No, not a rumours thread

My question is this. If promoted, do you think we have a bigger job in terms of rebuilding the team for the premier league, Or do you think should we stop in this division, we have a bigger rebuild on next window.

Think whatever division we are in will see a lot of changes.

Promotion-
Sees us need to add a lot of quality to the group with a decent outlay already commited on obligations to buy.
But may give us a chance at retaining Brownhill and CJ.
Hopefully sees us retain most of our valued assets i.e Steve, although this could limit spending.
Will likely want to clear out a lot of the current Loanees and fringe squad players

Relegation-
Should imagine that a lot of the loans will not return. I can't see us making the outlays for Flemming, Humphreys, Edwards, Anthony or Sarmiento ect and they may not want to come with offers elsewhere.
In a position where the assets such as Steve, Traff ect are flogged in order to generate some funds to replace positions within the team.
Likely lose both CJ and Brownhill on frees.
Likely to utilise the loan market again.
Have players on loan ourselves we can utilise.

Part of me thinks we have a bigger rebuild job in on should we stay down. I think we start to enter the merry go round of sell and invest less. Slowly reducing the quality year on year.
There could likely be 3-4 first team players move on between transfer fees and free contracts and 3-5 Loanees (that at a minimum 4 are considered first team players) all leaving the club.
That's potentially 6-9 first team players that won't be here next year.
I know we have loans that will come back such as Delacroix but it feels a big task.

The prem is a massive task in itself and a complete other animal in terms of everything. But ultimately we'd likely retain most of the squad and be able to build off an extremely solid defensive unit and Edwards and even Anthony going forwards. We need to add quality and to balance the spend with the commitment for the Loanees, but it feels less of a rebuild and more terms of adding the quality to the mix.

What do you think?

CJ goes to tribunal I think it was said. And as he’s part of this “wonder defence” I could see the outcome being relatively decent. Counting against us would be that we sent him to Hibs and PSV reserves so we can’t really claim to have had a lot of faith in him previously which would affect our development fee.

Citzens: If you know somebody who doesn't believe in global warming just show them this thread.

It's unseasonably early and getting worse each year.

*smiley face*

If promoted I’d like to see the entire team minus departures kept together. The value of already instilled teamwork is much underrated in my opinion. And we’ve seen that you can easily spunk £100 mill and STILL get relegated because you have to start gelling again. Just bank the money and only replace those that aren’t here

Rowls wrote: ↑

Mon Feb 24, 2025 8:42 pm

Citzens: If you know somebody who doesn't believe in global warming just show them this thread.

It's unseasonably early and getting worse each year.

*smiley face*

Was 26c here yesterday Rowls I even went out and planted seed in the garden. Unseasonably warm even for us

Relegation?

Well isn't the Fleming deal an obligation so we would be signing him anyway regardless of the out ome.

I would like us to have a bit more faith in the team if we do get promoted. Couple of good additions may be enough if we can incorporate well and keep the team spirit.

We’d need massive upgrades In midfield and attack to survive

IF promoted, our 3 main outlays should be:

- New right back that can also cover centre half too to add some physicality to back 4
- an upgraded Josh Laurent type with premier league quality on the ball
- a relatively large investment in a striker who runs in behind and is also a physical presence. Ivan Toney type without the £500k a week wages

We may also need to creatively replace Trafford assuming he was to go for close to or his City recall clause.

Not being promoted seems a much bigger task

OssyClaret wrote: ↑

Tue Feb 25, 2025 7:09 am

IF promoted, our 3 main outlays should be:

- New right back that can also cover centre half too to add some physicality to back 4
- an upgraded Josh Laurent type with premier league quality on the ball
- a relatively large investment in a striker who runs in behind and is also a physical presence. Ivan Toney type without the £500k a week wages

We may also need to creatively replace Trafford assuming he was to go for close to or his City recall clause.

Not being promoted seems a much bigger task

And that assumes we don't lose Esteve and Egan-Riley.

we don't want to go down that road when Kompany was here just discarding most of the team that got us promoted and putting new faces straight in was the wrong way to do things..

25m each on 4 players

1 left back
1 CM
1 left winger (assuming we keep Edwards)
1 striker

Hard to call with no clue which OOC players might stay. Probably more if we go up. We would still be an attraction for some possible signings if we stayed down. As we’ve never finished worse than 23rd in 10 years and that would be if we finished third this time.

Think we’ve got some work to do in the summer if we go up.

We need a right back and left back.

2 midfielders, a younger version of Shelvey a Brownhill replacement.

Two good replacements for Anthony and Sarmiento

2 strikers, one to start and an understudy.

Sprinkle in a few youth signings, ones for the future in the Koleosho, Oderbert and Trafford type, but don’t throw them under the bus.

We’ll probably lose Redmond, Roberts, Ekdal, Brownhill, Shelvey, Barnes, Green, Tresor, Obafemi, Messengo and a couple more, if not permanently at least on loan.

Fans will freak out at the thought of this many transfers again, I think it’s just the norm now for clubs like us, we are still in transition and have to roll the dice to a degree.

We have a very young squad that will benefit from keeping together. Too many changes as under VK, undermines the team as well as many of the players. Holding onto our players, especially CJER and Traff would be a top priority for me.
On the wish list would still be a goal poacher, who can turn up in places defenders least expect. Rory Delap type, who's having a very good season, and a player I didn't rate at Stoke, don't think he'll be available, but someone in his mould.
We won't have the strength or talent to put teams under lots of pressure, so we need players who know how to play on the break quickly.

Colburn_Claret wrote: ↑

Tue Feb 25, 2025 11:15 am

We have a very young squad that will benefit from keeping together. Too many changes as under VK, undermines the team as well as many of the players. Holding onto our players, especially CJER and Traff would be a top priority for me.
On the wish list would still be a goal poacher, who can turn up in places defenders least expect. Rory Delap type, who's having a very good season, and a player I didn't rate at Stoke, don't think he'll be available, but someone in his mould.
We won't have the strength or talent to put teams under lots of pressure, so we need players who know how to play on the break quickly.

I'd add, keep Esteve.

Quicknick wrote: ↑

Tue Feb 25, 2025 11:21 am

I'd add, keep Esteve.

I never mentioned Steve because I thought he was contracted to us, and selling him would be the height of madness. I don't think he'll be going anywhere. CJ and Traff on the other hand are huge concerns.

Given our unbelievable defensive record, albeit in the Championship, does anyone seriously think that we will keep hold of CJ, Trafford or especially Esteve even if we are promoted? The money clubs will offer ridiculous amounts for them that the club couldn’t refuse, even if they don’t actually need them. They will do this, as usual, just to make sure nobody else gets them. The major problem with the PL, as everyone knows, is the money, there is simply too much of it in the hands of the few. When Newcastle stole Chris Wood they didn’t need him, they just bought him to stop him scoring for us because they were in the same relegation battle at the time.
Whatever happens to us this season we will lose our best players, including Esteve, the best centre back in the Championship by a country mile. It has always been the case to a degree but now more than ever. I hope I’m wrong but I don’t believe I will be alas.

houseboy wrote: ↑

Tue Feb 25, 2025 11:28 am

Given our unbelievable defensive record, albeit in the Championship, does anyone seriously think that we will keep hold of CJ, Trafford or especially Esteve even if we are promoted? The money clubs will offer ridiculous amounts for them that the club couldn’t refuse, even if they don’t actually need them. They will do this, as usual, just to make sure nobody else gets them. The major problem with the PL, as everyone knows, is the money, there is simply too much of it in the hands of the few. When Newcastle stole Chris Wood they didn’t need him, they just bought him to stop him scoring for us because they were in the same relegation battle at the time.
Whatever happens to us this season we will lose our best players, including Esteve, the best centre back in the Championship by a country mile. It has always been the case to a degree but now more than ever. I hope I’m wrong but I don’t believe I will be alas.

I think there's a chance of keeping those three if we go up, but we'll have to pay them. They'll know they'll play. Go elsewhere they may not.

I think Esteve goes regardless and possibly Trafford too. To be honest I think it would be the perfect time to sell Trafford, he will be at peak value with the risk of that diminishing again after a season shipping goals left right and centre for us.

If we sold both, got a solid keeper on the cheap (Ramsdale maybe), then we could have 60 million to use on the squad before we even touch the PL money which would be quite a healthy position.

2 centre backs 3 centre mids, a full back for each side and a striker would be the absolute bare minimum to give us any chance. So realistically we'd have to spend at least 100 million again.

I'm not that fussed about surviving although it would be nice. Make a couple of additions to what we have including keeping the loans.

Add a forward a LB and another CM. Keep the rest for security in case of relegation so we can build on those we keep, plus we have money for those we sell and look to come back up again even stronger.

Dor Turgeman a 21 year old Israeli striker.

https://the4thofficial.net/2025/03/rang ... e-gers-do/

CR7 on a short term deal. Just so I can have his name on a Burnley shirt for my summer holiday.

Given the Chairman's experience of what happens when you change an entire squad, i would hope that as many of the squad, who have played consistently together, will be retained. We may lose loans. That would be hard enough. Additions to a core must be tge way forward. You cannot 'lise' 10 games, while the squad get to know each other's name and which foot they prefer!

Steve wants Premier league football so will stay
Traff goes we have a pick of decent keepers.Palmer ex WBA would be a good shout or Ashley Barnes mate at Luton.

I’d be going for the keeper at Stoke.

Personally think Traff will stay if we go up, unless offered a guaranteed number one slot elsewhere. Still feel he’s set to end up back at City and he needs more experience to be their number one.

If he goes though, imagine we’ll have scouted the whole of the world for the next up-and-coming ball playing keeper.

Amdouni seems to be doing pretty well at Benfica, who apparently have an option to sign him. Suspect that would be best for all concerned if we can at least get our money back.

Think that would just leave Tresor as a major problem from the madness of the 23/24 Summer, assuming Ramsey gets fit and cracks on.


https://www.burnleyexpress.net/sport/fo ... ca-5059471

summitclaret wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 02, 2025 9:43 am

Amdouni seems to be doing pretty well at Benfica, who apparently have an option to sign him. Suspect that would be best for all concerned if we can at least get our money back.

Think that would just leave Tresor as a major problem from the madness of the 23/24 Summer, assuming Ramsey gets fit and cracks on.


https://www.burnleyexpress.net/sport/fo ... ca-5059471

I was sure I had read somewhere on here that they’d activated their option, or would. Maybe I misunderstood it.

Either way, a sale is vital, either to boost the coffers for Parker to rebuild in the premier league or to ease the financial burden parachute payment reduction.

Pretty sure we have a deal for Humphrys at 12 mil with Chelsea,the chairman said we only loan players with a right to buy option at one of the QA’s?

Right now I would expect the below to all be singing on promotion:-
Edwards
Anthony
Flemming
Humphrey's
Egan Riley (if speculation is to be believed)

Don't think we will go for Sarmiento and don't think Brownhill will renew either. I suspect Barnes won't be renewed and will be offered a coaching role.

That's around a 40m commited spend already.

Realistically you look at the side with those additions and the stand out positions to strengthen would be full backs, Centre mid, Striker.
A 10-15m pound signing in each of these areas take you to a minimum another 40m and at most another 60m. And that's 4 signings. That's potentially 100m spend with only 4 additions to the first team from where we are now.

Even with sales, for a club like us to spend 100m it's a big ask. You than have to consider who's sold that generates significant funds.

We know it's likely Amdouni and maybe Tresor go. That could bring in anywhere from 20m-30m and as they haven't featured there's an argument to say they don't need replacing as first team players. If Trafford potentially leaves that means that along with the 6-7 you need now, you also need a keeper on top. Brownhill will need replacing if he leaves on a free too.

That's only selling one decent head in Trafford. A couple of fringe players in Amdouni and Tresor and Brownhill leaving on a free. Would potentially inject 50-60m back into the balance.

So 60m of sales.
40m to convert the loans.
Profit of around 20m but still anywhere between 6-8 players required.

It's not an easy job is it.

As I said earlier in the post for me we should convert the loans. Spend a modest outlay of 40-60 million on 4 first teamers (we don't have to chase premier league ready but better than what we have with potential). A couple of loan to buy options for the end of the season on survival and maybe one or two frees.

Further to my above post Ive tried to break it down a little further. I know there's a lot of ifs and buts involved but bear with me.

Currently.

Trafford
Sonne
Sambo
Worral
Esteve
Egan Riley
Sarmiento
Brownhill
Benson
Anthony
Humphrey's
Redmond
Foster
Flemming
Green
Roberts
Edwards
Pires
Cullen
Shelvey
Ramsey
Hannibal
Laurent
Koleosho
Tresor
Hladacky
Banel
Barnes
Beyer
Agyei
(Loans out)
Amdouni
Ekdal
Churlinov
Houtondji
Dodgson
Massengo
Delacroix
Obafemi
Costelloe

That's nearly 40 players there. Although I think there's a good few people would acknowledge would be no where near a premier league squad.
Wether through loans or sales for me the below all go (I have also included Brownhill whom I am reasonably confident will not be here next season) :-

Sambo
Sarmiento
Brownhill
Benson
Redmond
Green
Shelvey
Tresor
Banel
Barnes
Beyer
Agyei
Amdouni
Ekdal
Churlinov
Houtondji
Dodgson
Massengo
Delacroix
Obafemi
Costelloe

I'm being a bit ruthless and like I say a couple of those may be loans such as banel or sambo till we see what they can offer. That's getting shut of around 20 players and hard to see but what I feel is required.
We don't need to replace half of that though. It leaves us with

GK-Trafford, Hladacky
RB- Roberts, Sonne
CB- Worral, Esteve, Egan Riley,
LB- Pires, Humphreys
Centre mids- Cullen, Laurent, Hannibal, Ramsey
Wingers- Anthony, Edwards, Koleosho
Strikers- Foster, Flemming

Reflecting on that may see me offer a new deal for Benson.

Providing Trafford stays a new third choice is required, although with Hladacky not happy as Ipswich's number two we may have to replace both second and third choice keepers. And if Trafford leaves then maybe all three. Every chance we retain Green as number these and replace the number one and two slots.

Both full backs need an upgrade. Humphreys I expect to be in contention for CB eventually. So I would look for a new left back first allowing Humphreys to move across when required. As good as Roberts is it's unlikely Sonne is going to be there so a new right back needed Loosing Sonne to go on loan.

Centre halves even if you consider Humphreys moving over looks light. Could need one, could be in the Egan mold, an older head for cover.

Centre mid field. Probably two starters required. We lose Brownhill on a free and I think there are question marks over all three of Laurent, Cullen and Hannibal at the next level. Ramsey is an absolute unknown at this stage.

Out wide- another two players required and that's probably even if you retain Benson.

Striker- need a minimum of one starter and possibly a fourth choice. Maybe Banel could do that job.

That's potentially a back up keeper required (although we may keep the lot)
2 new full backs, preferably starters.
1 squad centre half
2 starting centre Midfielders.
2 wingers to compete for first team spots
1 Starting striker and potentially one fourth choice

That's a further 8 Signings on top of converting the loans and not considering selling any of the first team squad. With 6 of them preferably first team additions and a couple for the squad.

Wether is a sheep

Zero wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 02, 2025 1:56 pm

Wether is a sheep

It's also a hill on the ridge walk above Pooley Bridge.

Relax. Dont overthink things..have a nice summer.

We have 2, possibly 3 players right now that I've got no worries about being able to operate at PL level, and that's Trafford, Steve and Edwards.

I know the last thing we want is another summer of major overhaul and trying to knit a squad together again and I know it might seem like a risky strategy but In the event of promotion I would use the money to clear debts, sell players we know aren't going to cut it at that level, offer new contracts to those that can and buy players that we know can cut it at the champ and potentially higher. Easier said than done I know.

With that in mind id sell/release/terminate loan

Hladky
Sambo
Sarmiento
Brownhill
Benson
Anthony
Redmond
Foster
Green
Shelvey
Koleosho
Tresor
Barnes
And sadly, Beyer, if he isn't the player he was and could be.
Also all of the players that are out on loan.

That would leave us with a nucleus of players that are bought into the culture, and are either decent backup or can fight for a first team place.