talks a lot of sense, well worth 10 minutes of your time
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UjlUByTXJyw

An excellent appraisal of life at the bottom, I agree with his take on us too.

To do what he says about us though we need to stay brave, back the manager, back the players, back the system of play, and if we have to do it via relegation to get stronger, that’s what we do.

If there is too much dissent about that (as seen on here very day), we’re stuffed, and I see no route to thrive long term.

Exactly.
The "project" has been derided by those who are accustomed to instant or relatively instant success but Heck is absolutely spot on, VK and the club have a long term view, VK said as much in his first meeting with the players, I think its still on Ytube.
He advised that it would take time, it wouldn't be easy and there would be difficulties.
I think last season masked that with an imperious if unexpected Championship victory and promotion.
The doubters, nay whingers, should listen to this interview several times. There is a lot of truth in what the bloke says about the realities of what the promoted teams are up against on and off the field.

Fair play to him, he came accross well.

I have always found him arrogant and unlikeable.

evensteadiereddie wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 10:16 am

Exactly.
The "project" has been derided by those who are accustomed to instant or relatively instant success but Heck is absolutely spot on, VK and the club have a long term view, VK said as much in his first meeting with the players, I think its still on Ytube.
He advised that it would take time, it wouldn't be easy and there would be difficulties.
I think last season masked that with an imperious if unexpected Championship victory and promotion.
The doubters, nay whingers, should listen to this interview several times. There is a lot of truth in what the bloke says about the realities of what the promoted teams are up against on and off the field.

Yep its not easy to keep patience but it does seem like the majority of fans are subconciously acting in the modern way of calling for change as soon as a manager goes through a bad period. Hes shown more than enough to suggest he could be a very good manager and his players always seem to love him. Thats half of the battle.

The problem is when weve had to make so many transfers in the last few years is that we are bound to get a percentage wrong, this season has balanced out last season in that sense. He now needs time to filter out the ones he doesnt think are right and then put the finishing touches on the squad for next season, then i think we will be getting towards the squad VK wants, he may even need 2 more years to get to a settled squad hes happy with.


Not heard what Heckingbottom said, anyone fancy summing it up into some bulletpoints for us?

Our style of play has changed massively from last season, though, and not for the better.

He lives near us, never heard a bad word about him although I didn't warm to him as a manager either. He talks a lot of sense here.

I like Hecky and always thought he spoke well;

Worth noting that his situation going into the PL was vastly different than ours (as he alluded to) and yes, he does mentions the longevity and an abstract of our 'plan' and I would behind it but...

We are simply not the same team playing anywhere near to a similar style, and to me it seems some of the main signings brought in that are now seemingly first on the teamsheet do not have the skillset that I believe can play anywhere near to a system that we apparently want to be.

It's a real mishmash of styles and people in the media keep overlooking this key point - if we were of a similar style and we were nearly there and looked like we could get some results semi-regularly then that would be one thing.

To have wholesale changes like we have, look incredibly disjointed, barely have an identifiable playstyle other than crap and barely look capable of laying a glove on teams then that's when you go, "hang on a minute, something isn't working here"

CoolClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 10:44 am

I like Hecky and always thought he spoke well;

Worth noting that his situation going into the PL was vastly different than ours (as he alluded to) and yes, he does mentions the longevity and an abstract of our 'plan' and I would behind it but...

We are simply not the same team playing anywhere near to a similar style, and to me it seems some of the main signings brought in that are now seemingly first on the teamsheet do not have the skillset that I believe can play anywhere near to a system that we apparently want to be.

It's a real mishmash of styles and people in the media keep overlooking this key point - if we were of a similar style and we were nearly there and looked like we could get some results semi-regularly then that would be one thing.

To have wholesale changes like we have, look incredibly disjointed, barely have an identifiable playstyle other than crap and barely look capable of laying a glove on teams then that's when you go, "hang on a minute, something isn't working here"

Surely our biggest problem in terms of playing atyle is Brownhill not necessarily the new signings. Playing in a 442 we simply have to have someone there who is very good at receiving the ball and moving it on with little fuss even when under pressure.
This is his biggest weakness and is causing us huge problems in terms of playing out from the back now. If he plays it has to be infront of the 2 man midfield.

Goliath wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 10:49 am

Surely our biggest problem in terms of playing atyle is Brownhill not necessarily the new signings. Playing in a 442 we simply have to have someone there who is very good at receiving the ball and moving it on with little fuss even when under pressure.
This is his biggest weakness and is causing us huge problems in terms of playing out from the back now. If he plays it has to be infront of the 2 man midfield.

The 4-4-2 and Brownhill is one thing yes. Though I have never thought that's Brownhill's best position either - I don't think any of the current back three that start the build up have anywhere near the skillset needed to do it effectively in the PL. They're on a hiding to nothing.

I think what has happened this season shows that loans can be good in the short term but not necessarily long term.

I think if we had THB, Tella and Maatsen we would be a much better team and have faired better. Too many changes and we lost the nucleus of the team because Muric, Benson and Zaroury hardly played as well as losing the loan players.

Trafford is not ready for the Premier League yet but for some unknown reason, VK refuses to drop him and give Muric a chance.

The biggest mistake of all for me was letting Barnes go and keeping JRod. We really need Barnes guile, aggression, experience and encouragement for the younger players.

I just hope VK has learnt from this season and brings in a couple of players in the Barnes, Barton, Marney, Mee mould who will bring experience and toughen the side up. We have plenty of skilful players but we lack aggression and toughness with the current team.

Firthy wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 11:00 am

I think what has happened this season shows that loans can be good in the short term but not necessarily long term.

I think if we had THB, Tella and Maatsen we would be a much better team and have faired better. Too many changes and we lost the nucleus of the team because Muric, Benson and Zaroury hardly played as well as losing the loan players.

Trafford is not ready for the Premier League yet but for some unknown reason, VK refuses to drop him and give Muric a chance.

The biggest mistake of all for me was letting Barnes go and keeping JRod. We really need Barnes guile, aggression, experience and encouragement for the younger players.

I just hope VK has learnt from this season and brings in a couple of players in the Barnes, Barton, Marney, Mee mould who will bring experience and toughen the side up. We have plenty of skilful players but we lack aggression and toughness with the current team.

Barnes is pretty much done even at Champ level. He was rightly released, we cant sign players on new contracts when they cant offer anything at all on the pitch. Hes slow, technically poor, average in the air and doesnt score goals anymore. Kompany made the right decision there. He went out on a high at the perfect time.

Goliath wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 11:14 am

Barnes is pretty much done even at Champ level. He was rightly released, we cant sign players on new contracts when they cant offer anything at all on the pitch. Hes slow, technically poor, average in the air and doesnt score goals anymore. Kompany made the right decision there. He went out on a high at the perfect time.

I get your point but we sorely lack what he brings. Attitude, aggression and encouragement. I think it was worth keeping him for this season just to sit on the bench and bring on to encourage the younger players. The biggest thing missing from this team is leadership from a wise old head.

Firthy wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 11:19 am

I get your point but we sorely lack what he brings. Attitude, aggression and encouragement. I think it was worth keeping him for this season just to sit on the bench and bring on to encourage the younger players. The biggest thing missing from this team is leadership from a wise old head.

20k a week for that (at least). That'd be madness.
Having heard Barnes speak im not sure id really want him as one of the leaders anyway, hes not the sharpest tool in the box.

Jack Cork is much more suited to that role and is also technically top class which is always a bonus. In terms of experience we also have Taylor, Rodriguez, Berge, O Shea, JBG. There's no need for Barnes on top of that. If he was available on a free transfer im not sure people would be too happy if we signed him.

Different way of looking at this. We tried to play the same style as last season, but almost like we didn't account for the much improved opposition, especially considering the tough start. By the time we were playing beatable teams, confidence was shot and VK didn't know his best team. We effectively tried to run before we could walk. This wasn't helped by new players like Amdouni and Berge not getting their roles right as the two more advanced midfielders of a three.

VK tried to change at the beginning of the winter to a more pragmatic 4-4-2. I find myself understanding what he's trying to do, but not understanding why he thinks the players at his disposal can get the required results playing this way. It concerns me what he'll try do in the long term. Someone above says the players signed can't play the way he wants them to. I'm not sure that's fair on the players when the system that made us successful has been abandoned rather than tweaked. Also, it shows that Heckingbottom isn't correct by saying VK has stuck to his principles. He clearly hasn't; he's abandoned them in favour of something that doesn't work.

I'm also fed up with hearing that not signing Tella, Maatsen and Harwood-Bellis is the root cause of our problems. Often ironically by people questioning our level of experience and physicality. Tella is a cracking player, but when we see how Zaroury, Benson and new players like Tresor have used sparingly, it's not beyond doubt that he'd have also struggled to get a look in with VK's muddled thinking. Maatsen is also a good player, but would arguably be a luxury in a team on the backfoot. It comes back to the run before we can walk. You can't take a team full of Championship players and max £15m type signings and take on the Premier League clubs at their own game. Maatsen and Tella wouldn't have changed that. It would have been great to have secured the loan players, but ultimately I doubt it would have made much difference.

ChorltonCharlie wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 1:27 pm

Different way of looking at this. We tried to play the same style as last season, but almost like we didn't account for the much improved opposition, especially considering the tough start.

I don't think we did, like, hardly at all - Forest away was the closest and I thought we looked alright there.

ChorltonCharlie wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 1:27 pm

We effectively tried to run before we could walk. This wasn't helped by new players like Amdouni and Berge not getting their roles right as the two more advanced midfielders of a three.

One of the reasons why not having so many changes to start the year was so important - fielding a massively changed side in a system that infamously took 10-15 games to gel last year against better opposition was really silly.

CoolClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 1:35 pm

I don't think we did, like, hardly at all - Forest away was the closest and I thought we looked alright there.

We did in lots of games. The fiascos against Spurs and Chelsea owed a lot to playing out from the back with 5 players quickly pushing into attack. Lose the ball and be wide open. The box midfield was still clearly there, but applied without any kind of handbreak. Which didn't help because players like Brownhill and JBG had been replaced by Amdouni and Berge who were still coming to terms with getting the balance right.

Heckingbottom touched on it there, about the difference in athleticism and physicality too. If you're going to have a lot of young lads, or diminutive players in this league, they better be absolute world beaters. You can understand Dyche always having an emphasis on that side of it.

Even so, it does seem to have gone to another level in the last couple of years. I did think it was noticeable in the cup games against City and United last season, we looked like boys against men, as we have this season.

ChorltonCharlie wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 2:04 pm

We did in lots of games. The fiascos against Spurs and Chelsea owed a lot to playing out from the back with 5 players quickly pushing into attack. Lose the ball and be wide open. The box midfield was still clearly there, but applied without any kind of handbreak. Which didn't help because players like Brownhill and JBG had been replaced by Amdouni and Berge who were still coming to terms with getting the balance right.

We played our 3 man midfield against Chelsea at home yeah and fell to pieces - the other games we didn't.

Still didn't see a combo of Muric, Beyer, Ekdal at the back - I would have liked to have seen them give it a go as I felt they all had a good understanding of each others' game and complimented each other well.

CoolClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 1:35 pm

One of the reasons why not having so many changes to start the year was so important - fielding a massively changed side in a system that infamously took 10-15 games to gel last year against better opposition was really silly.

I agree with you about so many changes but there’s obvious reasons for that, we got promoted with 6 loan players and couldn’t retain them all.

Several of the squad from last season aren’t good enough yet.

Benson missed all of preseason and then started his first game back against Villa and went off injured at half time and missed the first 3 months.

Foster and Beyer have both missed huge chunks of games through injury/illness.

Brownhill started the season injured (according to his brother)

Ekdal got injured away at Forest in the cup early on and missed two months or so.

What does that leave us left from last season?

Muric and Anass weren’t given a proper chance, I agree with.

Cullen Al-Dakhil and Roberts were the first names on the team sheet to start and all 3 started in rotten form and simply had to be dropped.

For various reasons we just haven’t been able to get our team last season on to the pitch at the same time. Long injuries, drastic drops in form, form from some of the new players meant they’re undroppable (Berge and Luca).

KRBFC wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 2:32 pm

I agree with you about so many changes but there’s obvious reasons for that, we got promoted with 6 loan players and couldn’t retain them all.

Several of the squad from last season aren’t good enough yet.

Benson missed all of preseason and then started his first game back against Villa and went off injured at half time and missed the first 3 months.

Foster and Beyer have both missed huge chunks of games through injury/illness.

Brownhill started the season injured (according to his brother)

Ekdal got injured away at Forest in the cup early on and missed two months or so.

What does that leave us left from last season?

Muric and Anass weren’t given a proper chance, I agree with.

Cullen Al-Dakhil and Roberts were the first names on the team sheet to start and all 3 started in rotten form and simply had to be dropped.

For various reasons we just haven’t been able to get our team last season on to the pitch at the same time. Long injuries, drastic drops in form, form from some of the new players meant they’re undroppable (Berge and Luca).

The '6 loan players' though is bending the truth a tad -

Out of the 6, two were signed permanently (Beyer and Obafemi) and out of the others only Maatsen and Tella were straight up key players; Ekdal showed that we could perform to our best without THB in the side. Dervisoglu barely played though did score one key goal.

So really it was Maatsen and Tella that are the misses and we could have definitely grabbed Tella - moving on.

Al-Dakhil horribly managed to start the year with being moved here there and everywhere against some good teams.

Bordering suicide playing that high line at home against Villa and Spurs with a completely changed defence in both games.

Cullen had 0 help in the midfield against some good teams with Berge being instructed to join the attack. Go and watch some of them earlier games and look at how little help there was in midfield (especially when we lost the ball and were being countered) with Cullen in there.

Cullen has played well on recent showings - notably away at Spurs, against Luton and again when he came on against Bournemouth and I think some of the comments made about his performances earlier in the season fall on the managers shoulders

Ekdal was fit to start the season though yes did get injured at Forest.

The bottom line is we should (either to start the year or at some point) seen the following:

--------Muric
----Beyer-Ekdal
-----Cork-Cullen
-------Brownhill

or

--------Muric
-----Beyer-Ekdal
-------Cullen
-----Berge-Brownhill

We haven't seen any of the sort which to me is a massive shame.

biggest thing for me was him alluding to how the PL has changed massively in the last 3 years in terms of spend for the bottom clubs making it really difficult to stay up
So, Wilder, Heckingbottom, Kompany, Dyche (and I'm sure others I've missed) have said exactly the same thing - lads that are in the thick of it but staggeringly there are some on here that just think it's nonsense.

Vegas Claret wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 3:40 pm

biggest thing for me was him alluding to how the PL has changed massively in the last 3 years in terms of spend for the bottom clubs making it really difficult to stay up
So, Wilder, Heckingbottom, Kompany, Dyche (and I'm sure others I've missed) have said exactly the same thing - lads that are in the thick of it but staggeringly there are some on here that just think it's nonsense.

They're all gonna say that though aren't they?

Find it hard to believe when some teams in and around us have had players that they've had for years are doing just fine.

CoolClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 3:46 pm

They're all gonna say that though aren't they?

Find it hard to believe when some teams in and around us have had players that they've had for years are doing just fine.

who is doing just fine ?

Vegas Claret wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 4:03 pm

who is doing just fine ?

Anyone bar us and Sheff United

Vegas Claret wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 3:40 pm

biggest thing for me was him alluding to how the PL has changed massively in the last 3 years in terms of spend for the bottom clubs making it really difficult to stay up
So, Wilder, Heckingbottom, Kompany, Dyche (and I'm sure others I've missed) have said exactly the same thing - lads that are in the thick of it but staggeringly there are some on here that just think it's nonsense.

You are right on this. The knockers (I cannot call them supporters) rubbish what all these managers say about us and the league, then in due course they have rubbished all 20 managers.

Our style has been praised so far by most of the top teams, many of the middling teams have said we are in a false position, and virtually all managers say the league is now even more unforgiving. These things must all be true, even though we have made some big errors and are going down partly due to those as well.

VK will have a reset and hopefully go again (assuming we drop which we all now expect). The issues that plagued us this year won’t in the league below, which is a doddle in comparison, especially if these flair players we have get a run of wins, they are the type to fly with that, just like they may also be the type to shrink in a battle. He was too expansive this season - like if Southgate played an Amdouni in the hole instead of Bellingham, Southgate judges we need 3 midfielders in there, yet Kompany believes we only need 2, against similar opposition and with worse players behind them (ironically I think both managers are wrong given the players at their disposal). That’s what Kompany needs to reflect on I believe but he will get there.

CrosspoolClarets wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 4:12 pm

You are right on this. The knockers (I cannot call them supporters) rubbish what all these managers say about us and the league, then in due course they have rubbished all 20 managers.

Our style has been praised so far by most of the top teams, many of the middling teams have said we are in a false position, and virtually all managers say the league is now even more unforgiving. These things must all be true, even though we have made some big errors and are going down partly due to those as well.

VK will have a reset and hopefully go again (assuming we drop which we all now expect). The issues that plagued us this year won’t in the league below, which is a doddle in comparison, especially if these flair players we have get a run of wins, they are the type to fly with that, just like they may also be the type to shrink in a battle. He was too expansive this season - like if Southgate played an Amdouni in the hole instead of Bellingham, Southgate judges we need 3 midfielders in there, yet Kompany believes we only need 2, against similar opposition and with worse players behind them (ironically I think both managers are wrong given the players at their disposal). That’s what Kompany needs to reflect on I believe but he will get there.

Sorry but this is the usual stuff that was said about any of the other powderpuff teams from the Champ in the past 5 years or so that 'tried to play the right way' then rolled over.

We never had Klopp saying that about us when we took points off him with Dyche did we?

CrosspoolClarets wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 4:12 pm

You are right on this. The knockers (I cannot call them supporters) rubbish what all these managers say about us and the league, then in due course they have rubbished all 20 managers.

Our style has been praised so far by most of the top teams, many of the middling teams have said we are in a false position, and virtually all managers say the league is now even more unforgiving. These things must all be true, even though we have made some big errors and are going down partly due to those as well.

VK will have a reset and hopefully go again (assuming we drop which we all now expect). The issues that plagued us this year won’t in the league below, which is a doddle in comparison, especially if these flair players we have get a run of wins, they are the type to fly with that, just like they may also be the type to shrink in a battle. He was too expansive this season - like if Southgate played an Amdouni in the hole instead of Bellingham, Southgate judges we need 3 midfielders in there, yet Kompany believes we only need 2, against similar opposition and with worse players behind them (ironically I think both managers are wrong given the players at their disposal). That’s what Kompany needs to reflect on I believe but he will get there.

We've rolled over for all the big clubs, we've not laid a glove on any of them no wonder there all happy for us to carry on this way.

Jayrod is still at the club and needs playing
He is far an away one of most experienced Premier league players and I don't get the antipathy towards a player whose hardly played
I would agree though Barnsey should have been offered a role player coach most obvious

CoolClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 10:44 am

To have wholesale changes like we have, look incredibly disjointed, barely have an identifiable playstyle other than crap and barely look capable of laying a glove on teams then that's when you go, "hang on a minute, something isn't working here"

No you dont thats when you put the pedal to the metal smash through the barrier and plummet into the lake with the kids you bought in the back seat if your our Belgian messiah.

CoolClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 4:11 pm

Anyone bar us and Sheff United

really ? Forest have spent around 400 million (from memory) putting their squad together, Brentford aren't doing well compared to previous seasons etc etc etc Luton for all the deserved plaudits are in the bottom 3

CrosspoolClarets wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 4:12 pm

You are right on this. The knockers (I cannot call them supporters) rubbish what all these managers say about us and the league, then in due course they have rubbished all 20 managers.

Our style has been praised so far by most of the top teams, many of the middling teams have said we are in a false position, and virtually all managers say the league is now even more unforgiving. These things must all be true, even though we have made some big errors and are going down partly due to those as well.

VK will have a reset and hopefully go again (assuming we drop which we all now expect). The issues that plagued us this year won’t in the league below, which is a doddle in comparison, especially if these flair players we have get a run of wins, they are the type to fly with that, just like they may also be the type to shrink in a battle. He was too expansive this season - like if Southgate played an Amdouni in the hole instead of Bellingham, Southgate judges we need 3 midfielders in there, yet Kompany believes we only need 2, against similar opposition and with worse players behind them (ironically I think both managers are wrong given the players at their disposal). That’s what Kompany needs to reflect on I believe but he will get there.

Absolutely barking mad.

I think it’s virtually impossible to decipher the extent to which we’ve attempted to maintain our playing style from last season.

A team low in confidence, lacking sufficient quality and full of inexperience will probably look an uncoordinated mess regardless of what’s done on the training ground.

I think there’s been some evidence that we’ve tried to tweak things, but we did last season too. We became quite effective at going long when it was required as the season progressed last year.

It’s just harder to pick out discernible patterns when a) we see so much less of the ball, b) turn it over more and c) look devoid of belief the longer the season has gone on

It is a good interview but he hasn’t said anything that we didn’t already know. I can take relegation because we’re Burnley, but what I struggle with is the lack of fight, VK constantly picking out of form players and the treatment of the players who got us up.

Those who go every week and spend their hard earned money deserve to see players giving everything. When they perceive that that isn’t happening then it’s fine for them to be annoyed isn’t it?

We will see how the project is faring come the summer I’d say. If we lose our stars then doubts will start forming again.

We knew what to expect when we won promotion.
Everyone knew we needed replacements and more importantly reinforcements.
To say we have a project underway and it's progressing is unfortunately passing me by.
I only see 3 or possibly 4 of our current squad being PL players in 2 or 3 seasons time.
So in my opinion it's another major rebuild if we do happen to get promoted again.

NottsClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 2:07 pm

Heckingbottom touched on it there, about the difference in athleticism and physicality too. If you're going to have a lot of young lads, or diminutive players in this league, they better be absolute world beaters. You can understand Dyche always having an emphasis on that side of it.

Even so, it does seem to have gone to another level in the last couple of years. I did think it was noticeable in the cup games against City and United last season, we looked like boys against men, as we have this season.

Definitely helps a team if you’ve a few big guys in the middle of the pitch,but even if your small you can make up for lack of physique with effort and pace,Garnachio,Foden,and De Silva seem to manage.

boyyanno wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 6:27 pm

Absolutely barking mad.

Which one of us? All those other Premier League managers? Or were they kidding? I reckon Heckingbottom if asked would predict us to bounce straight back, he seemed very impressed with us, and of course we have already beaten him 5-0. We’ve messed up this season of course. But that doesn’t define the next one.

Westleigh wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 10:01 pm

Definitely helps a team if you’ve a few big guys in the middle of the pitch,but even if your small you can make up for lack of physique with effort and pace,Garnachio,Foden,and De Silva seem to manage.

First thing Pep did was sign big lads like Rodri, Ake etc.........

CrosspoolClarets wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 10:01 pm

Which one of us? All those other Premier League managers? Or were they kidding? I reckon Heckingbottom if asked would predict us to bounce straight back, he seemed very impressed with us, and of course we have already beaten him 5-0. We’ve messed up this season of course. But that doesn’t define the next one.

I think anyone who thinks we are playing good football and that we are in a false position in the league is absolutely insane or just not telling the truth. The league table never lies.

We've had plenty of pity praise yes, we've had plenty of criticism too. Let's put it this way, if you were the other 19 managers in the PL you'd want us to keep going about our business exactly the same way as we are, we've only taken 13 points. Why you'd give any credence to it is insane. We took pelters every week under Dyche and we were actually good.

CrosspoolClarets wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 10:01 pm

Which one of us? All those other Premier League managers? Or were they kidding? I reckon Heckingbottom if asked would predict us to bounce straight back, he seemed very impressed with us, and of course we have already beaten him 5-0. We’ve messed up this season of course. But that doesn’t define the next one.

What happened to Hecky after they got beat 5-0 and his team had phoned it in?

I remember plying Wigan Athletic in the Premier League in 2009 at home, I think we lost 3-1 from memory, and I stated back then that we just weren’t equipped physically for the Premier League. They had athletes, big physical guys who could also run, in their team and they dominated us. It was a light bulb moment for me that game and stuck with me.

Ferguson once stated it as well about looking down the tunnel at his players v Arsenal, and he needed physicality. He beed d height and more combative players.

Fast forward to Dyche and he got it. He build a team that was big and physical who could run. Yes, we were lacking a little technically at times against the big 6, but we caused them problems.

Right now we’re missing serious physicality. No, we don’t want that in every position, with the way we (are trying to) play we need technical players, but we are lacking a Tarkowski, a Barton, a Barnes, or even 2-3 of those.

I think we are on the right lines like Heckingbottom says but we have recruited badly for this season and it has cost us our place.
We need to do better the next time and as fans need to support Kompany and the club in what they are doing.
There has been an awful lot of nonsense and overreaction by many who post

Claretforever wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 10:32 pm

I remember plying Wigan Athletic in the Premier League in 2009 at home, I think we lost 3-1 from memory, and I stated back then that we just weren’t equipped physically for the Premier League. They had athletes, big physical guys who could also run, in their team and they dominated us. It was a light bulb moment for me that game and stuck with me.

Ferguson once stated it as well about looking down the tunnel at his players v Arsenal, and he needed physicality. He beed d height and more combative players.

Fast forward to Dyche and he got it. He build a team that was big and physical who could run. Yes, we were lacking a little technically at times against the big 6, but we caused them problems.

Right now we’re missing serious physicality. No, we don’t want that in every position, with the way we (are trying to) play we need technical players, but we are lacking a Tarkowski, a Barton, a Barnes, or even 2-3 of those.

Take your point about the Wigan game but they were massively helped by some classic Jensen theatrics.

Elizabeth wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 10:36 pm

I think we are on the right lines like Heckingbottom says but we have recruited badly for this season and it has cost us our place.
We need to do better the next time and as fans need to support Kompany and the club in what they are doing.
There has been an awful lot of nonsense and overreaction by many who post

The only overreactions are by those people defending our season.

13 points from 26 games is more than just not good enough, it’s a disgusting effort which is rightly being called out.

Iv seen enough of Kompany now to know what he’s all about as a manager, he’s another steven gerrard type, just buys players upon players until it works. Unfortunately for us it will cost us severely financially.

Look at Gerrard at rangers, he won the league ( aided by a huge drop off in form from their only rival ) after buying a huge squad of players, couldn’t repeat the same feat again and kept buying players. The next man comes in and is severely restricted because Gerrard the man with the name was afforded what he wanted.

The same is happening to us. Kompany is just going to buy and buy and buy a random selection of players and hope it works.

He’s very lucky he still has a job after this season calamity.

CrosspoolClarets wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 28, 2024 4:12 pm

Our style has been praised so far by most of the top teams, many of the middling teams have said we are in a false position, and virtually all managers say the league is now even more unforgiving. These things must all be true, even though we have made some big errors and are going down partly due to those as well.

You're referring to anecdotal evidence and opinion not truths. Even then I'd love to see the quotes from most/many/virtually all the managers teams that have said this. If you could be bothered, would be interesting to see it compared to similar compliments to Everton and their points deduction reaction, Nuno's impact at Forest, Brentford's general approach, Luton's fighting spirit. Think you'll find when it's said it's empty words to fill air time.

The hard facts show we're awful. Points, goals scored, goals conceded, chances created, chances conceded, possession, etc, etc are cold hard facts and none shine us in a good light.

It bugs me that we turn it into a black and white argument. You can still be supporter and be behind Kompany whilst acknowledging just how bad this season has been and that the lions share of that blame is on the manager.