Since62 wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 8:39 am

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/68464743

100% more balanced than version 1.....and accepts that his views aren't that of ALL Burnley fans.

I think that is a very well written report.

Yes, just about my thoughts.

There's blind faith and knee jerk reactions, most of us are somewhere in the middle.

My judgement will now be based on the summer window and the two or three glaringly obvious positions where recruitment is required with the right type of player.

Hopefully we don't have a revolving door in the summer and he has a full pre season to get things back on track.

If everything goes to plan we are only a few months away from enjoying Saturday afternoons again.

Much better.

Can’t argue with that, far more balanced and agree with all his points/valid questions.

Little dig at the last effort made me chuckle but that’s how you do it… showing his media experience I guess.

Well written.One absolutely key sentence there

"We're assuming he's learning" referring to VK

Goody1975 wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 10:06 am

Yes, just about my thoughts.

There's blind faith and knee jerk reactions, most of us are somewhere in the middle.

My judgement will now be based on the summer window and the two or three glaringly obvious positions where recruitment is required with the right type of player.

Hopefully we don't have a revolving door in the summer and he has a full pre season to get things back on track.

If everything goes to plan we are only a few months away from enjoying Saturday afternoons again.

Spot on

warksclaret wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 10:26 am

Well written.One absolutely key sentence there

"We're assuming he's learning" referring to VK

Yes I picked that out as well, we can only hope!

It does raise questions.

After coming off the game on Sunday I would have said 60/40% of fans in favour of him staying.

But it's probably higher around 80% in favour.

We have never been a sacking club and given plenty of time for managers to turn it around.

I bet it only went down to 50% wanting Laws out and that was toxic.

It’s a strange one and a strange season.

I want him to stay, I think we will go straight back up and hopefully he’ll learn for next time. But he has to start making better decisions this season too, and that has to start with at least trying a change to the GK. And it also means, as someone said, we can’t have another summer of 15 or so comings and goings.

Nori1958 wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 8:54 am

100% more balanced than version 1.....and accepts that his views aren't that of ALL Burnley fans.

That's not exactly the case.

He might say that in his ending line but if you actually read the content of the article he absolutely speaks for "all fans" for example:

"So I would say (fairly) categorically that despite Burnley being second from bottom of the Premier League, Vincent Kompany has nothing to worry about at the moment as far as supporters are concerned."

It's more balanced but the reality is you like it because it supports how you feel. You don't like the stuff that doesn't.

It's become a real problem on this board where people can't view things from a neutral perspective- It's good if it backs up your opinion and its apparently crap if it doesn't.

Goody1975 wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 10:06 am

Yes, just about my thoughts.

There's blind faith and knee jerk reactions, most of us are somewhere in the middle.

My judgement will now be based on the summer window and the two or three glaringly obvious positions where recruitment is required with the right type of player.

Hopefully we don't have a revolving door in the summer and he has a full pre season to get things back on track.

If everything goes to plan we are only a few months away from enjoying Saturday afternoons again.

Great post.

Where I sit on the spectrum come summer will largely depend on things like:

Now until the end of the season - not results but improvements in individuals and hopefully integration/minutes for players I expect we will need to rely more on next year (Cullen, Benson, Massengo)

Who we keep - I suppose this is more down to Pace, but keeping hold of the players who are looking prem quality (Berge, namely) is important.

Summer business - how we do balancing the squad and whether we bring in bigger, more physical players that are more able to compete if we go up.

Pre-season - a well planned one aimed at rebuilding confidence.

boyyanno wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 10:57 am

It's become a real problem on this board where people can't view things from a neutral perspective- It's good if it backs up your opinion and its apparently crap if it doesn't.

I mean looking at the two articles neutrally, this one is far better written it just so happens I agree with this one more.

KRBFC wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 11:10 am

I mean looking at the two articles neutrally, this one is far better written it just so happens I agree with this one more.

I don't disagree it's better written and it's more balanced. But the comments about how this one doesn't speak for all fans aren't exactly true- see my post above.

I realise he writes at the bottom that he doesn't speak for all fans. But that is in conflict with the passage I've quoted.

boyyanno wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 10:57 am

That's not exactly the case.

He might say that in his ending line but if you actually read the content of the article he absolutely speaks for "all fans" for example:

"So I would say (fairly) categorically that despite Burnley being second from bottom of the Premier League, Vincent Kompany has nothing to worry about at the moment as far as supporters are concerned."

It's more balanced but the reality is you like it because it supports how you feel. You don't like the stuff that doesn't.

It's become a real problem on this board where people can't view things from a neutral perspective- It's good if it backs up your opinion and its apparently crap if it doesn't.

Perhaps he read the thread on here where the majority wanted him to stay
Perhaps he doesn't hear any Kompany out chants at games to be able to come to that conclusion

I didn't say I agreed with everything he said, or supported everything he said, I just that it was a more balanced article than version one

boyyanno wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 10:57 am

That's not exactly the case.

He might say that in his ending line but if you actually read the content of the article he absolutely speaks for "all fans" for example:

"So I would say (fairly) categorically that despite Burnley being second from bottom of the Premier League, Vincent Kompany has nothing to worry about at the moment as far as supporters are concerned."

It's more balanced but the reality is you like it because it supports how you feel. You don't like the stuff that doesn't.

It's become a real problem on this board where people can't view things from a neutral perspective- It's good if it backs up your opinion and its apparently crap if it doesn't.

I think we can say the same about people generally over the last ten years or so in more or less every aspect of life. Reason and tolerance are old fashioned virtues it seems.

Nori1958 wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 11:18 am

Perhaps he read the thread on here where the majority wanted him to stay
Perhaps he doesn't hear any Kompany out chants at games to be able to come to that conclusion

I didn't say I agreed with everything he said, or supported everything he said, I just that it was a more balanced article than version one

Well hang on a second. You actually said he doesn't claim to speak for all fans when I've quoted a passage that clearly shows he does.

Now you've seen that you say yeah he does but maybe it's for x reason.

Yet this was exactly what you had an issue with the other person who wrote an article doing. So it can only be concluded that you rubbished the other because you didn't like the content. You've no issue with Boden presenting content in a similar way as long as you agree with the sentiment.

elwaclaret wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 11:26 am

I think we can say the same about people generally over the last ten years or so in more or less every aspect of life. Reason and tolerance are old fashioned virtues it seems.

I agree. I thought the same thing on the Kompany quote thread the other day.

I think it's perfectly fine to say you learn more from tough times than good. Yet a load of people that hate Kompany were saying it was a ridiculous statement.

I don't hate Kompany, but it's Burnley that I love. A lot of people are too extreme in either support or opposition of the manager where they view everything through that lense.

Whilst I'm not particularly a happy camper at the moment I don't view things through a Vincent Kompany lense like some do, I just try and call things as I see them.

When is version 3 out ?

boyyanno wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 11:28 am

Well hang on a second. You actually said he doesn't claim to speak for all fans when I've quoted a passage that clearly shows he does.

Now you've seen that you say yeah he does but maybe it's for x reason.

Yet this was exactly what you had an issue with the other person who wrote an article doing. So it can only be concluded that you rubbished the other because you didn't like the content. You've no issue with Boden presenting content in a similar way as long as you agree with the sentiment.

He said that Kompany had nothing to worry about from supporters.... He didn't say All supporters, and accepted that quite clearly

I don't have a clue why you've brought Boden into the argument, but if you knew anything about what I've previously posted I disagree with his views, and have no time for the podcast he appears on.... Stop trying to make out you know what iam thinking

Fair enough comments. My only personal gripes are obviously our league position but possibly worse is the lack of clarity from the owners and management. This whole season has been so frustrating and difficult for fans to comprehend especially after last season. We have gone from a professional well run club to an apparent shambles in all departments. Is it simply that we do not have the personnel to compete at the highest level ? Who knows ? Well certainly the fans have no idea how the club has gone from hero to zero in such a short time and that I think is the most worrying thing of all. I for one are looking forward to next next season with a certain amount of trepidation

boyyanno wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 11:30 am

I agree. I thought the same thing on the Kompany quote thread the other day.

I think it's perfectly fine to say you learn more from tough times than good. Yet a load of people that hate Kompany were saying it was a ridiculous statement.

I don't hate Kompany, but it's Burnley that I love. A lot of people are too extreme in either support or opposition of the manager where they view everything through that lense.

Whilst I'm not particularly a happy camper at the moment I don't view things through a Vincent Kompany lense like some do, I just try and call things as I see them.

I’m of the belief that the club generally got carried away after last seasons success and expected they had done enough to keep us up while we built. Obviously that has not happened. As one of the ones calling for Heart to be dropped, I can fully understand fans frustration in wanting a keeper who bosses the defence and owns his area but as usual people are going too far. I have come to the conclusion VK believes Trafford has the chin to take the vitriol and use it in the summer to toughen/tighten up the all too obvious deficiencies this season.

Nori1958 wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 11:40 am

He said that Kompany had nothing to worry about from supporters.... He didn't say All supporters, and accepted that quite clearly

I don't have a clue why you've brought Boden into the argument, but if you knew anything about what I've previously posted I disagree with his views, and have no time for the podcast he appears on.... Stop trying to make out you know what iam thinking

I didn't mean Boden, I meant Livesay in the article above.

I've quoted you the passage that shows what he said above.

It's quite clear you've got double standards dependant on wether you like the content- I don't understand why you can't admit it.

I mean you've already changed positions three times:

It went from: doesn't say he speaks for all fans
To: okay maybe he does but maybe there is a reason
To: No he doesn't specifically say all fans. - Did the other article?

I think you should try and view things from a more neutral perspective Nori. Not everything has to be viewed through the lens of if you like Kompany and this regime or not.

The same goes for the negative guys as I've said above.

boyyanno wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 11:59 am

I didn't mean Boden, I meant Livesay in the article above.

I've quoted you the passage that shows what he said above.

It's quite clear you've got double standards dependant on wether you like the content- I don't understand why you can't admit it.

I mean you've already changed positions three times:

It went from: doesn't say he speaks for all fans
To: okay maybe he does but maybe there is a reason
To: No he doesn't specifically say all fans. - Did the other article?

I think you should try and view things from a more neutral perspective Nori. Not everything has to be viewed through the lens of if you like Kompany and this regime or not.

The same goes for the negative guys as I've said above.

I think you're just arguing for the sake of it

I said it was a more balanced article, which most seem to agree with, have a go at them instead, unless it's just me you have a problem with

I've already said I didn't agree with everything he said,or supported everything he said, yet you're trying to argue I've agreed with everything in the article, when all I actually said was

"100% more balanced than version 1.....and accepts that his views aren't that of ALL Burnley fans"


It was him who said he didn't speak for all supporters in the article

I agree with the article.

I am with this article - the angriest shout the loudest .... no one is happy we have 13 points but I think 80% of fans want him to stay and 19% of the fans that want him to go will quickly change their minds if we are smashing it again 10 games into next season....

that said .... if we are nowhere near 10 games in to next season .... it will be a totally different ball game

Nori1958 wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 11:18 am

Perhaps he read the thread on here where the majority wanted him to stay
Perhaps he doesn't hear any Kompany out chants at games to be able to come to that conclusion

I didn't say I agreed with everything he said, or supported everything he said, I just that it was a more balanced article than version one

The majority of fans might want him to stay (on here anyway) but it's a result based pendulum that will swing to & fro depending on the results & to a degree performances. It wouldn't be highly unexpected nor unusual for us to lose most of our remaining games maybe the odd draw or win & for that majority to become a minority. It's very live & fluid.

I would imagine if you did a vox pop of fans going on the Turf, the vast majority would agree with the article.

Nori1958 wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 12:11 pm

I think you're just arguing for the sake of it

I said it was a more balanced article, which most seem to agree with, have a go at them instead, unless it's just me you have a problem with

I've already said I didn't agree with everything he said,or supported everything he said, yet you're trying to argue I've agreed with everything in the article, when all I actually said was

"100% more balanced than version 1.....and accepts that his views aren't that of ALL Burnley fans"


It was him who said he didn't speak for all supporters in the article

He said it yes, but the passage I quoted is contradictory to that.

I mean I'm not arguing for the sake of it, it's clearly evidenced.

It's the same as me starting a post to you and saying no disrespect, but then disrespecting you.

Anyway forget it you struggle to see anything outside of your own view.

The Shire Claret wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 12:31 pm

I am with this article - the angriest shout the loudest .... no one is happy we have 13 points but I think 80% of fans want him to stay and 19% of the fans that want him to go will quickly change their minds if we are smashing it again 10 games into next season....

that said .... if we are nowhere near 10 games in to next season .... it will be a totally different ball game

It's extremely debatable even if 100% of the fans wanted him out whether it'd be financially possible/viable for that to happen. Push come to shove it probably would with taking more debt on & that seems to be the order of the day to finance anything under the ALK model.

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 1:10 pm

It's extremely debatable even if 100% of the fans wanted him out whether it'd be financially possible/viable for that to happen. Push come to shove it probably would with taking more debt on & that seems to be the order of the day to finance anything under the ALK model.

You have repeated this point on multiple threads despite the fact that you have very little or no understanding of our financial situation.

Some very basic questions for you which you should know the answer to given how many times you have raised this point.

1. How much do you believe our current debt to be and what is it costing to fund that debt ?
2. How much is our current revenue ?
3. How much do you believe our current wage bill is ?
4. What would it cost to get rid of VK and his team ?

As said should be pretty for you to answer given the conclusion you have reached and keep on repeating

Big Vinny K wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 1:38 pm

You have repeated this point on multiple threads despite the fact that you have very little or no understanding of our financial situation.

Some very basic questions for you which you should know the answer to given how many times you have raised this point.

1. How much do you believe our current debt to be and what is it costing to fund that debt ?
2. How much is our current revenue ?
3. How much do you believe our current wage bill is ?
4. What would it cost to get rid of VK and his team ?

As said should be pretty for you to answer given the conclusion you have reached and keep on repeating
3

The last time we traded posts I thought we had come to a gentlemenly agreement not to quote each other to avoid any unpleasantness (post office thread) & it works well for me. The other day you quoted me & I thought you might have took the hint when I ignored but it's clear you are slow on the uptake or deliberately trying to cause trouble. I won't be replying again.

The Shire Claret wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 12:31 pm

I am with this article - the angriest shout the loudest .... no one is happy we have 13 points but I think 80% of fans want him to stay and 19% of the fans that want him to go will quickly change their minds if we are smashing it again 10 games into next season....

that said .... if we are nowhere near 10 games in to next season .... it will be a totally different ball game

Agree with this. I’m firmly in the camp that wants him to stay. However, August-October is a huge 3 months that will tip the scales one way or the other.

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 1:43 pm

The last time we traded posts I thought we had come to a gentlemenly agreement not to quote each other to avoid any unpleasantness (post office thread) & it works well for me. The other day you quoted me & I thought you might have took the hint when I ignored but it's clear you are slow on the uptake or deliberately trying to cause trouble. I won't be replying again.

I have no idea what gentlemen’s agreement you are referring to.
The Post Office thread was just another subject where your comments were as ignorant and ill informed as they usually are (as pointed out by others on that thread).

If you post something then expect to be challenged if people disagree whether it’s by me or someone else. If you don’t like it then simply foe me.

PremierLeagueClass wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 2:00 pm

Agree with this. I’m firmly in the camp that wants him to stay. However, August-October is a huge 3 months that will tip the scales one way or the other.

I don't think many in the Kompany to stay camp, would disagree with that view.

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 1:10 pm

It's extremely debatable even if 100% of the fans wanted him out whether it'd be financially possible/viable for that to happen. Push come to shove it probably would with taking more debt on & that seems to be the order of the day to finance anything under the ALK model.

About 20 times you’ve said we can’t afford to sack him. Roughly, very ball park, how much do you envisage it’d cost us? When’s his contract up? Do you think it’d be cheaper to sack him as a champ manager (another year further into his contract and you’d imagine on a reduced salary )? Don’t you think he’ll be in another role quite quickly and how do you imagine that’d change our outlay?

Have you literally ever heard of a company not being able to financially sack an employee? Me neither

Holtyclaret wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 2:50 pm

About 20 times you’ve said we can’t afford to sack him. Roughly, very ball park, how much do you envisage it’d cost us? When’s his contract up? Do you think it’d be cheaper to sack him as a champ manager (another year further into his contract and you’d imagine on a reduced salary )? Don’t you think he’ll be in another role quite quickly and how do you imagine that’d change our outlay?

Have you literally ever heard of a company not being able to financially sack an employee? Me neither

Football is quite unique with the amounts of money that's exchanged & the nuances of complex contracts that's before we start off with our fragile finances. You haven't heard about it because it's not really the kind of thing that's broadcast publicly. Company takes to street booming on a loud tannoy how they can't afford to sack a certain employee. Yes that's the norm

jakub tying himself in knots episode 617534

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 3:01 pm

Football is quite unique with the amounts of money that's exchanged & the nuances of complex contracts that's before we start off with our fragile finances. You haven't heard about it because it's not really the kind of thing that's broadcast publicly. Company takes to street booming on a loud tannoy how they can't afford to sack a certain employee. Yes that's the norm

Holtyclaret wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 2:50 pm

About 20 times you’ve said we can’t afford to sack him. Roughly, very ball park, how much do you envisage it’d cost us? When’s his contract up? Do you think it’d be cheaper to sack him as a champ manager (another year further into his contract and you’d imagine on a reduced salary )? Don’t you think he’ll be in another role quite quickly and how do you imagine that’d change our outlay?

Have you literally ever heard of a company not being able to financially sack an employee? Me neither

Usually deals are done so they don’t have to pay them up. Wasn’t it Man U who were paying for about five managers at the same time?

What we do know is that it would be very costly to sack him as it was when Sean Dyche was sacked.

"The loudest noise from Burnley fans this season seems to be the sound of heads being scratched."

That's a great line.

ClaretTony wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 5:09 pm

Usually deals are done so they don’t have to pay them up. Wasn’t it Man U who were paying for about five managers at the same time?

What we do know is that it would be very costly to sack him as it was when Sean Dyche was sacked.

Him getting us relegated will massively effect that figure though, I would have thought.

ClaretTony wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 5:09 pm

Usually deals are done so they don’t have to pay them up. Wasn’t it Man U who were paying for about five managers at the same time?

What we do know is that it would be very costly to sack him as it was when Sean Dyche was sacked.

Absolutely, it wouldn’t be cheap but isn’t ’unaffordable‘ by any stretch should the need arise.

Not that I’m expecting it anytime soon.

Burnley1989 wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 5:38 pm

Him getting us relegated will massively effect that figure though, I would have thought.

I don’t believe that’s the case

Burnley1989 wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 5:38 pm

Him getting us relegated will massively effect that figure though, I would have thought.

I don't think Alan Pace has ever considered relegation with Kompany in charge, he didn't think this season was possible.
Sign VK to new contract
Blow budget then




Oooops

bumba wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 5:54 pm

I don't think Alan Pace has ever considered relegation with Kompany in charge, he didn't think this season was possible.
Sign VK to new contract
Blow budget then

I’m going to have to disagree, it’s basic financial management to mitigate and plan for possible and probable events.

Tony can't half talk some b******s but that is a good article.

Holtyclaret wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 5:45 pm

Absolutely, it wouldn’t be cheap but isn’t ’unaffordable‘ by any stretch should the need arise.

Not that I’m expecting it anytime soon.

Not if you keep on borrowing it isn't.

I’m sure I speak for every single Burnley fan when I say that they are both excellent articles in their own way.

jos wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 6:09 pm

I’m going to have to disagree, it’s basic financial management to mitigate and plan for possible and probable events.

Surely we aren't talking about the same Einstein who somehow managed to take a gamble firing a manager who pretty much specialises in tried & trusted methods ensuring teams don't get relegated. That 1 worked out well!