV, it might not have looked like a foul, he should have gone to look at the screen to see it from the different angles. The same goes for all penalty decisions.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 1:04 pm
by warksclaret
kentonclaret wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2024 11:53 am
The goalkeeper would have said that the goal on Friday night should have been ruled out and the attacking player would have argued that the goal was legitimate and should be allowed. Opinions between pundits and ex players divided into two camps as to whether Trafford was fouled.
Thats why Kenton I suggested a panel of three. Also picking the right individuals will bring out integrity. When Trafford recently failed to grab a corner and the opposition defender outjumped him, (it may have been against Arsenal) ,Shay Given made a comment I had not even considered. He said Trafford used both feet to spring and climb, but goalkeepers gain greater height by leaping off their strongest foot. Its that degree of insight that helps create a more realistic verdict
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 1:31 pm
by dsr
In rugby league, just as they used to in football, they have one referee. He is the boss. His linesman are subservient to him, the VAR official is subservient to him, and the players have to do what he says. It works.
In football, it's far more democratic. Yes, we have a referee, but he has two assistant referees who are always in his ear, he has a VAR ref who can overrule him, and the players can pretty much call him what they want and complain about him without fear of punishment. He's not a referee, he's head of a committee. And it doesn't work.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 2:11 pm
by randomclaret2
It Is What It Is wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2024 11:25 am
I'm done with VAR now after all the ridiculous contentious decisions after ages of re refereeing
incidents from offsides, fouls, handballs, goals, penalties etc etc. in a TV studio bloody miles from anywhere.
The VAR decisions this season against us has robbed us being out of the bottom three to date
.VAR has totally destroyed the game and ripped the heart and emotions out of it.
The game was great before VAR, lots of contentious decisions and goals in real time but the mistakes the refs and assistants made were human but honest.....but the game flowed, no waiting 10 mins to celebrate a goal, and created a lot of talking points after the match.
Much prefer watching the championship and lower league matches with all their controversies.
Just wish the EPL was free of it.
50 odd years of watching the Clarets and football in general for me, and I have never felt as disillusioned by, and detached from , the whole **** Show as I am now....and yes, that does include the struggles of the 1980s.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 2:13 pm
by CoolClaret
& the money men
Hijacked the working mans' game and charge us a ton for the privilege of watching it!
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 2:23 pm
by Lip
Everton benefit from another poor VAR decision..FFS
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 2:25 pm
by Elizabeth
The commentator signalled a 3 minute wait for the decision
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 2:25 pm
by summitclaret
Wtf. How can that be offside? The Villa player was not obstructing the keeper's vision in any way. Operation save Everton in full swing again.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 2:25 pm
by alwaysaclaret
Lip wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2024 2:23 pm
Everton benefit from another poor VAR decision..FFS
Yet again favouring Everton, nothing wrong with this goal, no offside for me, and even the shirt pulling not enough, so the goal stands for me, but as some will no doubt point out, I'm not var.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 3:22 pm
by NL Claret
Is it var or total lack of competence demonstrated by the officials?
I am not enjoying PL at the moment. If it takes over 3 minutes to make a decision then it is not clear and obvious.
Spectators want to see goals not a system which could be known as goal prevention.
The officials in this country are not competent yet have a great deal of arrogance and thrive on control and power.
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 3:25 pm
by theduke
The villa guy who played the ball back was miles offside. Plus there was a foul too.
How was it a lucky decision to Everton???
Re: VAR has ripped the heart and passion out of football.
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 3:46 pm
by claret2018
It’s a great idea being used terribly.
Not sure there’s any conspiracy for the big clubs getting the decisions though. I remember us getting one of the wildest VAR decisions I’ve ever seen a few years ago against Bournemouth.