Probably going to upset the experts but after a trip to New York I have completely changed my mind over American brewed beer .
My favourite which I drink here whenever I get the chance is shipyard ale ,no doubt lots more american ales are now being sold in our pubs which maybe people on here can recommend.
Also give a big thumbs up for the new york pubs, lots of choice and very busy!

Some great pubs in New York. We went in Feb this year and found 3 or 4 excellent pubs

If I ever have to go on the low alcohol I try to get Shipyard, it's got a good flavour.

Love a Brooklyn Lager

Poulton-le-Claret wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 19, 2024 8:40 pm

Love a Brooklyn Lager

I'm into IPAs and craft beer. I rarely drink lager, however, Brooklyn is decent enough and inexpensive for what you get - a tasty drink.

I made the mistake of trying a shipyard ale…

It tasted like what I’d imagine fizzy, weak, grapefruit juice would taste like.

Each to their own tho…

Rivington Brewery ‘Never known fog like it’ is a cracking New England pale ale.

BurnleyFC wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 19, 2024 9:11 pm

Rivington Brewery ‘Never known fog like it’ is a cracking New England pale ale.

Will give that a go. Love a New England pale.

I wish we had some IPA’s and Pales on the Turf

Poulton-le-Claret wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 19, 2024 8:40 pm

Love a Brooklyn Lager

My love.

But now you can't find it for love nor money in the UK. First they brewed it in Liverpool instead of Brooklyn and now they've got rid of it altogether for that god awful Pilsner.

Sam Adams is still one of my favourite breweries. The taproom in Boston is definitely my happy place

Craft - another word for fruit-flavoured and overpriced.

It’s been the death knell for brewers of real ale - they have nearly all had to adapt and add the word ‘craft’ to their marketing and add fruit flavours, pretty much like every baker has to use the word ‘artisan’ to sell bread.

American micro breweries are outstanding but have no connection to craft ales.

Brooklyn lager used to be great till they stopped brewing it at Brooklyn Brewery about 5 years ago.

I remember supping it at Kent St ale house (other side of the road to Brooklyn Brewery) and thinking it tasted off. Then one of the brewers who was drinking there explained they’d subbed it out to someone upstate.

Tasted awful.

My favourite on that side of the pond is Sleemans honey brown Lager, which is from Toronto.

I've come back from good trips convinced the local beer is great and it's more likely the positive experience is the most important factor in that judgement. As good a reason as any I suppose. Shipyard is OK for me.

LincsWoldsClaret wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 19, 2024 11:04 pm

Craft - another word for fruit-flavoured and overpriced.

It’s been the death knell for brewers of real ale - they have nearly all had to adapt and add the word ‘craft’ to their marketing and add fruit flavours, pretty much like every baker has to use the word ‘artisan’ to sell bread.

American micro breweries are outstanding but have no connection to craft ales.

If you are going to criticise craft beer, at least do a bit of research prior to posting. You are just demonstrating your serious lack of subject matter with your above post.

LincsWoldsClaret wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 19, 2024 11:04 pm

Craft - another word for fruit-flavoured and overpriced.

It’s been the death knell for brewers of real ale - they have nearly all had to adapt and add the word ‘craft’ to their marketing and add fruit flavours, pretty much like every baker has to use the word ‘artisan’ to sell bread.

American micro breweries are outstanding but have no connection to craft ales.

That's not entirely true. Take Pomona Island or Cloud water as an example. They do an unbelievable range of barrel aged stouts every year that are superb. No fruit in sight.

I do agree the term craft doesn't really equate to much, but it doesn't equate to fruit being put in a pint. It's generally different hops bring used to alter the flavour profile.

Indeed one of the most popular real ales in the north west from experience is the ubiquitous Titanic Plum Porter which does have plums in (I can't stand it either, much prefer their Captain Smith)

Similarly find it odd that people say they won't drink lager, yet rave about German beer, which has for the most part is what is known as lager in the UK.

LincsWoldsClaret wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 19, 2024 11:04 pm

Craft - another word for fruit-flavoured and overpriced.

It’s been the death knell for brewers of real ale - they have nearly all had to adapt and add the word ‘craft’ to their marketing and add fruit flavours, pretty much like every baker has to use the word ‘artisan’ to sell bread.

American micro breweries are outstanding but have no connection to craft ales.

If a product is really good, it rarely needs to adapt for anybody. Perhaps they've just realised there's a much bigger market

Burnley1989 wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 20, 2024 7:23 am

If a product is really good, it rarely needs to adapt for anybody. Perhaps they've just realised there's a much bigger market

Exactly, it's opened up the market to a whole range of other people, and the choice nowadays is superb. No longer is it a choice between John Smith's, Carling, or Strongbow.

For me, good beer is good beer. I've had some superb real ales over the years that would be in my top 5 of all time (I'm looking at you Ginger Marble). Similarly I've had some absolute swill.

I personally like lots of different styles depending on the situation. From a clear Helles to a New England DIPA that is like soup. In winter I love an imperial stout, but you also can't beat a pint of cask bitter in front of a fire in a proper pub.

Jamesy wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 20, 2024 7:19 am

If you are going to criticise craft beer, at least do a bit of research prior to posting. You are just demonstrating your serious lack of subject matter with your above post.

Your level of research is clear - you’ve managed to say nothing other than you disagree. Which is fine but it would have been useful to say what that is based on. Never mind.

The best beer is the beer you like best ( to much beer snobbery) that said John Smith is p1ss in a glass.

bfcjg wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 20, 2024 8:39 am

The best beer is the beer you like best ( to much beer snobbery) that said John Smith is p1ss in a glass.

Precisely, personal tastes vary so much, I cannot stand Lambics or sours, but they are very popular.

tarkys_ears wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 19, 2024 11:00 pm

My love.

But now you can't find it for love nor money in the UK. First they brewed it in Liverpool instead of Brooklyn and now they've got rid of it altogether for that god awful Pilsner.

Sam Adams is still one of my favourite breweries. The taproom in Boston is definitely my happy place

Yeah that Pilsner is strange, no real flavour to it at all. I assume it is cheaper for them to make and sell?

Good shout on Sam Adams! I haven't had one of them in a long while, will be on the look out for one now

In the US I like the "Blue Moon" which can best be described as a German style weiss beer. It's one of the few beers that tastes just as good on tap as it does straight out of the bottle. Not keen on "Shipyard." I've done the "Sam Adams" brewery tour in Boston which is well worth a visit. There's a tasting session at the end and you can easily lose a day of your life there.

LincsWoldsClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 20, 2024 8:36 am

Your level of research is clear - you’ve managed to say nothing other than you disagree. Which is fine but it would have been useful to say what that is based on. Never mind.

Well I should have simply said you were talking out of your arse making a sweeping statement like that but I was trying to be polite.
Never mind.

LincsWoldsClaret wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 19, 2024 11:04 pm

Craft - another word for fruit-flavoured and overpriced.

It’s been the death knell for brewers of real ale - they have nearly all had to adapt and add the word ‘craft’ to their marketing and add fruit flavours, pretty much like every baker has to use the word ‘artisan’ to sell bread.

American micro breweries are outstanding but have no connection to craft ales.

Who's to blame? The brewers for brewing it or the drinkers for drinking it? Seems strange to have a go at breweries for je crime producing drinks that are popular.

Herts Clarets wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 19, 2024 8:31 pm

Some great pubs in New York. We went in Feb this year and found 3 or 4 excellent pubs

Jimmy's Corner was the best place I went. Never been there before, ordered drinks at the bar and was made to feel like a regular in his local pub. Beer was good and well priced for the location in Manhattan.

ChrisG wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 20, 2024 8:40 am

Precisely, personal tastes vary so much, I cannot stand Lambics or sours, but they are very popular.

I agree. What frustrates me is that so few places accommodate for these different tastes.

If you walk in to a bakery, you can get pies, pasties and rolls with every possible different type of filling. Walk in to most bars/pubs and you get a selection of awful lagers that all taste the same. It’s their main/only product and they bring so little variety.

It’s often the same for wines - red, white or rose is your choice - yet they’ll have a million spirits on offer and every Rekorderlig and Kopparberg variant going. It makes no sense to me.

You might get lucky and find Neck Oil on tap or a bottle of Brewdog in the fridge, but ask for a NEIPA in a bar and they’d look at you like you’d shat on the floor! Because the offering differs so much from what I choose to drink at home, I mainly don’t go now, which is a shame.

I’m sure it’s all down to margin and the fact the craft ale producers can only supply at a high price which probably makes them too expensive to create demand. Maybe everyone on this thread are beer snobs and have more money than sense, or maybe we’re in a massive minority and the market for more premium beers is really small, but personally I would rather spend double on one great pint than buy two crap lagers.

TheFamilyCat wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 20, 2024 9:31 am

Who's to blame? The brewers for brewing it or the drinkers for drinking it? Seems strange to have a go at breweries for je crime producing drinks that are popular.

That’s a good question. I’m not having a go at the breweries, they’re doing what they have to survive. Unfortunately, it reduces the range of real ales in favour of “craft” ales , if that’s what people want then fair enough.

Jamesy wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 20, 2024 9:28 am

Well I should have simply said you were talking out of your arse making a sweeping statement like that but I was trying to be polite.
Never mind.

Thanks for contribution to the discussion and look forward to learning more from your expertise.

TheFamilyCat wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 20, 2024 9:31 am

Who's to blame? The brewers for brewing it or the drinkers for drinking it? Seems strange to have a go at breweries for je crime producing drinks that are popular.

This was part of my point in the post above, the mass-produced lagers must be popular else they wouldn’t survive. But I have now stopped going anywhere that doesn’t sell a decent beer.

For example, I’ll go down to the Christmas markets but only ever go for the a drink in the one that sells Salt Jute beer because the supposed German pilsner stuff the others sell isn’t the best.

LincsWoldsClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 20, 2024 10:15 am

Thanks for contribution to the discussion and look forward to learning more from your expertise.

I wouldn’t waste my time trying to impart my knowledge of craft beer onto you, as judging by your original post and sweeping statement you have already formed your opinions on it. I will reserve my expertise for people who have an open mind about craft beer.

Can anyone reccomend any decent lagers from smaller breweries that you'd be unlikely to find in supermarkets or many pubs?

Tried lagers by Yonder and Drop Project breweries recently that were both very good.

JohnDearyMe wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 20, 2024 1:10 pm

Can anyone reccomend any decent lagers from smaller breweries that you'd be unlikely to find in supermarkets or many pubs?

Tried lagers by Yonder and Drop Project breweries recently that were both very good.

From British breweries:

Cloudwater Piccadilly Pilsner
Pomona Island Tannhauser Gate
Lost and Grounded Keller Pils

Booths do a decent range of German stuff from the big 6 from Munich which is generally decent. Also Tegernseer Helles is ace

NewClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 20, 2024 10:04 am

I agree. What frustrates me is that so few places accommodate for these different tastes.

If you walk in to a bakery, you can get pies, pasties and rolls with every possible different type of filling. Walk in to most bars/pubs and you get a selection of awful lagers that all taste the same. It’s their main/only product and they bring so little variety.

It’s often the same for wines - red, white or rose is your choice - yet they’ll have a million spirits on offer and every Rekorderlig and Kopparberg variant going. It makes no sense to me.

You might get lucky and find Neck Oil on tap or a bottle of Brewdog in the fridge, but ask for a NEIPA in a bar and they’d look at you like you’d shat on the floor! Because the offering differs so much from what I choose to drink at home, I mainly don’t go now, which is a shame.

I’m sure it’s all down to margin and the fact the craft ale producers can only supply at a high price which probably makes them too expensive to create demand. Maybe everyone on this thread are beer snobs and have more money than sense, or maybe we’re in a massive minority and the market for more premium beers is really small, but personally I would rather spend double on one great pint than buy two crap lagers.

Yeah I'd rather buy fewer better quality drinks as a general rule. I've spend what some would say are silly money on a third of a pint of an impy stout, but it was wine strength, and actually cheaper than a glass of the same volume of wine.

Lived near Manchester for a good few years before moving overseas, so was spoilt for choice with variety of beer.

ChrisG wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 20, 2024 1:25 pm

Yeah I'd rather buy fewer better quality drinks as a general rule. I've spend what some would say are silly money on a third of a pint of an impy stout, but it was wine strength, and actually cheaper than a glass of the same volume of wine.

Lived near Manchester for a good few years before moving overseas, so was spoilt for choice with variety of beer.

It’s definitely more readily available in Manchester than in Burnley/Lancashire, unfortunately. Which to some extent explains the pub closures in my opinion.

I can't believe Carling still exists.

Who drinks that stuff?

There’s loads of places in clitheroe that sell decent beer now

My current supermarket favourite is Northern Monk - Faith in Futures, which I get from Morrisons in Nelson

Although I defended craft beer and it is my preference these days, this selection in Sainsbury's is ludicrous.

Does anyone really want peanut butter or jam doughnut flavour beer?

TheFamilyCat wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 20, 2024 10:17 pm

Although I defended craft beer and it is my preference these days, this selection in Sainsbury's is ludicrous.

Does anyone really want peanut butter or jam doughnut flavour beer?


Screenshot_20241120_221530_Gallery.jpg

Some of those are surprisingly good.

I had a chicken gravy flavoured ale once. That wasn’t great.

Neck Oil, Gamma Ray, etc - Beavertown used to do some excellent beers, then they were bought out by Heineken. I'm not being at all prissy regarding large beer corps either. Camden Town was taken over by InBev nearly 10 years ago, but the change hasn't been as stark, at least to my palate.

JohnDearyMe wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 20, 2024 1:10 pm

Can anyone reccomend any decent lagers from smaller breweries that you'd be unlikely to find in supermarkets or many pubs?

Tried lagers by Yonder and Drop Project breweries recently that were both very good.

NZ Pilsner by Lakes Brew Co is excellent (in my opinion, anyway!)

LincsWoldsClaret wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 19, 2024 11:04 pm

Craft - another word for fruit-flavoured and overpriced.

It’s been the death knell for brewers of real ale - they have nearly all had to adapt and add the word ‘craft’ to their marketing and add fruit flavours, pretty much like every baker has to use the word ‘artisan’ to sell bread.

American micro breweries are outstanding but have no connection to craft ales.

I'm not sure this is the case. It probably depends where you go drinking. There's loads of real ale taps and pubs around these days. There's also trendier and more pretentious bars in big towns, cities and tourist hot spots with more of a focus on craft ales. Unfortunately in East Lancashire we still have too many pubs with a focus on Carling, Fosters and John Smiths. Like it or not, that's just supply and demand though.

I think the biggest problem the market has is the major breweries flooding the market with their own cheap versions of quality lagers and beers. That 'Spanish' lager Madri being a perfect example brewed by Coors in Tadcaster.

rosswallacefreekick wrote: ↑

Thu Nov 21, 2024 9:41 am

NZ Pilsner by Lakes Brew Co is excellent (in my opinion, anyway!)

Thanks to you and ChrisG. I will try and check those out.

ChorltonCharlie wrote: ↑

Thu Nov 21, 2024 9:51 am

I think the biggest problem the market has is the major breweries flooding the market with their own cheap versions of quality lagers and beers. That 'Spanish' lager Madri being a perfect example brewed by Coors in Tadcaster.

Moretti is brewed in Manchester by Heineken.

tarkys_ears wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 19, 2024 11:00 pm

My love.

But now you can't find it for love nor money in the UK. First they brewed it in Liverpool instead of Brooklyn and now they've got rid of it altogether for that god awful Pilsner.

Sam Adams is still one of my favourite breweries. The taproom in Boston is definitely my happy place

It's certainly available in London, can't speak for anywhere else though.

Another one bites the dust. Carlsberg took over Marston's back in July, so this is hardly news, but what is news is the decimation of their 'repertoire'.

The confirmed list of beers that will no longer be available is:

Banks’s Mild
Banks’s Sunbeam
Bombardier
Eagle IPA
Jenning Cumberland Ale
Mansfield Dark Smooth
Mansfield Original Bitter
Marston’s Old Empire
Marston’s 61 Deep
Ringwood Boondoggle
Ringwood Old Thumper

Looks like the hop industry is now under threat , it won't impact the champagne socialists though. Nothing against importing American hops etc but British beer should have a virtually zero food mileage carbon footprint and our hops are quite distinctive.
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/british-beer- ... 36481.html

bfcjg wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 26, 2024 5:52 pm

Looks like the hop industry is now under threat , it won't impact the champagne socialists though. Nothing against importing American hops etc but British beer should have a virtually zero food mileage carbon footprint and our hops are quite distinctive.
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/british-beer- ... 36481.html

Surprise surprise the Tory mouthpiece The Telegraph is running scare stories against the recent IHT changes.

I would bet my mortgage there will be no problems sourcing British hops because of this.

I think it is the NFU and farmers stating its under threat, the newspaper is just reporting it. It's not political It's a worry that British beer as we know it is under threat.

Craft should be quite cheap

ChrisG wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 20, 2024 1:20 pm

From British breweries:

Cloudwater Piccadilly Pilsner
Pomona Island Tannhauser Gate
Lost and Grounded Keller Pils

Booths do a decent range of German stuff from the big 6 from Munich which is generally decent. Also Tegernseer Helles is ace

Just tried the Piccadilly Pilsner and thought it was great. Thanks for the tip