• Everton

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:00 pm**

As the thread title suggests.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:01 pm**

2 points deducted for the latest bout of cheating.

They have still lost less points than originally deducted even with a second punishment. Spineless organisation.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:04 pm**

Operation save Everton kicks into gear.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:05 pm**

but it was all because of Covid

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:06 pm**

Curious they waited till after our game against them, and it looks like they took Luton’s result into consideration too

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:07 pm**

I do like the thought process that it was going to be 4 points but due to them already being punished once this season it would be fairer to just deduct 2 points.

Basically if you are going to cheat there is more reward for doing it more than once.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:14 pm**

How big was that game Saturday now ??

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:14 pm**

So had we beaten them two days ago we would now be just two points behind them

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:16 pm**

I would enjoy seeing them spend their last Goodison season in the Championship.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:19 pm**

Well, if Luton manage to finish ahead of them we may be lucky enough to have one more trip to the Lower Bullens stand again next season. Result!

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:21 pm**

They’re not going down. Rubbish how they’ve got away with it. 8 points is nothing!

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:23 pm**

Pearcey wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:21 pm
They’re not going down. Rubbish how they’ve got away with it. 8 points is nothing!

They might have been going down with an eight points deduction if we had actually been competitive this season.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:25 pm**

Fantastic logic and organisation from the rule makers.

First breach of PSR 10 points deduction but give you 4 back on appeal.

Second breach of of PSR 2 points deduction

Forest first breach of PSR 6 points deduction but 2 points back for cooperation

Honestly making it up as they are going along

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:25 pm**

Jamesy wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:23 pm
They might have been going down with an eight points deduction if we had actually been competitive this season.

Absolutely. They couldn’t have picked a better year could they. Galling.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:26 pm**

Pearcey wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:21 pm
They’re not going down. Rubbish how they’ve got away with it. 8 points is nothing!

For doing it 2 years on the row.

Really hope we can sue them now. Still haven’t heard about that, have we?

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:27 pm**

Jamesy wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:23 pm
They might have been going down with an eight points deduction if we had actually been competitive this season.

Yes, shouldn’t be overlooked by our leadership that we’re only in with an unbelievably outside chance because the two nearest teams above us have had points deducted.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:28 pm**

What a joke this is. Complete random number generation it seems.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:31 pm**

Having the arrogance to appeal 2 points deduction when the accounts don’t like, should be at high risk of having more points for appealing

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:39 pm**

Everton to appeal and May have them taken away
Imo there should be no pints deducted as there is no way City Chelsea Spurs United and others will ever have points deducted.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:39 pm**

So that is made up for by the extra two points we gave them on Saturday. I understand it all now.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:47 pm**

What a catastrophic result that was at Everton Simply catastrophic. But if we can’t survive despite Forest and Everton point deductions we have nobody to blame but ourselves. I do agree that the deduction should have been made before last Saturday. Clearly it was already decided

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:51 pm**

Rick_Muller wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:06 pm
Curious they waited till after our game against them, and it looks like they took Luton’s result into consideration too

Reported last week that Everton had asked that the latest sanction wouldn't be announced until after all their game at w/end.

Forest did the same earlier.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:52 pm**

It's a pointless exercise if 2 points is the outcome

Cheating pays, sadly

What is really frustrating, is that one of the mitigating arguments for the first penalty was that they had taken steps to improve things, as I understand it. But the latest financial suggest they are again going in the wrong direction. So how can only 2 points be logical?

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:55 pm**

This was my take on how the hearing for Everton's second PSR charge would go from March 21 2024 on the MMT - at that point Everton had not published their accounts

Chester Perry wrote: ↑
Thu Mar 21, 2024 2:02 pm
Ok, lets talk Everton

Next week is the believed to be the date set for the Independent Commission to hear the second set of PSR charges against them, this time Everton have followed the Nottingham Forest example - reported themselves and have been very co-operative in pursing a swift hearing.

We now know that a breach of PSR is a 3 point penalty, and that following the Forest approach is worth a 2 point reduction (1 each for self reporting early and being highly co-operative) - so it is expected the penalty would be reduced to 1 point

On top of that is a scale of penalty points for the size of breach - at Forest £34.5m was a 3 point penalty, but so was a £19.5m breach for Everton in their first case (after the appeal process). We do not know by how much Everton have breached or if the commission will accept the argument of double jeopardy/natural justice - Everton believe they have already been punished for 2 of the three years under the cycle - It may be that if the last full financial year have Everton within the threshold they do not get any added penalty and if the last financial year was outside the threshold they get a single point penalty as 2 of the 3 points have been deducted previously.

There is a another issue that I have not seen discussed anywhere and that is the one of being a repeat offender. I believe this should see another penalty, but it being so directly linked to the previous two years may see such consideration waived.

Overall I expect no more than a 2 point penalty (and possibly just the 1 or even none if the last financial year is within the PSR limits/Everton actually made a profit in 2022/23) and an agreement to not pursue an appeal - notice that this hearing will not commence until after we know if Forest has made an appeal, that decision will impact the judgement of the Everton hearing, and the application of a soft penalty to the charges.
.....

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:59 pm**

I'll predict here, with no way of proving one way or the other, that if the bottom three had performed better this season the points deductions would have been at different levels because none of these authorities or commissions want it to define a relegation.

In other words, it is bent. Prediction not fact.

Adding to the bent nature we were relegated last time, with Richarlison avoiding at least 2 bans during his hot streak.

If Forest or Everton go down I would be highly amused but cannot see it. For sure, I am hoping Luton stay up if we do not, because justice is more important than short term advantage for us.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:04 pm**

Fingers in the air, how many points can we deduct from Everton to make sure they stay up? Absolute joke that there is no clear and obvious amount of points to be deducted for breaching PSR rules. The lunatics are running the asylum.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:05 pm**

Largely irrelevant now after the 3 points we handed them on Saturday.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:06 pm**

kentonclaret wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:05 pm
Largely irrelevant now after the 3 points we handed them on Saturday.

It's not just about us though.

Bent is the right word.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:07 pm**

It’s not irrelevant to the fairness of the competition. In fact they should refer it to VAR to ensure we don’t have any more controversy.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:11 pm**

For their 3rd punishment they will gain points not lose them.
EPL is played by cheats & run by cheats.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:13 pm**

Hibsclaret wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:04 pm
Fingers in the air, how many points can we deduct from Everton to make sure they stay up? Absolute joke that there is no clear and obvious amount of points to be deducted for breaching PSR rules. The lunatics are running the asylum.

and yet it was straight forward for me to predict the commissions findings before it sat based on the rulings from the previous commissions judgements and without knowing their previous years financial results

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:16 pm**

taio wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:06 pm
It's not just about us though.

Bent is the right word.

Luton have a home game against Everton on 3rd May.

If we can beat Forest on the final day and Luton can win at home against Fulham who knows what might happen?

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:19 pm**

If I were the Premier League I would be using the press conference given last week by Sean Dyche as a example of the hubris with which Everton were treating the Premier League's wanings about their overspending

from The Guardian

‘Not on my watch’: Sean Dyche hits out at costly Everton mismanagement
Club are facing second points deduction for PSR breaches
‘It wouldn’t have happened on my watch, trust me,’ he says
https://www.theguardian.com/football/20 ... management
https://archive.ph/tzVa8

as I said on the MMT

What is most interesting about what Sean Dyche is saying here, is that the powers that 'were' in Everton (they have either left, abdicated responsibility or died) still wanted to spend money last year when they knew they were already heading for a further breach of the regulations and already huge losses (though they had not been charged for the first time, that came two months later) and had been receiving warnings from the Premier League for around 18 months. they simply didn't believe they would be officially charged and certainly didn't believe they would be given sporting sanctions.

That hubris and the public lies about taking the Premier Leagues warnings and rules seriously (along with their febrile attempts to extend the definition of the rules) should once and for all put an end to the notion that the club has been hard done to by the Premier League and that the Premier League is corrupt in the view of their fans.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:35 pm**

Thank god they didnt get anymore than 2 anymore than that might have had us avoiding relegation from this god awful corupt division.
Thanks guys, roll on next season and competitive football.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:44 pm**

It's a dead league this, not a sport at this level any longer. How can anyone have any interest in a league where cheats are allowed to prosper?

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:44 pm**

Are Forest done and dusted with their own cheating ? or is there more to come ?

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:51 pm**

lets cross to the department which decides the number of points deducted...

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:54 pm**

ClaretTony wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:14 pm
So had we beaten them two days ago we would now be just two points behind them

Such a missed opportunity.. the downside for them would’ve been massive and the momentum for us immense.. not to be sadly

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:54 pm**

AlargeClaret wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:44 pm
Are Forest done and dusted with their own cheating ? or is there more to come ?

They have the appeal and it will be interesting to see how their finances are this season

It is also possible that Everton may have a third set of charges next season if the takeover does not go through - though there are options including the sale of the stadium at Bramley Moore and or Jarred Branthwaite (who they got from Carlisle at the age of 17 for relative pennies, after Jamie Hoyland, who was scouting for Everton at the time, begged and begged them to do it, the recruitment department weren't keen apparently), before period end - their minds are going to be much more focused now it is known that PSR rules have teeth

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:55 pm**

Vincent'sCap wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:35 pm
Thank god they didnt get anymore than 2 anymore than that might have had us avoiding relegation from this god awful corupt division.
Thanks guys, roll on next season and competitive football.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:56 pm**

Vincent'sCap wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:35 pm
Thank god they didnt get anymore than 2 anymore than that might have had us avoiding relegation from this god awful corupt division.
Thanks guys, roll on next season and competitive football.

To do what exactly? Storm the league again…. Great… but it only brings us back to where we’ve come from. What exactly do you want as a Burnley fan?

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 4:03 pm**

Chester Perry references the "public lies about taking the Premier League warnings seriously" and this became abundantly clear when their Operating Loss for the last financial year was published at £89m. Never a chance that they would be within the PSR threshold of £105m.

But it gets worse......I've seen a document which indicates a projected Operating Loss for this current financial year of a further £55m, which on top of the Losses from '22 and '23 of £46m and £89m respectively suggests a rolling three year figure of £190m. Clearly potentially exceeding the threshold this time by a staggering £85m.

So, not only are they not taking the PL warnings seriously, they are simply laughing in the face of the PL......What level of punishment will they consider to be appropriate next time around ?.....If only we had taken points off them last weekend and made it really interesting.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 4:10 pm**

Maybe it’s just me and I have both Forest and Everton mates so maybe it’s that but it wouldn’t quite sit right with me to stay up because of points deductions. Don’t get me wrong I’d take it because I think we’ve had it for a good few years if not decades when we go down but it just doesn’t seem like cricket.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 4:12 pm**

ClaretTony wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 08, 2024 2:14 pm
So had we beaten them two days ago we would now be just two points behind them

Our destiny was in our hands from the moment the season started

And VK just messed up big style

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 4:12 pm**

Cornwallclaret wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:56 pm
To do what exactly? Storm the league again…. Great… but it only brings us back to where we’ve come from. What exactly do you want as a Burnley fan?

Not sure we will be storming the league again with our current squad minus the out of contract departing players?

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 4:14 pm**

quoonbeatz wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 08, 2024 3:44 pm
It's a dead league this, not a sport at this level any longer. How can anyone have any interest in a league where cheats are allowed to prosper?

Sounds like there will be no need for another open top bus tour at the end of next season should we get promoted. Nothing really to celebrate.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 4:19 pm**

If as a lot of people are suggesting there is collusion between the Premier league ,the independent panel and Everton to ensure they are treated in such a way as to ensure they stay up is there some sort of criminality going on or at least enough evidence to suggest a civil case would be successful. I doubt it would help us but Luton might benefit.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 4:27 pm**

It’s shocking really. A second breach and they get 2 points deducted. Surely a second offence would carry a more severe punishment. It’s a joke really. Having said that even the judicial system isn’t much better.

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 4:27 pm**

I would never want a team to get relegated due to points deductions because it’s not the players, staff and fans fault
, however Everton fans are unbearable and for a club to be caught twice they should have bigger punishment

Posted: **Mon Apr 08, 2024 4:34 pm**

they knew exactly what was required of them as a premier league club, but their administrators continually disregarded the rules ALL clubs must adhere to. Its a disgrace, and makes the division appear in a very bad light. Their fans deserve much better from them as well. Total lack of integrity.

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