More FFP breaches…

[dandeclaret]

According to the Athletic….


Everton + Nottingham Forest expecting to be informed on Monday that they’ve been found in breach of PL profitability & sustainability rules for 3yr cycle to June 2023. Both have prepared mitigation & will launch robust defences @TheAthleticFC #EFC #NFFC https://t.co/Rrz5YDSPIk

[ClaretTony]

Will be interesting to see what if any punishments they receive

[dandeclaret]

Seems to be talk of it being 10 points….. but with robust defences could engage further legal proceedings.

[gandhisflipflop]

I wish we had a robust defence. Just getting it in there first before the inevitable

[bfcjg]

After Friday's lilly livered effort both clubs could be deducted 10 points and I fear they'd still finish above us.

[Goliath]

Presumably there would be an appeal process. If thats after the season finishes then its possible that some clubs won't know what league they are playing in until the conclusion of the appeal which would be strange.

[NewClaret]

Presumably there would be an appeal process. If thats after the season finishes then its possible that some clubs won't know what league they are playing in until the conclusion of the appeal which would be strange.

Everything supposed to be dealt with in the season after the offence now - a big step forward.

Clubs at risk of breach now have to provide accounts to the PL earlier than the rest, which gives time for hearing and appeal to take place in season.

[CrosspoolClarets]

What chance have newly promoted sides got if the established sides spend so much? Then we get things like West Ham getting their stadium dirt cheap etc etc. Nation states funding super-clubs.

I don’t understand the argument by some that it isn’t fair on them to be punished.

[randomclaret2]

What chance have newly promoted sides got if the established sides spend so much? Then we get things like West Ham getting their stadium dirt cheap etc etc. Nation states funding super-clubs.

I don’t understand the argument by some that it isn’t fair on them to be punished.

Nobody seems bothered about the West Ham stadium

[Wokingclaret]

Will be interesting to see what if any punishments they receive

Whatever it is they will whinge, get everyone involved including Mayors involved and bring it up in Parliament

[CrosspoolClarets]

Nobody seems bothered about the West Ham stadium

Very true but if Everton had got a half a billion pounds stadium for £15m they wouldn’t have allegedly breached FFP. It is another unfair advantage. The three promoted sides in particular always struggle against unfair advantages.

[NewClaret]

Very true but if Everton had got a half a billion pounds stadium for £15m they wouldn’t have allegedly breached FFP. It is another unfair advantage. The three promoted sides in particular always struggle against unfair advantages.

Pretty sure the report clearly stated that stadium costs were not the cause of the breach.

[Roosterbooster]

Apparently deadline for any appeal decisions would be just after the season end (source 5Live)

[JR1882]

Pretty sure stadium/infrastructure & spending on women’s teams are exempt from calculations.

[IanMcL]

We'll be champions at this rate!

[Goliath]

Apparently deadline for any appeal decisions would be just after the season end (source 5Live)

That seems a bit mad. Am i misunderstanding it or does that mean we may not be able to prepare for the new season transfer wise because we wouldn't know what division we'll be in.

[ClaretOfMancunia]

That seems a bit mad. Am i misunderstanding it or does that mean we may not be able to prepare for the new season transfer wise because we wouldn't know what division we'll be in.

Correct. The timeline laid out has the appeal outcome due one to two weeks after the final game has been scheduled.

[quoonbeatz]

That seems a bit mad. Am i misunderstanding it or does that mean we may not be able to prepare for the new season transfer wise because we wouldn't know what division we'll be in.

They won't relegate anyone after the season has finished, they'll do what they always do and apply a non-punishment when it has zero effect, just as they've done this season with Everton.

[CaptJohn]

As the appeals are due to be heard during this season we could have a situation where relegation is decided in a courtroom and not the playing field. Another reason I'm becoming disillusioned with the game.

[Woodleyclaret]

If you are in the Premier league club you escape meaningful sanction if you are not you end up like scapegoat Darlington playing non league football
Maybe if overspending directors were charged with fraud and criminal charges brought as it would be with businesses things may change.

[Westleigh]

If you are in the Premier league club you escape meaningful sanction if you are not you end up like scapegoat Darlington playing non league football
Maybe if overspending directors were charged with fraud and criminal charges brought as it would be with businesses things may change.

If points were deducted for every dodgy decisions by Premier League clubs the eventual winners might have -10 points and all the rest could have -30 ,and we’d still get relegated.

[beddie]

It’s a shame if found guilty it’s not automatic relegation with no right of appeal, along with the team finishing bottom making the three.

[MrTopTier]

Bookies not changed their odds on either this morning, when showing suspended over the weekend, probably not going to be as bad as everyone is hoping for.

[NewClaret]

Do we know when an announcement is due?

[Kilson810]

Do we know when an announcement is due?

According to Sky Sports News, it's later today!

[NewClaret]

According to Sky Sports News, it's later today!

Cheers.

[ClaretLoup]

Don’t get too excited as we probably have to finish above Luton to benefit.

[ClaretOfMancunia]

... according to one of their top sources, "The Bobble"

https://twitter.com/ElBobble/status/1746920877805949212

Got a bad feeling any points deduction will be suspended until next season though, so not sure how much help it is to us.

[agreenwood]

Will we even know the extent of any points deduction for a month or two? Then the appeal supposedly not until May?

Forget our interest in this. From a competition standpoint, it’s a mess. If clubs are who haven’t done anything wrong are going into late May/June nor knowing which division they are definitely in, it could well lead to further legal action.

[ClaretOfMancunia]

Yes, I believe the outcome of any appeal could come after the conclusion of the season, which seems bizarre. Hence the speculation from some that the deduction might be suspended until the following one.

[Stockbrokerbelt]

Rules are that the sentence is in this season.

[Vegas Claret]

they have indeed both been charged and off it goes to the independent commission again. Fair chance of a points deduction, appeal process, VAR intervention

[Chester Perry]

Rules are that the sentence is in this season.

not quite - they will impact this seasons final standing, but it is quite likely that they will not be determined until after the season has ended

from the MMT last friday

It was always a possibility given the turnaround required and the numbers of appropriately qualified people to preside of such hearings having full diaries - but if this story is true then things could get really messy and possibly litigious, one thing for certain the media, politicians and most fans will be up in arms about it, should the situation arises

from The Athletic

Premier League clubs may not learn any points deductions until after season
https://archive.ph/VPImC

[ClaretOfMancunia]

Timelines as below

psr.png (172.9 KiB) Viewed 4282 times

[Vegas Claret]

.

[Chester Perry]

they have indeed both been charged and off it goes to the independent commission again. Fair chance of a points deduction, appeal process, VAR intervention

The Premier League statement is interesting

Everton and Nottingham Forest confirm Premier League PSR breaches
https://www.premierleague.com/news/3858986

as this quote shows

"Everton FC and Nottingham Forest FC have each confirmed to the Premier League that they are in breach of the League’s Profitability and Sustainability Rules (PSR). This is as a result of sustaining losses above the permitted thresholds for the assessment period ending Season 2022/23."

[quoonbeatz]

Two unbelievably flimsy defences from both Forest and Everton. Fully expect two non-punishments, just like the previous Everton charge.

The PL isn't in the business of punishing cheats so there's no real incentive to abide by the rules.

[forzagranata]

Imagine we somehow survive in the PL as a result of this farce - how many years 'ahead of schedule' will we be then?

[ClaretOfMancunia]

The Premier League statement is interesting

Everton and Nottingham Forest confirm Premier League PSR breaches
https://www.premierleague.com/news/3858986

as this quote shows

"Everton FC and Nottingham Forest FC have each confirmed to the Premier League that they are in breach of the League’s Profitability and Sustainability Rules (PSR). This is as a result of sustaining losses above the permitted thresholds for the assessment period ending Season 2022/23."

Why do you see this as interesting? Genuine question.

[gandhisflipflop]

Will Everton and Forest be getting a points deduction this season or not?

[agreenwood]

.

Evidence that client journalism is alive and well in football.

[agreenwood]

Imagine we somehow survive in the PL as a result of this farce - how many years 'ahead of schedule' will we be then?

Congrats on being the first to get in a dig at the club on a thread about the alleged wrongdoing of two other clubs.

[Chester Perry]

Why do you see this as interesting? Genuine question.

The two clubs start by admitting that they have broken the rules, they are both claiming mitigating circumstances, with Everton complaining about the rules they have known about for years, but it should be a binary decision - not that it will be

[FCBurnley]

First 10 point deduction for Everton was based on 21/22 season. New charges for Everton and Forest are based on 22/23 season and any point deductions will take place this season. Would assume minimum points deduction will be 10 points
Interesting times

[Quickenthetempo]

Why do you see this as interesting? Genuine question.

That statement reads like they have both plead guilty, that the clubs have told the Premier league they are guilty.

I've not read the article though.

[claretdj]

Just dock them both 20 points each & send them down with sheff utd.

[Chester Perry]

First 10 point deduction for Everton was based on 21/22 season. New charges for Everton and Forest are based on 22/23 season and any point deductions will take place this season. Would assume minimum points deduction will be 10 points
Interesting times

to be honest, if the rules are to have true power, punishment for repeated breaches in a cycle should carry a higher sentence - it has to be said that both clubs had appointed extremely strong legal teams last month in readiness for this and will no doubt weasel their way through it at a reduced punishment.

[jedi_master]

Can’t allow myself to care really. The VAR decisions against us (by my count, at least impacting a minimum certain four additional points, but also possibly another four on top as a maybe) have utterly melted my belief in us staying up as it just feels we’re fighting against more than eleven players. I realise that it is simple negligence from officials as opposed to corruption per se, but it doesn’t change my feelings.

Everton could probably suffer another ten point deduction and still stay up, such is the farce that this league currently is.

[Nonayforever]

Presumably with both Everton and Nottingham Forest admitting breaking FFP and being referred for a decision surely means that every other club has passed FFP for the same period.

[Vegas Claret]

Everton statement:
Everton Football Club acknowledges the Premier League’s decision to refer a breach of Profit & Sustainability rules (PSR) for the assessment period ending with the 2022/23 season to an independent Premier League commission.

This relates to a period which covers seasons 2019/20, 2020/21, 2021/22 and 2022/23. It therefore includes financial periods (2019/20, 2020/21 and 2021/22) for which the Club has already received a 10-point sanction. The Club is currently appealing that sanction.

The Premier League does not have guidelines which prevent a club being sanctioned for alleged breaches in financial periods which have already been subject to punishment, unlike other governing bodies, including the EFL. As a result - and because of the Premier League’s new commitment to deal with such matters “in-season” - the Club is in a position where it has had no option but to submit a PSR calculation which remains subject to change, pending the outcome of the appeal.

The Club must now defend another Premier League complaint which includes the very same financial periods for which it has already been sanctioned, before that appeal has even been heard. The Club takes the view that this results from a clear deficiency in the Premier League’s rules.

Everton can assure its fans that it will continue to defend its position during the ongoing appeal and, should it be required to do so, at any future commission - and that the impact on supporters will be reflected as part of that process.