David Webb (Sunderland) v Swansea City

How to Score
A. Decision Making (including use of advantage) - out of 25
B. Consistency - out of 25
C. Fitness and Positioning - of 25
D. Control and Authority - out of 25


Please only Rate the Ref if you attended the game and only do so, after the game has ended. Thank you

This should be fun.

After the outrageous disallowed goal at WBA we had the luck today with a contentious penalty award
We deserved the win to even up the WBA result
Also Cullen was lucky to not get a second yellow just before half time
Was watching on TV and otherwise a decent performance by the referee

Appalling performance as was fully expected from him, but at least he correctly gave the penalty (eventually).

Decent enough. Could probably go on to be good if he stopped giving away FKs for soft/no contact challenges

From tv he was frustrating and not particularly consistent. Both Cullen and Cullen should have been sent off. I’m slightly biased however I think he got the penalty decision correct. Made a very poor decision when their keeper dropped the ball, another one when their centre half threw himself to the ground and you could argue a slight case for a pen when Estève was pushed in the box. If you consider the contact when their CH was awarded a free kick then there was more in Esteve incident.

10
10
18
10

After today - I love him

A 13
B 10
C 15
D 14

We’ve had far worse.
Got both Cullens wrong but had no view of the contact on Roberts, he was behind the assailant.
Pen was correct. Hit a hand above head height and he wasn’t as long in giving it as some seem to think.

Thought he was poor. The soft free kicks for the full back. Felt there could have been a couple of red cards with our Cullen being one of them.

A - 8
B - 12
C - 18
D - 12

8
8
15
8

Gave absolutely everything against Portsmouth and then today gave nothing for the first hour, before suddenly deciding to blow for every bit of contact in the last half hour.

A. 12
B. 11
C. 17
D. 11

I’m sure he was swapped at half time. Though he was decent for 45 mins then appalling for 45. How he could not see such a clear handball from less than 10 yards away amazes me.

10
10
15
5

A - 10
B - 15
C - 15
D - 10

sjb wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 5:06 pm

Appalling performance as was fully expected from him, but at least he correctly gave the penalty (eventually).

The delay was presumably because he was waiting for advantage. I didn't see any signal from the linesman, though they might have talked to each other.

Continuation of the standard of refereeing at this level. Over again every time a Swansea player fell over it was given as an automatic. Cullen very lucky not to get a second yellow.

A. 14
B. 12
C. 19
D. 14

Nearly as bad as their Howard
Playacting by Swansea was judged to be a foul every time and when Swanseas cb took out his own keeper the ref awarded a foul.Total muppet !

Haven’t seen the game but that’s a really bad decision for the penalty.

A - 10 (penalty was spot on but he didn’t see it and was told in his ear it was a pen)
B - 10 (didn’t favour one side over the other but his decision making was inconsistent)
C - 15 (didn’t feel to be positioned ideally, including for the pen)
D - 12 (too lax on a few things and 4 minutes was terrible at the end, didn’t add on anything for time wasting as there were near 10 subs and a couple of injuries)

Pretty poor ref but eventually guessed and got the main decision right, guy’s hands were so unnatural I though he was hailing a cab.

dsr wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 6:27 pm

The delay was presumably because he was waiting for advantage. I didn't see any signal from the linesman, though they might have talked to each other.

I thought I did see words with the linesman. I may be wrong.

b]p[/b]10
9
15
12.
He didn't even want to give us the penalty.

quoonbeatz wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 8:03 pm

Haven’t seen the game but that’s a really bad decision for the penalty.

From where I sit in the Jimmy Mac upper, the penalty decision was correct.
His hand, as they say, was in an unnatural position.

12
10
18
12

10
10
10
10

I actually didn't think he had a bad game - we have had, and will have, far worse.

A - 15
B - 15
C - 20
D - 15

quoonbeatz wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 8:03 pm

Haven’t seen the game but that’s a really bad decision for the penalty.

Not really.

Juan Tanamera wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 9:24 pm

From where I sit in the Jimmy Mac upper, the penalty decision was correct.
His hand, as they say, was in an unnatural position.

It’s headed on to his hand from point blank range, which is one of the mitigating factors refs are meant to use.

We’d be fuming if that was given against us. Do we really want penalties given for point blank contact when the player knows nothing about it?

quoonbeatz wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 10:20 pm

It’s headed on to his hand from point blank range, which is one of the mitigating factors refs are meant to use.

We’d be fuming if that was given against us. Do we really want penalties given for point blank contact when the player knows nothing about it?

When you have your arm stretched up high you always run the risk of conceding a penalty in those situations.

Targetman wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 10:30 pm

When you have your arm stretched up high you always run the risk of conceding a penalty in those situations.

Yes, you run the risk of a referee making a bad decision, of course. His arm is hardly stretched up like he was waiting to bat the ball away though is it, he’s in a melee of players and knew nothing about it. The fact that the ref took about 10 mins to give it shows he had no idea either.

quoonbeatz wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 10:36 pm

Yes, you run the risk of a referee making a bad decision, of course. His arm is hardly stretched up like he was waiting to bat the ball away though is it, he’s in a melee of players and knew nothing about it. The fact that the ref took about 10 mins to give it shows he had no idea either.

His arm is high, well above his head, you cant do that in your own penalty area, if you do then more often than not a penalty will be given.
Thats the risk you run.

quoonbeatz wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 8:03 pm

Haven’t seen the game but that’s a really bad decision for the penalty.

I would suggest you read the rules

Handball when a player has
"made their body unnaturally bigger. A player is considered to have made their body unnaturally bigger when the position of their hand/arm is not a consequence of, or justifiable by, the player’s body movement for that specific situation. By having their hand/arm in such a position, the player takes a risk of their hand/arm being hit by the ball and being penalised"

As has been posted, the definition of a handball these days, and I’d be fuming at our own player for being so stupid if it was the other way round.

It’s a penalty by definition. His arm was clearly raised, nobody else seemed to have their arm raised in the photo. The decision was one of the few he got right in the second half.

dsr wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 6:27 pm

The delay was presumably because he was waiting for advantage. I didn't see any signal from the linesman, though they might have talked to each other.

I thought this too. I believe he was seeing if we scored as looked highly likely before he stopped the play for the penalty.

Roosterbooster wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 11, 2024 7:59 am

I would suggest you read the rules

Handball when a player has
"made their body unnaturally bigger. A player is considered to have made their body unnaturally bigger when the position of their hand/arm is not a consequence of, or justifiable by, the player’s body movement for that specific situation. By having their hand/arm in such a position, the player takes a risk of their hand/arm being hit by the ball and being penalised"

I know the law, thanks. I suggest you read the guidance around mitigating factors, one of which is proximity and you can’t get any closer than Jay and their player were.

There was an incident in the last few weeks, think it was in the PL, where a deep cross came in and a defender misjudged the flight of the ball and practically caught it on their forearm, unchallenged. Totally accidental but there’s no mitigation there and that should be a penalty.

Here, yes his arm is up but he’s looking at the ball, jostling with two players next to him, one of whom heads the ball against his hand from point blank range. It’s not like his arm is up for ages waiting to smash the ball away. It’s another referee who might well have learned the letter of the law but doesn’t understand the game.

Juan Tanamera wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 11, 2024 8:00 am

Screenshot_20241111-075642.png

As ever, watch it at full speed and not a still frame.

The raised arm is the fatal flaws in your argument, Quoonbeatz. The arm was the risk taken to try and get extra height. It then becomes fatal if hit by the ball.

Penalty without a doubt. Seen in the instant by several Burnley players, in the box and the referee.

quoonbeatz wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 11, 2024 8:55 am

As ever, watch it at full speed and not a still frame.

I watched it live, directly in line from the Jimmy Mac upper and my immediate thoughts was penalty and different views, different video shows have done nothing to change my mind.

quoonbeatz wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 10, 2024 10:20 pm

It’s headed on to his hand from point blank range, which is one of the mitigating factors refs are meant to use.

We’d be fuming if that was given against us. Do we really want penalties given for point blank contact when the player knows nothing about it?

No problem with that, apart from - why is his hand up there?

Happy to concede 0-0 to the Swans but we would need 1-0 for WBA game
For once we have had our just rewards

quoonbeatz wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 11, 2024 8:54 am

I suggest you read the guidance around mitigating factors

Do you have a copy? I'd like to read them again

The arm was raised. The ref clearly saw it. Probably asked his lino to confirm who's arm it was. Gave the penalty - would have been a FK if us. End of.

Why anyone is arguing this, we'll never know.

https://www.thefa.com/football-rules-go ... misconduct

The handball Law used to be more sensible - was the player interfering with play 'in the opinion of the referee'. Of course now we have to be more exact to get 'consistency' but it makes things unfair.

Remember the penalty at Spurs when it hit Barnes's arm in our relegation season, 2021-22 - see from 0.30:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zk4gwMaL5Y8